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Myriad Blaze
Common Sense Ltd
Nulli Secunda
238
   |
Posted - 2014.05.12 15:12:00 -
[1] - Quote
The New Player Experience (part 1/2)
At Fanfest this year CCP Rise presented the New Player Experience (NPE) panel and recently Ripard Teg wrote about it on JesterGÇÖs Trek - or to be more specific, he wrote about a slide GÇ£What we can do better GÇô Rich experiencesGÇ¥ that shows that the majority of players either quit EVE after a short subscription or become solo / mission players and quit EVE after a while.
It was said, that the tutorial itself tends to be a part of the problem and that CCP wants to address the NPE such that it guides players toward GÇ£richer experiencesGÇ¥.
It got me thinking. What would I suggest to make the NPE better? When I started playing EVE, what would have helped me? What would have been cool to try? 
I started playing EVE two years ago.
Well actually I started EVE in beta, but soon ended up leaving because it seemed like you had to grind for 2 weeks to field a ship that you lost after 2 seconds in PvP (yes, IGÇÖm exaggerating) plus I hated that you had to BM stargates because otherwise you ended up 15km away from them by default (I loved stacking AB and MWD, but thatGÇÖs another story).
7 or 8 years ago, I gave EVE another try. But I soon ended up leaving again. It seemed like I had to grind asteroids and missons to be able to afford a better ship so I could grind asteroids and missons more effectively.
Then, 2 years ago I started playing EVE. This time I was lucky to find some people who were newbie friendly, nice to be with and who were not adverse to PvP. And IGÇÖm still here GÇô finding people who are willing to explain stuff now and then, who would allow a newbie to join them doing missions or sleepers or PvP, who would help a newbie find a source of income to finance lossesGǪ finding newbie friendly people made the difference. 
So what does that mean for our NPE? How can we enhance the Tutorial to include what I (and others) learned from newbie friendly vet players?
In short: ThereGÇÖs no way to enhance the Tutorial to replace what other players can teach you. ItGÇÖs simply not suited for that task. What we need is the real thing - we need a newbie friendly corpGǪ or better, four of them.
So letGÇÖs stop with the chitchat and start with suggestions: 
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Myriad Blaze
Common Sense Ltd
Nulli Secunda
238
|
Posted - 2014.05.12 15:13:00 -
[2] - Quote
The New Player Experience (part 2/2)
LetGÇÖs have 4 CCP sponsored newbie training corps GÇô one for each empire faction. Each of these corps should have a CCP Dev as a godfather and a GM to handle administrative day-to-day affairs. Next we need some vet players who volunteer to take over the roles of corp officers and FCs. (It would be ideal for this, if it were somehow possible to GÇ£temporarilyGÇ¥ join this training corp without having to quit your original corp. That way you might get experienced guest FCs from the big alliances now and then).
Offer incentives for people who are joining the corp to help newbies. Let them earn empire faction LP. Maybe allow for a members vote to award a deserving FC a special prize (sponsored by CCP) for outstanding performance.
Sponsor the ships (hulls) for these training corps! A special ship skin for each training corp would be icing on the top (maybe as an award for something).
In a normal corp/alliance we would have a ship replacement program (SRP) that replaces ships lost in corp operations. I assume it would be too much hassle to have real people sort through killmails and authorize replacements. At least it would be too slow probably, for a newbie to stay operational. So letGÇÖs try to make it semi-automatically. Limit the SRP to certain ship hulls (IGÇÖd say the two main combat frigates, maybe the e-war frigate and maybe the destroyers). Any op for which the SRP is active has a start and an end date. Replace every hull covered by the SRP between start and end date (yes, this means weGÇÖre creating ship hulls out of thin air GÇô but I donGÇÖt think we would be able to install a healthy industry arm in our training corp to provide the ships with the necessary reliability).
Next we need stuff to do. Lots of stuff.
Set a goal. Like building and anchoring a tower in a contested system.
Now we need to mine ore to provide the necessary minerals. And we need people to protect our miners from enemy raids and rats.
LetGÇÖs do some missions together. The corp wallet needs some ISK plus we might get some mods we could use for our fleets.
We need someone to spy on our rivalsGǪ what are they doing at the moment?
What, they are trying to setup up their own tower in that system? LetGÇÖs get a raid together and try and gank their miners to slow them down.
Their tower is anchored? Ok, we need max numbers in fleet, max DPS fleet please. WeGÇÖre going to take this tower down.
Ok, we need to fill your wallets, so you can afford to buy better mods. LetGÇÖs help our mates in faction warfare.
Do we have someone here who wants to dabble in production? We need to build 1000 light missile launchers to support our troops.
I need a volunteer who will move this equipment to our deployment base a few jumps away. Plus I need an escort fleet. ItGÇÖs likely our enemies will try to catch the hauler.
GǪ
There are endless possibilities.
And once in a while we might be able to do something BIG:
Our CCP godfathers step forward, call for action, get into a (large) ship (maybe allow CCP piloted capitals in high sec for this  ) and we see (hopefully) large scale fleet PvP.
Or the empires join forces to fight a perceived greater evil: (real) nullsec alliances preparing to build their own stargates.
The members of the four empire training corps plus high sec volunteers - paladins of virtue, destined to bring light into the dark, order to chaos, to uphold the law GǪ against the hordes of evil GÇô CFC/N3/PL, nefarious criminals, murderous thieves, scum of the galaxy. (A word of advice for our high sec friends: In case of such an event please make sure your character portrait is up to date and good looking GǪ we want you to look the best when you appear on our KMs  ).
TL;DR: Install volunteer led newbie training corps to create a rich NPE.
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Sibyyl
Gallente Federation
841
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Posted - 2014.05.12 15:32:00 -
[3] - Quote
Sorry, I find myself unable to take anything Ripard, or his blog, says seriously. My apologies. I'm sure we're all intelligent enough to read and understand CCP's slide ourselves and make our own intelligent conclusions.
Many players provide newbie friendly corps and work very hard at doing so. I'm sure you already know what corps these are. I'd advertise for the one I belong to, because I really really love it.. but you probably also know which one that is.
I think that NPE can be enhanced by the content in the tutorials and missions. There should be videos, and if not videos some animated demonstrations of certain basic things in EVE. Maybe there should be some voiceover (I'd be happy to help). For new players, some of the screens in EVE should come with some arrows and message bubbles that tell you things that are obvious to veteran players (like hey, these are buy orders.. when you sell something it will automatically go to the highest one.. just an example).
NPE can be helped by encouraging socialization. Why is it so hard for people to find a corp. I mean, the way we find corps is very unscientific, in my opinion. I joined my corp because I'm a redditor. That's really actually not a good reason. Let's have checkboxes like dating sites do and help players who feel alone find groups they mesh with.
Just some ideas.. I can post more if you think this is an appropriate response to your post, OP.
Take solace knowing that even after the sun sets, and your sky is filled with darkness, that the sun is still shining. -D. Entervention
Psychotic Monk joins BNI |
TigerXtrm
Black Thorne Corporation
Black Thorne Alliance
679
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Posted - 2014.05.12 15:33:00 -
[4] - Quote
Myriad Blaze wrote:
TL;DR: Install volunteer led newbie training corps to create a rich NPE.
This is what the Rookie Channel, the current NPC corps and the Help channel are for.
What the NPE needs is clear explanation of the UI and less handholding before throwing new players in the shark tank. They need to be thrown into the shark tank the moment they join and have a clear means of asking for help once they start drowning.
The approach they explained at Fanfest (better UI, no more rewards for doing the tutorials) is a very good step.
My YouTube Channel - EVE Tutorials & other game related things! |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space
The ROC
5997
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Posted - 2014.05.12 15:34:00 -
[5] - Quote
Sibyyl wrote:Sorry, I find myself unable to take anything Ripard, or his blog, says seriously.
Bingo.
If he's reached a conclusion, I can be pretty sure that the truth is the opposite. His agenda is clear for all to see, to turn EVE into Trammel by constantly drumbeating about "new playerz, guys!".
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Lords.Of.Midnight
The Devil's Warrior Alliance
972
|
Posted - 2014.05.12 15:49:00 -
[6] - Quote
I would actually boil it down to expectation-levelling, that regardless of mechanic tweaks this is the one thing CCP needs to do better with new players.
This covers it nicely.
F
Would you like to know more? |
Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
1487
|
Posted - 2014.05.12 16:58:00 -
[7] - Quote
similar thread
Quote:I would actually boil it down to expectation-levelling
this, so much this. but its hard when so many players come into this game without doing a shred of research.
OP what ur describing sounds like existing corps but with a lot more hand holding. much more effort and money than maybe needed. Perhaps a link to the recruitment channel after the SoE arc would be a much simpler solution. and there are help channels where u can ask other players questions.
but nothing is goin to stop new players skipping the help and trying to start their own corp when they are a week old. and im guessing the amount of players who do that, and dnt research the game make up a big part of the 50% that leave.
EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY?No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided""So it will be up to a pilot to remain vigilant wherever they may be flying and be ready for anything at any time" |
Harry Forever
SpaceJunkys
1064
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Posted - 2014.05.12 18:09:00 -
[8] - Quote
you need to be able to join free for all fleets without big hurdles, its just all too complicated...
fleet commanders should be able to turn off shooting fleet members
YouTube - Tumblr - Facebook - Twitter |
Graabeerd Khagah
ImaNicePirate.com
Real Alliance Such Relevance
138
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Posted - 2014.05.12 18:25:00 -
[9] - Quote
I like if I may add something here as well. Reading the forums is a good/bad way to get a feel for any new player to see if they even want to try Eve, and I feel kinda bad that I had to bring this up because we know how GD can be a lot of times. BUT, if a new player comes in, and goes thru the tutorials and does even that much then yes some of the ideas here already presented I go for.
Reading the forums to get a feel as I said to see if they fully subscribe is to be seen yet, thanks.
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Hasril Pux
Red Cabal
18
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Posted - 2014.05.12 18:49:00 -
[10] - Quote
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:I would actually boil it down to expectation-levelling, that regardless of mechanic tweaks this is the one thing CCP needs to do better with new players. This covers it nicely. F
The Aura intro in that blog pretty much covers it. I'd probably even add in historic examples linked under highlighted text so the new player can delve through the horror if they want. Get that blog author to write it.
I'm not even joking, that is the cleanest cut way to enhance new player resolve and immediately psychologically prepare them (or at least nudge them in the right direction) for this game.
Sell them the reality of it, don't try to hide it under layers candy coated training exercises that gives the impression of a limitless friendly sandbox with weak enemies and easy pickens.
If you like any of the older ship models (original artwork) better than the redesign of your favorite hull and don't want them to be lost forever, support ship customization and this feature request. |
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Myriad Blaze
Common Sense Ltd
Nulli Secunda
239
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Posted - 2014.05.12 18:56:00 -
[11] - Quote
Sibyyl wrote:Many players provide newbie friendly corps and work very hard at doing so. I'm sure you already know what corps these are. I'd advertise for the one I belong to, because I really really love it.. but you probably also know which one that is.
Yes, there are some very nice and newbie friendly player run corps out there. And I'm very glad we have them. Yet so many people manage to end up solo or in a bad corp, either run by people who have no idea about this game or people who are out to scam their members (I've heard that a newbie corp can yield some nice passive income and if you play it right you'll even get them to harvest ore and gas free of charge - all for the corp, of course  ).
Sibyyl wrote:Why is it so hard for people to find a corp.
I'd say that's the core of the question.
Probably a part of the answer is, that we may do anything we want - like awox corp members, steal from them, betray them. And some people are out there to do exactly that. It's one thing for a vet player to deal with that, it's completely different for a newbie.
Don't get me wrong. I like that we are free to do as we want. But I also think that - just maybe - a newbie should have a chance to learn the basics without having to worry that his corp mates might kill or intentionally misguide him.
My idea was/is to make it possible for a newbie to jump into a ship and kill stuff. Without having to worry about ship replacements, "friendly fire" and ISK. If he likes it he'll want to fly bigger ships sooner or later. And hopefully he learned enough by then to know (at least some of) his possibilities and limitations.
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Hasril Pux
Red Cabal
18
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Posted - 2014.05.12 18:59:00 -
[12] - Quote
Just to clarify, I was criticizing tutorials, not your ideas.
If you like any of the older ship models (original artwork) better than the redesign of your favorite hull and don't want them to be lost forever, support ship customization and this feature request. |
Myriad Blaze
Common Sense Ltd
Nulli Secunda
239
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Posted - 2014.05.12 19:01:00 -
[13] - Quote
TigerXtrm wrote:Myriad Blaze wrote:
TL;DR: Install volunteer led newbie training corps to create a rich NPE.
This is what the Rookie Channel, the current NPC corps and the Help channel are for. What the NPE needs is clear explanation of the UI and less handholding before throwing new players in the shark tank. They need to be thrown into the shark tank the moment they join and have a clear means of asking for help once they start drowning. The approach they explained at Fanfest (better UI, no more rewards for doing the tutorials) is a very good step.
I don't remember a rookie channel, but I do remember that I was amazed by the amount of trolling, spamming and off-topic posting in the help channel... and I wondered why that channel didn't have a moderator despite the clear need to have one.
The only thing I learned from the help channel was not to ask questions but try and find the info in the web (most if not all the info is out there) and that people are idiots - granted, both are very valuable lessons in EVE.  |
Myriad Blaze
Common Sense Ltd
Nulli Secunda
239
|
Posted - 2014.05.12 19:18:00 -
[14] - Quote
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:I would actually boil it down to expectation-levelling, that regardless of mechanic tweaks this is the one thing CCP needs to do better with new players. This covers it nicely. F
I love your newbie introduction (and Jessica  ).
It's quite accurate, honest and if people follow its advice they already know more about EVE than a not so small part of the playerbase.
I just don't believe a "take it or leave it" situation is the only answer.
Some people just need some more time and a little more guidance than just a few lines of text that many people won't even read in the first place (which is unfortunate). Think about the training classes from Agony Unleashed instead, or Kane's Somali Coastguard Bootcamp. I think it would be nice to have more of that. |
Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
1487
|
Posted - 2014.05.12 19:30:00 -
[15] - Quote
Harry Forever wrote:you need to be able to join free for all fleets without big hurdles, its just all too complicated...
fleet commanders should be able to turn off shooting fleet members, and it needs to be visible if its a "friendly only" fleet
i think we play different games.
EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY?No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided""So it will be up to a pilot to remain vigilant wherever they may be flying and be ready for anything at any time" |
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