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BoBoZoBo
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Posted - 2003.09.24 12:35:00 -
[1]
So a few weeks ago the big deal on the forums was the homoginization of the market.
..Wahhh, Its all the same...
Now we have the trickles of new technology, and as with the real world, only a few people have access to that technology on a production bases...
and as a result, as in the real world...now you are changing your tune...
...Wahhh, not everyone has it....
Hey CCP, lets give everyone the miners so they can ***** about homoginization again.
This is ONE (1) item of technology, we still have hundreds to go, and different people are going to have access to different things.
And guess what...once everyone has access to all lvl2 items, we are going to go through the same thing with lvl 3, and 4 AND 5.
Stop being so impatient, and let the market develop.
Dam commies.
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Operator 9 |
Veruna Caseti
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Posted - 2003.09.24 12:39:00 -
[2]
 Quote:
This is ONE (1) item of technology, we still have hundreds to go, and different people are going to have access to different things.
Well, here's the problem. This ONE (1) item of technology is making BILLIONS (Bs) for a select few corporations.
When these "hundreds" of new technologies get added to the game, who do you think is going to have the ISK to invest in the blueprints and minerals to build them?
Wild guess: the people who made 10B isk selling Miner IIs.
This is not as small a problem as you make it out to be I'm afraid.
Veruna Caseti
Ishukone |
Die Harpie
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Posted - 2003.09.24 12:40:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Die Harpie on 24/09/2003 12:47:51
Ok, coffee is working now...
The BP needs to be as available as any other industry BP out there. CCP messed up on this one and they need to fix it.
Otherwise, this is the trend for the future...
Die Harpie
"I don't like food anymore!" |
BoBoZoBo
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Posted - 2003.09.24 12:41:00 -
[4]
Its all sour grapes...like I said
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Operator 9 |
Lucas De'Thal
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Posted - 2003.09.24 12:43:00 -
[5]
Quote:
So a few weeks ago the big deal on the forums was the homoginization of the market.
..Wahhh, Its all the same...
Now we have the trickles of new technology, and as with the real world, only a few people have access to that technology on a production bases...
and as a result, as in the real world...now you are changing your tune...
in the REAL world you can reverse engineer items. you can research and develop your own competing products. these means do not exist in game and all new tech is hand given to certain individuals or groups directly by the developers
Quote:
This is ONE (1) item of technology, we still have hundreds to go, and different people are going to have access to different things.
And guess what...once everyone has access to all lvl2 items, we are going to go through the same thing with lvl 3, and 4 AND 5.
how long has miner 2 been out, a month maybe. do you really see any other tech lv2 items for the rest of us to try to obtain?? maybe if they had of "trickled" them in a little sooner and in a quantity where it could be felt.
Quote:
Stop being so impatient, and let the market develop.
Dam commies.
shall we give CCP till next year or so then? 
______________________________________________
Hellmar > sorry for the attitude, playing a n00b character through the current state just left me a bit bitter
dev chat: Mar 18, 2004
hellmar> "you lot are just so clever you have a good history for out smarting us :-S "
dev chat: Feb 12, 2004 |
Veruna Caseti
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Posted - 2003.09.24 12:46:00 -
[6]
Quote:
Its all sour grapes...like I said
Maybe you should go read that Fable again. It doesn't apply to this situation. 
The fact is the Miner II BP is a limitless, risk free source of income. It is positioning a very small number of corporations to DOMINATE the EVE economy in the coming months and years.
How can you expect a reasonably healthy Market to be maintained when 2-3 corporations can make literally THOUSANDS of times more profit than the other 98% of the EVE community simply through the acquisition of a single item which is now essentially impossible for anyone else to acquire through any means?
Answer: you can't, and you won't unless something is done before it gets any more out of hand than it already is.
If you can't see past the "jealousy" aspect of this problem and to the root of the damage it will do to the LONG TERM health of the EVE Market, then you are short-sighted and need to take a closer look at the situation.
Veruna Caseti
Ishukone |
Guiermes
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Posted - 2003.09.24 12:55:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Guiermes on 24/09/2003 12:58:13
Edited by: Guiermes on 24/09/2003 12:56:08
Veruna is hitting it "right on the head".
Question to devs. When are you planning on ending this monopoly? No corporation would have this type of stranglehold on any segment of a market without others coming up with a "competeing" product.
Unfortunately this is a game and as such there is no way for anyone to break the monopoly. So my question still stands. When will the gods from on high break this monopoly, and allow for competition.
Oh and btw gods , can you please fix the empty flotsam, drifting cask, cache containers BUG that entered the game, with the introduction of patch 1217. Thank you
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Thalia
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Posted - 2003.09.24 13:11:00 -
[8]
Why not develop a way that will force people to develop higher level of technology.
My character have trained scince to level 5 and few other science and industry skills yet there is nothning for me to do.
And then technological advances are just handed out.
One of promises of this game is that we will be able to do things like reverse engineering and such things but they were never delivered.
And who gets next big item?
Should we try to keep playing field leveled or should we give it to same corporation again?
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Drethen Nerevitas
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Posted - 2003.09.24 13:13:00 -
[9]
Firstly, what exactly is your problem with communism?  I am very close to taking offence  .
Secondly, the MII situation sucks. I think we can all admit that. The best thing to do would be to introduce reverse engineering...
...but ONLY if the devs are willing and capable of introducing new items weekly and making the rev-eng time fairly long (Several days, at the least), otherwise everyone will have all the items without them making a lasting effect.
Thirdly, pizza.
Fourthly, vote Stavros!
_______________________________________________________________________
IMPORTANT: Devs (and players) please take notice.
1. 2. 3. 4. 5. 6. 7. |
Rammarr
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Posted - 2003.09.24 13:13:00 -
[10]
Heres a suggestion
Every coprp on eve declares on the corps with the BP's then they might see ufair a little differently
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Snoop
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Posted - 2003.09.24 13:19:00 -
[11]
CCP just need's to give me a CU Vapor II original bp so i can sell at 7.5mil per or 1.5k mega per laser and all this will be sorted ...
you know it makes sense 
i would also settle for a memory implant bp
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IcedBach Jr
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Posted - 2003.09.24 13:33:00 -
[12]
Guys Guys, this is what makes the game fun. Its so much like real life its scary. Some have more than others, it is and will be like that. So everyone stop whining and do smth. If that eagle guy wants to start a war with techell then so be it, he has every right. Its what we need really, a nice big war.
Praeludium to success |
Snoop
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Posted - 2003.09.24 13:57:00 -
[13]
Quote:
Its so much like real life its scary.
yea it is i couldnt belive it when an anonymous package arrived in my mail box with details of how to make the world's most advanced car making me an instant millionaire
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Lucas De'Thal
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Posted - 2003.09.24 14:14:00 -
[14]
try, multi-billionaire.
______________________________________________
Hellmar > sorry for the attitude, playing a n00b character through the current state just left me a bit bitter
dev chat: Mar 18, 2004
hellmar> "you lot are just so clever you have a good history for out smarting us :-S "
dev chat: Feb 12, 2004 |
IcedBach Jr
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Posted - 2003.09.24 14:30:00 -
[15]
Well, the package might be an idea, like the idea for a system that operates computer elements and makes them work togeather.
Praeludium to success |
Thero 'Deidorian
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Posted - 2003.09.24 14:33:00 -
[16]
are there other TechLevel 2 items in the eve game at the moment?
Thero 'Deidorian
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Veruna Caseti
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Posted - 2003.09.24 14:38:00 -
[17]
No, just this one, and the blueprints can't be copied. Not that I think Techell would copy the blueprints if they could.
Veruna Caseti
Ishukone |
Discorporation
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Posted - 2003.09.24 14:46:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Discorporation on 24/09/2003 15:00:02
Of course they would, they'd up the minerII production immensely.
As long as they could keep the supply at a certain level, or let the larger supplies trickle in steadily, they'd increase profit ;p
[Heterocephalus glaber]
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Bobby Wilson
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Posted - 2003.09.24 14:54:00 -
[19]
CCP didn't give the BPCs to Techell. They gave them to some players who were present at an *event*. We can't blame CCP for giving it the the players they did, we can't blame those players for selling the BPCs to the highest bidder and we can't blame the highest bidders for turning around and selling the final product for roughly what is worth compared to other miners on the trade channel (CU vapors for example, think about their price on the trade channel before miner IIs, or even still).
OTOH, we can and should blame CCP for not putting Miner IIs on the NPC market 3 weeks after the BPCs were introduced and as NPC manufactured products, since as many including Techell have pointed out, initial investments are already paid back and no one including Techell is enjoying the acrimony created by this stat of affairs.
Simple fix. Add Miner IIs to the list of goods for sale at Universities/tech schools by NPC corps for normal NPC markup (about 2.5 X mineral cost?). Problem solved, you're buying Miner IIs for 200K or so. It's about time for more Tech II stuff anyways, and Tech II miners would natch be an early application of research, given how important mining is to the economy.
Originally by: Selim
Cool, congrats.
Oh, stupid idea by the way.
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Hikaru Okuda
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Posted - 2003.09.24 14:59:00 -
[20]
You know... It's certainly interesting to watch all this. Personally, I'd rather use harvester drones than miner II's. I'd buy a miner II if I could get the same ROI I get for using my harvesters. At the current price, its just not worth it.
Granted, I usually run defense for mining operations, not do the bulk of the mining. I'm sure dedicated large scale miners can probably get a useful ROI even at the inflated prices.
I'd rather buy some spare Blackbirds than a single mining laser... 
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Snoop
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Posted - 2003.09.24 15:07:00 -
[21]
Quote:
We can't blame CCP for giving it the the players they did
we can it was a crap way off putting tech 2 into the game.....
and im pretty sure techell has an original ,im sure they once posted in a thread they was copying the miner 2 bp to up production.
i dont think anyone should blame the corp's that own the bp's or the people who was given them in the 1st place ,they was hardly going to say "this is a crappy way of introducing new tech and its not exactly fair".
when people was first outraged at how the tech 2 bp was implemented ,ccp should have decided the people who got the bp's would only get a headstart on the rest of the comunity ,realising it was a mistake and then after 1-2week's made miner 2's pirate drop's like they did on chaos or put a small amount of the original bp's on the market say 10 bp's in each empire region to encourage competition between the people who own the bp's..
i can only imagine the prices if ccp only put 5 tech 2 cruisers bp's into the game 100mil for a maller II anyone?
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Datsevlu
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Posted - 2003.09.24 15:11:00 -
[22]
Wrong they are Copies there are no originals in the game that I know of. Trust me if we could make copies we would it would take much pressure off of us. And we are not the only corp out there with these BP's.
-- Datsevlu
Blow'em up we'll build more.
Techell's ingame site |
Anara Valencia
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Posted - 2003.09.24 15:19:00 -
[23]
I don't agree with the how and why about the Miner II topic. CCP really screwed up here and should have just taken the technology out of the game.
But they go and make a bigger screw up by giving out BPs in an event. They say there is a storyline behind this and more techology will be available.
Well, it has been over a month and we have been nothing but the latest Scope article and that wasn't part of the storyline. Nor, has more of the technology been made available.
The fact that everyone in the game craves new content and technology and the Miner II is just that. Which gives it the potential to completely unbalance the game.
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Tituan
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Posted - 2003.09.24 16:24:00 -
[24]
The way tech lvl two bp's are being introduced via events is horrible. Why? Because it caters to a certain type of player the roleplayer, whom happens to be at a certain place, at a certain time. This is just wrong.
Am I an anti roleplayer? No I enjoy rp.
Am I against events? No they help to add "flavor" to the game.
However this game was modeled after corporate capitalism. Many people play the game as such, being highly competitive in prices of goods and trying to get an edge. Introduceing higher tech bp's through an a totally different aspect of the game throws the game off balance. Events and high lvl agent missions can give out high quality items that are slightly uber but in no way should be giving out blue prints for items that will allow certain select corporations make billions with very little investment.
Higher tech items should be the result of extensive R&D by player corporations requiring not just a large time investment but some kind of material/isk investment.
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Venona Birch
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Posted - 2003.09.24 17:11:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Venona Birch on 24/09/2003 17:12:45
Edited by: Venona Birch on 24/09/2003 17:12:08
Quote:
CCP didn't give the BPCs to Techell. They gave them to some players who were present at an *event*. We can't blame CCP for giving it the the players they did, we can't blame those players for selling the BPCs to the highest bidder and we can't blame the highest bidders for turning around and selling the final product for roughly what is worth compared to other miners on the trade channel (CU vapors for example, think about their price on the trade channel before miner IIs, or even still).
OTOH, we can and should blame CCP for not putting Miner IIs on the NPC market 3 weeks after the BPCs were introduced and as NPC manufactured products, since as many including Techell have pointed out, initial investments are already paid back and no one including Techell is enjoying the acrimony created by this stat of affairs.
Simple fix. Add Miner IIs to the list of goods for sale at Universities/tech schools by NPC corps for normal NPC markup (about 2.5 X mineral cost?). Problem solved, you're buying Miner IIs for 200K or so. It's about time for more Tech II stuff anyways, and Tech II miners would natch be an early application of research, given how important mining is to the economy.
must say that I agree with you totally
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