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0.0 Angel Ratting Pilgrim Setup

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DarknessInc	Posted - 2006.06.04 08:32:00 - [1] Edited by: DarknessInc on 04/06/2006 08:34:05 Im currently training to fly a Pilgrim ^_^ and my quickfit has found a nice setup where I can sustain cap, and a Tank (i hope) with Drones being the main force of DMG. EDIT: Added Drone Skills Req. HIGHS: 4x E50 NOS Mids: 4x Eutetic Cap Rechargers 1x 10MN AB (named or T1-2) Lows: 1x Medium Armor Rep II 2x Energized Reactive Armor II 2x Energize Magnetic Armor II DRONE BAY: 7x Valkyrie IIs this leaves me with these stats: Armor: EM: 60% Exp: 87.41% Kin: 81.16% Therm: 35% This would require: Drones lvl 5 Scout Drone Operation lvl 5 Minmatar Drone Specialization lvl2 Electronics lvl 2 (lvl5 to use cloak) (Cloaking lvl 4 to use a Covert Ops Cloak II) Science lvl 2 Energy Grid Upgrades lvl 2 Energy Emission Systems lvl 2 Amarr Frigate lvl 4 Covert Ops lvl 4 Spaceship Command lvl 5 Recon Ships lvl 1 Hull Upgrades lvl 5 Repair Systems lvl 4 Mechanic lvl 4 Engineering lvl 3 Electronics Upgrades lvl 5 Signature Analysis lvl 5 Amarr Cruiser lvl 5 BUT TO BE SAFE, when transporting it into 0.0, you need a Covert Ops Cloaking Device II, and to FIT THIS, you need to DISABLE all your Lows, and use Instas to escape through 0.0 effectivly <.< so what do you guys think ___________________ Hasnt Been, Hijacked For The Very First Like a Virrrgginn
Ginaz	Posted - 2006.06.04 08:35:00 - [2] go get a zealot and keep a close watch on local. FYI: You don't have to disable modules before cloaking. After cloaking, they will automatically stop with the next cycle. And forget the Pilgrim with less then recon 4
Gabby05	Posted - 2006.06.04 08:37:00 - [3] Think your need to use more than your medium drones to take out the bigger BS's like 1.5-1.8mil spawns unless you've trained up that recon to lvl 5. Still take ages might want to fit a couple of laser's on.
DarknessInc	Posted - 2006.06.04 08:39:00 - [4] Originally by: Ginaz go get a zealot and keep a close watch on local. FYI: You don't have to disable modules before cloaking. After cloaking, they will automatically stop with the next cycle. And forget the Pilgrim with less then recon 4 well. <.< I rat at my corp's POS, so Im not afraid of the Local. And I always train my ship skills to lvl4 ___________________ Hasnt Been, Hijacked For The Very First Like a Virrrgginn
BOBHOPE	Posted - 2006.06.04 08:39:00 - [5] Ginaz hit the nail on the head. but if you are crazy bout recon ships then yeh, recon 4 is a must (5 if your crazy like meh :D )
Hydrogen	Posted - 2006.06.04 10:40:00 - [6] Ermmm,... I am sorry to spoil the fun, but your suggested setup hurts alot. 1. about your setup: taking a Pilgrim for ratting is a bad idea. Pilgrim has less range than Curse (due to the range bonus on NOS), Pilgrim has less highs and less mids. 2. due to less range, a triple Cherub spawn will eat you alive in a Pilgrim. A Curse performs way better. 3. For ratting, both the Curse and Pilgrim lack hp. Due to that you need at least a 800 mm plate fitted in low. 4. Angel 0.0 belt spawns do mostly explosive and kin damage. Unfortunately the hard hitters also do em and therm 5. Med drones only hurt your damage output by app. 50% less than it could be That said: if I dared to rat in your setup, the highest I bring on would be 950K rats. All others would make me afraid of loosing my ship. How to improve? A1. Take Curse A2. Decide if you shield or armor tank (Hull Upgrades 5 ftw for armor tank). In case of armor tank you take: 800mm crystal carb, med repper II, 2 Energized adaptive nano II. Shield tankers take Large shield extender FS9+, shield amp, large shield booster, EM hardener at least. A3. You always need a Afterburner, so one ABII in mid A4. Take Med NOS II or med diminishing at least in highs My recommendation? B1. Curse for extreme ratting ;) B2. armor tank B3. fill highs with med dim nos and the remaining highs with hvy missile launcher B4. full PvP setup in mid Why? The Curse is the only ship I know, which is effective in PvE in a 100% PvP setup. AF Guide
Benglada	Posted - 2006.06.04 10:47:00 - [7] Originally by: Hydrogen Ermmm,... I am sorry to spoil the fun, but your suggested setup hurts alot. 1. about your setup: taking a Pilgrim for ratting is a bad idea. Pilgrim has less range than Curse (due to the range bonus on NOS), Pilgrim has less highs and less mids. 2. due to less range, a triple Cherub spawn will eat you alive in a Pilgrim. A Curse performs way better. 3. For ratting, both the Curse and Pilgrim lack hp. Due to that you need at least a 800 mm plate fitted in low. 4. Angel 0.0 belt spawns do mostly explosive and kin damage. Unfortunately the hard hitters also do em and therm 5. Med drones only hurt your damage output by app. 50% less than it could be That said: if I dared to rat in your setup, the highest I bring on would be 950K rats. All others would make me afraid of loosing my ship. How to improve? A1. Take Curse A2. Decide if you shield or armor tank (Hull Upgrades 5 ftw for armor tank). In case of armor tank you take: 800mm crystal carb, med repper II, 2 Energized adaptive nano II. Shield tankers take Large shield extender FS9+, shield amp, large shield booster, EM hardener at least. A3. You always need a Afterburner, so one ABII in mid A4. Take Med NOS II or med diminishing at least in highs My recommendation? B1. Curse for extreme ratting ;) B2. armor tank B3. fill highs with med dim nos and the remaining highs with hvy missile launcher B4. full PvP setup in mid Why? The Curse is the only ship I know, which is effective in PvE in a 100% PvP setup. Ishkur. --------------------------- Originally by: Wrangler Unfrtinately you dnot get to vote..
Joerd Toastius	Posted - 2006.06.04 11:48:00 - [8] Originally by: Hydrogen The Curse is the only ship I know, which is effective in PvE in a 100% PvP setup. Retribution :P (Tank + Guns + AB. Not much more you can do with it, and works ok for both)
Dimitri Vorski	Posted - 2006.06.04 13:46:00 - [9] Originally by: Joerd Toastius Originally by: Hydrogen The Curse is the only ship I know, which is effective in PvE in a 100% PvP setup. Retribution :P (Tank + Guns + AB. Not much more you can do with it, and works ok for both) +zealot
Rambo Armsdealer	Posted - 2006.06.04 13:46:00 - [10] Originally by: DarknessInc Edited by: DarknessInc on 04/06/2006 08:34:05 Im currently training to fly a Pilgrim ^_^ and my quickfit has found a nice setup where I can sustain cap, and a Tank (i hope) with Drones being the main force of DMG. EDIT: Added Drone Skills Req. HIGHS: 4x E50 NOS Mids: 4x Eutetic Cap Rechargers 1x 10MN AB (named or T1-2) Lows: 1x Medium Armor Rep II 2x Energized Reactive Armor II 2x Energize Magnetic Armor II DRONE BAY: 7x Valkyrie IIs this leaves me with these stats: Armor: EM: 60% Exp: 87.41% Kin: 81.16% Therm: 35% This would require: Drones lvl 5 Scout Drone Operation lvl 5 Minmatar Drone Specialization lvl2 Electronics lvl 2 (lvl5 to use cloak) (Cloaking lvl 4 to use a Covert Ops Cloak II) Science lvl 2 Energy Grid Upgrades lvl 2 Energy Emission Systems lvl 2 Amarr Frigate lvl 4 Covert Ops lvl 4 Spaceship Command lvl 5 Recon Ships lvl 1 Hull Upgrades lvl 5 Repair Systems lvl 4 Mechanic lvl 4 Engineering lvl 3 Electronics Upgrades lvl 5 Signature Analysis lvl 5 Amarr Cruiser lvl 5 BUT TO BE SAFE, when transporting it into 0.0, you need a Covert Ops Cloaking Device II, and to FIT THIS, you need to DISABLE all your Lows, and use Instas to escape through 0.0 effectivly <.< so what do you guys think with your amount of recharge I'd fit 2 armor reppers though without fitting a cloak I'd get a curse since it's quite alot better for your purposes
Skva	Posted - 2006.06.04 15:24:00 - [11] Originally by: Dimitri Vorski Originally by: Joerd Toastius Originally by: Hydrogen The Curse is the only ship I know, which is effective in PvE in a 100% PvP setup. Retribution :P (Tank + Guns + AB. Not much more you can do with it, and works ok for both) +zealot +ishtar :P Your signature is too large! Please resize it according to the forum guidelines. Jacques Archambault
xeno calligan	Posted - 2006.06.04 15:27:00 - [12] If you are not using the ability to fit a covert ops cloaking device then a Curse would be significantly better for your needs. Though it may sound strange, the Curse can fit a very hard shield tank and keep it running as long as the cap is flowing. Try the following: High: 5 Medium Diminishing Nos Mid: 10mn AB II, XL Shield Booster II, Inv. Field II, Photon Scat. Field II, Heat Dis. Amp II, Shield Boost Amp I Low: 2 Co-Processor II, 2 Reactor Control Unit II Resists: 66.74%, 68.59%, 73.76%, 89.5% With skills at level 5 the tank performs as follows: Minimum Absorbtion Rate: 451hp/s (vs. worst resist = EM) Shield Booster Duty Factor: 96%
Hitomi Ayame	Posted - 2006.06.04 15:38:00 - [13] Edited by: Hitomi Ayame on 04/06/2006 15:38:13 Originally by: Rambo Armsdealer with your amount of recharge I'd fit 2 armor reppers though without fitting a cloak I'd get a curse since it's quite alot better for your purposes What he said. I dont have experience in Recon ships, but even in a lowly Arbitrator, I've wished so many times to be able to fit a second armor rep. (can't because of fitting reqs) With the insane amount of cap you'll have, most of it's going to be wasted. Dual rep tank seems good here. - - -
DarknessInc	Posted - 2006.06.04 16:50:00 - [14] Originally by: xeno calligan If you are not using the ability to fit a covert ops cloaking device then a Curse would be significantly better for your needs. Though it may sound strange, the Curse can fit a very hard shield tank and keep it running as long as the cap is flowing. Try the following: High: 5 Medium Diminishing Nos Mid: 10mn AB II, XL Shield Booster II, Inv. Field II, Photon Scat. Field II, Heat Dis. Amp II, Shield Boost Amp I Low: 2 Co-Processor II, 2 Reactor Control Unit II Resists: 66.74%, 68.59%, 73.76%, 89.5% With skills at level 5 the tank performs as follows: Minimum Absorbtion Rate: 451hp/s (vs. worst resist = EM) Shield Booster Duty Factor: 96% Here's where your setup went wrong: Mid: 10mn AB II, XL Shield Booster II, Inv. Field II, Photon Scat. Field II, Heat Dis. Amp II, Shield Boost Amp I an Invun Shield? a EM Hardener and a Thermal Hardener are USELESS against angels. Instead. Try this: 2x Explosion Dampening Field II, 2x Ballistic Deflection Field II since angels are EXP/KIN damage dealers ___________________ Hasnt Been, Hijacked For The Very First Like a Virrrgginn
xeno calligan	Posted - 2006.06.04 17:15:00 - [15] Edited by: xeno calligan on 04/06/2006 17:18:13 Originally by: DarknessInc Here's where your setup went wrong: Mid: 10mn AB II, XL Shield Booster II, Inv. Field II, Photon Scat. Field II, Heat Dis. Amp II, Shield Boost Amp I an Invun Shield? a EM Hardener and a Thermal Hardener are USELESS against angels. Instead. Try this: 2x Explosion Dampening Field II, 2x Ballistic Deflection Field II since angels are EXP/KIN damage dealers According to TomB's dev blog "npc changes on the test server" 2005.11.15 (RMR changes): Originally by: TomB Damage Types: Angel Cartel are now focusing more on explosive/kinetic damage with turrets, few are still able to deal thermal and em damage but not as much as currently on TQ While Angels focus on kinetic and explosive, leaving a gaping 0% em and 20% thermal hole would be a mistake since Angels are not limited to just 2 damage types (as opposed to Guristas). As is, the resists on the Curse setup are already biased towards kinetic and explosive, so I would think the setup would perform quite well overall. Depending on the actual mix of npcs you fight, you might want to increase the bias towards kinetic and explosive a bit, but all-out kinetic + explosive would likely be a bad idea.
DarknessInc	Posted - 2006.06.04 18:10:00 - [16] That is why I made the Setup as an ARMOR tanker, due to IT being a Amarrian Ship. And the MIDs are left open for Cap Rechargers, to help with CAP regeneration, and you dont need any webbers etc. since their NPC rats, and Drones dont need assistance like that. ___________________ Hasnt Been, Hijacked For The Very First Like a Virrrgginn
xeno calligan	Posted - 2006.06.04 19:10:00 - [17] Originally by: DarknessInc That is why I made the Setup as an ARMOR tanker, due to IT being a Amarrian Ship. And the MIDs are left open for Cap Rechargers, to help with CAP regeneration, and you dont need any webbers etc. since their NPC rats, and Drones dont need assistance like that. The Curse is also an Amarr ship. In any case, it depends on whether you prefer to tank better or being able to tank even if you are unable to drain cap. In the latter case, I would recommend a 3 armor rep Pilgrim setup (dual armor rep setups perform 6% worse): High: 2 Nos + covert ops cloak + Focused Pulse Mid: 10mn AB II, 4 cap recharger II Low: 3 Medium Armor Repairer II, Armor Kinetic Hardener II, Energized Adap. Nano. Memb. II The minimum absorbtion rate vs. only kinetic and explosive is 421hp/s (lower if thermal becomes a problem) so it tanks 26% worse than the Curse (vs. kinetic and explosive), but with higher recharge rate.
Blind Man	Posted - 2006.06.04 19:12:00 - [18] Edited by: Blind Man on 04/06/2006 19:12:05 pilgrim for npcing
Nanus Parkite	Posted - 2006.06.04 20:27:00 - [19] The massive gaping whole in all of these setups is that you rely on the nos to run the tank. NPC's do not have unlimited cap and they will run out before you've destroyed them.
Agent2 Holtze	Posted - 2006.06.04 21:20:00 - [20] Quote: <.< so what do you guys think It makes me cry. You will earn more if flying a zealot, Apoc or geddon. Posting and you!
Darpz	Posted - 2006.06.04 21:24:00 - [21] using a pilgrim to npc is like pvping in a impel The only good fix is a DEAD fix
Ginaz	Posted - 2006.06.04 21:25:00 - [22] or solo pvp with a retribution
Knight Wyvern	Posted - 2006.06.04 21:33:00 - [23] You wont be able to survive with only 1 med repper, angels just put out to much raw dps, even if it is only/mostly exp and kin dmg. Even with 4 Eutectic Cap Rechargers, you wont be able to run 2 med reppers for very long as npc rats, even BS, dont have very much cap comparatively. (2000 or so?) I have tried hunting angels in a curse and have tried many different setups, but I always ended up warping out when fighting a bs harder than a commander. I'd go with an Arma for hunting angels, it does enough damage to be somewhat effective even against there high EM/Therm resists and you can still fit quite a few active hardeners. Aside from these facts the main bonus is the ability to insure the ship as you may lose it anyways if you run into a spawn with Arch angel frigs or cruisers which can warp scram you. Just my 2 cents tho.
Agent2 Holtze	Posted - 2006.06.04 21:51:00 - [24] Originally by: Ginaz or solo pvp with a retribution bad exampel. Posting and you!
LUKEC	Posted - 2006.06.04 21:57:00 - [25] Originally by: Skva Originally by: Dimitri Vorski Originally by: Joerd Toastius Originally by: Hydrogen The Curse is the only ship I know, which is effective in PvE in a 100% PvP setup. Retribution :P (Tank + Guns + AB. Not much more you can do with it, and works ok for both) +zealot +ishtar :P + domi ... requires a slight out of the box thinking ... but tbh, with 20mil sp, you can rat in anything. --------- Dead already?
Meridius	Posted - 2006.06.04 21:57:00 - [26] Originally by: Blind Man Edited by: Blind Man on 04/06/2006 19:12:05 pilgrim for npcing Originally by: Agent2 Holtze Quote: <.< so what do you guys think It makes me cry. Originally by: Darpz using a pilgrim to npc is like pvping in a impel Originally by: Ginaz or solo pvp with a retribution ^^ sums it up pretty well - _____
Hydrogen	Posted - 2006.06.04 22:46:00 - [27] Originally by: Nanus Parkite The massive gaping whole in all of these setups is that you rely on the nos to run the tank. NPC's do not have unlimited cap and they will run out before you've destroyed them. Then you never NPCd in a Curse Damage output is ok to kill the rat, before you are low on cap. That only with nice drone skills ofc. AF Guide
Hydrogen	Posted - 2006.06.04 22:49:00 - [28] Originally by: Knight Wyvern You wont be able to survive with only 1 med repper, angels just put out to much raw dps, even if it is only/mostly exp and kin dmg. errmm, you are invited to rat with me and watch how easy a Curse kills a triple Cherub spawn That is: with only one med repper II. If you like to: drop me an evemail ingame to met me ratting. Have a nice day. AF Guide
Hydrogen	Posted - 2006.06.04 22:50:00 - [29] Originally by: LUKEC Originally by: Skva Originally by: Dimitri Vorski Originally by: Joerd Toastius Originally by: Hydrogen The Curse is the only ship I know, which is effective in PvE in a 100% PvP setup. Retribution :P (Tank + Guns + AB. Not much more you can do with it, and works ok for both) +zealot +ishtar :P + domi ... requires a slight out of the box thinking ... but tbh, with 20mil sp, you can rat in anything. I doubt the Zealot and ishtar. But admit the Domi is a good point in ratting in a PvP setup. AF Guide

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