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What is the advantage of self destructing your ship

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Crazy Dave Smugglers Run Inc 6	Posted - 2014.05.27 06:09:00 - [1] - Quote I am told eve was designed to mimic the real world as much as possible in most aspects of the game. So in the real world, self destructing your ship ( or scuttling as its called in the Naval parlance) should render your ship and everything on it completely useless to any aggressors. Is this true in eve? or is it just basically a use less option that does nothing but end a fight allowing the aggressors to take still be able to use any survivable equipment? GM or DEV input appreciated. Thanks!
Learned Vagrant Veerhouven Ventures 4	Posted - 2014.05.27 06:14:00 - [2] - Quote Crazy Dave wrote: I am told eve was designed to mimic the real world as much as possible in most aspects of the game. So in the real world, self destructing your ship ( or scuttling as its called in the Naval parlance) should render your ship and everything on it completely useless to any aggressors. Is this true in eve? or is it just basically a use less option that does nothing but end a fight allowing the aggressors to take still be able to use any survivable equipment? GM or DEV input appreciated. Thanks! You can use this as a way to quickly move into your Medical Clone. For instance, you move your medical clone into a station in Null sec that you don't want to fly to, hop into your ship and self-destruct. Create a jump clone at the null station and move your medical clone back to hi sec. This is the way it used to be anyway. I'm just coming back from a year's break.
James Amril-Kesh 4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation 10122	Posted - 2014.05.27 06:18:00 - [3] - Quote Self destructing used to deny killmails and loot drops, but that's no longer the case. "Pretty much all 14 of the CSM were in favor of a drone assign nerf for OBVIOUS gameplay reasons" - Sala Cameron
Niko Lorenzio United Eve Directorate 353	Posted - 2014.05.27 06:23:00 - [4] - Quote You used to be able to self-destruct your ship to prevent it's cargo and modules from falling into the enemy hands. It also provided the victim with a bargaining chip for settling on a ransom rather than total destruction. With a two minute timer though, such cases were not very common. Recently CCP changed mechanics so that self-destructing has the same effect as your ship being blown up so it is no longer a viable tactic.
Scipio Artelius The Vendunari End of Life 1640	Posted - 2014.05.27 06:24:00 - [5] - Quote Come, go get your answer the scientific way, not by asking. Go in game and do it. You'll find out all you need to know through experiencing it. Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari . -á<- Argue this, not this ->-á( -í-¦ -£-û -í-¦)
Nakami Saans Perkone Caldari State 75	Posted - 2014.05.27 06:31:00 - [6] - Quote I've always felt that a self destruct feature should be a last resort option. You know you have no way out so instead of giving the aggressors the satisfaction of getting a kill and loot you self destruct. I also think a self destruct should send out a wave of destruction damaging anything in its radius, with damage varying depending on the size of the ship. This way you don't have a bunch of suicide Ibis' running into a fight. I also think you should be able to control the timer. Too much can happen in two minutes. As it stands now, the self destruct feature is almost useless. Rainbow Worrior of EVE...well...maybe worrior is too strong a word.-á I like to site see ^.^ Would like to make connections with other LGBT players, possibly a corp Please help me with my Philosophy Final!
Lexmana 1069	Posted - 2014.05.27 06:38:00 - [7] - Quote If you are out of ammo you can still watch an explosion.
Naomi Hale Children of New Eden 252	Posted - 2014.05.27 06:47:00 - [8] - Quote I always liked the idea of self-destruct causing an AoE explosion, so you can damage your attackers (not strictly kill them) but also taking a security hit in high sec since you are technically using a smart bomb. Just an option for people to use if you know you're ship is doomed. But then think of your poor ship crew when you do it, one thing to be killed in combat, another to be killed by your own ships Capsuleer in petty revenge. I'm Naomi Hale and this is my favourite thread on the forums.
Abrazzar Vardaugas Family 3605	Posted - 2014.05.27 06:50:00 - [9] - Quote Last measure. Pah! When engaging an enemy, you activate self destruct. If you cannot defeat the enemy before the timer is down, you will go down in flames. This will motivate everyone to kill the target as quickly as possible and not bother with dishonourable things like repairs or logistics. Low slots are all damage and application mods and a number of expanded cargoholds to denote your rank. Only once no enemy is left on grid are you allowed to disengage self destruct. Anyone forfeiting this codex gets kicked and declared kill on sight as a filthy heretic. Sovereignty and Population New Mining Mechanics
Webvan All Kill No Skill 6272	Posted - 2014.05.27 06:53:00 - [10] - Quote Scout etc stuck in a WH looking for a fast exit. Otherwise, it's just another part of EVE newbified into the ground. Too complicated? don't worry your little head, it's removed. Too much combat and danger? we have a mini-game app for that too.

Brooks Puuntai Solar Nexus. 1936	Posted - 2014.05.27 06:56:00 - [11] - Quote Naomi Hale wrote: I always liked the idea of self-destruct causing an AoE explosion, so you can damage your attackers (not strictly kill them) but also taking a security hit in high sec since you are technically using a smart bomb. Just an option for people to use if you know you're ship is doomed. But then think of your poor ship crew when you do it, one thing to be killed in combat, another to be killed by your own ships Capsuleer in petty revenge. The AoE effect was actually used in the Eve Books so it wouldn't be farfetched to do so, not to mention a bit obvious. However it could lead to abuse in High which is why they probably don't allow it. Also the crew is always expendable, they sign on knowing that. CCP's Motto: If it isn't broken, break it. If it is broken, ignore it. Improving NPE-á/ Dynamic New Eden
Vanell Draeko Fweddit I Whip My Slaves Back and Forth 20	Posted - 2014.05.27 06:59:00 - [12] - Quote Its a way to unstack yourself from a wormwhole that you cant get out Oh noes
Crazy Dave Smugglers Run Inc 6	Posted - 2014.05.27 06:59:00 - [13] - Quote Changing the mechanics on that was extremely lame. I can understand wanting to put an end to the denial of kill mails by the person opting to self destruct their ship. To render that function for all in purposes defeats the reason for a means to self destruct....In my eyes, if the owner of a ship wants to deny access to their "property and equipment" then that should have remained in the mechanics of the self destruct option. Now it may as well be removed. It is a worthless feature in the game. So much for mimicking real life in a futuristic setting.... Thank you all for your responses. I appreciate them. Good hunting to you all!! DEV's I hope you will one day re-think the whole idea regarding the option for a player to self destruct their ship and render all modules and cargo useless. Kill mails can still be given to the aggressors, but up until the ship is destroyed by them, then the player should have the option to deny his goods and equipment to those that would attack. In my eyes, by having it work the way it does makes the entire event 100% lopsided by giving the aggressors the ability to still have what ever survived. When in a true self destruct situation, nothing should or at least an extremely small amount would manage to survive. The player should be able to have some room to negotiate. This sadly does not exist.
Aralyn Cormallen Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation 415	Posted - 2014.05.27 07:00:00 - [14] - Quote Crazy Dave wrote: I am told eve was designed to mimic the real world as much as possible in most aspects of the game. So in the real world, self destructing your ship ( or scuttling as its called in the Naval parlance) should render your ship and everything on it completely useless to any aggressors. Really? I didn't realise in real life when a ship was scuttled it atomised so there was no potential for a wreck to salvage. You learn something new every day. Oooor, scuttling a ship merely makes it impossible to be stolen or captured intact (and in truth, is no different to it just being blown the crap up), and in this case it does the exact same in EvE.
Crazy Dave Smugglers Run Inc 6	Posted - 2014.05.27 07:07:00 - [15] - Quote Aralyn Cormallen wrote: Crazy Dave wrote: I am told eve was designed to mimic the real world as much as possible in most aspects of the game. So in the real world, self destructing your ship ( or scuttling as its called in the Naval parlance) should render your ship and everything on it completely useless to any aggressors. Really? I didn't realise in real life when a ship was scuttled it atomised so there was no potential for a wreck to salvage. You learn something new every day. Oooor, scuttling a ship merely makes it impossible to be stolen or captured intact (and in truth, is no different to it just being blown the crap up), and in this case it does the exact same in EvE. In the real world all that is needed would be to open the fairwater valves in main engineering and set scuttling charges through out the ship. Oh and yes any ship that is capable of carrying nuclear warheads can be manually detonated in extreme situations. Join the military and be a weapons tech and learn something. Even though such acts in this age would be extremely rare, war ships do have the means to be scuttled or violently disposed of.
Galen Darksmith Sky Fighters 256	Posted - 2014.05.27 07:26:00 - [16] - Quote Crazy Dave wrote: It would only make sense that a similar functioning method would be properly balanced in EvE. Not completely lopsided so that only one side wins. It's not balanced so that only one side wins. It's balanced so that sore losers can't go around being, well, sore losers. Best way to keep your mods out of enemy hands: don't die in the first place. "EVE is a dark and harsh world, you're supposed to feel a bit worried and slightly angry when you log in, you're not supposed to feel like you're logging in to a happy, happy, fluffy, fluffy lala land filled with fun and adventures, that's what hello kitty online is for." -CCP Wrangler
Grunanca Doughboys Shadow Cartel 237	Posted - 2014.05.27 07:35:00 - [17] - Quote Crazy Dave wrote: I am told eve was designed to mimic the real world as much as possible in most aspects of the game. So in the real world, self destructing your ship ( or scuttling as its called in the Naval parlance) should render your ship and everything on it completely useless to any aggressors. Is this true in eve? or is it just basically a use less option that does nothing but end a fight allowing the aggressors to take still be able to use any survivable equipment? GM or DEV input appreciated. Thanks! Put cyno in safespot and start selfdestruct. 5 seconds before your ship explodes, light cyno and jump in titan. Hopefully cyno dies before anyone warps to it and your titan can cloak in safety. That is what self destruct is for along with moving cyno alts.
Benny Ohu Chaotic Tranquility 3289	Posted - 2014.05.27 07:38:00 - [18] - Quote yes hello the primary use of selfdestruct is games of capital chicken
Sobaan Tali Caldari Quick Reaction Force 295	Posted - 2014.05.27 08:28:00 - [19] - Quote Nakami Saans wrote: I've always felt that a self destruct feature should be a last resort option. You know you have no way out so instead of giving the aggressors the satisfaction of getting a kill and loot you self destruct. I also think a self destruct should send out a wave of destruction damaging anything in its radius, with damage varying depending on the size of the ship. This way you don't have a bunch of suicide Ibis' running into a fight. I also think you should be able to control the timer. Too much can happen in two minutes. As it stands now, the self destruct feature is almost useless. One of the Mechwarrior games (Mech4, maybe?) had explosives you could mount in the R/L/C torsos to give a little kick during an engine crit. Pretty good for laughs in city fights, that and an old dual long-tom Atlas build I use to use for ***** and giggles.
Miles Parabellum Zealots of Bob 48	Posted - 2014.05.27 08:41:00 - [20] - Quote Other uses: 1. Getting silly pilots in probe-less ships out of wormholes. 2. Sacrificing ships to Bob to show your appreciation of good fights, ganks or loot drops. Bob'uh akbar!

Ramona McCandless The McCandless Clan 4582	Posted - 2014.05.27 08:46:00 - [21] - Quote Crazy Dave wrote: Any ship that is capable of carrying nuclear warheads can be manually detonated in extreme situations. lolno "A naughty sarcastic nun that's come to whip me with a ruler." - Domanique Altares "As Ramona previously mentioned, that is correct." --áISD Supogo
James Amril-Kesh 4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation 10125	Posted - 2014.05.27 09:38:00 - [22] - Quote Crazy Dave wrote: Any ship that is capable of carrying nuclear warheads can be manually detonated in extreme situations. I sure as **** hope not. "Pretty much all 14 of the CSM were in favor of a drone assign nerf for OBVIOUS gameplay reasons" - Sala Cameron
Vimsy Vortis Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation 1612	Posted - 2014.05.27 09:47:00 - [23] - Quote If you wanted "Realistic" self destruction in order to successfully self destruct you'd need a team of dust players armed with fire axes to run around your ship interior for twenty minutes smashing every piece of electronic equipment they can find while others jam classified information into cooking equipment (a mini-game of some kind might work here).
Ramona McCandless The McCandless Clan 4582	Posted - 2014.05.27 09:57:00 - [24] - Quote A better question is; Is there a disadvantage? "A naughty sarcastic nun that's come to whip me with a ruler." - Domanique Altares "As Ramona previously mentioned, that is correct." --áISD Supogo
Naomi Hale Children of New Eden 252	Posted - 2014.05.27 11:58:00 - [25] - Quote Aralyn Cormallen wrote: Crazy Dave wrote: I am told eve was designed to mimic the real world as much as possible in most aspects of the game. So in the real world, self destructing your ship ( or scuttling as its called in the Naval parlance) should render your ship and everything on it completely useless to any aggressors. Really? I didn't realise in real life when a ship was scuttled it atomised so there was no potential for a wreck to salvage. You learn something new every day. Oooor, scuttling a ship merely makes it impossible to be stolen or captured intact (and in truth, is no different to it just being blown the crap up), and in this case it does the exact same in EvE. Realism was never a part of EVE. It's closer than most games but it's still a game and therefore can never be realistic. In real life delicate computer and mechanical components don't tend to survive massive explosions unscathed. Since ships in EVE are almost always over 100m+ long any explosion that destroys the ship should ruin any working components. That's why I like the salvaging feature so much, you get burnt out, damaged or malfunctioning parts and scrap metal, which is what would be left in a destroyed ship. In EVE you don't even need to repair the modules you loot from wrecks, you can slap it straight on your hull. Not realistic. You should get salvaged parts and a lump of scrap metal equal to or less than the total mass of the ship, not intact ammo, turrets, launchers or hull plates. That's just weird. I'm Naomi Hale and this is my favourite thread on the forums.
Naomi Hale Children of New Eden 252	Posted - 2014.05.27 12:00:00 - [26] - Quote James Amril-Kesh wrote: Crazy Dave wrote: Any ship that is capable of carrying nuclear warheads can be manually detonated in extreme situations. I sure as **** hope not. I don't think he meant with the nuke... did he? I'm Naomi Hale and this is my favourite thread on the forums.
Aralyn Cormallen Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation 417	Posted - 2014.05.27 13:19:00 - [27] - Quote Naomi Hale wrote: Realism was never a part of EVE. It's closer than most games but it's still a game and therefore can never be realistic. In real life delicate computer and mechanical components don't tend to survive massive explosions unscathed. Since ships in EVE are almost always over 100m+ long any explosion that destroys the ship should ruin any working components. That's why I like the salvaging feature so much, you get burnt out, damaged or malfunctioning parts and scrap metal, which is what would be left in a destroyed ship. In EVE you don't even need to repair the modules you loot from wrecks, you can slap it straight on your hull. Not realistic. You should get salvaged parts and a lump of scrap metal equal to or less than the total mass of the ship, not intact ammo, turrets, launchers or hull plates. That's just weird. Oh, of course, but that applies both to self destruction and destruction at someone elses hands. The OP was pushing for self-destruction being somehow a "more effective" means of destroying your own ship, based on the fact that "it is" in real life. I was merely contesting that point, because as far as I can tell (of course, I'm no expert here), it isn't. Crazy Dave wrote: Not completely lopsided so that only one side wins. Not wishing to state the obvious, but I'm fairly sure when someone scuttles a warship in real life, it can't really be said that they've "won" anything. As I said in my first post (perhaps a little too sarcastically, apologies for that!), the point of scuttling is to prevent capture of the ship, and technically in EvE it does the same thing (since you are not ejecting). The difference here is not in the self-destruct mechanic, but in the fact there is rarely any reason to consider "abandoning ship" of your own volition, and the enemy have no means of capturing a ship against the owners will (no boarding mechanics or means of frying a pod while the ship remains intac) either, so there is no reason to have a mechanic to prevent such capture. Since you eject in pod at destruction the same as in ejection (and even ejecting to avoid skillpoint loss from T3's got changed so there was no longer this point to it), you might as well just ride it down. Perhaps if there was a reason to eject rather than await destruction, say if your pod automatically MJDed 100km from the ship (to get the pod away from close range tackle and maybe out of the clutches of warp bubbles), there might be a point to setting the self-destruct, and bailing out (in fact, at present, its preferable to await destruction, as you can spam warp while waiting to be ejected, rather than ejecting yourself and risk a delay before you warp that might cost you your pod). Alternatively, if setting the self destruct triggered a short-range aoe (and also took out your pod if you haven't bailed out and warped away in time), again, that gives a purpose to the mechanic of abandoning ship. To my mind, its not the self-destruct which is operating incorrectly - that's fine. It's just the mechanics that a self destruct are intended to prevent (ship capture) don't exist in the game in a manner to make the self-destruct relevant as a counter to it.
MatrixSkye Mk2 Republic University Minmatar Republic 807	Posted - 2014.05.27 13:44:00 - [28] - Quote Nakami Saans wrote: I've always felt that a self destruct feature should be a last resort option. You know you have no way out so instead of giving the aggressors the satisfaction of getting a kill and loot you self destruct. I also think a self destruct should send out a wave of destruction damaging anything in its radius, with damage varying depending on the size of the ship. This way you don't have a bunch of suicide Ibis' running into a fight. I also think you should be able to control the timer. Too much can happen in two minutes. As it stands now, the self destruct feature is ~~almost~~ useless. Fixed :P
Lady Garden 1	Posted - 2014.05.27 14:08:00 - [29] - Quote Overloading the warp drive to cause a localised subspace implosion could provide an effective and complete method of user-initiated ship disposal whilst satisfying the demands of high-sec safety.
Kijo Rikki Powder and Ball Alchemists Union The Predictables 684	Posted - 2014.05.27 14:10:00 - [30] - Quote This is obviously useful for killing a Klingon boarding party after you've safely beamed down to a planet surface. It is really hard to change your signature settings



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