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Sum DumHo
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Posted - 2006.06.11 06:01:00 -
[1]
Hello all. I was wondering if anyone had ever calculated the ft/lbs of force a 1400mm artillery can deliver?
I looked up a world war two gun called the Dora Using a handy calculator I found Here I calculated this 800mm artillery (real life one to boot) generated 8.5549e+8 ft/lbs of torque. Needless to say, this is more than enough force to knock nearly any non capital ship in the game nearly out of the system.
Anyone ever calculated the energy of the 1400s or larger artillery? Anyone ever got a "muzzle velocity" of the 1400s? I know Advances in Artillery Technology reduces the mass of a artillery shell, but also advances in propulsion technologies and the fact your firing it in a Drag free enviroment has surely raised the Muzzle velocity exponentailly.
Anyone else who is boored or knows care to help out?
PS Can I get one of those Dora guns listed on the website for a tempest or the new tier 3 minmatar battleship? Would be great fun to smack my friends and enemies about once they are dual webbed.  J/k
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KirStain
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Posted - 2006.06.11 06:09:00 -
[2]
Edited by: KirStain on 11/06/2006 06:14:33
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muzzle_energy
I've never seen anything relating to mass and velocity of the charges. |
Sum DumHo
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Posted - 2006.06.11 06:33:00 -
[3]
Good link, I think I'll go pester the GM's and Devs till they give me a answer
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Monica Foulkes
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Posted - 2006.06.11 08:28:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: KirStain
Edited by: KirStain on 11/06/2006 06:18:28
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muzzle_energy
I've never seen anything relating to mass and velocity of the charges, specifically. The velocity would be the hardest to estimate, anywhere between 20-80km/sec., just a guess.
Considering the muzzle velocity of a 175mm howitzer is just over 300m/s I would say your estimates are way off. But then again, in game you get insta hit at targets 200km+ away so the muzzle velocity is quite close to infinity
The 8h skill buffer | Insta BM Fix |
KirStain
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Posted - 2006.06.11 08:33:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Monica Foulkes
Originally by: KirStain
Edited by: KirStain on 11/06/2006 06:18:28
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muzzle_energy
I've never seen anything relating to mass and velocity of the charges, specifically. The velocity would be the hardest to estimate, anywhere between 20-80km/sec., just a guess.
Considering the muzzle velocity of a 175mm howitzer is just over 300m/s I would say your estimates are way off. But then again, in game you get insta hit at targets 200km+ away so the muzzle velocity is quite close to infinity
Just looking at how long after my weapon fires do I see damage on target.
Just imagine the force required to get a huge projectile to go that fast. Who needs MWD,  just aim in the oposite direction. |
Aduras Cartailin
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Posted - 2006.06.11 09:15:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Sum DumHo
PS Can I get one of those Dora guns listed on the website for a tempest or the new tier 3 minmatar battleship? Would be great fun to smack my friends and enemies about once they are dual webbed. J/k
Try one of these.
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Lorth
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Posted - 2006.06.11 09:18:00 -
[7]
You need to know the velocity, and thats not given at all. And the 'hits' in eve are instant, so you have no real way to figure it out.
The best you could do, is missile, assuming they have a stat for mass.
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Sum DumHo
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Posted - 2006.06.12 01:55:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Lorth
You need to know the velocity, and thats not given at all. And the 'hits' in eve are instant, so you have no real way to figure it out.
The best you could do, is missile, assuming they have a stat for mass.
OK Done. With maximum skills a raven firing a juggernaut javelin torpedo (chose this one because it did kinetic damage) generates 2.7348e+10 ft/lbs of torque. That much kinetic energy would move any battleship (Using a Apoc as a example as it has the highest mass of all the BS)It would sling a Apoc 11,120,039.17 meters in a single hit (If I calculated the kinetic energy correctly)
Ouch
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KirStain
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Posted - 2006.06.12 02:38:00 -
[9]
Edited by: KirStain on 12/06/2006 02:43:01
Torque is twisting force "spinning".
Applying force accelerates an object for the time that the force is applied. After to force stops the object still moves at the velocity it achieved until something else influences it.
The problem is the game uses under water physics, so you must know the drag coefficient.
Honestly, I don't see where you are trying to go with this. The game doesn't use "space" enviroment, it uses water as a medium. |
TheDeceit
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Posted - 2006.06.12 03:00:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Sum DumHo
Originally by: Lorth
You need to know the velocity, and thats not given at all. And the 'hits' in eve are instant, so you have no real way to figure it out.
The best you could do, is missile, assuming they have a stat for mass.
OK Done. With maximum skills a raven firing a juggernaut javelin torpedo (chose this one because it did kinetic damage) generates 2.7348e+10 ft/lbs of torque. That much kinetic energy would move any battleship (Using a Apoc as a example as it has the highest mass of all the BS)It would sling a Apoc 11,120,039.17 meters in a single hit (If I calculated the kinetic energy correctly)
Ouch
That would make fleet battles terribly fun!
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CutterJane
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Posted - 2006.06.12 04:55:00 -
[11]
Edited by: CutterJane on 12/06/2006 04:57:35
As others have said, its imposible to say how much muzzle energy any weapon in game would produce, as there are simply no numbers to work with.. the only hard number is the diameter of the weapon.
But, using a few moderate assumptions, you can get in the ballpark.
1) assuming the shot is identical to the projectile fired by a 16inch battleship gun, only scaled up to 1400mm.
2) the projectile speed is 100km per second. Probably way, way to fast, but thats easily the speed it reaches in game.
Considering this, the projectile would weigh approximately 50,000 kg. using the good old kinetic energy equation, KE = 1/2 * m * v2, the shot would generate about 250,000,000,000,000 joules of energy. Which is a lot. About 59 kilotons of energy.
Also broadside of 6 1400mm fired from a tempest would propel the tempest backwards at a nice 2700m/s due to recoil. Screw mwd's!
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Valeo Galaem
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Posted - 2006.06.12 05:03:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Sum DumHo
Originally by: Lorth
You need to know the velocity, and thats not given at all. And the 'hits' in eve are instant, so you have no real way to figure it out.
The best you could do, is missile, assuming they have a stat for mass.
OK Done. With maximum skills a raven firing a juggernaut javelin torpedo (chose this one because it did kinetic damage) generates 2.7348e+10 ft/lbs of torque. That much kinetic energy would move any battleship (Using a Apoc as a example as it has the highest mass of all the BS)It would sling a Apoc 11,120,039.17 meters in a single hit (If I calculated the kinetic energy correctly)
Ouch
Disregarding the improper physics terminology, this perception of missiles is wrong.
Usually, missiles are recoil-less. So launching one would produce no force acting on the ship that launched it.
Thar be Pirates
You are not authorised to hack into CONCORD's mainframe
Your Wallet has been emptied!
CONCORD Encryption |
Drizit
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Posted - 2006.06.12 06:03:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Drizit on 12/06/2006 06:05:28
The charge size would also need to be taken into consideration. Even a firecraker would move an artillery projectile and in space it would not stop moving although it wouldn't do much damage to the target.
Scaling up the chage size from a known artillery shell is inconsistant. The force generated sideways as well as forward into the projectile would blow the barrel apart unless the barrel casing was scaled up as well. This would make a 1400mm arty barrel somewhere in the region of 2.5m or more in diameter. Add to that acceleration of the shell which would require the barrel to be far longer to retain the same accuracy and you have one hell of a big gun. One of these would be roughly half the length of your Tempest.
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HippoKing
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Posted - 2006.06.12 06:39:00 -
[14]
The projectiles are insta-hit, so they must have infinite velocity (actually undefined, but go along with me here).
This means they need to accelerate to infinite speed in no time at all, giving us another undefined quantity (which we'll consider infinite). Force is equal to mass x acceleration, meaning it will be infinite. Of course, if you multiply this force by a vector, you get infinite torque.
As for the energy the projectile has, that would be (mv^2)/2 and given that m is infinite, thats infinite.
All in all, those are pretty impractical guns 
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Norath84
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Posted - 2006.06.12 07:37:00 -
[15]
Woud be fun if thay turned this on for a weekend on the test server
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New Ship Idea: Small Freighters (100k m¦) in EVE |
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