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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
X Gallentius
Justified Chaos
2327
   |
Posted - 2014.07.01 16:22:00 -
[61] - Quote
Smaller plex: Move VP/hour, Larger plex: More LP/hour. Interesting choices are better. |
Luwc
Biohazard.
WINMATAR.
159
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Posted - 2014.07.02 06:48:00 -
[62] - Quote
Gully Alex Foyle wrote:You've just set a pretty high bar for the July FW Epic Whine Awards.
People that cannot think of a proper argument tend to insult ;)
http://hugelolcdn.com/i/267520.gif |
Luwc
Biohazard.
WINMATAR.
159
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Posted - 2014.07.02 06:50:00 -
[63] - Quote
Crosi Wesdo wrote:Luwc wrote:You form a fleet to do offensive plexing with T1 frigs to be able to run novices. Sooner or later you will run out of novices and smalls to plex. The enemy forms cruisers and you have to go reship to cruisers just to see the hostile running away.
So you run the med and large... woops ... now its only small and novice again... burn 10jumps back. grab a frig to run a single site with your 10-20 man fleet. Try splitting your fleet.
and then keep loosing stuff like you do ? :p
http://hugelolcdn.com/i/267520.gif |
ALUCARD 1208
Spiritus Draconis
Drunk 'n' Disorderly
358
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Posted - 2014.07.02 07:21:00 -
[64] - Quote
coming from bio who couldnt even defend one system then switched sides 
GÖÑ HIGH FIVES GÖÑ-á |
Gully Alex Foyle
Black Fox Marauders
Repeat 0ffenders
891
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Posted - 2014.07.02 07:22:00 -
[65] - Quote
Luwc wrote:Gully Alex Foyle wrote:You've just set a pretty high bar for the July FW Epic Whine Awards. People that cannot think of a proper argument tend to insult ;) Except it was a compliment.
Including, as you did, so much bs in a single post is an impressive feat indeed. |
ALUCARD 1208
Spiritus Draconis
Drunk 'n' Disorderly
358
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Posted - 2014.07.02 07:24:00 -
[66] - Quote
Gully Alex Foyle wrote:ou've just set a pretty high bar for the July FW Epic Whine Awards.
At least bio would win something lol
GÖÑ HIGH FIVES GÖÑ-á |
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
Repeat 0ffenders
949
|
Posted - 2014.07.02 10:26:00 -
[67] - Quote
Luwc wrote:Crosi Wesdo wrote:Luwc wrote:You form a fleet to do offensive plexing with T1 frigs to be able to run novices. Sooner or later you will run out of novices and smalls to plex. The enemy forms cruisers and you have to go reship to cruisers just to see the hostile running away.
So you run the med and large... woops ... now its only small and novice again... burn 10jumps back. grab a frig to run a single site with your 10-20 man fleet. Try splitting your fleet. and then keep loosing stuff like you do ? :p
If you are afraid of losing things perhaps high sec pvp is more your pace? |
Vyktor Abyss
The Abyss Corporation
Abyss Alliance
520
|
Posted - 2014.07.02 11:01:00 -
[68] - Quote
Ahahah the irony. Too good. |
snake03
13
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Posted - 2014.07.02 11:58:00 -
[69] - Quote
Stalking Mantis wrote:I only subbed after reading a simular thread.
I heard there is plenty of action in the middleeast, man up and join...UNCLE SAM WANTS YOU!
I'm just a modern day caveman in search of a bigger club. |
Master Sergeant MacRobert
Space-Brewery-Association
24eme Legion Etrangere
65
|
Posted - 2014.07.02 12:51:00 -
[70] - Quote
To be honest, the more I think about the mechanism the more I think defensive plexing should be easier then offensive plexing.
If you are defending you run patrols to ensure the area remains safe. If you encounter hostiles you eliminate the threat. Then the level of security or system sovereignty is diminished.
The current gameplay design has determined that we should have active participation to lower system contested levels. Whilst this is sensible, why should it be that you can lower the level without any encounters with the enemy?
An alternative view would be to do away with defensive plexing all together!!!! Change it so that every 4 hours the level drops by 1% automatically. It only rises if someone offensive plex's.
You want to protect your system, you must now engage the enemy as they offensive plex and prevent plex completion. If they run more than two plex's in four hours then the contested level will go up.
Farming, in a defensive form, would be extinguished overnight. Protection of a system becomes a patrol and defend mechanism. You have to eliminate the enemy that tries to offensive plex or your system will become at risk over time. More combat!
Of course, this assumes there is a "workforce" of militia pilots that will be present 24/7 to guard these systems. Some systems would just get flipped on a regular basis. It could have the downside of clustering of Militia forces into some key essential systems.
I think that the current system has improved the warzone. Amarr has taken 4-5 systems since the change. This has been down to a concerted effort by organised groups. Most of the rest of the warzone is settling into low <10% contested.
The ease of defensive plexing will eventually lead to most systems being relatively stable unless a campaign (organised or at least persistent) is lead to take a particular system or set of systems. Should this not be how it should be? Systems can still be flipped with the right amount of effort.
It does put a downer on the influence to the War that casual play has but, this also should be so. Less effort less effect. You can still have an effect, particularly by eliminating enemies who would have plex'd.
However, I still think 7 spawns for a plex is too many. I think the ceiling should be 5 but, with the last one guaranteed to generate within the last 120 seconds of the plex completion.
Still do not agree with the Cov-Ops blanket ban but, we can live with it.
"remedy this situation or you shall spend-áthe rest of your life in a pain amplifier"
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Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
Repeat 0ffenders
949
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Posted - 2014.07.02 13:35:00 -
[71] - Quote
Vyktor Abyss wrote:Ahahah the irony. Too good.
Theres a difference between risking ships and throwing them away vyk. BTW, was nice flying with u the othe day, what happened? I thought 'we were through' lol. |
Vyktor Abyss
The Abyss Corporation
Abyss Alliance
520
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Posted - 2014.07.02 19:22:00 -
[72] - Quote
We are done - You're a complete ******** as far as I'm concerned and nothing you say or do will redeem or alter my opinion of you.
If a FC wants to let you fly with them too thats their choice - unlike you If I have an issue with someone I won't go throwing tantrums kicking people from comms, or go sending hate mail about how they will never be welcome in any fleet my character is booster in... I'm a bit more mature than you.
Instead I'll continue to enjoy my time in militia as happily and placidly as I did long ago when you were busy farming lvl 4s in highsec.
It just amuses me to see you lecturing people on risk and telling them to go PVP in highsec when we all know you're just a gobby risk averse highsec bear come to lowsec armed with EFT and a maxed out booster.
If you can't see the irony in your comment above then ok - more to be amused about. |
Baron' Soontir Fel
Justified Chaos
192
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Posted - 2014.07.02 19:53:00 -
[73] - Quote
The two things I don't like about the recent patch. Which are completely fixable in a small fixit patch.
1) NPC's shouldn't determine what PvP fit I can bring.
2) Tone down the amount of NPCs.
It really hurts me to see people who think that kiting is not valid or shouldn't be possible. You're a swordsman telling an archer he has no purpose on the battlefield. Rather than finding a horse (MWD) and running him down, you complain that the archer can kill you without you touching him. |
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
Repeat 0ffenders
949
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Posted - 2014.07.02 21:05:00 -
[74] - Quote
Vyktor Abyss wrote:We are done - You're a complete ******** as far as I'm concerned and nothing you say or do will redeem or alter my opinion of you.
If a FC wants to let you fly with them too thats their choice - unlike you If I have an issue with someone I won't go throwing tantrums kicking people from comms, or go sending hate mail about how they will never be welcome in any fleet my character is booster in... I'm a bit more mature than you.
Instead I'll continue to enjoy my time in militia as happily and placidly as I did long ago when you were busy farming lvl 4s in highsec.
It just amuses me to see you lecturing people on risk and telling them to go PVP in highsec when we all know you're just a gobby risk averse highsec bear come to lowsec armed with EFT and a maxed out booster.
If you can't see the irony in your comment above then ok - more to be amused about.
But... you did throw a tantrum and kicked off lol. Lecturing people on bad engagements =/= a lecture on risk.
You are kind of throwing a tantrum in this very thread. Is double irony like a double negative where it cancels out or more like multiplication?
EDIT, just had to check email to remind me what you kicked off about. It was me cutting you off on comms while you were giving bad slow brummy intel, i was also on grid and relayed the situation before you had finished you first 'errrr' lol.
Baron' Soontir Fel wrote:To the above suggestion:
I really like it, but system contested rates need to be able to drop by significant amount if the system is being actively defended. Say you're defending a system, and you kick out the invaders in every plex except the novice. Under your system, the contest rate will still rise. Which is bad as you can lose a system even when winning 75% of the plexes.
If there are roughly 5 perhaps 6 plexes per hour that = 3% contested rate if all plexes are won offensively. So the leaner decontest rate needs to be where if 3 of the plexes are defended and 3 are lost, the system retains the same contested rate.
So a passive decentest rate of 1.5% ish might be more realistic.
Only thing that cant decide if i like about it, is it wont actually change the way the warzone works. It will simply cut out defensive plexing with minimal other impact that i can see. |
Vyktor Abyss
The Abyss Corporation
Abyss Alliance
520
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Posted - 2014.07.02 22:07:00 -
[75] - Quote
would read but not worth the time o/ |
Luscar Seneca
Elysian.
Heiian Conglomerate
11
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Posted - 2014.07.02 22:21:00 -
[76] - Quote
Im still getting fights solo and small gang. Black Rise was recently the hottest region for kills. If anything needs to be changed, it is the 'risk averse' attitudes and not the mechanics. 'Risk aversion' being a euphimism for female parts and/or 'yellow bellies' which apply to both genders. Sorry ISD Es.
Get a gang, booster, crazy implants, drugs, whatever. Just go out there and lose ships. After all the rat in the plex isnt that big of a deal. Have fun out there, fly dangerously.
Ps. If Vik and Crosi are both Galls would you kindly move the argument to the 'lack of gal mil civil war' thread, please? :-)
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Zarnak Wulf
Amarrian Vengeance
Team Amarrica
1771
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Posted - 2014.07.03 04:15:00 -
[77] - Quote
A few quick points -
1) Systems require persistent, organized plexing to be turned now. Show up with a POS for different ships and a group of friends and the defensive plexing farmers will get off the field really fast. This is not a bad thing in any way, shape, or form. Taking systems should require effort and militia entities should not have to live in one system to avoid farmers via 'round the clock presence. I can make LP easily by just grabbing a ship and plexing. But any movement of the contested rate will be erased after I leave if it's not part of something greater. Victory through farming is a thing of the past and that can't be celebrated enough.
2) Several systems have fallen to Amarr since Kronos came out. Small corporations have moved into at least one system (cryptic on purpose) and have kept it relatively deplexed over the last three weeks. You can spread out of the primary systems. You'll get more combat that way. And FFS move into the damn warzone.
3) Why do people have to go 10 jumps to get into new ships?!? I know exactly where you were plexing and there was a friendly system one jump away. Bad logistics is bad, m'kay?
4) A lot of the criticism directed towards the plex changes is all over the place. Farmers are still out in force. But VP is down across the board. The new plexes eat ammo for breakfast and scare people away from them. But Farmers are still adapting. (with more expensive drone boats) Here is a random fact. Our home system is left undefended the majority of the day so we can plex elsewhere. After a week it finally moved into the 30% range. Oops. Try doing that before Kronos. You can dig yourself out now whereas before you where dependent on the other side getting fatigued.
5) You don't get one ship to rule them all for plexes. You just don't. Stop whining about it. The destroyers may work on smalls and even mediums but the Large plexes will drive you nuts in time and ammo expenditure. A Gila will eat mediums and be sufficient for larges but can't fit into smalls or novices. It's that persistant and organized thing. |
Luwc
Biohazard.
WINMATAR.
161
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Posted - 2014.07.03 06:45:00 -
[78] - Quote
GavinGoodrich wrote:OMG so happy to see the tears and the changes yay
and thats why you switched to one of the worst null sec alliances ?
http://hugelolcdn.com/i/267520.gif |
Gorski Car
ElitistOps
Pandemic Legion
303
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Posted - 2014.07.03 07:25:00 -
[79] - Quote
Running plexes and not missions. I hope none of you guys seriously does that.
#GORSKI4CSM
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4265138#post4265138
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Colt Blackhawk
Dissident Aggressors
Mordus Angels
297
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Posted - 2014.07.03 08:42:00 -
[80] - Quote
Luwc wrote:GavinGoodrich wrote:OMG so happy to see the tears and the changes yay and thats why you switched to one of the worst null sec alliances ?
There are good ones in null???
Btw: a winmatar loser talking about bad alliances is funny^^
[09:04:53] Ashira Twilight > Plant the f****** amarr flag and s*** on their smoking wrecks. |
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Veskrashen
Justified Chaos
290
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Posted - 2014.07.03 12:00:00 -
[81] - Quote
Gorski Car wrote:Running plexes and not missions. I hope none of you guys seriously does that.
Offensive plexing is about half the LP/hour with about 1/10 the effort. It's a good tradeoff for folks with limited time on hand, or those of us who actually have to put real ships on the line to run missions, or for newer folks without the requisite skills to mission well. |
Veskrashen
Justified Chaos
290
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Posted - 2014.07.03 12:06:00 -
[82] - Quote
Zarnak Wulf wrote: ***Lots of really good stuff***
This guy gets it.
Mission status: Accomplished.
I agree with my esteemed colleague Baron though, in that we need to be sure the NPCs don't make kiting fits unworkable. I'm kind of the opinion that the baseline should be that the plexes are easily doable in an appropriately sized ship; going up against larger NPCs than your ship should be somewhat more difficult but not impossible with proper skills and a T2 fit. As it is, kiting fits can't up-engage NPCs nearly as well as brawlers can. I'm not sure what to do on that score, other than potentially lower the tank of the small NPCs slightly to make missile frigates viable. Anything more than that and I'd be concerned about making it too easy on the farmers again.
Also, NPCs should shoot drones if the player's ship isn't a threat itself. But that's just me.
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Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
Repeat 0ffenders
949
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Posted - 2014.07.03 12:42:00 -
[83] - Quote
Veskrashen wrote:Gorski Car wrote:Running plexes and not missions. I hope none of you guys seriously does that. Offensive plexing is about half the LP/hour with about 1/10 the effort. It's a good tradeoff for folks with limited time on hand, or those of us who actually have to put real ships on the line to run missions, or for newer folks without the requisite skills to mission well.
+ the PvP that plexing routinely generates. |
Veskrashen
Justified Chaos
290
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Posted - 2014.07.03 13:13:00 -
[84] - Quote
Crosi Wesdo wrote:Veskrashen wrote:Gorski Car wrote:Running plexes and not missions. I hope none of you guys seriously does that. Offensive plexing is about half the LP/hour with about 1/10 the effort. It's a good tradeoff for folks with limited time on hand, or those of us who actually have to put real ships on the line to run missions, or for newer folks without the requisite skills to mission well. + the PvP that plexing routinely generates.
Sure, but Gorski Car's point was that plexing is suboptimal from an income generating standpoint. Those of us who plex to gain LP while we PvP aren't looking for efficiency in that way. Other than that, he's right when it comes to pure LP/hour, though LP/effort and LP/isk at risk is a different matter. |
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
Repeat 0ffenders
949
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Posted - 2014.07.03 14:00:00 -
[85] - Quote
Veskrashen wrote:Crosi Wesdo wrote:Veskrashen wrote:Gorski Car wrote:Running plexes and not missions. I hope none of you guys seriously does that. Offensive plexing is about half the LP/hour with about 1/10 the effort. It's a good tradeoff for folks with limited time on hand, or those of us who actually have to put real ships on the line to run missions, or for newer folks without the requisite skills to mission well. + the PvP that plexing routinely generates. Sure, but Gorski Car's point was that plexing is suboptimal from an income generating standpoint. Those of us who plex to gain LP while we PvP aren't looking for efficiency in that way. Other than that, he's right when it comes to pure LP/hour, though LP/effort and LP/isk at risk is a different matter.
Obviously, hes right from a farmers POV. Kinda goes without saying for a washed up nullbear. |
Yuri Antollare
Justified Chaos
63
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Posted - 2014.07.03 14:46:00 -
[86] - Quote
Well, there better be a ******* large upswing in activity soon or this one's a dud in my eyes, looks like the pendulum was pretty much broken and now my WZ aint swinging.
Also its not just kitey ships,
- Cloaky ships, gone
- Kitey frigs, gone
- Armor buffer frigs, gone
- ASB and AAR users in tears
- Dual rep, heavy tank frigs in tears
- Mid dps ships (AC Slashers, neuting tristans etc) in tears
- Solo EWAR boats, (Maulus etc) gone.
- AB/Scram boats with out a web, enjoy the rat scram kiting you out to 30km off the button before you kill it. Enjoy having a guy warp in 30 off you when you're AB fit.
- If you think even the novice rat doesnt make a difference in a close fight, well you might as well meta your guns for the same effect.
Thats just the reduction in content from a novice plex.
- Very few frigates can sit in a small or heaven forbid a medium and wait for a fight.
- Quite a large range of dessie fits can struggle in smalls and hopeless in mediums
- Frigate v Cruiser combat is effectively dead, most times if you succesfully engage the cruiser you are under their guns and unable to stop the constant rat dps from the ******* npc 13km away.
- Time to finish offensive plex, go to enemy militia home system, pop a small, kill one WT and 4 rats, look at timer, 9 minutes left..... **** me, blobbed by ten WT who have had a good 20 minutes to get their asses in gear, as pod is warping out, count 7 npc wrecks and 30 seconds left on timer.
Have I mentioned how damn annoying offensive plexing is now? Massive reduction in variety of fits/combat and a massive increase in annoyance factor was not on my christmas list. With every ship thats knocked out of FW its "only affects a small section of people," when you get to the point everyone is rocking max dps fits you know those small sections have started to add up.
And for what exactly? So some nullbear can only buy 5 tengus from his FW alt LP and not 7? I feel like I broke a finger and the hospital amputated my arm at the shoulder  |
Andre Vauban
Quantum Cats Syndicate
Repeat 0ffenders
303
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Posted - 2014.07.03 14:50:00 -
[87] - Quote
Gorski Car wrote:Running plexes and not missions. I hope none of you guys seriously does that.
A lot of Gallente do. I can triple box running plexes and can pvp at the same time. I usually run 1 dplex alt and two offensive plexers. I find I get more fights that way if I'm trolling around with 2 plexers. The only bad thing is when I get two fights at once :) It is also a lot more casual to run a plex in a T1 frig, destroyer, or cruiser than it is to run missions in a T3 or an Ishtar.
QCATS is recruiting:-á
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3896299 |
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
Repeat 0ffenders
949
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Posted - 2014.07.03 15:01:00 -
[88] - Quote
I can still use kites to pvp in all size plexes. However, since the changes i have completed a total of 1 novice plex solo during the heyd push... it took so long i honestly eft'd a new mission boat. |
X Gallentius
Justified Chaos
2331
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Posted - 2014.07.03 17:33:00 -
[89] - Quote
Colt Blackhawk wrote:
2.) Moved to galmil. Not accepted there and missions were not farmable so moved to amarrmil because...ah they thought they can farm amarrmil stuff^^
Correction: They were accepted in Gallente Militia. No problems at all tbh.
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Rahelis
Amarrian Vengeance
Team Amarrica
73
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Posted - 2014.07.04 10:56:00 -
[90] - Quote
Changes are exellent - tons of fights with minnies and pirates in amarr space.
We are making progress taking systems one by one through constant combat.
FW should be run by roleplay and devotion to your mili - not isk farming.
For isk farming null sec was made - all the farmers should move to null and leave the system in which they are when one unfriendly shows in local.
Isk farming is now done with FW missions - what is fine. At least that is some content and not stabbed t1 frig. |
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