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Mathew fluffersom
Caliban Logistics and Storage
Axion Bionics
0
   |
Posted - 2014.06.19 15:04:00 -
[1] - Quote
The title says it all, make the universe bigger.
Space comes under N3 or CFC, it's time to expand EVE to allow other corps to own a system.
Yeah people could take those systems but corps who have a strong fleet could hold the system without causing war and taking them from CFC or N3. |
Thorr VonAsgard
Never Surrender.
14
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 15:06:00 -
[2] - Quote
Add new systems in nullsec and CFC or N3 will take them...
It's not the solution.
The solution is to revemap the sov mechanics so, coaltions will be unable to old that much space. |
Frostys Virpio
The Mjolnir Bloc
The Bloc
1125
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Posted - 2014.06.19 15:08:00 -
[3] - Quote
Mathew fluffersom wrote:The title says it all, make the universe bigger.
Space comes under N3 or CFC, it's time to expand EVE to allow other corps to own a system.
Yeah people could take those systems but corps who have a strong fleet could hold the system without causing war and taking them from CFC or N3.
And what exactly would prevent N3/CFC from taking that new space just like they did with the current one? Is their organisation power and efficiency at the very limit? Are they unable to make a larger excel file to list their rentable systems? Is there a hard cap on how much SOV an entity not even implemented in the game can hold? |
Mathew fluffersom
Caliban Logistics and Storage
Axion Bionics
0
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 15:18:00 -
[4] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Mathew fluffersom wrote:The title says it all, make the universe bigger.
Space comes under N3 or CFC, it's time to expand EVE to allow other corps to own a system.
Yeah people could take those systems but corps who have a strong fleet could hold the system without causing war and taking them from CFC or N3. And what exactly would prevent N3/CFC from taking that new space just like they did with the current one? Is their organisation power and efficiency at the very limit? Are they unable to make a larger excel file to list their rentable systems? Is there a hard cap on how much SOV an entity not even implemented in the game can hold?
CFC and N3 and too busy fighting each other to take space back from a fleet of cap ships. It would be smart to take the space then offer your services as an allie then they wouldn't take the space.
They value cap pilots and would make an allie, not an enemy. |
RoAnnon
Eternity INC.
Goonswarm Federation
335
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 15:26:00 -
[5] - Quote
Mathew fluffersom wrote:CFC and N3 and too busy fighting each other to take space...
No we're not 
So, you're a bounty hunter.
No, that ain't it at all.
Then what are you?
I'm a bounty hunter. |
Samillian
Angry Mustellid
561
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 15:30:00 -
[6] - Quote
I take no joy in my belief that like a gas the major power blocs would simply expand their rental empires to fill any volume of worthwhile space added to EvE.
Result, more of the same.
Mathew fluffersom wrote:CFC and N3 and too busy fighting each other to take space back from a fleet of cap ships. It would be smart to take the space then offer your services as an allie then they wouldn't take the space.
They value cap pilots and would make an allie, not an enemy.
This leads me to believe you need to do more research into the politics of NullSec and that you have very little idea of the resources that either of these entities can put in the field if they care to.
NBSI shall be the whole of the Law |
Lady Zarrina
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
135
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 15:39:00 -
[7] - Quote
There needs to be a benefit to having unowned space.
There also needs to be a significant penalty for owning half of null-sec..
damn it is hard to delete my signature |
Dally Lama
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
11
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 15:43:00 -
[8] - Quote
Ditch timers. Half effective jump range.
TADA!
New Fitting Window | Exact Distances Above 10km | Remove all inactive contacts |
Mathew fluffersom
Caliban Logistics and Storage
Axion Bionics
0
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 15:58:00 -
[9] - Quote
Samillian wrote:I take no joy in my belief that like a gas the major power blocs would simply expand their rental empires to fill any volume of worthwhile space added to EvE. Result, more of the same. Mathew fluffersom wrote:CFC and N3 and too busy fighting each other to take space back from a fleet of cap ships. It would be smart to take the space then offer your services as an allie then they wouldn't take the space.
They value cap pilots and would make an allie, not an enemy. This leads me to believe you need to do more research into the politics of NullSec and that you have very little idea of the resources that either of these entities can put in the field if they care to.
I live in null, N3 space. I know from locals that 10 cap ship pilots are more useful than owning a system. I'm aware of how much they own as well, they own a lot but still value cap ship pilots over a system, without them they have nothing. |
Mathew fluffersom
Caliban Logistics and Storage
Axion Bionics
0
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 16:04:00 -
[10] - Quote
I'd suggest limiting the amount of space they can own but they'd have alts and alt corps who would then go and control other systems. |
Lola Partola
Parental Control Academy
0
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 16:05:00 -
[11] - Quote
There is only one solution they must somehow ban or not allowed to rent a system and then you'll see how the map will change |
Hakaari Inkuran
State War Academy
Caldari State
50
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 16:10:00 -
[12] - Quote
I thought the newest trailer was hinting at new space soon. I bet there will be no way to move capitals from current space to the new space, if so. That would help shake things up. |
Speedkermit Damo
Demonic Retribution
292
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 16:11:00 -
[13] - Quote
CCP should just turn every region occupied by renter alliances into NPC space.
Don't Panic.
|
Owen Levanth
Federated Deep Space Explorations
187
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 16:17:00 -
[14] - Quote
Speedkermit Damo wrote:CCP should just turn every region occupied by renter alliances into NPC space.
Or W-Space. Last I heard, wormhole systems are still free of the great power blocks. |
De'Veldrin
Black Serpent Technologies
The Unthinkables
2258
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 16:20:00 -
[15] - Quote
Owen Levanth wrote:Speedkermit Damo wrote:CCP should just turn every region occupied by renter alliances into NPC space. Or W-Space. Last I heard, wormhole systems are still free of the great power blocks.
Just because there's no name on the flag doesn't mean there's no flag.
GÇ£SandboxGÇ¥ does not mean that you will succeed at anything you attempt; it means you can attempt anything you want to succeed at. One of the largest obstacles in the way of your success is other players.
Schr+¦dinger's Hotdropper |
Mathew fluffersom
Caliban Logistics and Storage
Axion Bionics
0
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 17:06:00 -
[16] - Quote
De'Veldrin wrote:Owen Levanth wrote:Speedkermit Damo wrote:CCP should just turn every region occupied by renter alliances into NPC space. Or W-Space. Last I heard, wormhole systems are still free of the great power blocks. Just because there's no name on the flag doesn't mean there's no flag.
Easier to burn a flag if there's no name on it
|
Iain Cariaba
In Over Our Heads
61
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 17:17:00 -
[17] - Quote
Lola Partola wrote:There is only one solution they must somehow ban or not allowed to rent a system and then you'll see how the map will change
There is no in game system that allows renting of systems, so there's no way to put in a way to stop it.
Speedkermit wrote:CCP should just turn every region occupied by renter alliances into NPC space.
Again, rental space is determined by players outside of the established game mechanics. If you hate renter alliances that much, go take their space.
If I agreed with you, we'd both be wrong. |
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
1029
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 17:24:00 -
[18] - Quote
I think it would be a much better solution to make it not worthwhile for the big powerblocks to hold so much space. I expect there are already a lot of plans in the works for the next SOV revamp.
For starters I would significantly reduce jump range, or significantly increase the distance between regions. Curb the power projection, and they will no longer bother to hold hundreds of systems they do not use.
That leads to my next point. these huge power blocks hold hundreds of systems, most of which are just empty buffer systems, occasionally rented out. to protect core systems from attack. If the jump range was reduced such big buffers would not be needed.
Another change that could really help curb the issue of a couple power blocks dominating Null would be to put in measures to control the size of fleet battles. While it is truly epic to be in a battle with thousands of other pilots, the server nodes can only handle so much. It is very frustrating to be in a battle with such heavy time dilation that a few minutes worth of activity takes 30 minutes of more to play out.
What I suggest is a way to limit these engagements, and support it from a lore perspective as well. My Idea is to limit the mass per hour that can be cyno'd into a system. Not a limit per cyno becon, but per system. From a lore point of view it could be said that so much mass jumping into a system can destabilize the system it self, it would cause additional ships locked onto a cyno there to be deflected landing in a random system in that constellation. I am not talking about a small limit here, but a limit based on the load the server nodes can handle without TiDi. Large fights can still happen, but once the limit is reached, additional pilots will have to wait 1 hour before they can join in. Spread out the load, and give smaller alliances a fighting chance, as the big power blocks can not commit there full capital fleets at the drop of a hat. This could accomplish several things.
1- It would limit power projection, in that battles will no longer be whoever brings the most caps wins, it would be whoever is the best organized to get their fleet in before the system destabilizes would have the advantage. Defending systems will require planing to get you fleet in place before an invasion, and not holding space you can not defend. a surprise attack on your left flank while all your fleets are on the right flank could be devastating.
2- A much smaller alliance, with better organization, could win battles against the big power blocks. At the same time, staging systems would be easier to defend, as the home fleet could be bigger than the maximum size of an invading fleet. this would add a layer to sov warfare. it would no longer be possible to simply invade a staging system, you would have to draw them out, or make several attacks to wear them down. Break those huge fights down in to several not so huge fights.
3- The cap could be set at a point wear time dilation would be much more manageable, and the largest fights, would actually be fun, not a TiDi nightmare. Sure, it sucks to put a limit on fleet size, but the limits are already there, even with TiDi recent fleet battles have gone over the limit. Just because TiDi has kept servers from crashing, does not mean the fights are not to much for the servers to handle. |
Evei Shard
Shard Industries
315
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 17:36:00 -
[19] - Quote
Space needs to be expanded, but not just by a thousand systems. Several thousand at least. Enough that it is impossible for the entire subscriber base to effectively use all of it.
Even through renting, spreading out empires really thin in order to cover a huge region would invite other groups to say "why are we renting? we never see our landlords" and take that space for themselves.
A huge amount of space to cover would force any alliance to choose their borders. Right now, through power projection and sheer numbers, they are capable of maintaining large amounts of space, but sooner or later, through adding more systems, there is a manpower limit that is reached.
Cover a large enough area, and sooner or later someone is going to come in and remove renters from your fringe systems.
Yes, this means lots of empty null-sec space where some systems don't see players for days, but it would make the universe large enough that coalitions simply can't control more than a small portion of it.
Profit favors the prepared |
RavenTesio
Liandri Corporation
Liandri Covenant
124
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 17:53:00 -
[20] - Quote
Mathew fluffersom wrote:The title says it all, make the universe bigger.
Space comes under N3 or CFC, it's time to expand EVE to allow other corps to own a system.
Yeah people could take those systems but corps who have a strong fleet could hold the system without causing war and taking them from CFC or N3.
They will be... but there are some MASSIVE overhauls of systems in place that NEED to happen before they add anymore space as right now doing so would only expand the potential wealth (which is already absolutely ludicrous) that the major power blocs have as they'll just swarm through the new space; planting flags and installing new Renters / Pets.
What CCP's visions /appears/ to be is one that encourages major powers to create their own form of Empire Space.
As it stands if you look at the major Null-Sec Factions, while they claim massive swaths of it... where people /actually/ "live" is actually just a fraction of it. Basically Null-Sec is damn near identical to Amarr Space or Arizona, for most part just whole lot of nothing - but every so often you'll come across some major metropolis filled with people ready to shoot you because they're bored that day; can't blame them there's basically naff all to do.
Now personally one thing that would help the game right now would be a change to the Jump Portal mechanics...
Something like:
Limited Mass per Jump Portal (Something like a C3/4 Wormhole Mass before destabilising)
A Jump Bridge requires 2 Jump Portals to be Active (Start and End Point) [and yes I do include Covert Ops Portals in that]
Jump Portals have a 120 Second Cycle Time (Covert can still be 30, but would have a C1/C2 Mass)
Cynosural Fields should also require Capacitor to remain open / online, but even if you cap out the cycle time remains the same; so you'd end up stuck waiting for the time with no Cyno there until someone fed you cap. This would likely lead to Carriers or Logistics being jumped initially with only a small protection force (if any) so again a good way to ensure fights as those dropping have to logistically try to maintain the Bridge point.
The range is fine, but limiting the effectiveness and forcing Titans / Black Ops to be each end.
I can guarantee you that would cut-down on response times, fleet projection capabilities and lead to more fights.
One of the biggest issues is being able to easily move large fleets about, and cost frankly while sure might be irritating it has gone up; frankly is still a drop in the bucket and just screws over the "little guy" more. Instead the mechanics themselves have to really force a bottleneck on force projection and movement, being unable to properly provide back-up to an area - would mean either spreading out their forces, or losing that space.
...
Mind not sure how easy it would be to do, but you really want some Space under the current mechanics... figure a way to sow dissent within the Coalitions to a point where each of the members of any given coalition then rip themselves apart from the inside out. I mean I wouldn't imagine it would be that difficult to play egos' off of each other for riches, pride, etc...
Another options is hitting them where it hurts, their passive income; tempt renters away, do coordinated strikes against moons, heck you start hitting random R32 / R64 moons in the name of another group; or trick said group in someway to get involved, and a misunderstanding later and either you have diplomatic nightmare that will flair tempers, sow dissent and eventually Coalition Civil War.
That'll never break up particularly strong and closely knit groups, but something like N3 or CFC; honestly those groups are purely kept together out of fear of the established main group - you just need to find the weakest link, exploit it and watch things implode then explode.
Shouldn't even be that hard right now, long-standing "peace" tends to have that effect on pilots in big alliances / blocs ... they're just looking for an excuse for the galaxy to burn and for them to be involved in it. Of course leaderships will always try to limit such things because it's more profitable (and easier) to deal with peace time throwing the masses at proxy wars to fix the boredom. |
Hakaari Inkuran
State War Academy
Caldari State
50
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 17:56:00 -
[21] - Quote
Evei Shard wrote:Space needs to be expanded, but not just by a thousand systems. Several thousand at least. Enough that it is impossible for the entire subscriber base to effectively use all of it.
Even through renting, spreading out empires really thin in order to cover a huge region would invite other groups to say "why are we renting? we never see our landlords" and take that space for themselves.
A huge amount of space to cover would force any alliance to choose their borders. Right now, through power projection and sheer numbers, they are capable of maintaining large amounts of space, but sooner or later, through adding more systems, there is a manpower limit that is reached.
Cover a large enough area, and sooner or later someone is going to come in and remove renters from your fringe systems.
Yes, this means lots of empty null-sec space where some systems don't see players for days, but it would make the universe large enough that coalitions simply can't control more than a small portion of it.
It would also completely unbalance risk and reward in the PVE aspect of the game, doing bad things to the market. |
Evei Shard
Shard Industries
315
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 18:20:00 -
[22] - Quote
Hakaari Inkuran wrote:Evei Shard wrote:Space needs to be expanded, but not just by a thousand systems. Several thousand at least. Enough that it is impossible for the entire subscriber base to effectively use all of it.
Even through renting, spreading out empires really thin in order to cover a huge region would invite other groups to say "why are we renting? we never see our landlords" and take that space for themselves.
A huge amount of space to cover would force any alliance to choose their borders. Right now, through power projection and sheer numbers, they are capable of maintaining large amounts of space, but sooner or later, through adding more systems, there is a manpower limit that is reached.
Cover a large enough area, and sooner or later someone is going to come in and remove renters from your fringe systems.
Yes, this means lots of empty null-sec space where some systems don't see players for days, but it would make the universe large enough that coalitions simply can't control more than a small portion of it.
It would also completely unbalance risk and reward in the PVE aspect of the game, doing bad things to the market.
How? It doesn't change the abilities of the playerbase. If you're thinking about more material being brought in from deep space, it would still need to be transported all the way through old-nullsec just to get to Empire where the material would sell for best value.
Properly built mini-empires would have outposts and such that would allow for self sufficiency. Creating null-sec commerce islands. It might even encourage groups to not just shoot everything that flies into their space.
If you're worried about ratting income, that would need to be looked at, but it's not like expanding the universe is some trivial task in the first place. Of course i needs to be looked at in regards to what it would do to the economy, and balancing can be done based on that. Don't throw the idea out over issues that can be resolved.
Profit favors the prepared |
epicurus ataraxia
Z3R0 Return Mining Inc.
Illusion of Solitude
816
|
Posted - 2014.06.19 18:48:00 -
[23] - Quote
I do hope the new space is not just more of the same, whilst there needs to be a reward and reason for people to get together and expend time and effort to open things up, one would not like to see it just another owned block of real estate to passive farm and rent.
CCP seagull, is letting very little out, but I hope she is thinking BIG.
There is an opportunity to leave all the poor and questionable decisions behind without breaking the current game and strategies that have been worked out, I just hope there is a new opportunity for both Solo small and medium corp play and not just another area to do "blob" in.
There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE |
Speedkermit Damo
Demonic Retribution
292
|
Posted - 2014.06.21 10:35:00 -
[24] - Quote
Iain Cariaba wrote:Lola Partola wrote:There is only one solution they must somehow ban or not allowed to rent a system and then you'll see how the map will change There is no in game system that allows renting of systems, so there's no way to put in a way to stop it. Speedkermit wrote:CCP should just turn every region occupied by renter alliances into NPC space. Again, rental space is determined by players outside of the established game mechanics. If you hate renter alliances that much, go take their space.
Why? Clearly there's far more sov systems than the game needs. Only two coalitions are strong enough to be able to hold and defend sov. They hold far more space than they require, and hold all the rest just to deny it to anyone else. No wonder most of the playerbase stay in highsec.
Don't Panic.
|
Rhealee
PH0ENIX COMPANY
Cult of War
23
|
Posted - 2014.06.21 11:30:00 -
[25] - Quote
I love the idea of more systems added to the game. I hope we have to find them and build them up some how. But i dont think anything is wrong with the current setup. So many people ***** and moan about how others choose to play in the sandbox. Well if you dont like it get up and go somewhere else and do something new and different. The game is plenty big for anyone to find the right spot for them. So quit suggesting we punish other people for their choices and just mindyour own business and do your own thing. And power blocs control too much my ass. I took 20 guys and stole sov many times. If you're too lazy to go fight for something you want or dont want to work for your goal that's no one else's problem but your own. These forums are full of people whining about this or that. Quit bitching and get your ass up and do something about it or stfu.
My two cents. |
Bohneik Itohn
Amarrian Salvage Gnomes and Associates
309
|
Posted - 2014.06.21 13:41:00 -
[26] - Quote
More content is never a bad thing.
More space isn't going to mean that the fringes of space suddenly become the Oklahoma homesteading land-grab races though. Everybody who rushes out there will just be giving the big sov holders something to blow up while they grind it down.
Fix sov or remove it, then add more systems or add more WH systems and tweak them a bit to encourage a little bit more habitation.
Wait, CCP kills kittens now too?!-á - Freyya
Are you a forum alt? Have you ever wondered why your experience on the forums is always so frustrating and unrewarding? This may help. |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
1382
|
Posted - 2014.06.21 13:50:00 -
[27] - Quote
More space is not what is needed.
More content in the same space is the relevant thing.
Right now, systems are pretty barren, you might have 5-10 sigs 'worth running'. Another bunch considered not worth the time. And.... Oh, a few moons with POS'es which unless you reinforce in 5 minutes you will get ubber cap dropped. And a bit of PI going on. A few perma respawning ore sites, and a myriad of mostly pointless belts that actually get used mainly to try and spawn officer rats.
Work out good ways to increase the amount of content, especially co-operative content that really rewards working together in smart ways, so that a system can be a home to a vibrant active corp of 100, rather than that corp needing 50 systems to make an income over, and suddenly you don't need anywhere near as much sov for a single alliance.
Also sov costs can go up a bit to match the density which makes vast swathes of un-used space less attractive to hold then since your 5000 man alliance now only needs 50 systems + some buffer for safety, but still possibly if an alliance really wants to hold 500. |
Bohneik Itohn
Amarrian Salvage Gnomes and Associates
309
|
Posted - 2014.06.21 14:37:00 -
[28] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:More space is not what is needed.
More content in the same space is the relevant thing.
Right now, systems are pretty barren, you might have 5-10 sigs 'worth running'. Another bunch considered not worth the time. And.... Oh, a few moons with POS'es which unless you reinforce in 5 minutes you will get ubber cap dropped. And a bit of PI going on. A few perma respawning ore sites, and a myriad of mostly pointless belts that actually get used mainly to try and spawn officer rats.
Work out good ways to increase the amount of content, especially co-operative content that really rewards working together in smart ways, so that a system can be a home to a vibrant active corp of 100, rather than that corp needing 50 systems to make an income over, and suddenly you don't need anywhere near as much sov for a single alliance.
Also sov costs can go up a bit to match the density which makes vast swathes of un-used space less attractive to hold then since your 5000 man alliance now only needs 50 systems + some buffer for safety, but still possible if an alliance really wants to hold 500.
You assume that sov remains the same if space were expanded, whereas anyone who has addressed the issue has said "change sov or remove it, then expand".
Fix or remove sov, and null won't be so empty. When null becomes busy, having a new frontier to play in will be icing on the cake.
Oh, and increasing null income is not how you fix sov.
Wait, CCP kills kittens now too?!-á - Freyya
Are you a forum alt? Have you ever wondered why your experience on the forums is always so frustrating and unrewarding? This may help. |
Brutalis Furia
Hammer and Anvil Industries
6
|
Posted - 2014.06.28 03:17:00 -
[29] - Quote
If we assume that the aim is to break up the blocs or fracture null to the end of creating more opportunity for smaller entities, then the solution isn't more space. The solution has to do with overhead: you have to create a disincentive for any single entity to hold space just for the sake of holding it.
The how is a total rework of Sov mechanics, but simply adding more space to the equation isn't the answer. |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
6194
|
Posted - 2014.06.28 04:40:00 -
[30] - Quote
More space for renting out :3
^^ Delicious goon ((tech nerf, siphon, drone assist, supercap)) tears.
Taking a wrecking ball to the futile hopes and broken dreams of skillless blobbers. |
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