I do not believe Plex takes isk out of the game, it is a net 0 effect.

So... CCP are operating like the Federal Reserve or the Bank Of England; controlling inflation through Quantitive Easing or destruction of hard currency and interest rates?

Um.. isnt that it?

Yes - but only IF they do it like I wrote. I have no idea if this is their approach to keep ISK stable.

wait, what? CCP isn't the one taking the 600+m for your plex, it's another player. Bartender, I'll have what he's having... make it a double.

i would like to know if someone knows how CCP controls in- and deflation. I posted my idea or thoughts, but I am not sure what they are doing.

Because in one thread someone said plex price is raising 15% a year - so I would assume that our inflation is at 15% - that is kinda high.

Isk is far easier to make than it was 3, 4 or 5 years ago, so that probably has an effect too

In- and deflation is only driven by how much money CCP puts into and takes out of the eve universe.

Now it would be nice to know how much ISK CCP puts into the game and off the game. It is kinda hard to believe that the community generates more ISK with npc pirate bounty and mission rewards than it destroys with all the other points from the other list.

What do you think? Do we have any informations about that?

But what happens if 90% of all manufacturer would stop doing their business?

CCP charges less ISK for one plex?

Insurance ADDS ISK to the economy.

Unless you mentioned it somewhere and I missed it,
but in the initial post it's in the wrong category.

And aren't there still NPC buyorders around?
Especially for WH loot? Is that still a thing?


I get the impression that you're not really qualified to question CCPs doings.

Almost nothing, as others would instantly fill the void.

CCP doesn't charge any ISK for PLEX.

That means it is far easier to farm npc pirates or do missions now?

Because there is no other way to generate money into eve universe. Everything else like trading or hauler contracts is just cash flow inside eve universe and has nothing to do with in- and deflation.

(1) CCP charges less ISK for one plex? I thought they charge more ISK for one plex. That would mean, that you take more ISK out of game instead of leave it in game for a plex.

(2) And if you buy a plex for euros or dollars, it has no influence on in- or deflation. Because it does not generate any ISK in eve universe.

Well, of course, but this questions was about that nobody fills the void ;)

I thought you can buy plex time bonus for ISK. But I think that I missunderstood it.

I think you missed clone costs in your list.

Google is your friend. We have tons of information about this, along with the measures they have to adjust the habits of players.

I thought you can buy plex time bonus for ISK. But I think that I missunderstood it.

Well - I used google and didn't find any information about what I asked. There were no information about if they change any spawn rates of NPCs or if they do something else to work against inflation.

You google-fu is weak then. All the things on that list can and have been adjusted, as have all the items on the corresponding item faucet/sink list. Every item is a tool at their disposal to adjust inflation, should it prove necessary. Inflation rarely reaches the levels where it's needed, though, especially since it often just evens itself out on its own by transitioning into periods of deflation.

When did they change the price of an item from sink or faucet list?

This happens way to late and is not dynamically - it changes only during big announces and patches. But not during runtime.

Maybe that is why we have a 15% inflation every year.

Of course it takes money out of the game. CCP wants 600M or something from you for a plex. That means that CCP takes 600M out of the game.

It happens when it needs to happen, which is very very rarely since the economy is largely self-balancing at this point.

No, they don't.

CCP does not sell PLEX for ISK; it only sells PLEX for dollars.

Since you know everything - what is the current inflation in eve?

I think you've too much trust into a self balancing economy. And when I see prices a year ago and now, I doubt that inflation is not close to 15%.

And any yearly inflation is bad for an economy. Especially when you've the possibility to zero it.

All that I can read from you is that you do not know it either. I'll take a look at some prices over many years to get a better understanding of the real inflation.

Of course it takes money out of the game. CCP wants 600M or something from you for a plex. That means that CCP takes 600M out of the game.

Of course it takes money out of the game. CCP wants 600M or something from you for a plex. That means that CCP takes 600M out of the game.

Because in one thread someone said plex price is raising 15% a year ....

How PLEX works.

Player A goes to the eve online website and purchases a PLEX and redeems it in game.

Player A then sells PLEX on the market for ##### isk.

Player B needs a PLEX to either extend an account or use it for some other service CCP provides.

Player B buys a PLEX/PLEX's from the market and Player A gets isk for said sell.

Its a transfer of ISK from 1 player to another. The only isk removed from this is from the sells tax from Player A.

When did they change the price of an item from sink or faucet list?

No, that's not how it works. To answer your original question: CCP does nothing because it's a player controlled market.

*During the dr.'s presentation at fan fest he mentioned that CCP did take measures to stop the sudden spike in plex prices in game, because they were afraid of the bubble, so the price stabilized and steadily climbed, he never said how they did it however, but I personally think that when ccp bans and account or confiscates monies that they take the plex too if its a bot account, thuse they have all these plex's they can use on accounts long dead. But that's me.

So what's up with the rising PLEX prices?

According to CCP, usage of PLEXes has increased steadily year on year as the playerbase has grown and new services acceping PLEX have been introduced, but the stock on the market hasn't increased. The price has risen sharply in the past few months to over 710 million ISK, but the number on the market has decreased. PLEX in the EVE economy acts almost like gold in the real world, making it a reliable investment.

On the question of how high prices could go for PLEX if the market were left unchecked, Dr Eyjo commented that the prices on the Chinese server, Serenity, have already reached 3.6 billion ISK per PLEX. It was revealed that CCP actually intervened in the PLEX market to prevent a runaway price spike just a few weeks ago by selling some PLEX from the EVE Central Reserves on the open market.

A net value of around 20-25 trillion ISK is reportedly injected into the game each month, a level that Dr Eyjo insists isn't enough to cause any inflationary problems in the economy.

Now it would be nice to know how much ISK CCP puts into the game and off the game. It is kinda hard to believe that the community generates more ISK with npc pirate bounty and mission rewards than it destroys with all the other points from the other list.

....

Well - I used google and didn't find any information about what I asked. There were no information about if they change any spawn rates of NPCs or if they do something else to work against inflation.

**more on topic:

Punitively fining "pirates" in high sec would be a GREAT ISK sink! Yay! Fatally fine the pirates!

Because all the prices and rewards are static, CCP can't setup anything to work against inflation or deflation. Or am I wrong?

Yeah, you're wrong. CCP can create inflation or deflation by adjusting the availability of mineral resources.

Except that has nothing to do with inflation or deflation.
Refer to my earlier post about misunderstanding inflation as opposed to supply & demand.

TLDR Version, No, you are wrong.

Of course it takes money out of the game. CCP wants 600M or something from you for a plex. That means that CCP takes 600M out of the game.

Hang on what now?

Supply, demand and confidence are at the root of inflation. High demand , low supply pushes up what people will pay for an item , therefore making it cost more. ergo the price inflates.

When this happens on a broad front across the economy you get inflation

Low demand, high supply leads to merchants falling over themselves to sell their goods, thereby competing with each other, and the price people are willing to pay, ergo the price deflates.

When this happens on a broad front across the economy you get deflation.


messing around with mineral resources can lead to inflation or deflation.

Anything else is semantics

For me personally plex is just about at a breaking point if it goes up much higher I will not be able to maintain my play style and will have to drop my second account that would lead to me dropping both accounts as playing EVE with only one account just doesn't work for me.

For PvE playstyles, inflation is countered by power creep. It doesn't really conform with CCP's 'anti-power creep' stance, but it's what they're doing anyway.

Of course it takes money out of the game. CCP wants 600M or something from you for a plex. That means that CCP takes 600M out of the game.

Not always.

CCP keeps a pretty close eye on the rate at which PLEX prices change, and they have been known to sell plex directly in game themselves to control that rate of change*. In that case, the money goes into some CCP vault as is not returned to the economy like it would be if the purchase was made from another player.


*Note: It's my understanding that it's the rate of change of the price (+öp) that CCP cares about, not necessarily the actual in game price (p).

Except CCP has said that plex is all funded off banned accounts. They have never GENERATED plex to sell you. Only put existing locked plex onto the market.

Except CCP has said that plex is all funded off banned accounts. They have never GENERATED plex to sell you. Only put existing locked plex onto the market.

Sure I could spend the RL cash and while I like EVE it isn't worth the 30 a month to me I would rather go out for a drink one more time a month then spend the money on a game.

Sorry if you can't play for free anymore. Bye.


On a side note, it would suck if the PLEX mechanic jammed because of player price speculation. Maybe CCP could consider putting a time limit on PLEXs, to prevent hoarding?

I love the player driven market, but PLEX speculation may have nasty out-of-game effects.

Sorry if you can't play for free anymore. Bye.

EVE is dying, only I can save it, but I don't want to have to grind too much even though I easily make 700 Mil ISK in a few hours.

I disagree. EVE IS REAL AND EVE IS LIFE. If anyone has anything negative to say fact driven or not I shall defend her honor!.

Sorry if you can't play for free anymore. Bye.


On a side note, it would suck if the PLEX mechanic jammed because of player price speculation. Maybe CCP could consider putting a time limit on PLEXs, to prevent hoarding?

I love the player driven market, but PLEX speculation may have nasty out-of-game effects.

That's not entirely true. CCP does manipulate the market, but it tends to be things like making the shuttle no longer npc made, thus making the price of trit to rise.

People who are playing via plex are doing so because EVE is not worth the real world money to play..

Hang on what now?

Supply, demand and confidence are at the root of inflation. High demand , low supply pushes up what people will pay for an item , therefore making it cost more. ergo the price inflates.

When this happens on a broad front across the economy you get inflation

Low demand, high supply leads to merchants falling over themselves to sell their goods, thereby competing with each other, and the price people are willing to pay, ergo the price deflates.

When this happens on a broad front across the economy you get deflation.


messing around with mineral resources can lead to inflation or deflation.

Anything else is semantics

Plex prices rising is inflation.
As in, guess what the price of damn near everything on the market is based on.

No, that's the economy of supply & demand affecting prices. Which is NOT inflation. It is a change in price but the two are not the same.

Inflation is about the supply of money. Real world governments print more money with nothing physical to back it a lot of the time, that printing of money is what creates inflation. Hence why Inflation is driven by Isk Sinks & Faucets (Of which the single largest is rat bounties, mainly from Null the last time CCP gave any breakdown on where they come from)
If there is a larger supply of money, then people with lots of money spend more to ensure they get a specific item, because money is worth less. If everyone has a larger supply of money, then it becomes worth less universally and all prices increase. However this is NOT supply and demand.

PLEX prices rising is similarly not inflation, it's simply supply and demand on a single item, which also isn't following the standard market trends.

So yes, prices rising on items 'MAY' be a sign of inflation. However it can be a sign of supply & demand & increased costs, which is what most of the price changes in EVE's economy actually are, as they can be directly traced to balance changes & mineral requirement changes.

No, some yearly inflation is a good thing since it shows that there is growth in the economy and that there is room for more.

But this thread is a good example how deprecated this forum is

That's were you lost me. Inflation is good, because it shows that there is growth in the economy? Do you know what real worlds biggest economy problem is? It's based on continually growth.

Well - at the end this thread ended with too much blabla and self-profiling. But I guess one of the answers was that CCP manipulates prices and occurrence or pies/belts ressource and so on.

However, I got my answers - somehow. But this thread is a good example how deprecated this forum is compared to stack exchange alike Q&A forum.

Thanks to everyone that participated.

That's were you lost me. Inflation is good, because it shows that there is growth in the economy? Do you know what real worlds biggest economy problem is?

However, I got my answers - somehow. But this thread is a good example how deprecated this forum is compared to stack exchange alike Q&A forum.

Also removing faction standings losses from missions would help protect mission runners from inflation issues, which I expect to happen probably soon.

EVE's economy is a simulation where the broken-window fallacy isn't a fallacy.

Actually, the broken window fallacy is still valid for Eve, it is perhaps better to consider the broken window constrained. Breaking windows surely helps the Eve economy have incentive to replace those broken windows, but it is not what makes the Eve economy grow.

We must first recognize that for an individual, corp or alliance, destroyed wealth is destroyed. That lost wealth must be replaced, instead of used to some other purpose, which is Bastiat's point.

The constraint upon the fallacy is, there are few places for excess wealth to go and frankly there is not much anyone can do with it except make or brake more windows.

Fair enough. It might not be the thing that makes the economy grow, but the economy is still heavily predicated on windows breaking at a substantial rate. Without that need for constant replacement, it would very quickly break down and make pretty much all of the game activities pointless. It's more that relationship that I'm referring to.

There is no wear-and-tear and no GÇ£this year's editionGÇ¥ GÇö the only thing that creates continued demand for anything besides ammo is outright destruction.

We all always want more stuff and better stuff. Unlimited demand exists in Eve just as it exists in the real world. Even if things were to never blow up, players would still demand more and better stuff. We have ample evidence of this with the so called risk averse carebear sect flying around in 20 billion isk pimped out faction ships. (Outside of Eve, there are countless games that allow people to build, create and demand more stuff at pretty much zero risk, from SimCity to those inane PopCap games. ... hence the subjectivity of 'fun'.)

Yes, but once that single demand is fulfilled, it is also over. I wouldn't call it unlimited for the simple reason that, once you have that ship, you have no need for a second one. Your demand for that ship (and its fittings) is now zero, and will never increase. Sure, you could formulate a second (very similar) goal and build a different ship, but that's still a one-time deal. Before long, you run out of ships to pimp.

It's not a matter of GÇ£funGÇ¥ but of simple one-time fulfilment of a goal. Those other games actually suffer from the exact same problem, which is why their devs need to constantly produce more new stuff for people to grind towards, or new maps or higher scores and unlockables. That's where their demand comes from. They keep moving the goal-posts. EVE went with the route of (largely player-created) destruction instead, and cluster-bombs the entire pitch GÇö if you survive, you'll have to glue together the splinters into a goal before trying to score again

I personally have gone from 4 accounts to 2 as a direct result of higher plex prices.