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callisthenes excelsior
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Posted - 2006.06.26 11:13:00 -
[1]
I've noticed this rapid fall of prices for the +3 implant...
Social has always been at the gutter for about 12-15 million, but neural held high in the mid 30 mil range...
About a few weeks ago ocular basic went to 20 million, and now all the rest are trending down ...
Possible causes?
1) lower demand due to jump clones... I don't think so as volume is holding steady...
2) fewer pod kills... Again, volume seems steady...
3) leveling off of the player base . . . Perhaps as it seems the player base bump from RMR and the Two Account offer was not sustainable. Log ins are trending slightly lower, and maybe all those new players and alts now have their implant set...
4) Macro mission runners? Sadly, this might be it! I've only seen anecdotal evidence, so maybe others can comment on this.
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Eximius Josari
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Posted - 2006.06.26 11:17:00 -
[2]
I remember when +3 Perc and Int plants were less than 20 mil isk. And at that time there were no pirate implants, no +4s, and no +5s...
heh
Click Above |
robacz
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Posted - 2006.06.26 11:18:00 -
[3]
Maybe agent offers were changed? Looks like either implant offers are now more common, or they need less LP, dunno. Either way its good for customers I guess.  Demand is not lower imho, I would say its higher.
___________
Buying/selling Implants, Cargo Expanders |
Scrofalitic One
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Posted - 2006.06.26 11:19:00 -
[4]
Theres a thread about the change in agent offers in the Mission forum, it seems that since the patch the implant & skillbook offers are becoming the norm rather that the exception.
So expect prices on the connections books to plummet soon too :)
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Ghoest
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Posted - 2006.06.26 11:22:00 -
[5]
I wish agent offers included something else as important as implants and connections books.
Wherever you went - here you are.
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Jenny Spitfire
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Posted - 2006.06.26 11:25:00 -
[6]
Too many people in > 0.4, IMHO.
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RecruitMe@NOINT!
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spurious signal
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Posted - 2006.06.26 11:25:00 -
[7]
Could someone explain to me exactly how this supposed "macro mission running" would work?
I cannot believe that anyoen could code some software that could interact with EVE's interface independantly of human input well enough to actually run missions. I think this is just paranoid fantasy myself.
Macro mining, yeah I can see that, all you;d need is an app that moved the mouse from position x to position y once every z seconds to drag minerals from hold to can, but that's about it. I don't believe there's any such thing as a macro program that will enable people to mine for hours at a time completely unattended.
And I certainly don't believe anyone can set anything up to run *missions* using macros.
If you look at the server population over the last 12 months you can see a steady increase in players up to about March of this year when it levels off a bit. Maybe the 3-4 months since then have been long enough for a fairly large number of those new players to have got to the point when they're getting +3 implant offers from agents? Just a thought, there could be many other reasons. Maybe the continued sanctioning of ISK for cash via GTC's has contributed to the decline in prices as people become willing to sell their implants for less cos they know that they can get 300mill ISK easily whenever they want by buying a GTC?
I dunno, I'm just guessing, but I can think of a hundred things that are a lot more simple (and therefore likely) than the idea of an intelligent, highly advanced EVE playing software application that can run level 4 missions without the need for human input.
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Gail Porter
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Posted - 2006.06.26 11:30:00 -
[8]
Perception +3 used to be like 5-7mill
so its hardly crashing
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Toros Revoke
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Posted - 2006.06.26 11:30:00 -
[9]
Macro mission running, how could that work? It's got to be gremlins I say
There is a fine line between Genius and Insanity. Make sure you take your shoes off before you cross it. |
Glass Eye
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Posted - 2006.06.26 11:31:00 -
[10]
I beleive it was an actual refrence to mission running sweat shops. Or farmers if you will.
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Tachy
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Posted - 2006.06.26 11:38:00 -
[11]
@callisthenes: Your observation might hit the issue right on the spot. The 'drop rate' is way to high for the market.
Macro mission running isn't hard at all when you know what you're doing.
Not much thinking is needed to do most missions, no reaction to changed mission objectives. The mission system seems to be not flexible enough for on-the-fly changes to counter easy macroing. Macro Ratting is much more easy to do though.
Giving out more info would not be right though and might be agaisnt the forum rules.
Just please don't use macros, will you?
--*=*=*--
Even with nougat, you can have a perfect moment. |
Merrick Solipsus
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Posted - 2006.06.26 11:41:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Merrick Solipsus on 26/06/2006 11:42:01
I would say its because more people are getting to the point where they are able to get more +4 and +5 implants. +3 are no longer the best so people aare not willing to pay top dollar for them anymore. Its the same with +4's. They have also come way down with the number of +5 increasing.
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aeti
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Posted - 2006.06.26 11:46:00 -
[13]
so you mean the price is just going back to what it used to be like
which is good tbh
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Deja Thoris
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Posted - 2006.06.26 11:46:00 -
[14]
Basically, imo every other offer (with rare and notable exceptions) are crap.
Everyone waits for implant offers and takes them.
No-one wants to take an offer for a +3% to ship shinyness hardwiring when it costs 80k LP, 200 drone AI, 3000 tags and 100 mill ISK and it sells for 10k on the market, hence they take the implant offers.
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Shocknawe
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Posted - 2006.06.26 11:46:00 -
[15]
I would also suggest that the pirate implants have something to do with the falling of prices. Also alot of the newer players are into lvl 3 and 4 missions boosting supply of regular implants.
Of course I have no facts to back any of this up 
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Pottsey
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Posted - 2006.06.26 11:47:00 -
[16]
Macros for missions seem doable. I wouldnt want to do it for lvl 4 but for lvl 3 just take a passive tank. Then all you have to do is deal with targeting, shooting, and warping. But why would you want to macro missions?
I never did see the point of having everything on auto and not playing Eve. Eve is about the playing not the doing nothing part.
Passive shield tanking guide, click here. |
Ricka Bronzar
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Posted - 2006.06.26 12:04:00 -
[17]
Well I think the storyline missions are also throwing these out more.
I was doing lvl1 missions other day and I got a storyline(courier) mission.(carry something to 1 jp away ) and I got a +2perc implant for it :D
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Pete Stalker
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Posted - 2006.06.26 12:10:00 -
[18]
Imps for everyone! 
______________________
o rly?
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Plutoinum
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Posted - 2006.06.26 12:11:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Plutoinum on 26/06/2006 12:22:43
 Originally by: aeti
so you mean the price is just going back to what it used to be like
which is good tbh
/signed
One of my principles is never to log off to save my pod and implants, so sometimes pod losses are unavoidable. I'm quite happy about cheap implants.
( Reminds me to get some new... )
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Kuolematon
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Posted - 2006.06.26 12:43:00 -
[20]
Difference between +3 and +4 is so small in training time yet in price it's very huge, but I am happy because +3's (Hell, even +2's) are just fine for my carebear taste! 
Unnerf Amarr!
"Just because you can utterly ruin another player's game doesn't mean that you must."
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Danton Marcellus
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Posted - 2006.06.26 13:17:00 -
[21]
Time to remove them from the agent reward pool then and perhaps hand out BPCs instead to have them built like intended.
Remind me about The Maze.
I'm Danton Marcellus and I approve of this message. |
BoinKlasik
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Posted - 2006.06.26 13:22:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Deja Thoris
Basically, imo every other offer (with rare and notable exceptions) are crap.
Everyone waits for implant offers and takes them.
No-one wants to take an offer for a +3% to ship shinyness hardwiring when it costs 80k LP, 200 drone AI, 3000 tags and 100 mill ISK and it sells for 10k on the market, hence they take the implant offers.
ding ding! \o/ for Deja
I know this was the only mission lp rewards I wanted at all, since the rest of them required a huge investment for items that were almost impossible to get a good value for (+5% to all turret damage I was quoted about 3 differne tpossible prices, ranging from 100m (the cost of all those damn drone AI's u need for it anyway) to 250m)
*doh, I broke my edited sig :/* *cries*
this signature was lacking pink, I'll provide it for you. There. Looks better doesn't it? -Eris
Fixed it for you. Oh, btw, yarr! ~kieron
Didn't I tell you? The damsel moved in with me, we're having a great time. - Wrangler
The damsel may not be distressed any more, but how many times does the informant have to be silenced before he gets the message? - Cortes
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Drizit
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Posted - 2006.06.26 13:59:00 -
[23]
Got a full set of 3% rogue implants I can't even give away and a Talisma Delta (T2 implant according to the icon) that is sitting in my hangar unwanted.
The Talisman was a NPC drop which was pretty rare, I've only had two drops like that from highsec NPC's in the last year. The Rogues are all agent bonus rewards for missions. I'm getting a bit fed up with agent rewards like that, I'd rather have the isk rather than flood the market with items that are being dropped far too regularly.
Freight containers, implants and even some trade goods prices like oxygen and data sheets are taking a hammering simply because so much gets given as an agent bonus.
Leave the implants as a trade for LP since it still takes a while to get enough for a good implant. But let's have the agent bonus paid in isk rather than trade goods and such, let's level this market out to what it should be so that traders can do what they do best. As a mission runner, especially kill missions, you are a combat pilot. Getting data sheets and oxygen as a reward tries to push you into a traders profession which is most likely not what you want to do. I don't want to waste time scanning the market for hours to see where I can sell this junk.
--
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Blighter
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Posted - 2006.06.26 14:03:00 -
[24]
increased supply (more players who grind missions, and never risk losing the implants)?
So players are, themselves, oversaturation the market, untl the markey crashes, and +3's are not worth anymore than a +3 agility hardwire.
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Tannach
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Posted - 2006.06.26 14:41:00 -
[25]
Didnt someone post a little while back how they made 6 billion ISK in 3 months by playing the +3 implant market.
As soon as this was posted the number of +3 implants available seemed to increase, and the market started to die.
Tan
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Blind Man
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Posted - 2006.06.26 14:51:00 -
[26]
meh, +4's are cheap enough for the average person to have a set now 
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Dark Shikari
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Posted - 2006.06.26 14:55:00 -
[27]
Remember when implants were just a few million each?
Then Exodus came... 
--Proud member of the [23]--
-WTB Platinum Technite, WTS Nanotransistors, Heavy Electron II, 100mn AB II- |
Lord WarATron
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Posted - 2006.06.26 14:56:00 -
[28]
Well, a few weeks ago when +5's were going for a bil each, I cashed in my offer for a +5. Then the market collapsed, and now +5's go for 300-450mil tops.
+4's now go for under 100mil in some places, insted of 150mil+.
Overall, the entire implant market has crashed. People up up buy-orders 20% below market average for implants, and hence the average market value goes down, then people who sell at market average relise the price has went down and place sell orders for 20% below the original value.
The cycle repeats until people stop doing implant offers so supply meets demand.
Overall, there has never been a better time to buy implants!
---
Slot 10 Akemons Modified 'Noble'Zet 5000 implant +8% Armour
FREE |
qrac
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Posted - 2006.06.26 15:04:00 -
[29]
Jump clones..
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Jenny Spitfire
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Posted - 2006.06.26 15:15:00 -
[30]
Hippo, this is why we need a chance based implant failure...
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RecruitMe@NOINT!
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HippoKing
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Posted - 2006.06.26 15:28:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Jenny Spitfire
Hippo, this is why we need a chance based implant failure...
Maybe time based, but not chance.
As for the reason for implant prices falling: jumpclones and COSMOS
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Messerschmitt facility
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Posted - 2006.06.26 15:40:00 -
[32]
Good, very good that the market crash! I am so happy. Hopefully T2 market will crash as well. PvP'ers can also taste the joy's of this game as well
_________________________________
A conclusion is the place where you got tired of thinking...
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Jenny Spitfire
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Posted - 2006.06.26 15:41:00 -
[33]
Originally by: HippoKing
Originally by: Jenny Spitfire
Hippo, this is why we need a chance based implant failure...
Maybe time based, but not chance.
As for the reason for implant prices falling: jumpclones and COSMOS
Time based would make implant market a seasonal market. Not really healthy, IMHO. Then again, I dont use implants so dont really care they drop below average. I can buy them when they have reached rock bottom prices.
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RecruitMe@NOINT!
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Galk
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Posted - 2006.06.26 15:56:00 -
[34]
Another reason might be that more of the new players these days... could be just multiple accounts.. not new starting out players.
Ofc they're tailored achura and probaly get tossed implants from their mains anyway..
I think thats not the only reason.. but it's probaly one of the things thats breaking the cycle.
______
Long ago one gorgeous night, we let the stars grow free.
We let Zhuge do that once, he came back carrying a traffic cone, a forsale sign and three empty bottles of dutch lager. He also lost his Zimmer Frame... - Imaran
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agent apple
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Posted - 2006.06.26 16:12:00 -
[35]
New players
Its not a bad thing but the new breed of level 4 mission runners is at hand and when they see that 20m+ item they have to sell they just undercut everyone on the market to offload it (and by a couple of mil rather than 10k isk like traders), and the next one does the same, and so on and so forth.
Whats really of interest is why +5's are so low. Nobody goes for them as rewards as the payout to lp cost is worse than lower level offers so they should be rarer and higher in price.
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Galk
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Posted - 2006.06.26 16:24:00 -
[36]
Edited by: Galk on 26/06/2006 16:27:39
Nahh not realy apple.
I know that i sell to resellers, they make the world go around as it should.
But your right... there are allways people that do their best to shave prices making it hard for the resellers to maintain the price.
As for the plus +5's.... there isn't just the mass market.... the flush of actual new players was enough to sustain the +3 market for many months...
Why i mentioned the many alt accounts bumping new accounts these days... it's gota have an effect.
______
Long ago one gorgeous night, we let the stars grow free.
We let Zhuge do that once, he came back carrying a traffic cone, a forsale sign and three empty bottles of dutch lager. He also lost his Zimmer Frame... - Imaran
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gfldex
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Posted - 2006.06.26 16:33:00 -
[37]
Originally by: spurious signal
I cannot believe that anyoen could code some software that could interact with EVE's interface independantly of human input well enough to actually run missions. I think this is just paranoid fantasy myself.
Because you dont got a clue. Some ppl have a clue and invented dll injection.
Every time a human can interact with a game with his eyes shut a program will do the same better.
--
$ perl -n -e 'print "Stop blameing pirates! Oveur is the root of all evil!\n" if m/podkill|lost my ship|gank|gate camp|Verone/;'
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Malthros Zenobia
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Posted - 2006.06.26 17:10:00 -
[38]
My 2 +3 perc implants both went for around 35mil a week or 2 ago.
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Malthros Zenobia
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Posted - 2006.06.26 17:14:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Deja Thoris
Basically, imo every other offer (with rare and notable exceptions) are crap.
Everyone waits for implant offers and takes them.
No-one wants to take an offer for a +3% to ship shinyness hardwiring when it costs 80k LP, 200 drone AI, 3000 tags and 100 mill ISK and it sells for 10k on the market, hence they take the implant offers.
Exactly.
I spent 15k lp and 10mil ISK last night for a political connections skillbook (diplomacy III has 4 hrs to go ), and I've gotten quite a few 30k lp for 2 +3s offers.
And yet at 50k lp what did I get? This:
"Oh hey, for 50k lp, I'll build you a RAVEN. Oh, and did I forget to mention you have to suplly the minerals too?
LP rewards need a massive overhaul. The T1 ship offers and isk to tags are the worse, because the tags give you their market value anyways, and the ship offers just waste LP.
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Dark Shikari
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Posted - 2006.06.26 17:15:00 -
[40]
Originally by: gfldex
Originally by: spurious signal
I cannot believe that anyoen could code some software that could interact with EVE's interface independantly of human input well enough to actually run missions. I think this is just paranoid fantasy myself.
Because you dont got a clue. Some ppl have a clue and invented dll injection.
Every time a human can interact with a game with his eyes shut a program will do the same better.
Its even easier than that, as EVE uses Python for its game engine, which is not only fully decompilable but is also extremely easy to inject code into. This is how, for example, 0.0 ISK escrows get instaclaimed.
--Proud member of the [23]--
-WTB Platinum Technite, WTS Nanotransistors, Heavy Electron II, 100mn AB II- |
HippoKing
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Posted - 2006.06.26 17:18:00 -
[41]
Edited by: HippoKing on 26/06/2006 17:20:11
Originally by: Dark Shikari
Originally by: gfldex
Originally by: spurious signal
I cannot believe that anyoen could code some software that could interact with EVE's interface independantly of human input well enough to actually run missions. I think this is just paranoid fantasy myself.
Because you dont got a clue. Some ppl have a clue and invented dll injection.
Every time a human can interact with a game with his eyes shut a program will do the same better.
Its even easier than that, as EVE uses Python for its game engine, which is not only fully decompilable but is also extremely easy to inject code into. This is how, for example, 0.0 ISK escrows get instaclaimed.
its even easier than that. There is a uncompiled python in the eve client 
Look in the script, lib and stdlib folders
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Scake
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Posted - 2006.06.26 17:29:00 -
[42]
Personally I think it is a large degree down to a certain character giving out the fine details on how to run a lucrative +2 - +3 implant selling business a few weeks back. Now everybody and their pod buddy is trying it.
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Galk
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Posted - 2006.06.26 17:31:00 -
[43]
About the bad offers....
They are (atleast some of them) put there deliberately.
The offers is a big mess for sure... thats because there mainly dictated by the market/playerbase whats hot whats not...
Aka most people take the offers for cash sales only...
My take... i wish it wasn't that way....
If there were offers to make me happier to keep (i mean the golden days were when everybody wanted that faction bs for themselfs were they not).. or just want to keep for the things i want to do in the game.. rather than just require me to throw cash at things.. then i would be happier with that system.
But ofc the big dilemma is that whatever... there will allways be people that want to farm offers to isk.... and you risk treading on other areas of the game, if you start tossing things like ships and blueprints you would normaly use the isk for...
It's a great system.. but like everything else.. so many ways you can play it... ultimately it doesn't work as good as it should.
However.. the current system is crap.. nearly everybody looks at the isk... not good if im honest.
______
Long ago one gorgeous night, we let the stars grow free.
We let Zhuge do that once, he came back carrying a traffic cone, a forsale sign and three empty bottles of dutch lager. He also lost his Zimmer Frame... - Imaran
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Kurren
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Posted - 2006.06.26 17:46:00 -
[44]
I tell you what...
Just give me all the implants you can't sell, and I'll sell them for you...
--- --- --- ---
SobaKai.com
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Tizi
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Posted - 2006.06.26 18:33:00 -
[45]
Implant prices should be a lot lower than they have dropped to. High implant prices are a big barrier between new players and their ability to maintain pace with older richer players.
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VossKarr
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Posted - 2006.06.26 19:07:00 -
[46]
I'm glad to see the price of +3 implants (and +4's for that matter,too... ) gradually returning to the levels from way back when...
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Capt Nubpants
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Posted - 2006.06.26 21:39:00 -
[47]
+3 perc implants used to be 8mil each :/
19-22mil for int and memory.
The implant is no where "near" crashing. In fact it's FINALLY starting to stabilize as supply caught up to demand.
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Weirda
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Posted - 2006.06.26 21:47:00 -
[48]
actually....
Resellers have moved on
probably what have happened. back in the day of the yulai hub (and before implant were in regular market, only escrow), very few reseller controlled the entire implant market and drove it up A LOT.
judging by the going rate of Vagabond, and what weirda see them dumped on the market for (usually see them dumped on market for 170mils, then next day there are none and there are same amount at 220+ mils for example), it just seem like there is a lot more stuff for reseller to make isk off of.
amount of implant used to be more fixed then it is now, so was easier to control.
dunno though - just a stupid minnie!
__
Weirda
Assault Ship need 4th Bonus and More! |
MysticNZ
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Posted - 2006.06.26 22:10:00 -
[49]
Yes they are cheap... which is why for the first time in almost a year I bought a full set.
-=====-
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Mi Lai
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Posted - 2006.06.26 22:20:00 -
[50]
Rest assured that I do anything in my power to keep this market alive .
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Vaugue
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Posted - 2006.06.26 22:32:00 -
[51]
My agent offered me 4 +3intel implants this morning for 60k LP's. I turned it down. This is probably the 9th or 10th time I've down an offer for various and mulltiple +3 implants. Just some insight..
ps: why is it everytime i try to post it asks me to log in 5 or 6 times before it does it? I'm already logged in ffs.
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Why use a forum to auction when you can sell it on Eve-Bay!
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