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Learning Skill Non-Functional

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Stryker Zee	Posted - 2003.09.30 12:08:00 - [1] Ever since the last patch launched, the Learning skill no longer works. I do the math on how long training from lvl 3 to lvl 4 large projectile skill 'should' take, then I start the skill training and see how long it 'actually' takes. My calculated time was approximately 5 days 16 hours with 14 in both Perception and Willpower (the primary and secondary skills), and with lvl 4 Learning skill (0.92x time modifier). Skill points required are 224,274 (lvl 4) - 40,000 (lvl 3) = 184,274 SP. I used the formula: T(minutes) = (Learning skill modifier) x (SP)/(primary skill score - 0.5 x secondary skill score). Actual time posted when I start the skill training is aproximately 6 days and 3 hours, which is exactly what you get if you neglect to include Learning skill in the equation. I would appreciate others checking their training times closely to see if they are experiencing the same problem. If so, please take the time to write a bug report.
Lola	Posted - 2003.09.30 12:17:00 - [2] Did you take into account the display bug with attributes and the way learning causes atributes to go from 12 to 14? ----------------------------------------- Sig rented by Drethen Nerevitas.
Discorporation	Posted - 2003.09.30 12:39:00 - [3] Learning modifies the attributes directly by 2% per level. The value is truncated :) [Heterocephalus glaber]
Anisitol	Posted - 2003.09.30 12:57:00 - [4] I use this formula and it gives me correct results: T = SP / (Pri + Sec/2)(1+0.02L) Note that you can't use the attribute levels from the "Attributes" sheet when calculating skill training time. You have to adjust those values to be able to use them in the formula. The values shown seem to include the learning skill and are truncated to an integer. I think this is a correct way to adjust the values (Valid up to and including 24 points): If you have learning lvl 1 or 2 no adjustment is needed. * Learning lvl 3: If attibute is > 16 subtract one point. * Learning lvl 4: If attibute is > 12 subtract one point. * Learning lvl 5: If attibute is > 9 subtract one point and if > 19 subtract two points. Can anyone confirm this?
Lola	Posted - 2003.09.30 12:57:00 - [5] I meant what he said. ----------------------------------------- Sig rented by Drethen Nerevitas.
Stryker Zee	Posted - 2003.10.01 02:19:00 - [6] There is nothing wrong with the way I applied the formula I stated. I am using the correct values for Perception and Willpower. The Learning skill is simply not working. It has been confirmed by a few people I associate with. However, it was my hope that more people would care enough that they weren't getting proper training times and would submit a bug report so this problem can get fixed. If everyone remains oblivious to this problem, the Devs will likely overlook fixing it, and I don't know about you, but I don't care for spending 11 hours more training a skill than I should.
Redan Chulipa	Posted - 2003.10.01 02:46:00 - [7] You report it and I'll just stand here nodding in approvement.
Charlemagne	Posted - 2003.10.01 03:19:00 - [8] Stryker, learning skill as far as I know doesn't decrease the training time by 2% per level, it actually increases all your attributes by 2% per level. thus the value you actually see on your screen for your attributes are not exactly correct. so if you had willpower 14, learning 4, you would actually have a willpower modifier of 15.1 or so? something like that, anyway. that's how I understood it to work.
Stryker Zee	Posted - 2003.10.01 03:46:00 - [9] Charlemane, don't know where people are getting the idea that "Learning" skill (the skill itself, not the category of skills) increases attributes. There are individual skills within the Learning category that do that. For example, Iron Will increases Willpower by 1 point per level. The Learning skill clearly states in its description that it decreases training time by 2% per skill level. The formula that I listed is the one given by a dev in one of the devchats, so I am 100% certain it is correct.
Charlemagne	Posted - 2003.10.01 04:59:00 - [10] Stryker, ok, thanks for the clarification.
Lola	Posted - 2003.10.01 05:06:00 - [11] Quote: Stryker, learning skill as far as I know doesn't decrease the training time by 2% per level, it actually increases all your attributes by 2% per level. thus the value you actually see on your screen for your attributes are not exactly correct. so if you had willpower 14, learning 4, you would actually have a willpower modifier of 15.1 or so? something like that, anyway. that's how I understood it to work. This is correct, stryker is wrong. ----------------------------------------- Sig rented by Drethen Nerevitas.
Lola	Posted - 2003.10.01 06:01:00 - [12] I should add that the skill description is misleading. ----------------------------------------- Sig rented by Drethen Nerevitas.
Anisitol	Posted - 2003.10.01 08:19:00 - [13] Edited by: Anisitol on 01/10/2003 08:28:29 Quote: There is nothing wrong with the way I applied the formula I stated. I am using the correct values for Perception and Willpower. The Learning skill is simply not working. It has been confirmed by a few people I associate with. However, it was my hope that more people would care enough that they weren't getting proper training times and would submit a bug report so this problem can get fixed. If everyone remains oblivious to this problem, the Devs will likely overlook fixing it, and I don't know about you, but I don't care for spending 11 hours more training a skill than I should. Well, I use this formula from the EVE-online support section and I get correct values compared to the ingame time and real time (skills finish when they should). Correction of the displayed attribute points still needed. Granted, the description for the learning skill is incorrect. It increases the learning speed by 2% per level. It does not reduce the learning time by 2%.
Stryker Zee	Posted - 2003.10.02 12:05:00 - [14] When did the Learning skill change then? Because this isn't how it was calculated into learning time originally. I'm sure I could spend a lot of time going back thru devchats, but that would be a waste of time. I've been playing EVE since beta 7, and I know for a fact the way I described the formula is how it was originally implemented. I don't know wth is up with the way it is implemented now, but it trivializes the effectiveness of the Learning skill. As mentioned, the effect is non-linear, and doesn't give as much of a benefit to training time as a flat 2% per level reduction would give once your attributes reach a certain level.

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