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Sirrah
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Posted - 2003.10.03 18:42:00 -
[1]
I am curious to what is the public opinion is on this issue. From what I understand, CCP is saying that this is NOT an exploit and a from of "tactic".
I personally do not see it fair for players to congest the jump in points with loot cans and irrelevant drones. Doing this as a means to lag a player's client so that when he/she does enter space, they wake up to a half destroyed ship with little options to take.
I also find it contradictory that CCP stated in a CSM meeting that this issue will be resoved such that other players will not be able to see another's ship until their client has caught up. So, if this is not an exploit, then I fail to see why it has to be "fixed".
http://www.oberon-inc.com/
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Master Scy
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Posted - 2003.10.03 18:54:00 -
[2]
The problem is that CCP can't prove these people are exploiting... They could have valid reasons for having those drones (yeah, right... like the tachyons won't blow everything apart before the drones are even half way to the target) or containers (too lazy to empty them  ).
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You think Marco Polo said
"Damn Mongolians were camping that cave entry into the next valley the entire day, you can't get friggin anywhere in the world with those damn griefer tribes all over the place" ?
-Indigo Seqi
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Scragg
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Posted - 2003.10.03 19:06:00 -
[3]
I always figured the definition of a game exploit was using a feature or system of the game that is not operating as intended to give you an unfair advantage over other players.
If CCP did not intend for there to be jump in lag and they did not intend for mining drones and cargo cans to add lag at a jump in point then it's an exploit.
That all said... I have noticed after the last patch that jump in and warp in lag seems to not be quite as bad as it was. I'd have to say CCP has recognized and is in the process of addressing the issue and it is an exploit. It just may not be an exploit CCP wants to ban people over.
Scragg, Tyrell Corporation
Vice-Director Military Operations |
Salamon
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Posted - 2003.10.03 19:27:00 -
[4]
Randomize jump in points and solve the problem. IMHO that is the best and only way to solve this problem. You are never going to eliminate the lag and people are abusing it.
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Skillz
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Posted - 2003.10.03 19:32:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Skillz on 03/10/2003 20:03:38
Who knows, I don't anyways.
Keep on flaming, lamers.
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Arkonor
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Posted - 2003.10.03 20:05:00 -
[6]
no it takes teamwork and smart thinking to pull it off ,its not an exploit
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Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2003.10.03 20:06:00 -
[7]
Teamwork is the new way to excuse exploiting?
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
Arkonor
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Posted - 2003.10.03 20:10:00 -
[8]
its not the pirate/bounter hunters fault the client loading is coded in a bad way.
and seeing as everyone can do it just like the transfering shield's at sentry gun protected gates i dont see why its unfair ,its just thinking outside of the box 
whats wrong with a goold old fashioned ambush anyway? its a good tactic
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Skillz
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Posted - 2003.10.03 20:25:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Skillz on 03/10/2003 20:27:40
Inducing lag is thinking outside the box and not an exploit? How about crashing the servercluster with a disto DOS but not the whole way, only so much you make most lose their server nodes?
Keep on flaming, lamers.
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Arkonor
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Posted - 2003.10.03 20:30:00 -
[10]
you never heard the phrase "all's fair in love and WAR" ?
carebear tbh skills
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Xelios
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Posted - 2003.10.03 20:35:00 -
[11]
I think CCP considers it an exploit personally, but they won't admit that publically because they'd get a flood of exploit petitions in, with 90% of them being useless as it can't be proven. It would be a nightmare for them if they confirmed it's exploiting.
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Skillz
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Posted - 2003.10.03 20:38:00 -
[12]
Well, Arkonor, you're propably the type that would duplicate 100.000 megacyte too.
Keep on flaming, lamers.
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Arkonor
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Posted - 2003.10.03 20:45:00 -
[13]
did i say i personally had ambushed people at jump in point's? i just dont see what is wrong with using tactic's
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Xelios
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Posted - 2003.10.03 20:47:00 -
[14]
Couldn't cheating be called a tactic too?
How is deploying useless drones and dropping/leaving cans all over the place to lag the target a tactic? It's really no different than the sensor booster exploit from a while ago, would you consider that a tactic as well?
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Arkonor
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Posted - 2003.10.03 20:54:00 -
[15]
 Quote:
How is deploying useless drones and dropping/leaving cans all over the place to lag the target a tactic?
u dont need drones and containers if you have enough people,
the sensor booster CTD problem was obviously an exploit.
amÀbush
The act of lying in wait to attack by surprise.
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Xelios
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Posted - 2003.10.03 21:14:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Xelios on 03/10/2003 21:14:49
This thread isn't about ambushing people, it's about causing lag for people with loot cans and useless drones to gain an advantage over your target.
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absimiliard
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Posted - 2003.10.03 21:28:00 -
[17]
arkonor: Since "all if fair" i assume you won't mind if i dos your connection during combat. Or if i'm really in a foul mood maybe i will install a keystroke logger on your comp, and after you are done playing, log on as you, give all of your stuff away, delete your chars and cancel your account for you.
Its all fair right? right?
please note that *I* wouldn't do anything discussed above, but someone else could... |
Jash Illian
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Posted - 2003.10.03 21:55:00 -
[18]
Quote:
Edited by: Xelios on 03/10/2003 21:14:49
This thread isn't about ambushing people, it's about causing lag for people with loot cans and useless drones to gain an advantage over your target.
According to people like you, all drones are useless.
Last time I went through an ambush at a jump in point, despite all the drones and ships there my computer had the screen loaded before my ship had begun to autotarget back. So what does that mean?
That means I could have easily jammed the person that was still locking my ship if I was in EW mode. At which point he'd been defenseless except for 2 things:
1) FoF Cruise Missiles, which few people invest in.
2) His combat drones, which will not attack automatically unles they're already deployed when the person attacks you.
Why you people persist in crying over something that happened weeks ago and has had fixes implemented (drone lag is severely reduced) I haven't the foggiest. Is that all the ammunition you have? Some people might have exploited so everyone that has a drone is an exploiter that must be banned?
I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather **** my enemy.- Rohann
Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!- Lallante |
Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2003.10.03 22:01:00 -
[19]
Easy way to avoid jump-in campers:
Set your autopilot one jump beyond the system you want to arrive at.
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
Salamon
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Posted - 2003.10.03 22:04:00 -
[20]
Having a set jump in point is like giving a mugger a gun, bullets, and a map of where you will be and when you will be there. The lag is like showing up at the exact place and time the mugger is waiting with a blindfold on and your hands tied behind your back. Not much of an ambush more like clubbing a baby seal.....
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Maitan Shalok
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Posted - 2003.10.03 22:11:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Maitan Shalok on 03/10/2003 22:13:53
Edited by: Maitan Shalok on 03/10/2003 22:13:22
It certainly should be considered an un-fair (read exploit) advantage considering what is wrong with it.
I remember playing other MMORPGs where this kind of situation happend and was quickly resolved via a code fix.
When going from a non-pvp to a pvp zone, either the zone-in area aka jump in point was marked no combat zone or combat cannot be initiated by either the zoned-in player or against the zoned-in player for a certain amount of time (enough time for the player to prepare defense/offense).
CCP doesn't like it, but won't declare it an exploit because it'll raise a lot more complications.
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It's not an exploit until we fix it - CCP
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DREAMWORKS
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Posted - 2003.10.03 22:25:00 -
[22]
If your using harvesters at a jump in point, i cant say you really need them for 1 thing but creating lag for others... I wouldnt be happy if i got killed because of my computer not beeing able to load the data.
__________________________
http://www.nin.com/visuals/thtf_hi.html |
Masi
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Posted - 2003.10.03 22:27:00 -
[23]
sigh... wonder what will be moaned about next. Last few days i've warped in 2 more then 4 ships at a gate and a warp in point and not had any lag (This was near peak time with 5k ppl online) It's your systems/Internet. If i've been playing other games that are demanding, then play Eve i find it takes a bit longer to load when jumping in etc. From a fresh start, its up stright away
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var'ulfur
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Posted - 2003.10.03 23:06:00 -
[24]
thier will always be lamers that will use the game aginst you. seen it in every online game i played.its wrong yes but the peole that do it are in reality very scared and pitiful people that need to be better than somone eles and cant do it without cheating. so we as real players just have to deal with it. that is life either you run with the big dogs or stay on the porch. |
Lallante
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Posted - 2003.10.03 23:10:00 -
[25]
Regardless of whether it is fair or nice, it is not an exploit.
An Exploit is when a player uses a BUG in the game to gain an advantage in a way the game didnt intend.
Lag is not a bug, its a feature (albeit one they want to remove). therefore using lag to your advantage can hardly be called an exploit.
However, this is not to say I condone use of harvestors / containers, I consider it cheap, but not an exploit.
Lall - THE Vocal Minority -
ShinRa
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Salamon
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Posted - 2003.10.08 17:08:00 -
[26]
Exploit or not I think it is safe to say it ttakes away from the enjoyment and playability of the game. Not all of us are blessed with high spedd conections and it does not take that much to lag a dial up. CCP needs to recognize that if left as is this becomes a huge disadvantage to players who travel in 0.0 space and use dial up connections. I have lost 2 BS's to this "not an exploit but not a designed feature" and am really at my wits end. If by the time you log in screen you are already webified and stasified your options are pretty limited. RANDOMIZE THE JUMP IN POINTS@!
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Baldour Ngarr
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Posted - 2003.10.08 17:30:00 -
[27]
Quote:
An Exploit is when a player uses a BUG in the game to gain an advantage in a way the game didnt intend.
Lag is not a bug, its a feature (albeit one they want to remove).
Any unintended feature could reasonably be regarded as a bug. In this case, not a bug in the software, but in the connection systems; they don't work fast enough. I hasten to point out, it could also reasonably be regarded as not a bug. There's no black and white here.
In any event, this thread will go nowhere if the argument remains fixed on whether or not we should apply the Exploit label. What we need to KNOW, is:
(1) Do CCP consider it a legitimate tactic; and if not,
(2) What are they going to do to remove it; and
(3) What penalties are they prepared to place on people using it, and will they give a formal public warning that it's not an allowed tactic.
We still need to know these things, whether we call it exploit, bug, feature, or just plain bad luck. At this point, I'm supposed to suggest dropping the pointless argument and just trying to get along. Yeah, right, like that's ever going to happen
_______
"Soon" is an ancient Icelandic word meaning "some time before the next Ice Age." |
DeltroNomicoN
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Posted - 2003.10.08 17:31:00 -
[28]
Quote:
Easy way to avoid jump-in campers:
Set your autopilot one jump beyond the system you want to arrive at.
That doesn't work, trust me.
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Danton Marcellus
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Posted - 2003.10.08 19:14:00 -
[29]
This is said to be dealt with in the next patch, with the complete load before entering the system.
Convert Stations
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Indigo Seqi
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Posted - 2003.10.08 19:42:00 -
[30]
lol you don't need teamwork at all to setup a JIPT(!), it's even easier to do than the avarage 0.0 gatecamp.
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