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KuranesGrey
Oberon Incorporated
Prime Orbital Systems
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Posted - 2006.07.20 17:41:00 -
[1]
There's a curious market dynamic at work in empire right now. The +1 implant market is totally askew because one guy is trying to corner it. A bit of competition could be quite profitable.
+1 Implant prices have fallen significantly in the past month since the server patch that changed agent mission rewards. A full set of the 5 +1 implants now costs between 2M and 3M if you buy at the market. But the spreads are crazy. For instance the highest buy order for memory implants in Lonetrek is 1.05M, but the lowest sell is 1.74M. That wide a spread is not economically sustainable, there should be more competition.
The reason there is no competition is because one guy is trying to corner the market in all of empire. He spends all day watching the markets in various regions raising his bid by the annoying .01 ISK over any competing orders. If someone places a buy order too high for him to top he just fills the competing buy order to clear it from the market and keep the visible orders low.
Of course he only has the resources to keep this up so long, particularly since there's a real profit opportunity here for others. He seems to only be happy with a 50% spread. So put in buy and sell orders at a 20% spread. You're still making a profit, either from the normal market dynamics or directly from the cornerer guy as he desperately tries to defend his artificial profit margins. Eventually the market will stabilize and the poor newbies who really need +1 implants won't be quite so screwed.
However, the intrepid trader should beware the awesome Smack Talk powers of this guy trying to corner the market. I've been buying some implants myself in one region recently. Didn't think much of it until I got a blizzard of email and convos from his various NPC alts. Some of the more amusing samples:
- Most people are thankfull when I "give" them 1 round.I gave you 1 and your greedy bewhind comes back for more.Im in every Empire Region and you just made it to my bad list.I will punish you in Every Region , Greedy Noobie
- let the punishment begin. all greedy noobies must freaken Hang
- You cant be that stupid and Greedy. Your just Fing with me now , but thats all good becuase you will Never sell the ones I stuffed down your throat anyways! Be a Punk and see how far you get in this game
- youve been out bid punk. come and change your bids noobie
- We know your life is Pathetic , What its not so Pathetic that you will go buy more accounts so you can harass me in more regions? See a doctor.
I knew about smack talking pirates, but I'd never encountered a smack talking trader before. Nutty. Given the profit opportunity involved he won't be able to sustain a monopoly for long.
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Dark Shikari
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.07.20 18:29:00 -
[2]
Petition him for harassment. That kind of language in EVEmails will generally get you banzored 
--Proud member of the [23]--
-WTS Heavy Electron II, 100mn AB II, Medium Warp Bubbles- |
Tami Auryn
Natural Evolution
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Posted - 2006.07.20 18:35:00 -
[3]
lol very amusing :D
Who would ever want to make money in +1 who uses +1's ? :)
Might as well go for +2's.
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KuranesGrey
Oberon Incorporated
Prime Orbital Systems
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Posted - 2006.07.20 18:43:00 -
[4]
The irony about the idea of petitioning him for harassment is that's what he's threatened to do to me. Not because of what I've said (I don't respond to smack talk). No, according to him the mere fact of me placing orders on the market is harassment of him and a violation of TOS. With nonsense like that no wonder poor CCP has too many petitions to answer.
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Havelcek
Eve Defence Force
Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.07.20 18:53:00 -
[5]
That really irritates me, probably more than it should, for some reason. POS does a great job stocking their 0.0 stations with goods without an insane markup, and then you have to deal with azz-pirates like this guy. Hope you petitioned it for harassment.
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Jenny Spitfire
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.07.20 21:03:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Jenny Spitfire on 20/07/2006 21:05:30
Trade smacktalking is quite common for cheap stuffs under 2M and 0.01 ISKs undercutting once every few minutes. I get turned on when they convo me. Hehehe. My advice is take no prisoners. It is a free market. 
----------------
RecruitMe@NOINT!
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Argenton Sayvers
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Posted - 2006.07.20 21:35:00 -
[7]
Hmm, why do i never get fanmail.
The only one ever to complain about my prices is KilROCK, but that is to be expected ...
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HippoKing
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.07.20 21:36:00 -
[8]
 Originally by: Jenny Spitfire
I get turned on when they convo me.
While I wouldn't go that far, possibly the thing I enjoy most about eve at the moment is just after I kill people, them convoing me and prove they deserved it tenfold
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Heikki
Gallente
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Posted - 2006.07.21 01:31:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Tami Auryn
who uses +1's ?
Uhm, PvPers who get podded a bit too regularly..?
-Lasse
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Delwynndwn Siele
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Posted - 2006.07.21 02:51:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Heikki
Originally by: Tami Auryn
who uses +1's ?
Uhm, PvPers who get podded a bit too regularly..?
-Lasse
And noobs (like myself) who can't afford better.
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Bermag
Point-Zero
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Posted - 2006.07.21 08:38:00 -
[11]
lol this just make me want to go and setup some buyorders to mess with this guy :-)
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robacz
Gallente
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Posted - 2006.07.21 10:16:00 -
[12]
Heh looks like I should start with +1s again. Could be fun. 
___________
Buying/Selling: Implants, Cargo Expanders and more |
KuranesGrey
Oberon Incorporated
Prime Orbital Systems
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Posted - 2006.07.21 14:49:00 -
[13]
Since posting my message a couple of the empire markets have gotten quite competitive. There's still Mr .01-raising smacktalker, but there's also a significant volume of larger buy and sell orders that are narrowing the spreads. Given the easy money there is working these trades, I suspect the competition will just increase.
I'm making a fair amount of money working those spreads myself. Sometimes directly from the smacktalker, I have some funny entries in my wallet where I'm buying an implant from him at 375,000 only to sell them back to him later at 450,000. Always accompanied by an Evemail from him like "You Have NO Clue about how the market works do you?".
BTW, +1s are very useful. Newbies care a lot about them, both because they're cheap to buy and because they're the first valuable item they get to sell. Me, I use +1 implants in my PvP clones. A full set is cheaper than one of my rocket launchers :-)
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Trinitey
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Posted - 2006.07.24 00:45:00 -
[14]
Funniest thing just happened. I bumped into the poster and I said Hi.
He then Jumped down my throat accusing me of being the person he posted about.
Then it accured to me.
1. He may be extremly Paranoid?
2. There IS no other Person and he made it up to sucker us into the market so he could take advantage of us.
Dosnt this constatute a scam?
Becuase +1 Implants were Really cheap before he started this thread and the prices have done nothing but go up. Which is funny becuase I read in other posts where there was a tremendous ampunt pouring into the system becuase of some changes in the LP rewards system.
Shouldnt prices be going down?
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Grohh
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Posted - 2006.07.24 03:16:00 -
[15]
The market going back up probably has little to do with this thread and more to do with panic. I watched the market as two weeks ago there was a sudden wealth of +1 implants. Panic probably set in as people with inventories watched the prices go down. Now that the panic is wearing off, the prices are going back up.
While some regions couldn't sell them for 400K, I was still selling them in other high-sec regions for 1M+.
Now the question is, is it time to buy low (there are some regions that are still depressed) in hopes that the recovery is of good size? Hmmmm....
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Gainomax Recovery
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Posted - 2006.07.24 18:14:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Gainomax Recovery on 24/07/2006 18:15:53
Trinitey: When I read your post, which by the way is the first post you've ever made to the forums, I'm beginning to wonder. Is this a post only to discredit the original poster of this thread (which by the way has made numerous posts about lots of other subjects on the forums).
He's merely reflecting about the state of the implant market as it is today. Or should I say Augments market?
Personally I hope prices go up because some competition is entering the market and are pushing the prices up from rock bottom.
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Trinitey
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Posted - 2006.07.24 22:47:00 -
[17]
Well let me answer that.
1. Grohh is only 1 day old and talks about how good things are. Kinda Funny.
2. The Original Poster im told has at least 12 of his characters playing the Market , so I wouldnt doubt that anyone spreading Miss Information such as him is Probably STILL him. (which I belive you to be 1 of them Gainomax)
3, Funny he talks about all these things this supposed person that has a Monopoly on the market (Ive never had a problem in my 2 Regions) has said and asked for us to help him ( Im posative HE is the 1 in all the Regions and justs want to dump his surpluse to us).
4.I had his alt threaten me in 1 region, Lets List what they said.
a. I Hope you enjoy Endlessly changing your Orders.
b. (after I sold him 50 socials in almost as many stations) Im not worried about the augments I get , im not in it for the money , ill just delete them.
Now he is "Targeting me" for no other purpose but to make me "quit" and not to protect his corp , a region his share of the market. NO PvP aspect at all or Game aspect at all. This is what I understand ToS says you CANT do.
After all my encounters with this guy. He is the person he is talking about , but you know what?
I LOVE it becuase I made 800 million selling to his alt in ONE Region. (Ive been STOCK Pileing augments and was worried Id get stuck with them , in my 2 regions alone I have about 5k of each augment so I can guess whats out there)
Im glad he stirred you guys up becuase Im making a Killing. But I feel bad when I see the obviouse new guy step into the arena and I dump all those useless augments on him that he will Never get rid of.
If Im selling to your "Buy" price and im tripling my money , how far can I Undercut your sell prices? And thats just in "MY" 2 Regions. If this other person was real Im psure they would be doing ALOT better than me!
Just becarefull about the rumors that are spread and that persons 11 other characters are saying. lol
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Benchley
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Posted - 2006.07.25 02:30:00 -
[18]
I'm one of the guys who's started playing the market to take advantage of Trinitey / Goldie Maker / Day Dreamer's crazy behavior.
I've made a fortune off him in three different regions as he fills my buy orders to clear them out, then later clears my sell orders thus buying back the implants he sold me at a nice profit.
I entered the market when I saw the original KuranesGrey post, mostly out of spite. People often write stupid things on teh internets, and I try not to let it bother me because there's so little I can do about it. But here I see a stupid person behaving boorishly, and it's within my power to cause him some pain. This because I've got a tremendous amount of isk, plenty of time on my hands, and a spleen that's three sizes too big.
You guys would absolutely not believe the email exchanges. Trinitey / Goldie Maker / Paper Pusher / Day Dreamer is angry. This is getting to him.
You can hear echoes of it here, when he complains of the "harassment" he's suffering because some of his new competition (me among them, though I'm scarcely the only one) has an overdeveloped appreciation for schadenfreude.
Buddy, you think PvP ship combat is nasty? It's kid stuff. Market competition is PvP with the gloves off. And you're losing. Bad.
Now put a sock in it before I embarass you to within an inch of your life by posting the evemail exchanges we've had.
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Trinitey
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Posted - 2006.07.25 07:33:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Trinitey on 25/07/2006 07:38:01
Ive used that Tactic myself and I Highly doubt it was a "Fortune" unles 1 or 2 mil is a "fortune" to you.
Clearly your another one of the original posters alts how else would you Know names? and can someone confirm that those Are the names that the original poster was talking about?
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Trinitey
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Posted - 2006.07.25 08:57:00 -
[20]
I must have been tired when I read this the first time. I didnt see that you grouped ME in with "this" person and also all The personal attacks. IMOP I see about 5 things that might get you baned.
Have you read ToS or the Forum rules?
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Serious Bob
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Posted - 2006.07.25 13:12:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Serious Bob on 25/07/2006 13:13:26
Originally by: Trinitey
I must have been tired when I read this the first time. I didnt see that you grouped ME in with "this" person and also all The personal attacks. IMOP I see about 5 things that might get you baned.
Have you read ToS or the Forum rules?
Apart from the exact same writing style as the OPs hate mail (writing it BIG makes it mean more!), the same threats about ToS and rules.. and to top it off you're obviously annoyed. No, I have no idea how he could group you together.
Trading ftw! I think I'll have a look at the +1 market.
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Mangold
Freelance Unincorporated
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2006.07.25 15:03:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Serious Bob
Edited by: Serious Bob on 25/07/2006 13:13:26
Originally by: Trinitey
I must have been tired when I read this the first time. I didnt see that you grouped ME in with "this" person and also all The personal attacks. IMOP I see about 5 things that might get you baned.
Have you read ToS or the Forum rules?
Apart from the exact same writing style as the OPs hate mail (writing it BIG makes it mean more!), the same threats about ToS and rules.. and to top it off you're obviously annoyed. No, I have no idea how he could group you together.
Trading ftw! I think I'll have a look at the +1 market.
Signed. Looks like the same person to me.
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Benchley
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Posted - 2006.07.25 16:44:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Trinitey
Edited by: Trinitey on 25/07/2006 07:38:01
Clearly your another one of the original posters alts how else would you Know names? and can someone confirm that those Are the names that the original poster was talking about?
That's not a bad guess. Like me, KuranesGrey appears to know where his shift key is and what that key with the funny little dots on it is used for. To further the similarity, neither of us compulsively insists that anyone who crosses us is "off their meds." (Trinitey backing out of his driveway and narrowly missing a bicyclist: "Hey kid, take your meds!" On getting cut off in traffic: "lady you noob you suck at driving take your meds!" etc.)
And, finally, it does turn out that I'm running more than one of the characters that have recently entered the +1 implants market and are making money off your formidable efforts to keep the spreads wide. Look down your list of antagonists--I'm three of them.
And, frankly, it doesn't bother me one bit for you to imagine me to be an even more formidable opponent than I am. If it would frighten you to imagine that I'm running a dozen such efforts, that's absolutely fine with me.
However, my urge to correct an error can sometimes outweigh my desire to appear as a criminal mastermind, and so I must reluctantly deny that I am, in fact, KuranesGrey.
Since you're a master of sock puppetry yourself, mere projection will require you to believe that all your antagonists are, similarly, just one guy. This denial, then, actually kills two birds with one stone. The fact that KuranesGrey and I are in fact two different people will be plainly obvious to anyone with a minute or two to examine the readily available data. (And who, no doubt we'll soon learn, isn't taking their meds.)
And as for Day Dreamer / Trinity, he surely won't believe the truth. And that also suits me just fine. It's sort of a win-win thing. (Kind of like buying low from and selling high to the same guy. What is that? Structural irony? I dunno.) |
KuranesGrey
Oberon Incorporated
Prime Orbital Systems
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Posted - 2006.07.25 18:19:00 -
[24]
It's too bad this thread has degenerated into insults and accusations of sock-puppetry. Because what's interesting about Eve isn't the Forum Warriors, it's the market dynamics. And the +1 market has become very dynamic.
For the record, I don't run any trading alts. And yes, I do think Trinitey is one of the manifestations of the smacktalking trader I first posted about. The others I know about are Day Dreamer, Paper Pusher, and Goldie Maker. I made the link when Trinitey sent me smacktalk Evemails at the same time as the others. He also sometimes trades in the same times and directions as the others, working to clear orders and widen the spread.
Of course all of these alt accusations and rebuttals are impossible to prove or verify. Particularly with NPC corp members. But it doesn't much matter; what matters is the market trades.
My post has had the intended effect of bringing in more competition to the +1 market. Prices are stabilizing somewhat with the increased competition, although not as fast as I'd hoped. The cornerer is awfully persistent. Just last night in Domain he bought 25M worth of implants from me and relisted them for 30M. Then again, he sold me those same implants for 20M a few days ago. Not a huge profit, but I'll happily keep it up.
There's also an increase in trading volume as speculators move in. Usually about 25 Limited Neural Boosts trade a day in Domain. It's up to about 40 a day in the last week. Yesterday someone who I don't think is the cornerer placed a large sale order for about 200 Neurals at a low but profitable price. That order then got cleared yesterday, a 10x increase in trading volume from typical. Same thing happened yesterday with Limited Ocular Filter. You can see it yourself in the game, just click "Price History".
Either someone's working very hard to maintain a wide spread, someone's shilling bids to manipulate average prices, or someone clever has found a cross-region trade and made a profit. Don't know which it is, but it's definitely interesting.
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Miss Overlord
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Posted - 2006.07.25 18:21:00 -
[25]
i am starting to wonder if thoes behind these alts are actualy working an ISK selling angle />?
Wonder if this is the new macroer in action
Ok enough about conspiracy theories i guess his margins are slipping he might be aligned with an alliance and under pressure to keep funds going into their coffers (perhaps without naming anyone a certain alliance under heavy fighting atm)
Or his just uptight in RL and his failure on the market is affecting his RL obsession
Either way time for me and a few friends to enter the market as wel and wipe out the profit margins completley
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Grohh
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Posted - 2006.07.26 03:04:00 -
[26]
Even though I am only "one day old", I still have a idea what the markets are looking like. For example, as of Sunday morning, the min sell order spread in the carebear area for LNB implats gets up to 2 to 1 between different regions. Essence is the most depressed at 360K. Khanid's min sell is over 1 million.
So there is money to be made in buying and reselling in other regions. I'm still making nice money doing direct buy/sell trades in implats.
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Trinitey
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Posted - 2006.07.26 04:33:00 -
[27]
This was your original post
Originally by: Grohh
The market going back up probably has little to do with this thread and more to do with panic. I watched the market as two weeks ago there was a sudden wealth of +1 implants. Panic probably set in as people with inventories watched the prices go down. Now that the panic is wearing off, the prices are going back up.
While some regions couldn't sell them for 400K, I was still selling them in other high-sec regions for 1M+.
Now the question is, is it time to buy low (there are some regions that are still depressed) in hopes that the recovery is of good size? Hmmmm....
You say 2 weeks ago , yet you were 1 day old.
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Feta Solamnia
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Posted - 2006.07.26 09:03:00 -
[28]
heheheh, ah... the good ole foolish market games.
Yulai was full of them and so many people that though that creating a temporary artificial lack of supply would cover for the ever-increasing prices they'd pay to keep the market clear.
In the end they ended up creating a spike on the price (that they'd pay from their own pocket) followed by a steep fall below the previous levels when they tried to offload their items along with the normal flow.
Have fun guys 
Originally by: Oveur
I have access to all market data. Believe me, we have not reached anything close to deflation yet.
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Grohh
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Posted - 2006.07.26 14:04:00 -
[29]
You really need to get over the "one day old" stuff. Alts? Other accounts? Come on, you are smarter than that.
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KuranesGrey
Oberon Incorporated
Prime Orbital Systems
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Posted - 2006.08.03 14:55:00 -
[30]
Well, it's been another week and I'm sad to say that the Domain +1 implant market is still cornered. In the past couple of weeks I spent some time in Domain narrowing spreads and making a modest profit, but I got busy with some 0.0 PvP action and haven't been around to tend my bids. (The hazard of not using alts). I've returned to find the spreads are, once again, 50-100% in each item.
I'm not a serious market trader myself, but I'm surprised that more people aren't competing in this market. Are the amounts involved just not large enough to be interesting? There's a fair amount of turnover; seems a shame to let one person control the prices.
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HappyKitten
Caldari
State War Academy
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Posted - 2006.08.03 17:09:00 -
[31]
Originally by: KuranesGrey
what's interesting about Eve isn't the Forum Warriors, it's the market dynamics.
misguided...
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KuranesGrey
Oberon Incorporated
Prime Orbital Systems
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Posted - 2006.09.02 16:41:00 -
[32]
The smacktalker trader has finally been broken. Someone new came into the Domain market about two weeks ago and placed very large buy and sell orders for all +1 implants with a 10-20% spread. Ie: buy 100 at 400,000, sell 100 at 450,000. Bigger orders than the smack talker could clear. The new trader seems quite willing to maintain orders with the smaller profit margin.
In retrospect I should have done this myself. I was trying to narrow the spreads with smaller orders and wider spreads. Basically too greedy. It took a bigger commitment than I made to take over the market.
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Marlenus
Caldari
Ironfleet Towing And Salvage
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Posted - 2006.09.17 09:14:00 -
[33]
He's still at it and still smacking.
In my region, he was buying up all the +1 charismas for a fraction of their mineral value. I started outbidding him; hey, I like free minerals. He's called me an idiot, a moron, dumb, stupid, and all sorts of stuff like that, but his big shtick is that "I don't know how the market works." He's tried dumping into my buy orders once they get up near the mineral value, but when I can turn around and process the implants, sell the minerals, and place *bigger* buy orders, I don't see how he hopes to break me.
It's actually really funny. I kinda like being called an idiot by a guy who keeps giving me free minerals. "I don't think that word means what you think that word means..."
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Scionissis
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Posted - 2006.09.17 11:03:00 -
[34]
Hi. I'll be joining this trade :) - Sounds like a lot of fun!
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Ezoran DuBlaidd
Minmatar
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Posted - 2006.09.17 14:21:00 -
[35]
Originally by: KuranesGrey
sock-puppetry.
i like that term!
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Maximum Panic
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Posted - 2006.09.18 17:57:00 -
[36]
This +1 implant article has a funny parallel to real life media coverage on a commodity. Quick buck manipulators will be like those people that are watching CNBC and think now is a good time to buy energy stocks (becaue CNBC ran a report that said it was....).
When you guys graduate to the +3 market give me a call.
I have routinely cleared Jita of +3 implants for "redistribution" to more profitable locales. I am not greedy and my target is just to make 10-15% off the carry. The key of any market is data --> I know the true demand and buy rate of the real life players in many remote regions for +3 implants.
If the manipulators start to buy up like crazy that is when I see the "spike" and unload all my implants (or other goods i stockpile) then wait for the real things to settle. Made billions on the mineral market every time market manipulators come in.....
Market PVP doesn't send you an eve killmail - but that flashing in your wallet sure hurts just as much I bet.
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Scionissis
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Posted - 2006.09.18 21:07:00 -
[37]
^ wow, your ePeen sure is big. I'm impressed.
...anyway. Back to the topic at hand. One of the alts is bugging me and starting to make threats. I'll reduce the spread on all +1 implants to 50k see if he accepts my offer of buying me out of the market. I don't mind a 50k profit per implant. Lets see how long he wants to put up with it. 
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Marlenus
Caldari
Ironfleet Towing And Salvage
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Posted - 2006.09.20 00:31:00 -
[38]
Yeah, threats indeed.
He just told me he was about to get Tycoon, and with all his spare market slots he was going to track down everything I'm buying and selling and make it cost a lot more. And with all the money he made from doing that, he was going to hire people to pod me.
It's *amazing* how much anger and energy he brings to his market efforts!
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Scionissis
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Posted - 2006.09.20 01:59:00 -
[39]
You too huh? He's threatened pretty much the same to me. The most recent line was that he was going to make me hurt, etc etc etc. He also claimed that since I'd made him log in 9 times a day (how sad!) he was making 5 times as much profit and that my buy/sell orders had netted him 350% profit. Meh. I don't care, I'm still making some cash, and now I'm just messing with the orders for spite  .
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OutOfTheBox Cyborg
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Posted - 2006.09.20 11:02:00 -
[40]
yup this guy was buying mem 1's off me at 2 mil a go at one point and selling them at 1.5 in order to teach me a lesson! The guys eve mails became so derranged that I became worried about his well being. I sincerely hope he is getting the help he needs and not just living some isolated life and going more and more mad.
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Marlenus
Caldari
Ironfleet Towing And Salvage
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Posted - 2006.09.21 00:47:00 -
[41]
Yeah, I'm a little worried about his mental health.
He sold me a bunch of implants for less than mineral value (!) and then sent me smackmail about how he'd "slammed them down my throat."
He sure showed me...
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Scionissis
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Posted - 2006.09.21 01:46:00 -
[42]
All he has to do is pay me 50m isk and I'll leave the market to him. How fair is that? ;)
Anyway, does anyone have a good spreadsheet with the cost in minerals for most/all T1 items? It would be good to know what is a 'bargain' for refining alone!
I think i'll keep messing with him. A few orders a day, here and there should make him smile, and hey, as the guy said, I'm helping him make more profit!
Perhaps he's been visiting the underpants gnomes:
Step 1: Buy implants
Step 2: Sell for less than bought
Step 3: ????
PROFIT!!11oneone!!
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Angry Sheep
Amarr
Aur0ra
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Posted - 2006.10.06 10:30:00 -
[43]
This thread and another has made me laugh so much, I always found trade to me more ruthles that pirating.
This trader has broken the number one rule, and by shouting about it all, made us aware of the money to be made.
Looks like a new business venture for "Angry Enterprises"
w00t w00t here I come...
It's a Dog eat Dog World out there and I'm wearing Milky Bone underwear
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F'nog
Amarr
Celestial Horizon Corp.
Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.10.15 02:42:00 -
[44]
Any other news on this? I'm wondering if PP has done anything else amusing lately?
Originally by: DB Preacher
The only time BoB's backs are to the wall is when backdoor bandit is in local.
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Zelma Moonlight
Trader's Academy
Daikoku Trade Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.10.15 11:19:00 -
[45]
I got this friendly mail today:
Quote:
...
I will pod you. then I will pod you again , then i will pod you again. I hope your caring alot of items when I do it.
...
you are "playing" in "my" market" I will pod you everytime I see you bid against me.
...
As I have started buying and selling +1 implants in my starter station, I suspect this is the angry player mentioned here.
Personally, I think a trader who is so angry about a three week old competitor must be in a very weak position.
For a few 10.000s isk profit, I will do a lot of extra jumps. Somehow I don't see how any older player could compete with that.
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Scionissis
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Posted - 2006.10.16 01:32:00 -
[46]
He's still doing it. And now and then me or an alt like to mess with him a bit. I've made good money off the guy :)
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Shadarle
|
Posted - 2006.10.20 00:46:00 -
[47]
I don't care if the margin is 300%, if it's 300% of 100-200k like it is in the system I'm in then it's a complete waste of time.
I can make 1-50 mil per item with a 5-20% margin or I can make 200k at a 300% margin. Lets see... do I care about the ISK or the margin...
I guess for people with piddles for money it's nice... but otherwise I don't get it. Plus I don't notice any of these implants being over 300k in my region... not even close to the 1+ mil stated in this thread.
**********************************************
Tank Rankings - Ships & Fittings Compared!
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=386174 |
SonOfAGhost
Minmatar
Republic Military School
|
Posted - 2006.10.20 04:50:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Shadarle
Plus I don't notice any of these implants being over 300k in my region... not even close to the 1+ mil stated in this thread.
Please specify the region and how many are on the market, I'll bring my hauler.
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Futuri
|
Posted - 2006.10.20 14:23:00 -
[49]
Edited by: Futuri on 20/10/2006 14:23:55
I wonder if the guy makes any money at all, filling your competitor's orders is never good for the bottom line :P
he does it again
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Motivated Prophet
Zerodot Schools
|
Posted - 2006.11.09 01:21:00 -
[50]
Edited by: Motivated Prophet on 09/11/2006 01:21:58
Trin is one of his alts:
Originally by: "EVEMails"
2006.11.08 05:35
you are truelly slow. look at when you were outbid, it was before you sent this. so you lied again. becuase im not outbid. can we say SLOW. get back on that short
bus!
--------------------
2006.11.08 05:33
Perhaps you missed the part about not caring.
BTW, you're outbid. Stop typing EVEMails and start playing the market, kid.
--------------------
2006.11.08 05:28
that might take awhile becuase your clearly slow. you know 4 of my characters. how about the other 20?
--------------------
2006.11.08 05:27
Meh. I let you know when I begin to care.
--------------------
2006.11.08 05:18
read the boards and "bios" there are many more. i wont give you the names becuase , well your a moron. ready to deal yet?
--------------------
2006.11.08 05:15
You can't be everywhere with Paper Pusher, Goldie Maker, Trinitey, Day Dreamer....
<3
--------------------
2006.11.08 05:05
omg your not only slow your a moron to boot. IM everywhere. JITA is the CHEAPEST for you to BUY at. Id be Losing ISK here is I wasnt supporting it from other
regions.
--------------------
2006.11.08 05:03
I pay your prices? Try again. I pay my prices. Jack Jita around all you like; I'm everywhere. :)
And the IQ is probably not a good topic to bring up. You'll lose that battle, and it's not one I enjoy winning.
Yours,
MP
--------------------
2006.11.08 04:59
and all that belittling is going to get you a better price. in fact. id go as far as to GIVE you all the +1 implants youll ever want if your IQ was more than mine.
If your to Ignorant to understand my meaning becuase I misspelled a word then get back on that SHORT bus and go back to school.
your prices keep going UUUUUUUUUPPPPPPPPPPPPPP!
--------------------
2006.11.08 04:54
It's spelled "throw" and "laughable".
Also, there's this thing called a "shift" key. It makes letters B-I-G. Readability ftw.
At any rate, as I said, I'll just stick to ripping you off with alts whenever I need another batch.
--------------------
2006.11.08 04:52
im fine in the kiddie +1 market. its Mine. Im ok with that. your the 1 coming to the kiddie market and trying to through a laugable 12 billion isk around like its
something.
If you had that much you would just buy them. you are clearly clueless.
--------------------
2006.11.08 04:46
Stop trying to be Taiwanese National. You're not half the man he is.
Go play in the tech2 market with the big boys. Or keep to your kiddie pool of +1's. Whatever.
I'll just keep ripping you off with alts. :-D
--------------------
2006.11.08 04:45
lets rock MORON. now you get NOTHING and like it. I have 16 times your ISK and 100 times the inventory.
Im not the newb here. Get back on your SHORT bus and go back to school , take youer meds and try to learn something
And, yeah, he's still at it. I especially liked when he tried to blackmail me:
Originally by: "EVEMails"
2006.11.09 01:03
Ill meet you in the middle. 1.6m a set and I wont show this letter to your investers. lol
--------------------
2006.11.09 00:55
Sorry, I buy at 1.4 and no higher.
Unless, of course, I'm outbidding you. Then I have no qualms--the sky's the limit.
<3,
MP
--------------------
2006.11.09 00:51
I just sold 500 sets to 1 of my good customers at 1.75m a set. id match that price on sets to you with the condition you pull your bids of course.
this is a time sensitive offer and must be accepted immediatly , becuase as you see , prices just seem to be skyrocketing
(continued)
Edit: incorrect QUOTE tags.
|
Motivated Prophet
Zerodot Schools
|
Posted - 2006.11.09 01:24:00 -
[51]
And then, with his uber skills, managed to both raise and lower the price in the same EVEMail after I responded:
Originally by: "EVEMails"
2006.11.09 01:09
it took 9 months to be able to pay what I pay for them. why should your punk mouth entitle you to a share of that? are you truelly that slow, ive made more isk per
unit since you placed your bids. having your rediculous bids is working in my favor.
1.7 and thats my last offer. you hold steady ill just keep raising the prices. ill go 1 better. ill go 1.5 RIGHT NOW and if you pass on then I promise it will cost you
20% more per day
--------------------
2006.11.09 01:05
Son,
I'll go post this letter on eve-o right now if it'd make you feel better.
If my investors think I'd spend a penny in the same way I talk one when I'm negotiating a deal, then they wouldn't have given me their isk in the first place.
1.6 is not acceptable. 1.4 is. I know what you pay for your implants. 1.4 or there is no offer.
Is there really that much money to be made in +1's? I mean, Jesus, this guy apparently has nothing better to do than outbid me by 0.01 isk and send me half-intelligible EVEMails. I don't know whether to petition him for harrassment or quote him on OMGRawr.
At any rate, long story short, he's still at it, lol.
MP
|
Futuri
Caldari
|
Posted - 2006.11.09 04:56:00 -
[52]
Priceless...
By the way, good luck with your skillbook venture, nice idea, I wish I had some spare cash to invest
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Kesslan Osefice
|
Posted - 2006.11.09 05:47:00 -
[53]
Been reading the threads about this guy and it's funny as hell. Makes me wonder how many other people are out there like him? I mean I run a small production corp atm, but this maket trading stuff where you get all sorts of silly threats seems much more fun.
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Futuri
Caldari
|
Posted - 2006.11.09 05:52:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Kesslan Osefice
Been reading the threads about this guy and it's funny as hell. Makes me wonder how many other people are out there like him? I mean I run a small production corp atm, but this maket trading stuff where you get all sorts of silly threats seems much more fun.
It's not that much fun actually, that guy is unique, thats why all the excitement :p
Sometimes you do get involved in a bid war but I usually don't even bother to figure out whom I'm fighting, it takes time and time = ISK, hehe.
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Kesslan Osefice
|
Posted - 2006.11.09 07:41:00 -
[55]
Aww, what a pitty. And here I thought all you die hard market traders really lived it up and had secret wars with one another the rest of the EVE World never gets to see ala Shadowrun!
Mr. Johnson: There is a particular... thorn in the side of my employer. Your target is a simple Subway eatery establishment manager by day. But by night he is known as Margin Trader007.
Runners: And what's the pay?
Mr. Johnson: My employer is willing to pay you 300M ISK to.... deal with this particular thorn. His trading savy has become too much of a threat, and he must be elimited. A bonus of 50M a clone head has also been authorized. We are also willing to buy what ever +1 implants can be found in the wreckage of his ships.
Runners: Well, I guess that sounds pretty good. Anything else?
Mr. Johnson: Yes, this conversation never happend, and no one else is to ever know why Mr Margin Trader007 has been targeted. If so much of a peep comes out to the rest of the EVE World, you will be.... dealt with. Such things... would destroy EVE as it is now known to be. You wouldnt want that now would you?
Runners: Cetainly not Mr. Johnson, we accept. Any other available data on the target would of course be apperciated.
Mr. Johnson slides over an EVEMail containing the pertinent advance, and the Runner's wallets blink. "Here is a small advance in.... good faith that this job will be done properly."
Runner1: Rock on! We can sooo get some new T2 guns with these!
Runner2: Wewt! New T2 capcharger for me!
Runner3: LOL!!11 I'm OMGWTFBBQPWN that d0O|) so f@st!!!!!111
Runner4: Heh.. I just put in a buy order for 10,000 bottles of spirits and exotic dancers to celebrate!
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Stoick Furious
|
Posted - 2006.11.09 15:04:00 -
[56]
You guys should leave him and his +1 implant market fixing alone. It sounds like he's saving up for a brain.
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SencneS
Amarr
Keepers of the Holy Bagel
|
Posted - 2006.11.09 17:56:00 -
[57]
Be thankful it's just +1 implants.
In my early beginnings I had a great thing going with Vitoc. about a month after I started I was able to buy 6000 units at 7500ea and sell it at 12000ea I was making a fortune.
Then someone who I was "undercutting" threatened me, it turned into a price war, profits on both sides where low. Then a third party came in. The guy I was undercutting paid some Pirate like 25million to kill this 3rd guy. However the pirate he paid was known to me which I had already paid my "right to trade" fee in the system. So they wouldn't take the contract on me, but they said if he offers more they would.
I was even debating to put a contract on the guy that threatened me. I was going to go as high as 50mil for his corpse and the kill mail.
The moral is, people with money that you interfere with will do anything they can to make you stop.  Be thankful you're talking about 20% spread instead of a 75% on large quality of items.
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Futuri
Caldari
|
Posted - 2006.11.09 21:30:00 -
[58]
Originally by: SencneS
Be thankful it's just +1 implants.
In my early beginnings I had a great thing going with Vitoc. about a month after I started I was able to buy 6000 units at 7500ea and sell it at 12000ea I was making a fortune.
Then someone who I was "undercutting" threatened me, it turned into a price war, profits on both sides where low. Then a third party came in. The guy I was undercutting paid some Pirate like 25million to kill this 3rd guy. However the pirate he paid was known to me which I had already paid my "right to trade" fee in the system. So they wouldn't take the contract on me, but they said if he offers more they would.
I was even debating to put a contract on the guy that threatened me. I was going to go as high as 50mil for his corpse and the kill mail.
The moral is, people with money that you interfere with will do anything they can to make you stop. Be thankful you're talking about 20% spread instead of a 75% on large quality of items.
How can killing someone prevent him from trading? If someone really ****ed me off in a price war I would just place a huge buy order at 3% spread and resume normal operation in a week or so when the guy gave up. Yes it would kill the profit for that week but you would not be losing any money and such an order would not take much time to maintain...
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Motivated Prophet
Zerodot Schools
|
Posted - 2006.11.09 23:42:00 -
[59]
Well, he made the mistake of showing me his stockpiles (nice e-peen!). He has about a billion isk-worth of each implant in Jita. So if you want to take his lunch money, it's a bit of an investment. You could probably focus on just one implant type and do well, though. All his characters are in noobcorps, so he can't hold corp orders; you might also do well putting up multiple buy orders for the same thing and manipulating them to lock him out for the duration of the 5-minute order-change timer.
Frankly, I'd really like for someone to break the guy, but I just don't have the finances (okay, fine, I DO, but my shareholders would NOT be amused, lol) to do it. Spreads in Jita are holding at 50-100%, which is just ridiculous.
Who wants to step up to the plate and take this guy down?
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Futuri
Caldari
|
Posted - 2006.11.10 00:36:00 -
[60]
Hmm if he's only at 1 billion I might do that. I just tied myself up in another feist tho so it might take a week before I have the funds :P
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Kogame Tomika
Gallente
|
Posted - 2006.11.10 02:13:00 -
[61]
Yeah, this guy is still at it, in his various alts. I personally got a kick out of how he bought some of my +1s at 280,000 sold them back to me at 140,000 and then presumed to tell me that I didn't know what I was doing. I was trying to be nice, and explain that the idea of buy low sell high was pretty easy, when he filled all my buy orders! Nice of him I thought.
When I reposted them for sale, he then proceeds to call me a noob and once again explains that I don't know what I am doing. Wasn't going to get into it any more with such an idiot.
Quote:
Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter.
Martin Luther King Jr.
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Shell Salopa
|
Posted - 2006.11.10 05:55:00 -
[62]
Edited by: Shell Salopa on 10/11/2006 05:57:27
Edited by: Shell Salopa on 10/11/2006 05:56:28
Edit: fixed the quote tag 
Originally by: Motivated Prophet
Frankly, I'd really like for someone to break the guy, but I just don't have the finances (okay, fine, I DO, but my shareholders would NOT be amused.
As a shareholder in your corp. Assuming you could even make a tiny proffit out of it. I would be highly ammused
Though obviously I would prefer you follow the inital buisiness plan you placed as I feel it has alot of potential. But back on track to this +1 implant guy, maybe he does have a bil worth of +1 implants. But one must wonder at this rate, just how much money he's actually LOST obtaining that many, especially give the fact that so many people seem to now be buying from him and reselling to him at a proffit. Enough people, evne with limited resources coudl quite likely just about bankrupt the guy if he's really that persistant.
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Kesslan Osefice
|
Posted - 2006.11.10 06:04:00 -
[63]
*sigh* god I that, the above is my alt. (wish the **** thign woudlnt go first)
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Acroporidae
|
Posted - 2006.11.10 07:41:00 -
[64]
It seems I've run into this same guy. I'm a new player, didn't even know about EVE until month ago. When I started playing I was thinking that the economy model looks interesting and planned to mainly play a trading character. A couple of weeks later I was a bit shocked when this player started spamming my mailbox with insults :)
Ah well, I think I'll just configure the eve-mail cost to 100K and continue trading :)
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Motivated Prophet
Zerodot Schools
|
Posted - 2006.11.10 09:14:00 -
[65]
You can set your default character with which to post. Click "settings" in the left-hand nav bar while viewing the forums.
And just to clarify: he had a approximately billion isk in each +1 implant. Picture
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Tostitos
|
Posted - 2006.11.10 09:35:00 -
[66]
Wow, just wow. I have 5mil, can I get into this?
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Kesslan Osefice
Panther's Paw Industries Ltd
|
Posted - 2006.11.10 10:18:00 -
[67]
Originally by: Motivated Prophet
You can set your default character with which to post. Click "settings" in the left-hand nav bar while viewing the forums.
And just to clarify: he had a approximately billion isk in each +1 implant. Picture
Hey! Thanks :D
ANd to be on topic. Wow.. thats alot of implants. But still, even with that many, his operating procedures leave something to be desired in the long run. If I had the time I might well have hoped onto the band wagon myself.
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Kogame Tomika
Gallente
|
Posted - 2006.11.10 13:08:00 -
[68]
I don't ordinarily engage in forum smaktalk, but I have to wonder how this chap amassed such a vast collection of implants while remaining viable as a merchant. He bought some +1 implants off of me (total profit to me about 1/2 million) then sold them back to me, and then rebought them from me at an even higher profit margin (about 3/4 million this time).
Now I'll be the first to admit that I don't understand all the nuances of "advanced" trading, but you gotta wonder who much ISK this guy is buying off e-bay to pay for his behaviour.
Quote:
Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter.
Martin Luther King Jr.
|
Kazuo Ishiguro
Caldari
School of Applied Knowledge
|
Posted - 2006.11.10 15:02:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Tami Auryn
lol very amusing :D
Who would ever want to make money in +1 who uses +1's ? :)
Might as well go for +2's.
Seconded.
The margins where my alt is are considerably better right now.
----------
Racer in the ISGC Frigate League |
Kogame Tomika
Gallente
|
Posted - 2006.11.10 16:41:00 -
[70]
Edited by: Kogame Tomika on 10/11/2006 16:42:29
Well, when you're just starting out, a 60-80% return is decent, with only small startup funds. A few lucky trades and you can even get 100% returns on investment. Granted, that's usually only a 100K per unit, but when you are playing with small wallets, that seems bigger. I still have my fingers in them, though most of my trades are now in ship components (just like everyone else :) )
You can make decent ISK at it. My second week my wallet went from 5 million to 50 million just buying and selling these things. Not bad to start out.
Quote:
Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter.
Martin Luther King Jr.
|
Father Weebles
Wreckless Abandon
|
Posted - 2006.11.13 06:45:00 -
[71]
the smacktalking trader from hell? 
"Welcome to EVE, where inflation is out of control." |
KuranesGrey
Oberon Incorporated
Prime Orbital Systems
|
Posted - 2006.12.01 17:38:00 -
[72]
I've been too busy the past few months to get involved in small empire market trades. So I was glad to come back to this thread and see other people are amused by the dynamics.
Interesting that he claims to own 1B worth of +1 implants. That's a lot of sunk cost. It must have been very painful for him a few months ago when the price of implants fell so drastically after they became more common as mission rewards.
|
Motivated Prophet
Zerodot Schools
|
Posted - 2006.12.01 20:32:00 -
[73]
Indeed. He has claimed in another thread that he's worth a total of around 20 billion, across all of his accounts.
He eventually flooded my buy orders when he got tired of them sitting there, mocking him, I suppose. No complaints from me. :-D
MP
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Taliac
Caldari
|
Posted - 2006.12.10 11:13:00 -
[74]
He's the worst trader i've ever seen
He's selling me implants for 400k and buying them back for 580k
And what some already said, he's calling me a noob, idiot and more of that.
I deleted most mails that he send without even reading them, because it was all a bit the same.
I will annoy him a bit more, i'm not in it for the profit so i will do this for a few months, if i'm not getting bored with it.
Oh, and another alt he uses is Morpheouse.
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Schmeckel
|
Posted - 2006.12.25 23:51:00 -
[75]
A couple of weeks ago I was trading in implatns and this guy 'paper pusher' started berating me and accusing me of ripping him off. He continued to verbally assault me vie email until I stopped trading just to get away from him.
After hearing that he is a serial assaulter I think I will start trading in them again.
|
Cptn Z
Minmatar
|
Posted - 2006.12.26 17:39:00 -
[76]
Originally by: Schmeckel
He continued to verbally assault me vie email until I stopped trading just to get away from him.
Just block him, he's sick.
---
Regards, Z |
Tao Rhekdai
Gallente
Merch Industrial
|
Posted - 2007.01.02 11:50:00 -
[77]
Heh, he and his alts are still up to it.
However, as he's flooding my buy orders, he seems content to send me rather pleasant mails asking if I'm buying them to sell in 0.0 space and offering to make a supplier deal. Actually, he's sent me the same identical email from several alts. Haven't gotten badmouthed by him, though I suspect thats only a temporary thing.
To anyone out there interested: there definitely still is opportunity for cash to be made here, particularly since he enjoys clearing buys. I dont mind doing a little bit of legwork to pick them up 
|
Shakuul
Caldari
The Imperial Commonwealth
The Sundering
|
Posted - 2007.01.04 01:21:00 -
[78]
memory implants are down to a 386k/585k bid/ask spread. This doesn't seem like much. Even with the whole market in one region you're making like 5mil a day.
|
Marlenus
Caldari
Ironfleet Towing And Salvage
|
Posted - 2007.01.09 15:23:00 -
[79]
Amusing follow up on Paper Pusher.
For months he was in NPC corp and flying a Badger. Today I spot him on a Jita gate in a raven. He's in a new corp for six days. Corp name is "The Elite Collective" and the description is:
This is a Corp formed becuase I found myself being Richer or Smarter than Any Corp that tried to recruit me. Any others would "Demand" I provide some "Service"
This Corp is for the "Elite" Player.
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Rufless
|
Posted - 2007.01.09 16:19:00 -
[80]
I'm not one of those people who will regale you with tales of profit made at the expense of this strange fellow. But it really seems like this thread is made up of alts.
There are a dozen people here telling the reader that a guy who is trying to corner a market is using smacktalk to scare folks away and also giving every comer profits.
As a new player, am I supposed to believe that someone who is giving profits to all comers is in fact trying to scare them out of the market?
How is that supposed to work?
He makes a loss and everyone else makes a profit and this is his way of keeping people out of the market? I would have guessed the opposite to be true or at least he causes the new comer to lose as well.
What would make sense to me is this:
He wants the market so he drives prices to the point where he loses money AND the newcomer loses money. With his bigger bank account he can outlast the new comer and scare him away.
But if the newcomer makes decent profits, why would they run away?
|
Motivated Prophet
Zerodot Schools
Power Corrupts Industry's
|
Posted - 2007.01.09 18:31:00 -
[81]
Originally by: Rufless
I'm not one of those people who will regale you with tales of profit made at the expense of this strange fellow. But it really seems like this thread is made up of alts.
There are a dozen people here telling the reader that a guy who is trying to corner a market is using smacktalk to scare folks away and also giving every comer profits.
As a new player, am I supposed to believe that someone who is giving profits to all comers is in fact trying to scare them out of the market?
How is that supposed to work?
He makes a loss and everyone else makes a profit and this is his way of keeping people out of the market? I would have guessed the opposite to be true or at least he causes the new comer to lose as well.
What would make sense to me is this:
He wants the market so he drives prices to the point where he loses money AND the newcomer loses money. With his bigger bank account he can outlast the new comer and scare him away.
But if the newcomer makes decent profits, why would they run away?
Keep in mind he trades across multiple regions.
Yes, he will flood buy and sell orders to increase his spread, but by expanding his margin on an implants by 50k per implant, he's able to lose a portion of the value of a few dozen or a few hundred implants in order to increase his margin on the few hundred or few THOUSAND he'll buy and sell before someone places another order he'll have to flood.
He also capitalizes on peoples' stupidity--he'll bid you up, trying to get you to outbid him, and then when you're buying high enough or selling low enough, he'll just merrily flood your orders not just to clear them out but because he's making a PROFIT by doing so. This is especially true with cross-region trading.
Basically, yes, people make money off of PP. But PP makes more money off of the rest of Eve, so it balances out nicely. If someone really wants to stop him, they need to make money off of him consistently, throughout his active day. That'll slow him down in a hurry.
MP
|
Hin Vemere
|
Posted - 2007.01.09 23:00:00 -
[82]
MP is right, he's not completely stupid. But he is insane, so if you are thinking of getting into +1 implant trading, here is the essential first step. |
Hin Vemere
|
Posted - 2007.01.09 23:25:00 -
[83]
Originally by: Taliac
He's the worst trader i've ever seen
He's selling me implants for 400k and buying them back for 580k
The implants he sold you for 400k were already bought from newbies for <330k, and once he's bought them back for 580k he can sell them (again to newbies) for >620k. If he takes an overall loss per implant, it's much smaller than you think, and in the meantime he's instantly cleared your buy/sell orders so his orders are the only ones the newbies see. It's a risky strategy for the reasons already mentioned but he clearly has the dedication (and smacktalk) to outlast most newcomers to the market. |
Rufless
|
Posted - 2007.01.10 12:10:00 -
[84]
Originally by: Motivated Prophet
He also capitalizes on peoples' stupidity--he'll bid you up, trying to get you to outbid him, and then when you're buying high enough or selling low enough, he'll just merrily flood your orders not just to clear them out but because he's making a PROFIT by doing so. This is especially true with cross-region trading.
MP
In this part, you say he will drive you to buy higher and sell lower. The opposite of what is good for you. That equals a loss for the person who is challenging him and a gain for him. But in these posts in this thread, people are claiming he loses and they gain. If two people are buying and selling the same set of goods directly to each other, only one can profit and the other loses.
I understand the clearing orders out part and that makes sense as a good strategy but the whole "who gets profit and who gets losses" part sounds strange...
|
Trebor Locke
Gallente
ClanKillers
Dusk and Dawn
|
Posted - 2007.01.11 01:58:00 -
[85]
Originally by: Shakuul
memory implants are down to a 386k/585k bid/ask spread. This doesn't seem like much. Even with the whole market in one region you're making like 5mil a day.
Thats a 51% return on your investment. A very good return I might add. Find a market that sells those in a high volume and you can make about 20-30mil a day from that investment alone.
Correction. 51% is an outstanding return rate! 10% returns is pretty normal for a trader but anything above 20% returns is just out of this world.
--------------
Traders rock PVP. Not only do we fight and wage wars against each other,
but we make it so you "Hardcore" PVPers still have ships ^_^ |
Kima Sha
Muppet Inc
|
Posted - 2007.01.11 10:22:00 -
[86]
Edited by: Kima Sha on 11/01/2007 10:19:37
Had some fun with him last night.
I decided to put in a buy order for 10 and within 15 minutes I had Goldie Maker in a private conversation with him calling me a moron and asking what my intentions where. After explaining that I didn't want to marry them, just take them into the back of my ship and have a good time I offered him a deal. For 50 million I would leave the +1 market alone. He refused so the offer gradually went up to 150 million. He decided to call me a brain-dead mouthy moron and refused, said he was going to war-dec my corp and stomp my guts out.
I promptly went to another region and put up a load more buy orders.
BTW, he credits you guys for getting him his billions, because of you trying to mess with him he has always come out on top and now has billions of isk.
--
CEO - Muppet Inc |
Paper Pusher
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Posted - 2007.01.19 00:32:00 -
[87]
Let me clear all this up for you.
Whats easeier to belive? That I Humilated someone coming into the market and then gloated about it , so they come here and make up fictional stories?
OR
That they are telling the Truth! and they are making millions and millions as easy as can be?
Now my proof and food for thought is this.
IF what they say is true and there is so much effortless easy ISK im giving away , THEN why do they stop?
Dang you Motivated , your the only 1 who truelly saw what was happening and didnt let me "manipulate" you.
Kuranes was the easiest. I called him a few schoolyard names and he was my loyal slave for almot 3 months, LOL.
Update: In the last 24 hours I have made (thats to my wallet and up and after all my refreshing bids) 4.5 Billion. I know that peanuts but that from One of my alts and off Implants Only. I almost feel bad that the new player comes out and fetches my Implants for me (making me a sizable profit when they buy them) spending hours if not days to retrive them , then posting them back at a cut-throat price (LOL) and me buying them , then selling them for 35 to 50% more.
Like ive tried to tell some of the new players. you can literally make more running Level 1 Agent Courier Missions. But hey , thanks for the "slave" labor.
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Baron Oxes
Hypermagic Mountain
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Posted - 2007.01.19 09:14:00 -
[88]
Paper Pusher - from my limited dealings with you after I got bored and thought I'd mess around with +1 implants, I'd like to thank you for your 'hands-on' trading approach and your mild insanity : )
I was hoping you'd accidentally press 'Accept' on the trade window you opened to show me your 1950 units of Limited Occular Filters, next time maybe.
To anyone else, this seems like a good initiation into the more rabid corners of the market and you don't need a great deal of cash to get involved. Good fun : )
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Motivated Prophet
Zerodot Schools
Power Corrupts Industry's
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Posted - 2007.01.19 13:51:00 -
[89]
Originally by: Paper Pusher
Dang you Motivated , your the only 1 who truelly saw what was happening and didnt let me "manipulate" you.
As I've said here and elsewhere--you run a hell of a tight ship. It's just unfortunate that you're a *bleep*, or I'd invest in you. As it stands, one of these days, I'll enter that market and see if I can't outdo you.  But not today.
MP
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Donovan Killar
Caldari
Darkness Inc.
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Posted - 2007.01.19 15:26:00 -
[90]
Hey Paper how you been? Rather amused to see a three page long forum post about you. Honestly I hope I can do something to get a three page thread all to myself some day. Have a good one, see you in space.
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Taliac
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.01.20 00:21:00 -
[91]
I made about 40 to 60 mil with those +1's.
Paper pusher gave it to me, filling my buy orders and than buying the same items back.
Just make sure the profit stays low (about 10 to 20k per implant), he won't like it, and starts acting like an idiot 
But it gets boring after a while, it's all to easy.
And there are better ways to make money.
But it is a nice way to start making isk.
Btw, he started a corp with all his alts in it.
Something with elite players iirc
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Paper Pusher
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Posted - 2007.01.20 04:24:00 -
[92]
Originally by: Taliac
I made about 40 to 60 mil with those +1's.
Paper pusher gave it to me, filling my buy orders and than buying the same items back.
Just make sure the profit stays low (about 10 to 20k per implant), he won't like it, and starts acting like an idiot
But it gets boring after a while, it's all to easy.
And there are better ways to make money.
But it is a nice way to start making isk.
Btw, he started a corp with all his alts in it.
Something with elite players iirc
Either your a Liar or your Delusional (no name calling Just actual statement of facts).
I made so much isk from you its insane, you can go look and still see his sell orders on the market.
I artificially Inflated the market to catch another mouthy person , which I then sold +1's that were selling only 5 days earlier at 1/3 the price. I hooked him in for about 2.5 billion before he wised up , then as I was letting the prices settle back into thier normal prices Mr Taliac come along < challenging me for the market. LOL
I Inflated the buy orders 20% then dumped 100 units of each onto him. then he reposted new but orders at 50k less. I dumped another 100 of each on him. he then relisted MORE buy orders , and after bidding him up got him back to the 2x real worth and dumped ANOTHER 100 on him.
This guy is tottally a fruad , the only time he had me buy orders from him and "made a profit" was when there were 1 or 2 blocking the sell price from being 35% more. Id remove the 1 or 2 units and make 35% more for the 20 or 30 id sell , before he came along again.
I belive he honestly thinks he made isk , and if so , why did he stop? This guy , in my Honest Openion needs to take his medication or seek professional help , becuase Everyone knows that Nobody has made "40 to 60 million" off me.
Bottom line I sold him well over 300 units at 2 to 3 times the "real" price and I bought maybe 20 back over the next Month , which netted me at least 35% increased profits by doing so. This guy seems to think i should undercut a 1 unit bid and lose 35% profit? or give up bragging rights how he took me for millions.
I useually dont respond to post when its clear that people are completly lieing , which seems to be a "Trolling" to me , but the facts are so clear that anyone can see he is nothing but a liar. There are still 50 units of most , still on the market at a good 35%$ to 70% the go9ing rate , those are his. IN Fact. I was so all over undercutting him that he sold Very very Few to anyone at all.
The sad part is I was Honest with him and told him what I was doing , I told him to check the price history and he could see. he told me to bleep off. Oh well , I took his isk. He used his alt Debby isk also. man I wonder how anyone that gullable could have ever got that much isk to donate to me.
Thanks and anytime you want to make more from me like you have in the past , you know where I am. In fact if anyone sees his name on any buy or sell orders , please evemail it to me , id love to run this guy out of buisness becuase he has no clue.
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Kesslan Osefice
Panther's Paw Industries Ltd
Power Corrupts Industry's
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Posted - 2007.01.20 08:56:00 -
[93]
Originally by: Trebor Locke
Originally by: Shakuul
memory implants are down to a 386k/585k bid/ask spread. This doesn't seem like much. Even with the whole market in one region you're making like 5mil a day.
Thats a 51% return on your investment. A very good return I might add. Find a market that sells those in a high volume and you can make about 20-30mil a day from that investment alone.
Correction. 51% is an outstanding return rate! 10% returns is pretty normal for a trader but anything above 20% returns is just out of this world.
See and thats the thing. From what I gather PP never leaves a station. At most, he builds an alt, moves it to a particular hot spot. And then leaves it there till the day EVE dies. Meanwhile through market manipulation he's selling say.. 100 implants to Joe. Joe then pulls up the market info. Oh look he can resell those 100 implants for an easy 5% proffit 6 jumps away. So he zips on over and sells em.
Meanwhile Jill comes along to the station Joe was at. Oh hey.. implants are 10% cheaper here than in her home system. Yoink! Drag em back to the home system sell em for that 10% proffit.
So now PP has had to share otu 15% of that 51% proffit, but has litterally spent 0 time shipping it around. It's all other people doing the work for him. Ultimately that proffit is comming out of the pockets of people who either just dont care about the price their paying for a given item, or folk who simply dont know better. ALot of PVPers I've met in EVE use +1 implants. Because their 'cheap'. They'll still fork over a good 600K+ for em though. But they can make so much more ratting and such that to them it's a drop in the bucket so they dont even think about the fact that those implants were purchased for say.. 100k from a noob who got em as a mission reward 50 jumps away and sold em for peanuts.
I think this also explains PP's choice word of 'slaves' to folk buying/selling from him. Sure their still making a decent proffit. But if he's making that 51% spread, shaving a few percentage points off here and there in time savings is going to pay off for him in the long run. And it's a modle that will effectively work for as long as EVE is a viable MMO. Since ifi t's still viable it will allways have down on their luck, or otherwise new players. And to them that 100k seems like a princley sum. Why for 100k they can finally buy that friggate + fittings they wanted! Sweet! Meanwhile the rest of us look at 100k and just yawn because we can make that much in split second and our ships + fittings cost us 10M, 40M, 500M, several billion?
__
These posts represent my personal views and not those of my corp. These do not reflect offical corp views... wait. I'm the CEO, I guess they do. |
Taliac
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.01.20 09:30:00 -
[94]
Originally by: Paper Pusher
blablabla
Like i said, it's gets boring and there are better ways to make money.
Next time read my very small post, it's not so difficult
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Kesslan Osefice
Panther's Paw Industries Ltd
Power Corrupts Industry's
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Posted - 2007.01.20 10:49:00 -
[95]
Originally by: Taliac
Originally by: Paper Pusher
blablabla
Like i said, it's gets boring and there are better ways to make money.
Next time read my very small post, it's not so difficult
Are there? Thats the real question. Think about it. For you obviously there are better ways to make money than hauling around a bunch of +1 implants. But what if you didnt have to haul them around? And what if, instead of working on a scale of 1,000 implants you were working on a scale of 1,000,000 implants? And best of all you didnt have to do a lick of hauling yourself.
Besides, unless PP is funneling the ISK he's making into RL cash somehow, then he's doing it for some.. to me twisted version of fun. But fun means different things to different folk. And better yet, this way of 'shipping' things around costs you alot less money in the long run. Think about it for a moment. Setting up a transport order takes time, if your smart you'll set a collateral that will at least cover your lost materials should the person default on delivery for what ever reason.
On top of that what if the market near you suddenly changes due to competition? Some one else makes a move on 'your turf'. You could arguably be forced out all togeather, and suddenly here you have paid say.. 10 million to ship a bunch of implants to a given location. Shipments which.. may or may not get there for various reasons, or ones that will.. within two weeks time. ANd in any case you now have to ship to a new, more profitable region.
Thats alot of time some one has to spend actually hauling that crap around. And for various things people wont bother with hauling contracts. Either because the colatteral is set so high it's not worth it, or the payment is so low it's just not worth their time hauling the items over.
Enter EVE traders. They make their living hauling crap around for sale. Buy low sell high. The real pros will cram proffit up the gils and plan their routes so their time nets them the most money and thats their way of having fun. Or at least making enough moneyt o buy that new PVP ship so they can get back to the buisness of blowing up their fellow players.
So you dont even bother with the added time it takes to setup the shipment orders etc. You just fiddle with buy and sell orders. Set it up right and with the way EVE works, some one will eventually notice that either buying or selling an item in a given area is to them, worth the time involved in goign out there and buying/selling it. Or hauling it from one end to the other. It could even be a trader who has plotted out a course that will take him say.. 40 jumps to deliver 10kM3 of cargo at a really good price. But.. he can haul 18km3 in the same ammount of time... hrmm.. what to do with that other 8km3? Oh boy! Along the route he's planning to take some one is buying +1 implants at 300k, but just one system over some one else is selling them at 100k! Sweet! jump 1, fill up on 8kM3 of implants, and go on your merry way, drop off at the proper station along the way, then merily continue and drop off the orrigional 10kM3 cargo. The trader is happy, they made a nice proffit.
Meanwhile you've done 0 work to move those implants. And all for the low low cost of say.. 5% out of that nice big huge 51% proffit margin of yours.
__
These posts represent my personal views and not those of my corp. These do not reflect offical corp views... wait. I'm the CEO, I guess they do. |
Taliac
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.01.20 17:16:00 -
[96]
Originally by: Kesslan Osefice
Originally by: Taliac
Originally by: Paper Pusher
blablabla
Like i said, it's gets boring and there are better ways to make money.
Next time read my very small post, it's not so difficult
Are there? Thats the real question. Think about it. For you obviously there are better ways to make money than hauling around a bunch of +1 implants. But what if you didnt have to haul them around? And what if, instead of working on a scale of 1,000 implants you were working on a scale of 1,000,000 implants? And best of all you didnt have to do a lick of hauling yourself.
Besides, unless PP is funneling the ISK he's making into RL cash somehow, then he's doing it for some.. to me twisted version of fun. But fun means different things to different folk. And better yet, this way of 'shipping' things around costs you alot less money in the long run. Think about it for a moment. Setting up a transport order takes time, if your smart you'll set a collateral that will at least cover your lost materials should the person default on delivery for what ever reason.
On top of that what if the market near you suddenly changes due to competition? Some one else makes a move on 'your turf'. You could arguably be forced out all togeather, and suddenly here you have paid say.. 10 million to ship a bunch of implants to a given location. Shipments which.. may or may not get there for various reasons, or ones that will.. within two weeks time. ANd in any case you now have to ship to a new, more profitable region.
Thats alot of time some one has to spend actually hauling that crap around. And for various things people wont bother with hauling contracts. Either because the colatteral is set so high it's not worth it, or the payment is so low it's just not worth their time hauling the items over.
Enter EVE traders. They make their living hauling crap around for sale. Buy low sell high. The real pros will cram proffit up the gils and plan their routes so their time nets them the most money and thats their way of having fun. Or at least making enough moneyt o buy that new PVP ship so they can get back to the buisness of blowing up their fellow players.
So you dont even bother with the added time it takes to setup the shipment orders etc. You just fiddle with buy and sell orders. Set it up right and with the way EVE works, some one will eventually notice that either buying or selling an item in a given area is to them, worth the time involved in goign out there and buying/selling it. Or hauling it from one end to the other. It could even be a trader who has plotted out a course that will take him say.. 40 jumps to deliver 10kM3 of cargo at a really good price. But.. he can haul 18km3 in the same ammount of time... hrmm.. what to do with that other 8km3? Oh boy! Along the route he's planning to take some one is buying +1 implants at 300k, but just one system over some one else is selling them at 100k! Sweet! jump 1, fill up on 8kM3 of implants, and go on your merry way, drop off at the proper station along the way, then merily continue and drop off the orrigional 10kM3 cargo. The trader is happy, they made a nice proffit.
Meanwhile you've done 0 work to move those implants. And all for the low low cost of say.. 5% out of that nice big huge 51% proffit margin of yours.
First thing, i never haul, i'm to lazy for that
I'm sure i can make more money if i do it like you say, but i do not want to spend to much time making money.
I have one alt, with that one i spend about 30 minutes every 1 or 2 days setting up buy orders and selling it again.
Profit is somewhere around 700 mil per week, and i don't need that much.
As long as i'm able to pay for Eve with the isk and replace the ship losses, i'm happy with it.
Annoying PP was fun for a while, and i did make some money with it, but that was never my intention.
And i'm sure many more will annoy him and make money with it, no matter what he says
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Paper Pusher
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Posted - 2007.01.21 08:17:00 -
[97]
Let me clear 1 thing up. ( I just spent 10 minutes spilling my guts on the mechanics of the +1 market , then I deleted it , I lost it there for a second.lol
New players rarely sell me implants (unless they are a "marketer")
Yes Low sec is the major consumer for this product.
Let me ask you , as a new player how many sets of +1's did you "Buy"?
Me personally I never bought 1 and sold 2?
The major seller is the mission runner and they arent "new".
Another thing , if I wasnt "Grooming" the market , price would be even less than they are , fortunatly I can stock pile these things and some foolish invester Always seems to come along and pay me 3 to 5 times what I invested.
There are , lets say , 5 factors that are exclusive to the +1 market and no other. when you can "control" all these factors , then you can compete. If you only know 4 and I know 5 , I win, Also no amount of isk can take control of the market. well thats untrue I guess , if someone spent endless isk and knew they would never get it back , sure then you could. Its all about knowing all the "Factors" and the most anyone has proven they know is 2 of them , tops.
Sorry to bable. My point was. New Players arent the "Victim" here and actually for the most part benifiet that im here, Ill have nomore "blaming it on the new player". hehe
Also see my other post , Im "Selling" insider info for a limited time. I will show you a methode to tottaly Grief/Exploit the market and shut down "High Volume" dealers.
This has been cleared by a GM and told me "If you have time , your more than welcome to do it". (which isfunny becuase it donst take any "time" to do it , withen 15 seconds I can shut any high volume dealers buisness down).
This will be a "Limited" offer and for a "Limited" time. Search my Name and you will see the post , Im off to write it up in a little bit.
Fly Safe (or like I tell most my Competition)
Stupid is as Stupid does
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Kua Burrow
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Posted - 2007.01.29 01:37:00 -
[98]
Originally by: KuranesGrey
There's also an increase in trading volume as speculators move in. Usually about 25 Limited Neural Boosts trade a day in Domain. It's up to about 40 a day in the last week. Yesterday someone who I don't think is the cornerer placed a large sale order for about 200 Neurals at a low but profitable price. That order then got cleared yesterday, a 10x increase in trading volume from typical. Same thing happened yesterday with Limited Ocular Filter. You can see it yourself in the game, just click "Price History".
I'm lazy and I think others share this gift. Would you post images of the appropriate price history? It would add a bit of flavour to an already fascinating thread. This could become a part of EVE folklore.
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