Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Trebor Daehdoow
Dirt Nap Squad Dirt Nap Squad.
1074
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 16:23:00 -
[1] - Quote
Please discuss issues related to this session in this thread. We look forward to your comments and suggestions. CSM - because I have not yet plumbed the depths of my inherent masochism! CSM 6 Activities Summary | My CSM blog |
Orakkus
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
11
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 17:26:00 -
[2] - Quote
Appears to be working as intended. Eve is back on track. CCP will make more money. More money means more Profit and investment into their other projects down the road. |
Vertisce Soritenshi
Varion Galactic Tragedy.
199
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 19:50:00 -
[3] - Quote
Orakkus wrote:Appears to be working as intended. Eve is back on track. CCP will make more money. More money means more Profit and investment into their other projects down the road. OMG...
So anyway...changes need to be made to the CSM to ensure more balance for who is represented in the overall community. I don't see how it is even possible.
CSM members...(No offense Trebor) should not be allowed to run if they have already been voted in and served on the CSM once or twice already. Support our boobies!-áLINKY! |
Drake Draconis
Shadow Cadre Shadow Confederation
121
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 20:09:00 -
[4] - Quote
Vertisce Soritenshi wrote:Orakkus wrote:Appears to be working as intended. Eve is back on track. CCP will make more money. More money means more Profit and investment into their other projects down the road. OMG... So anyway...changes need to be made to the CSM to ensure more balance for who is represented in the overall community. I don't see how it is even possible. CSM members...(No offense Trebor) should not be allowed to run if they have already been voted in and served on the CSM once or twice already.
Your a day late and a dollar short.
They lifted the restriction even under exterme protest and CSM now have unlimtied terms....you have a snow balls chance in hell in reversing that.
*Happened Last year....don't recall when or how or what but it was a dark day for CSM/CCP* |
Solo Player
78
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 20:53:00 -
[5] - Quote
Recently started to work as intended - by the players. As a leverage for players to get their views taken seriously by being legitimated, public, loud and focussed about it.
Still, could improve on its legitimacy by improving the election process. For example, reduce number of nominations to a more manageable number through some sort of primaries on the forums while making sure minority interests remain represented. RL politics have come up with quite a few ways to do this. Also, make it easier and more attractive for players to vote. 50% participation would greatly add legitimacy. |
Vertisce Soritenshi
Varion Galactic Tragedy.
199
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 21:37:00 -
[6] - Quote
Free 5k Aurum for voting!
Only thing I can really think of without giving free ISK or PLEX and screwing the game over. Support our boobies!-áLINKY! |
StukaBee
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
36
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 22:32:00 -
[7] - Quote
Vertisce Soritenshi wrote:Free 5k Aurum for voting!
Only thing I can really think of without giving free ISK or PLEX and screwing the game over.
Free Aurum just means that of those people who don't currently vote, those who don't care enough about Aurum will continue to not vote, and those who want free Aurum will pick a name at random from the list (or just the first name at the top) so they get their payout. It might give the false impression of legitimacy but it wouldn't increase the number of informed or engaged voters. |
Vertisce Soritenshi
Varion Galactic Tragedy.
199
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 23:38:00 -
[8] - Quote
StukaBee wrote:Vertisce Soritenshi wrote:Free 5k Aurum for voting!
Only thing I can really think of without giving free ISK or PLEX and screwing the game over. Free Aurum just means that of those people who don't currently vote, those who don't care enough about Aurum will continue to not vote, and those who want free Aurum will pick a name at random from the list (or just the first name at the top) so they get their payout. It might give the false impression of legitimacy but it wouldn't increase the number of informed or engaged voters. This is true but there really isn't any way to "incentivise" voting without giving some kind of reward compensation. Unfortunately it will always lead to that outcome. I think CCP should work on the out of game and in game advertisements to help get the word out. Make it easier to see the information people are voting for and more information about the person and what they wish to accomplish as well. Support our boobies!-áLINKY! |
Abdiel Kavash
Paladin Order Fidelas Constans
163
|
Posted - 2011.11.23 23:46:00 -
[9] - Quote
Any sort of incentive for voting will only add random noise to the results.
The only way to encourage responsible voting is to promote the CSM and make people widely aware of what it is and what it does. Propaganda and campaigning by the candidates, and the idea that we can change the course of this game, is what brought many people in 0.0 alliances to vote for CSM6, not getting free stuff. |
Goose99
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
208
|
Posted - 2011.11.24 03:40:00 -
[10] - Quote
Make voting mandatory... like creating a portrait. Can't log into game until you vote. |
|
StukaBee
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
37
|
Posted - 2011.11.24 08:14:00 -
[11] - Quote
Goose99 wrote:Make voting mandatory... like creating a portrait. Can't log into game until you vote.
Same problem as giving away Aurum above:
Stukabee wrote: It might give the false impression of legitimacy but it wouldn't increase the number of informed or engaged voters. |
Lord Zim
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
182
|
Posted - 2011.11.24 09:32:00 -
[12] - Quote
Goose99 wrote:Make voting mandatory... like creating a portrait. Can't log into game until you vote. "oh god, what's this? I can't play my game until I pres butan? JUST SHOW ME A BUTAN AND I WILL PRES I NEED MY ICE MINING FIX!"
Yep. This suggestion won't help, no matter how many times guys like you put this forward. |
Goose99
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
216
|
Posted - 2011.11.24 17:15:00 -
[13] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:Goose99 wrote:Make voting mandatory... like creating a portrait. Can't log into game until you vote. "oh god, what's this? I can't play my game until I pres butan? JUST SHOW ME A BUTAN AND I WILL PRES I NEED MY ICE MINING FIX!" Yep. This suggestion won't help, no matter how many times guys like you put this forward.
What you're afraid of is just the opposite - that the ice miners would actually read the short description and run down goon candidate. |
StukaBee
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
38
|
Posted - 2011.11.24 23:19:00 -
[14] - Quote
Goose99 wrote:Lord Zim wrote:Goose99 wrote:Make voting mandatory... like creating a portrait. Can't log into game until you vote. "oh god, what's this? I can't play my game until I pres butan? JUST SHOW ME A BUTAN AND I WILL PRES I NEED MY ICE MINING FIX!" Yep. This suggestion won't help, no matter how many times guys like you put this forward. What you're afraid of is just the opposite - that the ice miners would actually read the short description and run down goon candidate.
How would a bot know who to vote for? |
Cygnet Lythanea
World Welfare Works Association
3
|
Posted - 2011.11.24 23:25:00 -
[15] - Quote
You do realize that bots have evolved quite a bit from the old days. The trick is to leave them in IRC channels for a while so they start to learn english and then have them listen in say, Minmater channel here in game, and pretty soon you'll have them wandering around mining ice and spouting 'LOL l2p noob!' 'Can i haz yur stuff?' and posting their considered opinions on how awesome goonswarm is in the forums. |
Bomberlocks
CTRL-Q
59
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 01:04:00 -
[16] - Quote
The CSM, or at least part of it, has done a good job at reporting to the players this term. Two Step, Trebor and Seleene in particular come to mind. |
Tahna Rouspel
BWE Special Forces Rage Alliance
16
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 04:24:00 -
[17] - Quote
I think the CSM did a good job. It didn't feel like there was any bias towards a certain part of the game in the arguments. I just hope the next CSM will take into consideration all parts of the game in the future as well. I would hate to see Null sec get all the income and wormholes and low sec miss-out despite being equally as dangerous. |
Evei Shard
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
16
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 05:18:00 -
[18] - Quote
Keep the CSM, but give users an easily visible bright red "vote on Eve related issues' button right next to where their character selection is. Let the players decide at the screen if they want to be involved where the game goes, instead of having to hear about second or third hand, or, worse yet, stumbling onto the forums to find out about it.
People don't need the stuff forced on them, but they need the option to do so clearly in front of them, specifically so they know that they have that option in the first place.
More player interaction directly with CCP at a level that provides CCP with raw data to work with (instead of having to pay someone to read through the endless repeating threads on the forums). Less CSM manipulation. Profit favors the prepared |
Xorv
Questionable Acquisitions
2
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 06:59:00 -
[19] - Quote
Seems to be working better than it ever has since I've been following EVE. Granted it's dominated by people from Null Sec alliances, but I'd rather have them representing me than someone voted in by players that are forced to vote. If players can't take the time to inform themselves and vote, well I'd rather they had no say at all tbh. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
1238
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 08:41:00 -
[20] - Quote
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:Please discuss issues related to this session in this thread. We look forward to your comments and suggestions.
I trust you will strongly resist any proposals for "reserved seats" for specific so-called 'consituencies'. Special treatment is not a way to improve the credibility of a democratic process. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
|
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
1238
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 08:44:00 -
[21] - Quote
Vertisce Soritenshi wrote:Orakkus wrote:Appears to be working as intended. Eve is back on track. CCP will make more money. More money means more Profit and investment into their other projects down the road. OMG... So anyway...changes need to be made to the CSM to ensure more balance for who is represented in the overall community. I don't see how it is even possible. CSM members...(No offense Trebor) should not be allowed to run if they have already been voted in and served on the CSM once or twice already.
Yes if there is one thing that will increase the effectiveness of the CSM, it's ensuring that only those people who have to spend half their term getting used to the way CCP works can be elected. We should definitely toss that experience into the dumper and ensure that only inexperienced CSMs represent us. This is not at all a back-door proposal to get rid of CSMs you don't like even though they got lots of votes because you're afraid that the CSMs you do like won't get as many. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
1238
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 08:46:00 -
[22] - Quote
Goose99 wrote:Lord Zim wrote:Goose99 wrote:Make voting mandatory... like creating a portrait. Can't log into game until you vote. "oh god, what's this? I can't play my game until I pres butan? JUST SHOW ME A BUTAN AND I WILL PRES I NEED MY ICE MINING FIX!" Yep. This suggestion won't help, no matter how many times guys like you put this forward. What you're afraid of is just the opposite - that the ice miners would actually read the short description and run down goon candidate.
Of that the bots would vote for whoever the bot script writer wants them to... Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Trebor Daehdoow
Dirt Nap Squad Dirt Nap Squad.
1077
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 10:06:00 -
[23] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:I trust you will strongly resist any proposals for "reserved seats" for specific so-called 'consituencies'. Special treatment is not a way to improve the credibility of a democratic process.
I for one will resist them, because it's impossible to properly implement it. And in any case, very few players stay in one particular niche for their entire EVE careers.
WRT to focusing on one area to the exclusion of others, right now the focus is on fixing basic stuff that broadly affects a lot of people. Getting CCP to implement Dead Horse POS's, for example, is something that helps everyone. Improving industry and mining makes hisec more interesting and nullsec more valuable -- and worth fighting over. And so on, and so on.
People in the CSM might disagree over whether iterating nullsec sov or FW or lowsec is the highest priority, but these are disagreements at the margins. And if a sharp-eyed dev at CCP comes up with (or notices on the forums!) a low-cost way to iterate an existing game feature (like FW, or bounties), we are certainly going to get behind that, even if it doesn't directly affect an area of the game we hold near and dear -- because the bang for the buck will be too good to ignore.
CSM - because I have not yet plumbed the depths of my inherent masochism! CSM 6 Activities Summary | My CSM blog |
Akrasjel Lanate
Naquatech Conglomerate
197
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 17:23:00 -
[24] - Quote
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:Please discuss issues related to this session in this thread. We look forward to your comments and suggestions.
CSM shouldn't have monopoly mostly for CSM |
Khudin Hadashur
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2011.11.25 20:01:00 -
[25] - Quote
As far as changes for the CSM is concerned, I found myself agreeing with what The Mittani posted in his Chairman's thread:
Mittens wrote: I think the CSM needs one change only for CSM7: a minimum signatures requirement to be added on the ballot. Something relatively minor, like 100 signatures.
|
Kenpachi Viktor
Gradient Electus Matari
90
|
Posted - 2011.11.27 10:17:00 -
[26] - Quote
I would like to see the signatures requirement, also I'd like to see an instant run-off voting system used where you can vote for just one person, or preference vote for everyone. keep the 12 month terms, but have half the seats up for election every 6 months "Watch what they do not what they say. Talk is cheap, and while I do like the current activity of the Devs it really doesn't mean much unless we start seeing results."-á |
Gevlin
SMANews.net SpaceMonkey's Alliance
44
|
Posted - 2011.11.28 10:46:00 -
[27] - Quote
CSM needs more marketing avenues with the actual game of eve.
like: Splash screen on Load up the IN CQ captian Quarters the In space TV in space near Jump Gates
if it is in game - the CSM will have to work in "Role playing " some of the topics to avoid emerssion breaking
A link to the in game Browser's Wiki of the CSM would be Handi or a web page pointing to a particular poll
One of the larges concerns I have is the developing of official polls the need to be neutral. Several Polls written by the CSM during the summer of incarnage were written with incredibly bias. If a poll is written it should be done by that CSM Mediator guy. So that the polls will depict an unbias question and provide a valid answer.
The private Polls that when out during the last Summer (the market research) the CSM should view the results of these, so they can temper of what they see from the forums that can easily suffer from group think vs what people are thinking on an individual by individual basis. They then can leverage their vocal minority input to position that also addresses the information collected from the surveys. I agree with several people: CCP needs to focus most of eve's recources on FIS, but the development of WIS still needs to continue, just as a slower and more efficient pace. In eve I wish to be more than just a machine. |
Tiger's Spirit
Troll Hunters INC.
23
|
Posted - 2011.11.28 13:50:00 -
[28] - Quote
Disband :D |
FloppieTheBanjoClown
The Skunkworks Petition Blizzard
362
|
Posted - 2011.11.29 01:45:00 -
[29] - Quote
Here's an idea for getting people to vote: create a new faction frigate and only give it to people who vote. It doesn't have to be Dramiel 2.0, just something worth having.
Or maybe a vanity item. Or a choice, that faction frig, a *GOOD* vanity item, or *insert third good idea here* |
Mara Villoso
Big Box
32
|
Posted - 2011.11.29 21:33:00 -
[30] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:I trust you will strongly resist any proposals for "reserved seats" for specific so-called 'consituencies'. Special treatment is not a way to improve the credibility of a democratic process. If only it were actually a democratic process. It's anything but. There's nothing to stop CSM members from voting for or against anything they want, whether or not the constituency that elected them wants it. That's a particular problem for groups outside the big alliances. As long as metagaming is allowed in the CSM, it not only isn't democratic, it never will be.
If the goal is to have players directly interface with CCP to assist in the overall development of the game, the CSM is actually the worst possible way to go about it. The crowd sourcing method and other common RL tools for gathering opinions and information from particular constituencies should be more than enough to fulfill the underlying purpose of the CSM. "Direct democracy" in EVE is entirely possible. Why should CCP limit itself to the opinions and machinations of a handful of people? Why take the risks associated with NDAs and such? While I have no direct evidence of anyone acting on information gleaned from their roles as CSM members, it seems odd to me that ice interdiction coincided so perfectly with a complete change to the POS fuel system. Enough with fake politics and a CSM that doesn't truly represent all of the game's constituencies. |
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |