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Nevil Oscillator
0
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Posted - 2014.09.22 00:03:00 -
[31] - Quote
J'Poll wrote:
Uhm, and that would be useful to how many other players?
.
I don't know how many players it would be useful to, who knows what they get up to when I am not there ?
and a lot of the time I can't tell what they are doing when I am there 
Your corp contact technique sounds quite interesting where would you find a list of who is signed up ?
See, you didn't know you had a problem until I solved it. |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
Late Night Alliance
6156
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 00:20:00 -
[32] - Quote
Nevil Oscillator wrote:My point was just that knowing that they are FW players and what side they are on could potentially be useful nothing more.
Okay... I see the problem here.
Understand that there are many different corporations and alliances in Faction Warfare on each side. More often than not, these corporations and alliances will often fight amongst each other even though they are fighting against a common enemy.
If one person/corporation/alliance wants you to help... he/she won't really care if you shoot other "friendly" members unless they are part of the same fleet (which again means that you should ALSO be a part of that fleet).
In fact... they will sometimes stand back and encourage you to shoot.
Using your (flawed) example again:
You are contracted to break up a gatecamp by one group in Faction Warfare. That group WILL NOT CARE if you shoot people belonging to their side unless they are part of the same group.
And again... you can use the contact standings options to set certain people friendly or not.
At the same time, just because you set a group "friendly" it does not mean they will do the same. They might just shoot you anyways.
Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective.
"How did you veterans start?" |
Nevil Oscillator
0
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Posted - 2014.09.22 01:21:00 -
[33] - Quote
ShahFluffers wrote:
And again... you can use the contact standings options to set certain people friendly or not.
.
I think this will not set apart your selected group from anyone else you happen to have collected in your personal low standing list, if you use that.
See, you didn't know you had a problem until I solved it. |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
Late Night Alliance
6157
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 02:55:00 -
[34] - Quote
Nevil Oscillator wrote:ShahFluffers wrote:
And again... you can use the contact standings options to set certain people friendly or not.
.
I think this will not set apart your selected group from anyone else you happen to have collected in your personal low standing list, if you use that.
Correct. Red standing will be red standing, blue will be blue.
Generally speaking though... when you set someone red is it because you consider them VERY unfriendly (more than usual) and you really should not care about anything beyond that.
Also... you are nikpicking about asinine details. Most of this stuff is common sense when taken into the context of "everyone versus everyone"/"everything is PvP" theme of EVE.
Is it really THAT important to distinguish between "people who want to kill you" and "people who want to kill you?"
Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective.
"How did you veterans start?" |
Nevil Oscillator
0
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Posted - 2014.09.22 15:59:00 -
[35] - Quote
ShahFluffers wrote:
Is it really THAT important to distinguish between "people who want to kill you" and "people who want to kill you?"
My mother always said ' Don't fight all your enemies at once '
In reality she didn't but must I always take the credit for the originality of my semi-proverbial guidance ?
See, you didn't know you had a problem until I solved it. |
Inxentas Ultramar
Ultramar Independent Contracting
1525
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 20:58:00 -
[36] - Quote
J'Poll wrote:Nevil Oscillator wrote:My point was just that knowing that they are FW players and what side they are on could potentially be useful nothing more. Uhm, and that would be useful to how many other players? Near none.
J'Poll, you might underestimate LP workings here. Did you realize shooting players in certain NPC corporations (such as newb + npc corps and militias) do not only convey normal Crimewatch 2.0 penalties, but also a standings decrease? Now, this might not be relevant at first glance but there are some concrete repercussions to consider.
As it happens I can't exchange normal cap booster charges for Navy ones per the LP route, I have to buy these from the market as my standings with the only corps that offer them is too low to run missions. I cannot create jumpclones at any of the NPC corporations that also harbour players, as my standings with them are a flat -10 because I relentlessly murder anything neutral that may or may not have a cyno. I'm unsure if I could enter FW on this character without repping my standings.
It has it's uses to know what NPC corp a player is in, but yeah I just shoot them and damn the consequences. I simply buy Navy charges and pick a non-player NPC corp to mission for. It's no big deal, but it's nice to know what the actual consequences are. |
J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds
4506
|
Posted - 2014.09.22 21:46:00 -
[37] - Quote
Inxentas Ultramar wrote:J'Poll wrote:Nevil Oscillator wrote:My point was just that knowing that they are FW players and what side they are on could potentially be useful nothing more. Uhm, and that would be useful to how many other players? Near none. J'Poll, you might underestimate LP workings here. Did you realize shooting players in certain NPC corporations (such as newb + npc corps and militias) do not only convey normal Crimewatch 2.0 penalties, but also a standings decrease? Now, this might not be relevant at first glance but there are some concrete repercussions to consider. As it happens I can't exchange normal cap booster charges for Navy ones per the LP route, I have to buy these from the market as my standings with the only corps that offer them is too low to run missions. I cannot create jumpclones at any of the NPC corporations that also harbour players, as my standings with them are a flat -10 because I relentlessly murder anything neutral that may or may not have a cyno. I'm unsure if I could enter FW on this character without repping my standings. It has it's uses to know what NPC corp a player is in, but yeah I just shoot them and damn the consequences. I simply buy Navy charges and pick a non-player NPC corp to mission for. It's no big deal, but it's nice to know what the actual consequences are.
*cough* Overview ticker...
Pilot A (CAS) - Center of Advanced Studies - Gallente born pilot still in new player corp.
Pilot B (IC24) - Imperial Crusade - Amar FW pilot
I don't need a freaking useless feature to see that a person is in a certain corp...as it's already there in your overview / in space.
It won't work if involves learning all them player corps / alliances in FW and their tickers though.
Issue wasn't about the consequences, it was about wanting to have all different NPC corps show up on the overview with their own tags (be it background or symbols). Which isn't that useful for many people, you can do it already with standings if you really want or just look at the tickers.
And fun part, if they shoot you first, it really doesn't matter anymore as at that point, it's carte blanche and fire all guns at them without any problems.
Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy
Ever wanted to PvP but can't find people to fly with.
Look no further and this chat: Redemption Road |
Nevil Oscillator
0
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Posted - 2014.09.22 22:15:00 -
[38] - Quote
ShahFluffers wrote:
Also... you are nikpicking about asinine details.
I would agree that we are getting side tracked on a minor detail about FW, It is a Q&A thread to clarify what the current situation is.
Therefore probably not the place to spend too long suggesting what features should or shouldn't be added.
See, you didn't know you had a problem until I solved it. |
Nevil Oscillator
0
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Posted - 2014.09.23 09:18:00 -
[39] - Quote
So the reason some NPC pirates will not shoot until you shoot at them is nothing to do with CONCORD.
It is because they are scared and are hoping you will leave them alone.
See, you didn't know you had a problem until I solved it. |
Cannibal Kane
My Little Pony of the Apocalypse
Cannibal Empire
4361
|
Posted - 2014.09.23 09:31:00 -
[40] - Quote
Nevil Oscillator wrote:So the reason some NPC pirates will not shoot until you shoot at them is nothing to do with CONCORD.
It is because they are scared and are hoping you will leave them alone.
You assume to much.
"Kane is the End Boss of Highsec." -Psychotic Monk |
J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds
4507
|
Posted - 2014.09.23 09:36:00 -
[41] - Quote
Nevil Oscillator wrote:So the reason some NPC pirates will not shoot until you shoot at them is nothing to do with CONCORD.
It is because they are scared and are hoping you will leave them alone.
No it has to do with triggers (fire upon them, get within 'x' km of them, etc.)
Not everything can be explained from the wiki / lore, some things happen as they do because of how its programmed.
Edit: Sniped Page 3
Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy
Ever wanted to PvP but can't find people to fly with.
Look no further and this chat: Redemption Road |
Nevil Oscillator
0
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Posted - 2014.09.23 09:50:00 -
[42] - Quote
J'Poll wrote:
No it has to do with triggers (fire upon them, get within 'x' km of them, etc.)
I would call that an AI mechanical process, not a reason, why does the ship need to explode to create a point they can warp to ?
See, you didn't know you had a problem until I solved it. |
J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds
4507
|
Posted - 2014.09.23 11:12:00 -
[43] - Quote
Nevil Oscillator wrote:J'Poll wrote:
No it has to do with triggers (fire upon them, get within 'x' km of them, etc.)
I would call that an AI mechanical process, not a reason, why does the ship need to explode to create a point they can warp to ?
Yeah, and the reason it works that way, because CCP programmed the AI like that.
Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy
Ever wanted to PvP but can't find people to fly with.
Look no further and this chat: Redemption Road |
Nevil Oscillator
0
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Posted - 2014.09.23 11:19:00 -
[44] - Quote
J'Poll wrote:
Yeah, and the reason it works that way, because CCP programmed the AI like that.
Yes but my question was - Does that follow any Eve logic or is it just plagiarism of Space Invaders ?
See, you didn't know you had a problem until I solved it. |
Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight
The Devil's Warrior Alliance
5093
|
Posted - 2014.09.23 12:29:00 -
[45] - Quote
Nevil Oscillator wrote:J'Poll wrote:
Yeah, and the reason it works that way, because CCP programmed the AI like that.
Yes but my question was - Does that follow any Eve logic or is it just plagiarism of Space Invaders ?
just simple ai.
the content in eve is the other players
=]I[= |
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
4138
|
Posted - 2014.09.23 16:54:00 -
[46] - Quote
Nevil Oscillator wrote:My point was just that knowing that they are FW players and what side they are on could potentially be useful nothing more.
FYI: You can add militia to your overview, which allows you to easily identify if they are in FW and which militia they belong to.
You can also show info on them, or their corp, or their alliance, and again, if you know where to look, the info window tells you which militia they belong to (if they belong to a militia).
|
J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds
4511
|
Posted - 2014.09.23 18:47:00 -
[47] - Quote
Nevil Oscillator wrote:J'Poll wrote:
Yeah, and the reason it works that way, because CCP programmed the AI like that.
Yes but my question was - Does that follow any Eve logic or is it just plagiarism of Space Invaders ?
Of course it follows EVE logic, as it's part of EVE.
Unless you like to warp into a mission / signature / incursion and be instant primary of entire pocket and dead before you can do anything, if that floats your boat....
Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy
Ever wanted to PvP but can't find people to fly with.
Look no further and this chat: Redemption Road |
Nevil Oscillator
0
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Posted - 2014.09.23 19:44:00 -
[48] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
FYI: You can add militia to your overview, which allows you to easily identify if they are in FW and which militia they belong to.
That will be the answer to that then
See, you didn't know you had a problem until I solved it. |
Nevil Oscillator
0
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Posted - 2014.09.23 23:18:00 -
[49] - Quote
Star Gates seem to be of a different design depending on which faction sovereignty the system is but am I correct that only CONCORD are able to lock access to any of them ? and this only occurs when you are criminally flagged for initiating PVP aggression ?
See, you didn't know you had a problem until I solved it. |
Paranoid Loyd
1958
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Posted - 2014.09.23 23:23:00 -
[50] - Quote
No, it is the weapons timer that locks the gate (also stations). The criminal flag does not matter (accept that you will get a weapons timer for 60 seconds whenever you have a criminal flag), however, if you are in anything but your pod and have a criminal flag you can not warp.
http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/73443
"PvE in EVE is a trap to turn you into PvP content, don't confuse it for actual gameplay." Lipbite |
Nevil Oscillator
0
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Posted - 2014.09.23 23:36:00 -
[51] - Quote
Paranoid Loyd wrote:, however, if you are in anything but your pod and have a criminal flag you can not warp.
You can't warp or you get warp scrammed when C arrives ?
See, you didn't know you had a problem until I solved it. |
Paranoid Loyd
1958
|
Posted - 2014.09.23 23:52:00 -
[52] - Quote
It is hard coded that when you get a criminal flag you are globally warp disrupted until you are in your pod.
It just makes it easier than the GMs trying to police people who are evading concord (this is considered an exploit).
"PvE in EVE is a trap to turn you into PvP content, don't confuse it for actual gameplay." Lipbite |
Nevil Oscillator
0
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Posted - 2014.09.23 23:55:00 -
[53] - Quote
Paranoid Loyd wrote:It is hard coded that when you get a criminal flag you are globally warp disrupted until you are in your pod.
It just makes it easier than the GMs trying to police people who are evading concord (this is considered an exploit).
But you still get a criminal flag in low sec, so I assume it doesn't do it in that situation ?
See, you didn't know you had a problem until I solved it. |
Paranoid Loyd
1958
|
Posted - 2014.09.24 00:16:00 -
[54] - Quote
You can only get a criminal flag in low sec attacking a pod that is not a legal target, can't say I have done that so I can't give you a definitive answer but since there is no Concord I think that is safe to assume.
"PvE in EVE is a trap to turn you into PvP content, don't confuse it for actual gameplay." Lipbite |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
Late Night Alliance
6162
|
Posted - 2014.09.24 00:19:00 -
[55] - Quote
Nevil Oscillator wrote:Paranoid Loyd wrote:, however, if you are in anything but your pod and have a criminal flag you can not warp. You can't warp or you get warp scrammed when C arrives ?
The former.
In the past CONCORD used to "infini-point" people when they showed up (i.e. their warp disruptors had an "infinite" amount of strength to it, meaning Warp Core Stabilizers did not work)... however some enterprising people learned that if they warped out just before CONCORD arrived they could go to another place and gank again (in high-sec).
So the system was changed to basically disallow warp as soon as someone is criminally flagged.
Note two things about this though;
- Evading CONCORD punishment in any way, shape, or form is considered an exploit as per the EULA and is punishable with a ban. If you see someone doing this (or find a way yourself) file a petition immediately.
- There are two stages of criminal conduct;
----- suspect timer: If you attack someone in low-sec, attack a mobile depot, attack a mobile tractor unit, or flip a jetcan you will gain this status. No NPCs will attack (except maybe station/gate guns), but all capsuleers can engage someone with this status at will anywhere in the game. It will continue for about 10-15 minutes after your last "offensive act."
----- criminal timer: if you attack a player in high-sec, pod someone in low-sec, or attack player structures except for the ones listed under the "suspect timer" you will gain this status.
This means that in high-sec any ship you fly will be immediately blown up by CONCORD (exception: your pod)... in low-sec it will be no different from a suspect timer in terms of effects unless you enter high-sec. It will continue for about 10-15 minutes after your last "offensive act."
These two timers are NOT to be confused with...
- Weapon Timer: This only comes when you attack another player regardless of the legality of it. You will not be able to dock or use stargates for 60 second after your (or the person you are supporting) last offensive act.
- Aggression Timer: There are two versions of this one but both do the same thing; they keep your ship from "disappearing" in space if you log off for any reason. The NPC form of this one will keep you in space for 5 minutes. Player Aggro will keep you in space for 10 minutes.
- Limited Engagement Timer: I'm a little fuzzy on this one... but I believe it means that you can engage the people listed in it freely. This timer lasts for 10 minutes.
Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective.
"How did you veterans start?" |
Nevil Oscillator
0
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Posted - 2014.09.24 00:58:00 -
[56] - Quote
ShahFluffers wrote:
- Limited Engagement Timer: I'm a little fuzzy on this one... but I believe it means that you can engage the people listed in it freely. This timer lasts for 10 minutes.
It is to do with attacking someone with a suspect flag,it brings that flag up as soon as you engage, the result of which is that they can fire back. Given that it is 15 mins they could potentially go get a bigger ship.
If you shoot their frigate that stole from your wreck for instance then just sit there salvaging the rest of the battlefield. But from my experience they prefer to just use an indestructible frigate.
See, you didn't know you had a problem until I solved it. |
Paranoid Loyd
1958
|
Posted - 2014.09.24 01:05:00 -
[57] - Quote
Limited engagement timers are 5 minutes
"PvE in EVE is a trap to turn you into PvP content, don't confuse it for actual gameplay." Lipbite |
Nevil Oscillator
0
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Posted - 2014.09.24 02:22:00 -
[58] - Quote
Paranoid Loyd wrote:Limited engagement timers are 5 minutes
See, you didn't know you had a problem until I solved it. |
Nevil Oscillator
0
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Posted - 2014.09.24 15:46:00 -
[59] - Quote
So the star gates belong to CONCORD ?
See, you didn't know you had a problem until I solved it. |
Toshiro Hasegawa
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
83
|
Posted - 2014.09.24 15:59:00 -
[60] - Quote
i think the star gates belong to the empires in which they reside.
History is the study of change. |
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