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Flaming sambuka IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2006.08.13 13:44:00 - [1] Highs: 7x modal mega ion's 1x med ghoul nos Meds: 1x fleeting web 1x fleeting scrambler 1x heavy electrochem injector 1x quad lif fueled mwd Lows: 1x lar2 1x 1600mm rolled tungsten 2x eanm 2's 3x magstab 2's Does very very nice damage, only thing im concerned about is the tank, its quite weak but then its a gank setup not tank, soon as i get awu to 4 il try and fit a couple neutrons in there. Opinions? be nice
Waagaa Ktlehr Amarr Fluffy wing Fangs	Posted - 2006.08.13 13:47:00 - [2] Pretty much the "classic" 1v1 setup. Lots of damage, not a whole lot of tank. I prefer more tank on mine, but this will work in small engagements where you're able to remove a lot of the incoming damage quickly by ganking something. Training for T2 blasters will make the thron really shine though, T2 Blaster ammo is just... evil :) ------------------------------------------ A lapdance is always better when the exotic dancer is crying..
Flaming sambuka IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2006.08.13 13:49:00 - [3] Originally by: Waagaa Ktlehr Pretty much the "classic" 1v1 setup. Lots of damage, not a whole lot of tank. I prefer more tank on mine, but this will work in small engagements where you're able to remove a lot of the incoming damage quickly by ganking something. Training for T2 blasters will make the thron really shine though, T2 Blaster ammo is just... evil :) Cheers :), atm im streamlining toward using tech 2, give it a couple months n i think this will do really well, ripped my mates apoc apart :D
MrCjEvans Caldari Shinra	Posted - 2006.08.13 14:04:00 - [4] i personally would fit a dcu instead of one of the hardners, many a times will u kill bs just living on structure, i use neutrons tho
Flaming sambuka IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2006.08.13 18:42:00 - [5] To work out dps its ammo damage x damage modifier divided by rof x number of guns right? Atm im getting 394 dps from my bthron using this setup, all gunnery skills are at 3 + bs is at 3, i know it should be alot more, if not double than this, is it my skills or am i adding things up wrong?
slothe Caldari Forsaken Empire	Posted - 2006.08.13 19:05:00 - [6] if you go for gank you want 7x neutrons, which you should be able to fit with very similar setup.
Flaming sambuka IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2006.08.13 19:06:00 - [7] Edited by: Flaming sambuka on 13/08/2006 19:06:28 Originally by: slothe if you go for gank you want 7x neutrons, which you should be able to fit with very similar setup. Ya im full on pg atm, must train up awu, still gota get weapon upgrades to 5
hUssmann Caldari Veto.	Posted - 2006.08.13 19:42:00 - [8] Originally by: Flaming sambuka Ya im full on pg atm, must train up awu, still gota get weapon upgrades to 5 I suggest getting your gunnery and BS level up before thinking about that, a good BS tank will be able to hold your damage for quite a while. ___________________________ Eris, no pink 'Eris woz 'ere 2006' kthx :)
Neon Genesis Gallente Hooligans Of War	Posted - 2006.08.13 19:44:00 - [9] Your setup is going for full damage seemingly, and below 400 dps and you're going to be tanked very easily. Up those skills to 4, upgrade to neutrons if you can. ____
Xoduse Beasts of Burden Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2006.08.13 19:46:00 - [10] Originally by: Flaming sambuka To work out dps its ammo damage x damage modifier divided by rof x number of guns right? Atm im getting 394 dps from my bthron using this setup, all gunnery skills are at 3 + bs is at 3, i know it should be alot more, if not double than this, is it my skills or am i adding things up wrong? Your a mega pilot with all gunnery at 3 and BS level 3? You are missing out on rapid firing (4% rof iirc), surgical strike 4 (3%dmg), motion prediction 4 (more dmg cuz you hit more often), and controlled bursts 4 would help your cap a tad. Plus you are missing out on another 5% dmg on BS 4 along with some more tracking help. I'm guessing you probably have large hybrids 3 too? (5% more damage). Now consider the fact that each one of those bonii are added into all 7 blasters on your megathron and youll see the problem. Also, if you wanted more tank, train weapon upgrades V, then train adv. weapon upgrades up, and use a dual repper, dual eanm II, dmg control tank with 2x mag stab IIs. ---------------------
suicide Caldari Synergy.	Posted - 2006.08.13 23:54:00 - [11] Edited by: suicide on 13/08/2006 23:55:37 My Blasterthron Setup: (press links to see ingame stats of items) High: 3 x Electron Blaster Cannon II 4 x Neutron Blaster Cannon II Mid: 1 x Quad Lif Fueled I Booster Rockets 1 x Heavy Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I 1 x J5B Phased Prototype Warp Inhibitor I 1 x Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I Low: 2 x Large 'Accommodation' Vestment Recontructer I 2 x Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II 2 x Magnetic Field Stabilizer II 1 x Emergency Damage Control I Have an alt with a Damnation wich is allways boosting me with: Armored Warfare Link - Damage Control (Command Bonus -13.44%) Armored Warfare Link - Rapid Repair (Command Bonus -13.44%) Armored Warfare Link - Passive Defence (Command Bonus -13.44%) Skirmish Warfare Link - Rapid Deployment (Command Bonus 18%) Ship Attributes (Hull/Armor/Shield) -> Link Ship Fitting (CPU/Powergrid) -> Link Dronebay(depending on enemy): Ogre II Wasp II Berserker II Heavy Tracking Disruptor Drone Heavy Webifier Drone Ammo: Antimatter Void Null Implants: 3% bonus to ship agility 3% bonus to ship velocity 3% bonus to hull hp 3% bonus to turret optimal range -3% to turret cpu Will be able to switch one Electron Blaster Cannon II to an Ion Blaster Cannon II once Advanced Weapon Upgrade LVL5 finish. Any thoughs about this setup?
Luc Boye Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.08.13 23:57:00 - [12] Mixing electrons and neutrons is very bad idea. You'd always have one half of guns outside their optimal. Why not just fit rack of ions instead? -------------------------- MWD Cap Penalty?
suicide Caldari Synergy.	Posted - 2006.08.14 00:03:00 - [13] Originally by: Luc Boye Mixing electrons and neutrons is very bad idea. You'd always have one half of guns outside their optimal. Why not just fit rack of ions instead? Electrons have Null ammo fitted and Neutrons have Antimatter fitted so the range is pretty much the same.
Negative Nancy	Posted - 2006.08.14 00:08:00 - [14] Try fitting a full rack of neutrons, calculate the damage, then a full rack of electrons, calculate damage again. There really isn't that much of a difference. I don't understand why people don't realize this. I guess neutrons are better if you want a little extra range and want to conserve some ammo. ----------------------------------------- Originally by: Chadawahee Originally by: Neprox What is wow? wow is what you say when you start up eve for the first time
ChalSto The Galactic Empire Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.08.14 00:09:00 - [15] Edited by: ChalSto on 14/08/2006 00:09:40 Originally by: suicide Edited by: suicide on 13/08/2006 23:55:37 My Blasterthron Setup: (press links to see ingame stats of items) High: 3 x Electron Blaster Cannon II 4 x Neutron Blaster Cannon II Mid: 1 x Quad Lif Fueled I Booster Rockets 1 x Heavy Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I 1 x J5B Phased Prototype Warp Inhibitor I 1 x Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I Low: 2 x Large 'Accommodation' Vestment Recontructer I 2 x Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II 2 x Magnetic Field Stabilizer II 1 x Emergency Damage Control I Have an alt with a Damnation wich is allways boosting me with: Armored Warfare Link - Damage Control (Command Bonus -13.44%) Armored Warfare Link - Rapid Repair (Command Bonus -13.44%) Armored Warfare Link - Passive Defence (Command Bonus -13.44%) Skirmish Warfare Link - Rapid Deployment (Command Bonus 18%) Ship Attributes (Hull/Armor/Shield) -> Link Ship Fitting (CPU/Powergrid) -> Link Dronebay(depending on enemy): Ogre II Wasp II Berserker II Heavy Tracking Disruptor Drone Heavy Webifier Drone Ammo: Antimatter Void Null Implants: 3% bonus to ship agility 3% bonus to ship velocity 3% bonus to hull hp 3% bonus to turret optimal range -3% to turret cpu Will be able to switch one Electron Blaster Cannon II to an Ion Blaster Cannon II once Advanced Weapon Upgrade LVL5 finish. Any thoughs about this setup? DPS from 3X Electrons II+ 4X Neutrons II are nearly equal to the dps of 7X Ions II Ions = better tracking than Neuts = better hits = more dps Me? I¦m just another guy in Local......but better u pay attention.....
Joshua Foiritain Gallente Coreli Corporation	Posted - 2006.08.14 00:42:00 - [16] Originally by: suicide Originally by: Luc Boye Mixing electrons and neutrons is very bad idea. You'd always have one half of guns outside their optimal. Why not just fit rack of ions instead? Electrons have Null ammo fitted and Neutrons have Antimatter fitted so the range is pretty much the same. Fit Ions with Void ----- [Coreli Corporation Mainframe]
Nebuli Caldari Art of War	Posted - 2006.08.14 02:56:00 - [17] Originally by: Negative Nancy Try fitting a full rack of neutrons, calculate the damage, then a full rack of electrons, calculate damage again. There really isn't that much of a difference. I don't understand why people don't realize this. I guess neutrons are better if you want a little extra range and want to conserve some ammo. You gotta be joking? CEO - Art of War
Atandros Gallente The Man of La Mancha	Posted - 2006.08.14 03:07:00 - [18] Originally by: Nebuli Originally by: Negative Nancy Try fitting a full rack of neutrons, calculate the damage, then a full rack of electrons, calculate damage again. There really isn't that much of a difference. I don't understand why people don't realize this. I guess neutrons are better if you want a little extra range and want to conserve some ammo. You gotta be joking? No, do the math and check it out. Each blaster type does only about 6% DPS more than the one preceding it. I don't understand why people don't realize it either, but... -------
Nebuli Caldari Art of War	Posted - 2006.08.14 03:18:00 - [19] Originally by: Atandros Originally by: Nebuli Originally by: Negative Nancy Try fitting a full rack of neutrons, calculate the damage, then a full rack of electrons, calculate damage again. There really isn't that much of a difference. I don't understand why people don't realize this. I guess neutrons are better if you want a little extra range and want to conserve some ammo. You gotta be joking? No, do the math and check it out. Each blaster type does only about 6% DPS more than the one preceding it. I don't understand why people don't realize it either, but... Screw maths, I'll go against your electron blaster mega vs my neutron blaster mega and see who wins? Think you should know the outcome if you fly blasterthrons at all. Maybe you are comparing BASE gun stats, say a gun for example is doing 10 dps, and you have skills which boost it 50% that 50% isnt going to make as much difference to a 10 dps gun as it will to a 15 dps gun, same with damage mods. Honostly, and this isnt a flame or smack or anything but have you actualy tested an electron vs a neutron mega in ACTUAL pvp? I get the impression you havnt tbh, if you had you would understand the difference and wouldnt be struggling to see it. CEO - Art of War
Nebuli Caldari Art of War	Posted - 2006.08.14 03:56:00 - [20] OK running the numbers on quickfit, which I hate incidently it gives wrong impressions, but.... Electron II, max skills, 3 damage mods = 847.073dps Neutron II, max skills, 3 damage mods = 968.039dps 120.966 DPS difference, thats alot. So now we have a mega with 4 spare low slots, what is the electon mega going to be able to fit that the nuetron mega cant? Answer = nothing, so why lose DPS? If you fit electrons you need to fit a heavy tank otherwise its pointless fitting them. Go PVP with the different set ups and dont rely on quickfit to give you the answers, or pure maths, it doesnt work out the same in real combat. Electrons = Heavy tank Ions = med tank, med gank Neutrons = full gank CEO - Art of War
Jon Engel APEX Unlimited Kimotoro Directive	Posted - 2006.08.14 05:23:00 - [21] I suggest taking 20 days to train Rapid Firing V and Controlled bursts V. Rapid Firing V increases your DPS greatly. My set up is Turrets, 6 blasters, two heavy Nosses Mids, Mwd, Webby scrambler, Sensor booster Lows, 2 Large repper2s, 1600mm rolled tungsten plate, two mag stab2s and a RCU. I think thats what I have, Its late and I cant think all that well. Any how the double noss is a great thing to have on your ship. The 5 heavy drones in your hold make up for the missing blaster.I recomend investing some time on those precious Support skills to level 5.
LWMaverick	Posted - 2006.08.14 06:14:00 - [22] Originally by: Negative Nancy Try fitting a full rack of neutrons, calculate the damage, then a full rack of electrons, calculate damage again. There really isn't that much of a difference. I don't understand why people don't realize this. I guess neutrons are better if you want a little extra range and want to conserve some ammo. Just stick with youre electrons then. <3
hellwarrior Caldari Finite Horizon	Posted - 2006.08.14 06:18:00 - [23] Originally by: Jon Engel My set up is Turrets, 6 blasters, two heavy Nosses Mids, Mwd, Webby scrambler, Sensor booster Lows, 2 Large repper2s, 1600mm rolled tungsten plate, two mag stab2s and a RCU. drop the sensor booster, also you run 2 nos, which isn't a bad idea, however that means you're leaning to more of a tank setup, therefore i suggest dropping a mag and teh 1600 and going for more of a tank, also, maybe change your setup/skills to drop the RCU, no blasterthron setup is as good as i can be if running a grid unit. just some suggestions, feel free to pay no attn to me im silly.
MOS DEF Celestial Fleet Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.08.14 07:01:00 - [24] Originally by: Nebuli OK running the numbers on quickfit, which I hate incidently it gives wrong impressions, but.... Electron II, max skills, 3 damage mods = 847.073dps Neutron II, max skills, 3 damage mods = 968.039dps 120.966 DPS difference, thats alot. So now we have a mega with 4 spare low slots, what is the electon mega going to be able to fit that the nuetron mega cant? Answer = nothing, so why lose DPS? If you fit electrons you need to fit a heavy tank otherwise its pointless fitting them. Go PVP with the different set ups and dont rely on quickfit to give you the answers, or pure maths, it doesnt work out the same in real combat. Electrons = Heavy tank Ions = med tank, med gank Neutrons = full gank To be fair you have to mention tracking too though. The electrons track a lot better and will have better hits wich will even out the real DPS done quite a bit especially on non BS targets. I am surprised how often this is overlooked. Tracking affects DPS and this is constantly ignored. To be fair one has to mention the range advantage of the neutrons though. For pure BS VS BS combat i`d pick the neutrons for sure. For anything else i am not so sure. Would need some testing.
LWMaverick	Posted - 2006.08.14 07:05:00 - [25] Originally by: Jon Engel I suggest taking 20 days to train Rapid Firing V and Controlled bursts V. Rapid Firing V increases your DPS greatly. My set up is Turrets, 6 blasters, two heavy Nosses Mids, Mwd, Webby scrambler, Sensor booster Lows, 2 Large repper2s, 1600mm rolled tungsten plate, two mag stab2s and a RCU. I think thats what I have, Its late and I cant think all that well. Any how the double noss is a great thing to have on your ship. The 5 heavy drones in your hold make up for the missing blaster.I recomend investing some time on those precious Support skills to level 5. If youre going to tank it, then atleast put some resists on it, and a DCU is = ftw, and how are you going to run that tank without any kind of cap mods?? Sry to break it ya, but youre setup is atm = ftl <3
Loka Gallente adeptus gattacus Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.08.14 07:26:00 - [26] I have asked myself if 2x named webber and 3 heavy webber drones are enough to "scramble" a ship? How slow must a ship be, that he cant warp off again? _________________________ Noob In Action - [NIA]
slothe Caldari Forsaken Empire	Posted - 2006.08.14 07:45:00 - [27] http://dl.eve-files.com/media/0608/mega.png ftw
LUKEC Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.08.14 10:06:00 - [28] Originally by: slothe http://dl.eve-files.com/media/0608/mega.png ftw Your cap skills are 4tl. --------------------- Looking for frentix? Mail me.
Waragha Art of War	Posted - 2006.08.14 10:29:00 - [29] Originally by: MOS DEF To be fair you have to mention tracking too though. The electrons track a lot better and will have better hits wich will even out the real DPS done quite a bit especially on non BS targets. I am surprised how often this is overlooked. Tracking affects DPS and this is constantly ignored. To be fair one has to mention the range advantage of the neutrons though. For pure BS VS BS combat i`d pick the neutrons for sure. For anything else i am not so sure. Would need some testing. Does anything other than bs vs bs matter? Cruisers will most likely be within webrange and friggies you probably wont be shooting at anyways (drones). Getting an bit of extra tracking wont help you much in a closerange battleship. Originally by: Trepkos ... The only difference between GS and NPC's are that GS respawn quicker.
LUKEC Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.08.14 10:39:00 - [30] Originally by: MOS DEF To be fair you have to mention tracking too though. The electrons track a lot better and will have better hits wich will even out the real DPS done quite a bit especially on non BS targets. I am surprised how often this is overlooked. Tracking affects DPS and this is constantly ignored. To be fair one has to mention the range advantage of the neutrons though. For pure BS VS BS combat i`d pick the neutrons for sure. For anything else i am not so sure. Would need some testing. Just . Have you recently checked dmg difference of ions vs electrons? Electrons are 4tl unless if you are putting 2x officer rep and some officer dmg mods on... navy thron or vindicator. Also tracking doesn't matter much on webbed cruiser if you know how to navigate thron.(not that any cruiser survives 5x heavys II long) --------------------- Looking for frentix? Mail me.
Sandra Tseng THE MISPHIT'S	Posted - 2006.08.14 10:47:00 - [31] Actually I think it is spelled "Sambouka" Killed my sig AGAIN! :p http://www.ninc.org/krubarax/images/2d/verydisco.jpg
Luc Boye Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.08.14 11:23:00 - [32] tbh of all the attributes of electrons, I find the range most annoying. I mean dps = whatever, tracking = who cares, but range is ftl. You are so easy to kite when using electrons that its not funny. Neuts with null on the other hand even make vagabonds worry ::
Polux Quam Singulari	Posted - 2006.08.14 12:21:00 - [33] Originally by: slothe http://dl.eve-files.com/media/0608/mega.png ftw Nope and I hate to say it as he is FE, hes right, I am a maxed caldari pilot, but I bought myself a mega as I wanted to try out guns, only differance was the guns & drones, I used anode megas & 5 heavy ECM drones on my 1st day went to renyn to play with the war targets with a buddy in a jag on jump in we had a: caracel, 2x thoraxes, curse, omen, and 2 frigs, taranis, 1 of the thoraxes was using ecm drones and I was jammed 3 times, OUTCOME all cruisers dead, inties and frigs warped off, I was in 50% structure, Jag not a scratch. Now waiting 17 days for T2 Large hybrids & Void I am now a convert of this ship, been flying Ravens for 3 years no more!! Was not a good day for IAC, but a great fight all the same
Atandros Gallente The Man of La Mancha	Posted - 2006.08.14 14:46:00 - [34] Edited by: Atandros on 14/08/2006 14:46:17 Originally by: Nebuli OK running the numbers on quickfit, which I hate incidently it gives wrong impressions, but.... Electron II, max skills, 3 damage mods = 847.073dps Neutron II, max skills, 3 damage mods = 968.039dps 120.966 DPS difference, thats alot. That's fourteen percent, to be precise. It's about noticeable, but the crucial concern is what you trade off for it. Bear in mind that you get diminishing returns on DPS after a while. What's most important is that you get more damage than is needed to break an opponent's tank and then increase your damage immediately after that threshold (f.ex. you deal thermal damage and you have an enemy with 50% thermic resistance and a repair rate of 200 per second; you need at least 400 DPS to break his tank, and increasing your damage from 500 to 600 in this situation would equal doubling your DPS since you can kill the enemy in half the time). But, after a while, each successive point of damage starts to matter less and less since you have so many already and it stops being worth it to add more when there are more things you could get for your resources instead. No enemy ship you can encouter besides multi-billion Gist / Core flying pinatas will have a tank where you'll extract a significant advantage from doing, say, 1200 DPS as opposed to 1000. 900-1000 is the threshold for heavy BS / CBC tanks. Quote: So now we have a mega with 4 spare low slots, what is the electon mega going to be able to fit that the nuetron mega cant? Twin large reps and, most importantly, a Heavy Nosferatu (although you'll need a good CPU implant for the latter). The heavy nos, in addition to compensating for the DPS lost when you go for electrons, will ameliorate the Electron range issues and will enable you to pop 20km scrambling inties with ease. It should also be noted that the falloff for Electrons with Null will sit at about 16,5km (Sharpshooter V, Trajectory Analysis IV), which means even those are far from useless at destroying nasty HACs and such outside web range (especially when assisted by the nos). Originally by: Nebuli Screw maths, I'll go against your electron blaster mega vs my neutron blaster mega and see who wins? Think you should know the outcome if you fly blasterthrons at all. Maybe you are comparing BASE gun stats, say a gun for example is doing 10 dps, and you have skills which boost it 50% that 50% isnt going to make as much difference to a 10 dps gun as it will to a 15 dps gun, same with damage mods. Honostly, and this isnt a flame or smack or anything but have you actualy tested an electron vs a neutron mega in ACTUAL pvp? I get the impression you havnt tbh, if you had you would understand the difference and wouldnt be struggling to see it. The rrrrage! Chill, anyway. I'm not proposing that Electron Blasterthrons are the only thing to fly ever nor am I denigrating Neutron Blasterthrons, I'm talking solely about the discrepancy in damage between gun classes. Personally, since I mostly fly solo, I prefer having a stronger tank and a nosferatu as opposed to a flimsy tank, no nos, longer range and lots of damage that I probably would pick if I were a gang damage-dealer, and so I usually end up taking electrons or ions. While I find the tracking disparity to have little appreciable impact, I definitely agree that the range, most of all, is problematic with electrons (though even they are far from useless, as I've outlined above). -------
ElCoCo Gallente KIA Corp	Posted - 2006.08.14 15:39:00 - [35] Dunno why... even after the changes I only feel comfortable fitting ions

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