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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Garia666 Amarr adeptus gattacus Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.08.15 07:44:00 - [1] you cant even handle 300 in one 0.0 system. since eve keeps growing the lagg stays the same. after years of upgrades and better code some things actualy never change. i was wondering if ccp has any idea on how to solve something like that. sine there can be over 500 people in jita. mabe its an idea to have something like an spare heavy server which can be placed in war zones. something you could place in a downtime?
Pepe Prawn	Posted - 2006.08.15 09:10:00 - [2] I think they know what the problem is. Its just the solution is to expensive to inplement. ( cost/subscriber/Profit ratio thingy )
Savio	Posted - 2006.08.15 09:22:00 - [3] they could make more 0.0 space = more space for people to be at = less crowded systems...
babylonstew Caldari Caldari Scouting and Intel Group	Posted - 2006.08.15 09:33:00 - [4] trouble is, if they sort it so 500 man fleets can fight, everyone brings 700 and then complains about the lag again. its the old expand to fill the alotted space then complain when theres no more space thing Forum advice Linkage
Khajit Smitty Minmatar MisFunk Inc.	Posted - 2006.08.15 09:33:00 - [5] Originally by: Savio they could make more 0.0 space = more space for people to be at = less crowded systems... 0.0 systems arnt that crowded, just when Hostile Fleet A meets Hostile Fleet 2.....
Mr Happ Gallente Hellbound Saints	Posted - 2006.08.15 09:39:00 - [6] Originally by: Garia666 you cant even handle 300 in one 0.0 system. since eve keeps growing the lagg stays the same. after years of upgrades and better code some things actualy never change. i was wondering if ccp has any idea on how to solve something like that. sine there can be over 500 people in jita. mabe its an idea to have something like an spare heavy server which can be placed in war zones. something you could place in a downtime? Yes yes yes, we are kinda sick of your alliance to be honest and it's moaning,m RA never field more than 40 in a gang and around 70 if its a special occasion, the fact your coalition cannot remove RA with as many pilots as you have or simplky 300 v 70, well, LOL is all i have to say, stop *****ing
Tao Han Caldari Crucial Electronics	Posted - 2006.08.15 09:39:00 - [7] Originally by: Savio they could make more 0.0 space = more space for people to be at = less crowded systems... Problems start when Fleet A engages Fleet B to take down POS C, would not help to add more space then since people in 0.0 more or less live to fight eachother.
Khajit Smitty Minmatar MisFunk Inc.	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:19:00 - [8] The problem lies that when there is action everyone wants to get in on that action so gangs tend to grow to large sizes. And trying to say, "You 40 go sit in system xyz, while us 40 get to have fun shooting stuff here in system abc" the 40 going off to xyz are gonna be somewhat upset. Lag will always be a problem until some form of game dynamic is introduced that makes smaller sized gangs better/more effective than large 200 man blobs. Having a spare heavy server is not a bad idea but then the problem comes in as to who gets the use of that server? as there are many fights going on in many areas of the eve universe and ontop of that you still will have a bottle neck when it comes to the database side of things.
Neon Genesis Gallente Hooligans Of War	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:22:00 - [9] More upgrades please.
EvilNate Caldari Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:24:00 - [10] It's suppose to be fixed in the new dragon client, it's been stated like a zillion times, please feel free to moan after it's been released. Nate. -------- www.bydi.org
Henka Gallente Lazor Monkeys Knights Of the Southerncross	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:28:00 - [11] Originally by: Khajit Smitty The problem lies that when there is action everyone wants to get in on that action so gangs tend to grow to large sizes. And trying to say, "You 40 go sit in system xyz, while us 40 get to have fun shooting stuff here in system abc" the 40 going off to xyz are gonna be somewhat upset. Lag will always be a problem until some form of game dynamic is introduced that makes smaller sized gangs better/more effective than large 200 man blobs. Having a spare heavy server is not a bad idea but then the problem comes in as to who gets the use of that server? as there are many fights going on in many areas of the eve universe and ontop of that you still will have a bottle neck when it comes to the database side of things. It's difficult to take on a fleet that has around 200 stabs (in the entire fleet) and aswell, logoff as soon as they don't have a 5 to 1 advantage. So, yeah, its hard to fight someone who dont like to fight.
Hellspawn01 Amarr	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:31:00 - [12] It cant be fixed. More players come while the server gets upgraded so nothing changes. If the server would have a limit, then you can expect to have less lag. With the current server, it will die a very painfull death when we reach 30k players. Say bye to fleet combat Ship lovers click here
Henry Fredyericus Gallente H.F. Enterprises	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:37:00 - [13] ...when I understood it right, the devs are testing the next so called "Dragon" patch, what supposed to allocate server power more efficiently to heavy-load systems...but the time will tell If A is success in life, then A equals x plus y plus z. Work is x; y is play; and z is keeping your mouth shut. - Mr. Einstein
The Enslaver Shinra Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:39:00 - [14] Originally by: Mr Happ Originally by: Garia666 you cant even handle 300 in one 0.0 system. since eve keeps growing the lagg stays the same. after years of upgrades and better code some things actualy never change. i was wondering if ccp has any idea on how to solve something like that. sine there can be over 500 people in jita. mabe its an idea to have something like an spare heavy server which can be placed in war zones. something you could place in a downtime? Yes yes yes, we are kinda sick of your alliance to be honest and it's moaning,m RA never field more than 40 in a gang and around 70 if its a special occasion, the fact your coalition cannot remove RA with as many pilots as you have or simplky 300 v 70, well, LOL is all i have to say, stop *****ing Sorry, how is that situation important in this matter? Fact is that a system should be able to support that many people, why shouldn't it? With that attitude, no wonder you are so insignificant... --------
Dethis Caldari Eve University	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:40:00 - [15] You can complain after the dragon code if it doesnt help then all hell can break loose -------- Kill em all and let god sort em out
Boonaki Caldari Suffoco Noctis Atrocitas	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:47:00 - [16] Originally by: Dethis You can complain after the dragon code if it doesnt help then all hell can break loose It'll be out Oct 22nd, feel free to complain on Oct 23rd (or Oct 24th) Fear the Ibis of doom!
Indra Sebuchiore Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:53:00 - [17] I've got it! If a major cause of lag is node overload when multiple systems are sharing a node that isn't balanced properly, why don't CCP buy more nodes so every system has it's own CPU! Also, they can give us vets a free BMW on our birthdays, too. __________________________________________ "In girum imus nocte, et consumimur igni."
Khajit Smitty Minmatar MisFunk Inc.	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:54:00 - [18] Originally by: Boonaki Originally by: Dethis You can complain after the dragon code if it doesnt help then all hell can break loose It'll be out Oct 22nd, feel free to complain on Oct 23rd (or Oct 24th) I would give it a week or two before you start moaning, let the glitches,hiccups and bottlenecks be ironed out first - as there are always these issues with major upgrades.
Sky KiorSun Minmatar Kinetic Vector Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:57:00 - [19] Jita will always be lagged to hell for as long as it continues to be a center for trade, creating more 'trade centers' would combat this problem but Eve as it is at the moment isnt really big enough to have more than 1 trade center. Perhaps if the Eve universe was 4 times the size it is then 4 trade centers would accomplish this (Eve with 4x the ammount of systems it has now, mmmmm !) Of course this still wont get rid of the lag with large fleet battles but tbh i'm trying to keep clear of such battles now for just that reason, smaller engagements are far much more fun or even staggered engagements splitting your fleets into smaller more mobile groups to support each other. But hey, I dont know wot the hell i'm talking about anyway
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.08.15 10:58:00 - [20] Originally by: Khajit Smitty Originally by: Boonaki Originally by: Dethis You can complain after the dragon code if it doesnt help then all hell can break loose It'll be out Oct 22nd, feel free to complain on Oct 23rd (or Oct 24th) I would give it a week or two before you start moaning, let the glitches,hiccups and bottlenecks be ironed out first - as there are always these issues with major upgrades. October 22? Last I heard was september. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Ishquar Teh'Sainte Euphoria Released	Posted - 2006.08.15 11:06:00 - [21] Originally by: Neon Genesis More upgrades please. i estimate: it won't change anything ... due to the hardware-upgrades in winter we got less lag and better performance. what happened? the fleets grew bigger and bigger 'til we reached again the point where the game stopped being enjoying. if we get again a new performance upgrade - it will be the same in a few months ... then such posts like "FFS why can't CCP handle battles in systems with 800players in it!!1!kthxbye - i'm out!" imho the only way to change this would be a tweak in certain game-mechanics (POSwars) ___________________ -Skellibjalla- Life is a garden of perceptions. Pick your fruit.
Ling Xiao	Posted - 2006.08.15 11:23:00 - [22] It's because of ONE thing and ONE thing alone: CCP keeps encouraging, and even FORCING players to form huge server-killing fleets to take territory. It's the way they designed the game - sovereignty, POS, stations and all that. Until that changes, there will never be a lag free territory battle.
Testy Mctest	Posted - 2006.08.15 11:30:00 - [23] As I understand it, the problem is that the server farm dynamically allocates resources based on the trends since last downtime, which is too late. Obviously there's some limit to the infrastructure or the program which prevents it from being done truly dynamically. What it is that stops this being done, or why it's not #1 priority above all other things, I dont know. Originally by: Serzos Welcome to EVE. Please select a difficulty Easy Medium Hard Minmatar Scrapheap Challenge!
Waxau Liberty Rogues Tactical Narcotics Team	Posted - 2006.08.15 11:45:00 - [24] I suggest CCP do what they did to Yulai all those years back - for those that dont know, Yulai was rens + Jita combined, but with less players playing back then. What i suggest is now, they disperse the market more. Make more places hubs. Maybe that means more missions in other systems. Or move some agents from rens and jita. The problem with the lag is there are soooo many people in one system, the serer has trouble handling all the different processes. But im gonna get flamed for suggesting to move agents:P
Matthew Caldari BloodStar Technologies	Posted - 2006.08.15 11:49:00 - [25] Originally by: Garia666 you cant even handle 300 in one 0.0 system. since eve keeps growing the lagg stays the same. after years of upgrades and better code some things actualy never change. i was wondering if ccp has any idea on how to solve something like that. sine there can be over 500 people in jita. 500 in Jita != 300 in a 0.0 system. What players are doing is vastly more important in terms of server load than how many players there are. Those 500 in Jita are spread all over the system. Even round the popular stations there's rarely a cluster of more than 50. Few of them will be in active combat at any one time, and a large number will actually be docked and taking up minimal resources. When you get 300 in a 0.0 system, they're very likely to be in one or two big groups, and likely going to be trying to shoot each other. The problem with fleet battles is that server load is proportional to the square of the number of people in the same grid. In Jita, you've got people spread over loads of grids. If we assume there are 10 clusters of 50 players, for 500 total, that's a load factor of 10*50^2=25000. Now, lets move to the 0.0 system, where we have 300 players, all in the same grid, for a load of 300^2=90000. Less players, more load, because of what those players are doing. Assuming that the jita node is at 100% at 25000 load factor, even giving the fleet battle a dedicated node like Jita, won't really make much difference. And if you did have a node that could support 90000 load factor, then you'd still be able to support far more in Jita than in the fleet battle (about 940 assuming there were still just 10 groups). ------- There is no magic Wand of Fixing, and it is not powered by forum whines.
Lorette Gallente Grandma's WIth Guns	Posted - 2006.08.15 11:52:00 - [26] Edited by: Lorette on 15/08/2006 11:54:52 The funny thing is the systems that come out worse off are actually the less used systems, its been said before that the servers auto-select which systems need more processing power on average and adjust to that. So when jita has an average of 400 peeps its not really effected when another 50 jump in....however a 0.0 system that averages 0.4 people a day and two fleets warp in (100 each) that system is going to grind to a halt REALLY bad and the server wont readjust to compensate very fast either. One thing id like to add is they really need to add more servers to the server farm in a certain ratio to active players, its all fine and nice to have 15k concurrent on the current hardware, but having 30k on the same hardware isnt really something id celebrate...id fear it tbh. Ofc i have no idea what the situation is on this im just speculating.
Archangel Raphael	Posted - 2006.08.15 12:10:00 - [27] ok well i havnt been playing eve very long,, and so i obviously cant make a "experienced" comment on how things were before i started. However, i do frequent the forums regularly and do often read about certain systems slowing down or lagging due to the high volume of users within those particular systems. Now i have recntly setup my own corp and deliberately made its hq in jita, because of all the passing trade, and in all honestly, even with over 500 users in system,ive never really noticed any lag. but i dont deny others are suffering.. so comeing from someone who is based in the most heavily populated sytem. i feel just in making my suggestion, as it'll affect me maybe more due to the fact that i dont lag. my suggestion is to put in place some sort of cap, to limit the amount of users in a system at any given time.. how this "cap" would be implemented is anyones guess, but for example, some sort of traffic light system at gates..if the system u are heading into is full the lights will be on red... i dont need to explain it further. now this in my opinion could create new trading hubs as ppl decide that they want to be as close to the existing major hubs but cannot viably trade from there,, so perhaps the adjoining systems may start to flourish and eventually alleviate the intial problem at that point maybe the capping system could be removed. because it was in all fairness supposed to be a temporary measure
Jobie Thickburger Gallente Miner Guide to the Galaxy	Posted - 2006.08.15 12:10:00 - [28] Originally by: Garia666 you cant even handle 300 in one 0.0 system. since eve keeps growing the lagg stays the same. after years of upgrades and better code some things actualy never change. i was wondering if ccp has any idea on how to solve something like that. I'm Sure CCP looks into it, and wants to fix it. But comeon, They increase the amount playable in the system, You bring in more, etc... Quote: sine there can be over 500 people in jita. Yea, See, They ALWAYS KNOW there will be 500ish people in Jita, so they can Easily allocate a little more server space towards Jita to keep it stable. As for 0.0.... Have you ever sent your battleplans to CCP 48h ahead of the fight, Detailing about how many large ships, and how many POSs you intend to bust? Because otherwise they don't even have ANY clue as to what 0.0 system to backup. Quote: mabe its an idea to have something like an spare heavy server which can be placed in war zones. something you could place in a downtime? Won't work, They'd have to have a large number of backup servers, Or otherwise, reinforce every 0.0 system like Jita is done now all the time. Besides, How many 0.0 warzones are there right now? North (all of it) South w/ RA.... Prov w/ CVA.... BoB w/ Whoever... To many wars to back up a "warzone" and unless they know what system it will be in before hand, they can't back up a system to what it needs to be anyway. Just approach it as a problem to Adapt and Overcome, rather than moan about. CEO - MGTTG
Par'Gellen Gallente Low Grade Ore	Posted - 2006.08.15 12:11:00 - [29] Turst me, they can afford to buy things. Any elementry school student can figure out the math on that.
Leam Gallente Celtic industries Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2006.08.15 12:14:00 - [30] Edited by: Leam on 15/08/2006 12:14:51 Cross your fingers and hope dragon make it better :P. Then, long long long ago in the first battles, people complained cause there was so much lag in 40 vs 40 battles. Then 150 vs 150, then 200 vs 200... in few words, it has improved A LOT... so that's what a 30k peeps server is for

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