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Trevedian
Amarr
KR0M
The Red Skull
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Posted - 2006.08.16 18:29:00 -
[1]
I say all the same rules as last time, except make all the ships Tech 1. It would be a nice twist...
This will prevent the "Our rich mining alliance can't afford T2 ships for us to compete" from whining and it will enable more people to participate. I would allow faction ships as well, and Cosmos, T2 modules also.
Making all the ships Tech1 would get more people involved and would be cheaper. What do you think?
Sex0r > you're bounty turns me on.. you seem like the kind of amarrian to dominate me
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Larkonis Trassler
g guild
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Posted - 2006.08.16 19:47:00 -
[2]
You'd not allow Tech 2 ships due to expense but would allow equally if not more expensive faction ships?
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Trevedian
Amarr
KR0M
The Red Skull
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Posted - 2006.08.16 21:16:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: Larkonis Trassler
You'd not allow Tech 2 ships due to expense but would allow equally if not more expensive faction ships?
Yeah I would allow faction ships to add some variety... Who wants to see just a couple different kinds of ships compete, why not allow faction ships(frigs & cruisers included), just think how it would cause the faction ship market to spike up, just like the last tourney.
Any alliance can afford to field a team, if they can't then they should dissolve their alliance imo. So I really don't think the "We can't afford to compete" is a valid whine...
The complaint that people can't match the skills of older players would be nullified to a large degree if we only included T1 ships, and it would allow more people to be able to compete.
I'd also allow pirate faction implants because, honestly, there are lotsa complexes in-game you can farm and make the 500 mil or so to buy them.
Sex0r > you're bounty turns me on.. you seem like the kind of amarrian to dominate me
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Donmadefy
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Posted - 2006.08.16 21:55:00 -
[4]
I don't know if it's been done before, but you could always have more defined ship squads ... say any race of two frigates and one cruiser. Or make it a bit more scenario orientated, and have five ships, one of which is a standard industrial and the other four ships cruisers for example. The strategy is to destroy your opponents industrial whilst protecting your own.
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Brisi
Sniggerdly
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Posted - 2006.08.17 00:14:00 -
[5]
Simple rule that would make a lot of difference:
No pirate implants.
I am Brisi, I am as One. Resistance is fertile.
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Samirol
Ore Mongers
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Posted - 2006.08.17 02:06:00 -
[6]
no pirate implants tbh would fix most of it
Ore Mongers is recruiting |
Baun
Celestial Apocalypse
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Posted - 2006.08.17 02:33:00 -
[7]
No pirate implants would fix everything if the no faction rule were kept in place.
The Enemy's Gate is Down
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Sahi Natara
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Posted - 2006.08.17 05:38:00 -
[8]
I'd allow faction implants, it would be too much work for the organizers to make sure no one had implants... What if I have Infomorph Psychology 5 and all my Jumpclones have implants?
I'd also allow Tech 2 ammo for all the ships except battleships.
This would make it more interesting!
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Brisi
Sniggerdly
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Posted - 2006.08.17 10:22:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Sahi Natara
I'd allow faction implants, it would be too much work for the organizers to make sure no one had implants... What if I have Infomorph Psychology 5 and all my Jumpclones have implants?
Nothing a GM couldn't handle.
I am Brisi, I am as One. Resistance is fertile.
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Mi Lai
Sanguine Legion
Atrocitas
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Posted - 2006.08.17 11:34:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Brisi
Originally by: Sahi Natara
I'd allow faction implants, it would be too much work for the organizers to make sure no one had implants... What if I have Infomorph Psychology 5 and all my Jumpclones have implants?
Nothing a GM couldn't handle.
I'd be willing to help 
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LadyUnlucky
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Posted - 2006.08.17 11:49:00 -
[11]
agreed
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Malthros Zenobia
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
Kimotoro Directive
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Posted - 2006.08.17 15:26:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Brisi
Simple rule that would make a lot of difference:
No pirate implants.
QFMFT
Seeing all t1 ships with basic T1 mods would be VERY interesting as well.
Plus then anyone who *****es about costs would just be laughed at.
Personally, I think:
No pirate implants
No Ewar
No T2 Ammo
No faction ammo/mods
Announcers with better understanding of PVP (sorry guys but you seem to know less about it thatn even I do  )
Well known people on EVE TV, that still play the game
A giant FFA between all competeing teams and CCP after the last match, optional participation.
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Malthros Zenobia
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
Kimotoro Directive
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Posted - 2006.08.17 15:27:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Sahi Natara
I'd allow faction implants, it would be too much work for the organizers to make sure no one had implants... What if I have Infomorph Psychology 5 and all my Jumpclones have implants?
You jump into one that doesn't use pirate implants.
If they all have pirate implants, they can, if nothing else, note which you have, pod you, then have you plug in a new set afterwards?
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Mauli Banika
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Posted - 2006.08.18 01:02:00 -
[14]
Tech 1 ships would make it fun. Let people keep their implants, I dunno about T2 ammo. Just T2 and cosmos mods.
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Watcher Three
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Posted - 2006.08.18 04:55:00 -
[15]
With no T2 ammo allowed and with pirate imps with t2 shield in, it was a boooring fight. The one with the strongest defence wins, no chances for those who choose to attack. Sure, there were some intresting matches in semifinal (mostly due to BoB pilot CTD) but the final was totally stupid. Both sides could do nothing. The defence was just to strong (oh, ASCN did not even bother to shoot AFAIR). ASCN wanted to survive too much, so most of their matches were a torment to watch.
So, ether allow T2 ammo, or remove T2 shield and pirate imps. It will give us much more intresting and dynamic fights. Let the things go BOOM! 
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Jack Thurner
Shinra
Lotka Volterra
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Posted - 2006.08.18 09:37:00 -
[16]
Tbh. Remove CNR's and crystal implants, and it should be just fine 
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Semkhet
The Priory
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Posted - 2006.08.20 20:08:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Semkhet on 20/08/2006 20:12:18
The problem is complex, but my main complaint would be related to cap boosting, because most of the tanking depended on cap injectors.
Since tanks have a pretty defined drain, it was easy to calculate how many charges you needed for such short encounters. If the generic match duration is extended beyond the amount of time of "tank cap replenishment" represented by the number of booster charges a battleship may hold in his cargo, then we would see much more tanks failing after a certain point.
But since it would'n be interesting to see matches where all tanks hold at least for the first 15-20 minutes, we could tackle the problem by inversing the premise: we only need to limit the number of booster charges the competing ships are allowed to hold in their cargo.
This would oblige pilots to manage their booster charges much more carefully, and would also give a new dimension to the effect of target switching and the related defensive reallocation of shield & armor remote tanking.
Also, psychologically, the simple fact of knowing that you could not rely during the whole match on tanking by assisted cap boosting through charges, you would automatically consider your setups under a less defensive perspective.
The second complaint relates to the size of the arena: it was too small. Between the lag and the fact that the area was unmarked, it was almost impossible for small ships to MWD without ending outside the arena and getting pwned by the referees. Therefore make the arena a bit larger and mark it, like a bubble for example. Besides, if the arena was big enough to allow small ships to exit the default targetting range of battleships, we could see a much better tactical use of the frigs and dessy's because their life would'n depend on remaining glued to their team, their life hanging on remote tanking.
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Tyrrax Thorrk
Amarr
Umbra Congregatio
Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2006.08.21 12:19:00 -
[18]
I wouldn't change the rules unless the format was changed.
Arena combat is kinda lacking in strategic movement 'n stuff, ECM might be viable if the battleground spanned more than just a single node, i'd like to see WCS and warp scramblers being needed, interdictor probes..
Hell even mobile warp disruptors..
Maybe have the battleground span a planet, it's moons and belts.
Scanning skills would factor in, maybe up the time limit a lil bit and have the judges penalize teams that try to get stalemate by hiding entire time.
I'd say allow podding, allow all implants, I'd prefer if crystals got nerfed a lil bit, but it doesn't really make much difference.
Teams that think not spending billions means there's no point in participating wouldn't win even if they had all the ISK in the world simply because their attitude is defeatist and weak, not to mention stupid.
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Keitaro Baka
Babylon Scientific and Industrial Enterprises
Babylon Project
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Posted - 2006.08.21 13:47:00 -
[19]
make everyone a jumpclone to fight (ie no implants at all) or indeed allow podding in the current state of 3 rounds in a poule..
that should be the main issue...
as for the smaller ones.. well .. making everything tech 1 non faction/cosmos/named should be fun but favours certain types and ships..
I'd say use EW or nothing of the sort (none of that NOS, Neut, Webbing, painting is allowed, ECM, tracking disruption, remote sensor dampening isn't crap) .. sure it will make the battles different but watching 5 ships tanking 5 ships for 20 minutes isn't all that great either..
if you wanna make it money based I'd say make it budget based.. every item that has a npc base price can be used and you have a max to use on your team (i'm well aware of certain problems with this...)
but mainly what I want to see is:
STICK TO YOUR OWN RULES!! ffs seeing that raven tank everything and then the battle gets extended like twice while the rules say: draw.. honestly .. made me switch of evetv and rant in our public channel for 15 mins (where most people agreed btw, if you make the battles 20 minutes and someone survives it's a draw..)
A fun rule to implement with all the uber tanking going on would be some sort of objective.. keep the exotic dancer save or summin.. you do that and you won't lose .. (ie have a piece of cargo not be stolen within the battle)
- All the stuff above does not necessarily reflect my corp, my alliance or even me
- Pure drone user... give us a mini carrier and faction Typhoon and Dominix please |
CherniyVolk
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Posted - 2006.08.24 03:28:00 -
[20]
why are all the tournies I stumble across only available for alliances?
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Swatcat
Gallente
Skunkwerx Haulage
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Posted - 2006.08.24 11:47:00 -
[21]
Personally I would like them to introduce a budget/ceiling on isk spent - this would be base or NPC priced, you can buy 3 rattlesnakes if you want but rest of the ships are then T1 low end as you are out of budget.
Instead of the 'artificial' arena format we have, I would agree with a previous post about spreading it out over a larger space - maybe a capture & hold an object event would be fun?
Swatcat
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jamesw
Omniscient Order
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Posted - 2006.08.26 14:31:00 -
[22]
I would love to see an additional "side tournament" of some kind. Perhaps its for another day, but it involves my personal favourite style of combat
The Old School Battleship Skirmish
A simple 3 vs 3 battleship only showdown.
- 20km start range.
- No implants.
- No Faction BS - only standard tier 1, 2 (or 3 if they are out).
- No Faction/Officer Mods.
- No EW.
- No Warping.
See who's left alive at the end.
--
NEW Vid: Domi For the Win! |
Malthros Zenobia
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
Kimotoro Directive
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Posted - 2006.08.26 17:31:00 -
[23]
How about making it open to teams of any sort?
If a team of NPC copr people want to play, let them LeMonde.
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master data
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Posted - 2006.08.26 17:34:00 -
[24]
I can't afford the 5% ROF on missles hardwiring implant... and that costs more than a low-grade crystal/slave set.... its not fair, even my mommy said so!
An ISK ceiling is stoopid because prices go up and down... And its tech 1 or 2, cosmos stuff anyway, who can't afford that?
Why allow people to use hardwirings but not faction implants, when hardwirings can cost more?
Using all tech 1 ships does make the field less skillpoint dependant, but do we really need to go that ghetto?
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SpacePervo
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Posted - 2006.08.26 17:43:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Malthros Zenobia
How about making it open to teams of any sort?
If a team of NPC copr people want to play, let them LeMonde.
Why don't u make a team for your alliance instead of whining? Kimotoro Directive didn't have a team last time did they?
There are lots and lots of alliances that didn't field teams at the last tourney, they just made excuses (bad ones like ur doing, NPC Corps, gimme a break).
The "isk celing" is a close second for being the most useless idea because its impossible to implemement because who is gonna add up all the modules, ships etc.?
Allowing podding is stoopid too because no one has warp scramblers fitted, and if they did, they'd be gimping their ships compared to ppl who fit smart setups... Besides shooting a pod doesn't prove your team are better fighters anyway.
Taking faction implants out of the tourney wouldn't hurt ASCN's boring tank team at all, but perhaps allowing a different set of ships or kind would make things more fast paced and exciting.
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Tobias Raddick
Caldari
Raddick Explorations
Myriad Alliance
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Posted - 2006.08.26 23:41:00 -
[26]
Another possible is this:
Ensure all pilots have 'clean' clones (no implants etc), then give each team a budget from which they can purchase the ships / modules / implants they want to take with them into the tournament. And the end of the tournament, all items are given back, all pilots with implants purchased for the tourney are podded & reimbursed their clone cost.
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Captain BoomBoom
Imperial Shipment
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Posted - 2006.08.28 12:25:00 -
[27]
Simple solution
Dont Let BoB enter..... |
turnschuh
Eye of God
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Posted - 2006.08.28 15:34:00 -
[28]
reduce starting range to 30km or so
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Ssieth
Caldari
Elite United Corp
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Posted - 2006.08.30 08:26:00 -
[29]
I guess I'm really just echoing/compiling what other people have said but here goes:
- No T2 ammo or we'll end up with a missile-boat load-out for every team
- Ditch pirate implants, they pander to the isk-rich too much for my liking. If it's intended that the tourney is a measure of how much isk you can throw around then OK but if it's about capsuleer skills then ditch them
- I'm less concerned about faction ships... at least there's some risk inherent in using them due to their cost and the high chance of losing them
- Consider the possibility of restricting teams to ships of one racial type. This would encourage teams to adopt noticeably different tactics from one-another rather than all just wading in with cap-boost-tanking
~~ Ssieth ~~ |
McTaggart
Gallente
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Posted - 2006.08.30 11:27:00 -
[30]
What I would personally enjoy; Tech 1 cruiser 5 a side.
- The arena would basically be empty space, by a moon or a planet for scenery with four or five collidable objects. Both teams start with these 5 objects bookmarked and warp in either from two points a couple thousand kilometers either side or from anywhere in the system. I'm leaning more towards anywhere in the system tbh.
- Only tech 1 cruisers allowed, no tech2, no faction. Maybe racial teams, probably not.
- Tech 2 mods are allowed, tech 2 ammo is not. Faction/deadspace etc is out too.
- Only two ships are allowed to fit EWAR. This is to stop 5 blackbirds permajamming everyone. Also applies to damps, tracking disruptors and (*sigh*) target painters. Maybe also not more than 3 ewar modules per ship.
- No implants.
Although this is more like an entirely different contest than changing the old one.
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