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ACE McFACE
Acetech Systems
104
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 10:40:00 -
[1] - Quote
bebe kitteh wrote:I have one very real question: "why are the new third teir Battlecruisers that are cappable of firing Battleship weapons, made of paper?" Seriously, change the name, skill requirements and call these "T2 destroyers". based on what I read about the blaster tweak/rebalance, who in the hell is going to equip a nagga with 'blasters'? Missiles are the caldari racial weapon, so why is the naga a BLASTER BOAT? you can not speed tank in a BC with an orbit under 75km- too many ships will neut,disrupt, web, the stuffing out of you if you try it. I am not going to buy a ship that can't survive one volley from a MACHARIEL! (by the way 14K+ volley damage at 146 KM is just awesome,  Especially when you tack on how tough a mach is compared to these new BC's) I am not going to buy a ship that can be torn apart by a dramiel! I want to ba ble to stand a fricking chance against a LOKI.... I am not lining up to buy plex to buy and fit one of these "t2 destroyers". there is a massive balance problem right now. that being pirate faction ships. can the empires get a clue, and reverse engineer some of these things? I mean, holly hell! with a set of Halo implants the dramiel has a 27 signature, a POD has 25 signature! comparing the pod to a dramiel,, and then using the same ratios to improve every ship in the game would be NICE! Alright, Don't buy one then... don't think your holding every ship builder in EVE to ransom with this 'threat'
Real men wear goggles and a Navy shirt! |

bebe kitteh
Bebe Kitteh Co
2
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Posted - 2011.11.26 10:40:00 -
[2] - Quote
*blink* blink* this is wierd. make your sigg bigger- I can't hear you, and post twice sum moar plz, kthnx |

Generals4
Caldari State
367
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Posted - 2011.11.26 10:43:00 -
[3] - Quote
So your complaint is that a sniper fitted pirate battleship can kill a shortrange fitted strategic cruiser when said battleship is in a ideal sniper situation?
What about the opposite, what if you catch the mach at a short range situation and it can't even land a volley on you? should mach pilots cry "T3's are OP" because they lose in the worst case scenario of a sniper fitted BS?
On top of that if the mach is that far just warp away. -Death is nothing, but to live defeated and inglorious is to die daily. |

ACE McFACE
Acetech Systems
104
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 10:45:00 -
[4] - Quote
bebe kitteh wrote:*blink* blink* this is wierd. make your sigg bigger- I can't hear you, and post twice sum moar plz, kthnx I know this is the EVE forums and all, but why do so many people make a thread asking for answers then whine and complain when people disagree with them, making themselves look like collosal idiots? Real men wear goggles and a Navy shirt! |

Generals4
Caldari State
367
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 10:49:00 -
[5] - Quote
ACE McFACE wrote:bebe kitteh wrote:*blink* blink* this is wierd. make your sigg bigger- I can't hear you, and post twice sum moar plz, kthnx I know this is the EVE forums and all, but why do so many people make a thread asking for answers then whine and complain when people disagree with them, making themselves look like collosal idiots?
Because this is the internet. People don't want discussions they just want to hear yes-men agreeing with them. -Death is nothing, but to live defeated and inglorious is to die daily. |

ACE McFACE
Acetech Systems
104
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 10:51:00 -
[6] - Quote
Generals4 wrote:ACE McFACE wrote:bebe kitteh wrote:*blink* blink* this is wierd. make your sigg bigger- I can't hear you, and post twice sum moar plz, kthnx I know this is the EVE forums and all, but why do so many people make a thread asking for answers then whine and complain when people disagree with them, making themselves look like collosal idiots? Because this is the internet. People don't want discussions they just want to hear yes-men agreeing with them. I agree! Real men wear goggles and a Navy shirt! |

ThisIsntMyMain
Republic University Minmatar Republic
61
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 10:51:00 -
[7] - Quote
bebe kitteh wrote:Cryten Jones wrote:/me thinks someone just lost a big Tengu fit to a MACHARIEL in low sec....bitter much :-) Adapt or die, this is all.  yes I did.  anywho, let's play your game: how would you adapt a tengu to waltz through repeated 14k+ volley damage? what if your not able to run, for some damn reason or another? how would you people do it? Many of you claim to be smart, show me how and I'll GTFO+ STFU+ L2P.
I wouldn't fit it for PvE and then jump it un scouted into a 0.3 system.
And you do of course understand the difference between Tech 3 ( a 700 Mill Tengu) and Tier 3 ( a 50 Mill BC ) since we started off the thread talking about Tier 3 glass cannons. |

bebe kitteh
Bebe Kitteh Co
2
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Posted - 2011.11.26 10:56:00 -
[8] - Quote
I was replying to the poster whoese signature is ascII faces, rows and rows of it. I don't look for yes men. I just hope for more than snide insults and put downs.
I agree that these new BC ships will be great at something, that something is being popped.
I agree that the mach is expensive and does it's job well, I agree that.... ships have roles and team work is the point of most online games. I agree...
crap. people.
I guess I get to stay right where I am. |

Amro One
One.
42
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Posted - 2011.11.26 11:02:00 -
[9] - Quote
why are SB glass cannons?
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bebe kitteh
Bebe Kitteh Co
2
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Posted - 2011.11.26 11:10:00 -
[10] - Quote
Amro One wrote:why are SB glass cannons? I would guess that it is becuase they have considerable advantages, stealth and heavy weaponry. this would be an encouragement to use tactics, and apply the ship's role as often as possible.
I know Stealth bombers are fragile, yet a group of 5 of them working together with a good FC- they become scary as all get out.
on the other hand, I have seen a player try to take one against a destroyer. in a face to face, "fair fight". the destroyer kilt him befor breakfast.
So the lesson here for me is...
learn my ship's role and applicable tactics? |
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Tore Vest
Vikinghall
80
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Posted - 2011.11.26 11:12:00 -
[11] - Quote
Have read somwhere that tier3 bc are good miningships  |

ThisIsntMyMain
Republic University Minmatar Republic
61
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 11:13:00 -
[12] - Quote
Quote:learn my ship's role and applicable tactics? Very good young padawan |

bebe kitteh
Bebe Kitteh Co
2
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Posted - 2011.11.26 11:16:00 -
[13] - Quote
ThisIsntMyMain wrote:Quote:learn my ship's role and applicable tactics? Very good young padawan
okay, I will now GTFO+ STFU+ L2P... any ideas on where I should go looking for my schooling?
|

Dirty Weegie
The Dirty Rejects Scelus Sceleris.
5
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 11:18:00 -
[14] - Quote
Dont feed trolls, it only makes them more stupid
If you can't win fair... Cheat |

MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
118
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 11:19:00 -
[15] - Quote
for belt ratting the talos will be rather nice...
fit wiith
8 nutron blaster II with Null
mids: 10mn ab II tracking comp II optimal range script then two meta iv large shield extenders
lows: 3 mag stab II 2 tracking comp II
rigs: 3 shield extender rigs
drones: 5 hobgoblins
you are doing 950 dps with drone out to 45km with fall off...
it does not matter that it has no tank kill it kills so fast... |

ACE McFACE
Acetech Systems
104
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 11:19:00 -
[16] - Quote
bebe kitteh wrote: I was replying to the poster whoese signature is ascII faces, rows and rows of it. I don't look for yes men. I just hope for more than snide insults and put downs. I agree that these new BC ships will be great at something, that something is being popped.I agree that the mach is expensive and does it's job well, I agree that.... ships have roles and team work is the point of most online games. I agree... crap. people. I guess I get to stay right where I am. High sec ganking is also a role, and even the others would be good as a kind of heavy hitter for smaller more mobile fleets, with logistic support of course Real men wear goggles and a Navy shirt! |

Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
1251
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 11:19:00 -
[17] - Quote
Generals4 wrote:ACE McFACE wrote:bebe kitteh wrote:*blink* blink* this is wierd. make your sigg bigger- I can't hear you, and post twice sum moar plz, kthnx I know this is the EVE forums and all, but why do so many people make a thread asking for answers then whine and complain when people disagree with them, making themselves look like collosal idiots? Because this is the internet. People don't want discussions they just want to hear yes-men agreeing with them.
That's hardly unique to the internet.
Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |

ThisIsntMyMain
Republic University Minmatar Republic
61
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 11:25:00 -
[18] - Quote
bebe kitteh wrote:any ideas on where I should go looking for my schooling?
https://gate.eveonline.com/Corporation/EVE%20University |

Kinis Deren
EVE University Ivy League
21
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 11:29:00 -
[19] - Quote
bebe kitteh wrote:I have one very real question: "why are the new third teir Battlecruisers that are cappable of firing Battleship weapons, made of paper?" .......
My understanding is that the new Tier 3 BC are intended for a specific purpose, which is an effective weapon against capital ship dominated fleets. This encourages diversity of fleet compositions, since a good FC will have to consider a counter to the possibility of bumping into a fleet with a healthy compliment of Tier 3 BCs.
Respectfully, I don't believe that the intention was to create a new FOTM solo mission ship and I guess that having a 'glass tank' prevents this. I like the look of the Tornado but I'll probably be sticking with my Hurricane for solo/small gang roams. |

Phyress
Isumi Industries
7
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 11:31:00 -
[20] - Quote
Also, I've heard rumors of these lovely classes of ship whose role is 'EWAR'. I think that they might have some nice synergy with the new battlecruisers.
Of course, this would require you to play with other people, but who plays MMO's for the multiplayer? |
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ThisIsntMyMain
Republic University Minmatar Republic
61
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 11:34:00 -
[21] - Quote
The new Tier 3 BC's are not "intended" to do anything by CCP. Their high DPS is simply balanced by lack of tank and their design is an experiment. What they get used for is entirely up to the players. I don't think anybody really knows yet what they will be best for - but the Jita undock is likely to see quite a few of them. |

Jace Errata
Cobalt Valkyrie Industries The Ambivalent
39
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Posted - 2011.11.26 12:25:00 -
[22] - Quote
Took an extended break halfway through writing this; when I got back the thread had gained two and a half pages. Oh well, point still stands SO:
Quote:Okay I'm going to try to get this post right the first time.
The role of a Tier 3 battlecruiser appears to be a fleet support ship. It has high damage output, but requires a fleet to defend it to be effective. In effect, it's a subcapital supercapital (or a subcapital post-Crucible supercapital). This is quite simply Perfectly Fine. If it could fit a heavy tank in addition to its battleship-size weapons, it would effectively become a low-end battleship rather than a specialty battlecruiser. Let's...just assume there's some kind of signature here, 'k? ... ... OH WAIT. Jace Errata on Twitter |

Solstice Project
Cult of Personality
203
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 12:28:00 -
[23] - Quote
@OP:
Emo.
Crying for cryings sake. Please don't ever breed. |

Fix My Lasers
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
3
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 13:20:00 -
[24] - Quote
OP is right actually. Well, at least at some points. My point of view is those ships is a waste of time and money:
- DPS is done with BS sized guns. Which means they can't hit well targets up to the cruiser size. - No Drones except Talos. Which means every ship that is smaller then a cruiser can eat you alive. - No Tank or very little. Well I actually don't mind that. Glass cannon should have low HP, but high utility and versatility, sadly those BCs don't have utility nor versatility. - The price is too high. t1 BS might cost you less. If I was to choose between t3 BC and t1 BS I'd take Phoon or Domi for sure. Those BCs can't compare to them. - Making a PvP ship only is a fail. 80% of this game is about PvE. Carebears and others outnumber everything. - The role of those ships itself is a bit useless and can be replaced with another ship type easily. When you say to someone things like: You suck, you are dumb or anything that specifies someone you should think twice before saying them. Maybe you're the one who fits those words in a first place? |

seany1212
Mind Games. 0ccupational Hazzard
30
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 13:26:00 -
[25] - Quote
ThisIsntMyMain wrote:The new Tier 3 BC's are not "intended" to do anything by CCP. Their high DPS is simply balanced by lack of tank and their design is an experiment. What they get used for is entirely up to the players. I don't think anybody really knows yet what they will be best for - but the Jita undock is likely to see quite a few of them.
This, but moreso they fit as an anti-capital role, being able to put high dps down on larger targets while having a small Sig radius and agile |

Acac Sunflyier
Burning Star L.L.C.
40
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 13:26:00 -
[26] - Quote
The Oracle won't be. Clearly somebody needs to go back and read all the descriptions carefully. The only one they specifically stated would be a glass cannon is the Talos. |

Ammzi
Imperial Guardians Blazing Angels Alliance
135
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 13:28:00 -
[27] - Quote
The oracle has the same damage potential as a nightmare. It is cap stable and fits into wormholes just beautifully. It's not our fault that OP doesn't have the brightest bit of imagination on how to use these ships.
OP - quit EVE, you suck at it. quote CCP Spitfire
"Hello Im Blue,"
|

Halcyon Ingenium
The Randomites
30
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 13:37:00 -
[28] - Quote
bebe kitteh wrote:I have one very real question: "why are the new third teir Battlecruisers that are cappable of firing Battleship weapons, made of paper?" Seriously, change the name, skill requirements and call these "T2 destroyers".
Haha, ok.
bebe kitteh wrote:based on what I read about the blaster tweak/rebalance, who in the hell is going to equip a nagga with 'blasters'? Missiles are the caldari racial weapon, so why is the naga a BLASTER BOAT?
Aha! That is what this is really about.
bebe kitteh wrote:I am not lining up to buy plex to buy and fit one of these "t2 destroyers".
No one is asking you to.
bebe kitteh wrote:there is a massive balance problem right now. that being pirate faction ships. can the empires get a clue, and reverse engineer some of these things?
Ah, I stand corrected, this is what this is actually about.
bebe kitteh wrote:I mean, holly hell! with a set of Halo implants the dramiel has a 27 signature, a POD has 25 signature! comparing the pod to a dramiel,, and then using the same ratios to improve every ship in the game would be NICE!
Confirmed, OP is a pirate faction ship whine.
People say things like: "Oh, you make so much money. What do you need any more for?" Well, actually, *****, I never asked for your opinion. I'll let you know when I have enough money. -Gene Simmons |

Aqriue
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
178
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 15:51:00 -
[29] - Quote
Fix My Lasers wrote:OP is right actually. Well, at least at some points. My point of view is those ships is a waste of time and money:
- DPS is done with BS sized guns. Which means they can't hit well targets up to the cruiser size. - No Drones except Talos. Which means every ship that is smaller then a cruiser can eat you alive. - No Tank or very little. Well I actually don't mind that. Glass cannon should have low HP, but high utility and versatility, sadly those BCs don't have utility nor versatility. - The price is too high. t1 BS might cost you less. If I was to choose between t3 BC and t1 BS I'd take Phoon or Domi for sure. Those BCs can't compare to them. - Making a PvP ship only is a fail. 80% of this game is about PvE. Carebears and others outnumber everything. - The role of those ships itself is a bit useless and can be replaced with another ship type easily. 1. Destroyer packs destroy a hulk quickly 2. Upscale that to the tier 3 battlecruiser 3. Fly in small gangs (not just for ganking) 4. Put in an oven preheated to 425 degrees while your 3 braincells fire in sequence 5. DING! Dinner is ready! Watch those cruiser and normal battlecruisers gangs upscale to BS gun cruiser gangs. They pack decent tank with logi back up with greater firepower. So if you run a gang of 6 guys and say 2 of them now fly a Tornado, with logistic back up and a tackler....skies the limit. Got quick agile snipers to warp in with 1400mm guns. Got OMGWTBBQ!!! firepower with 800mm guns and I imagine if the target (assuming at least cruiser or larger) is web to hell its going to melt quickly. You guys with BC 5, just train T2 large guns (like 4 weeks) and now you got a POS basher (should you be inclined) in the size of a BC. What else can you do with a a tier 3 ship I haven't thought up yet?
For lowsec warfare, I can see the tier 3 BC as a good DPS support ship and you can finish off the target quicker (self destructing freighter?) then GTFO before the target's support get there. |

John Caesse
Navy of Xoc The Remnant Legion
98
|
Posted - 2011.11.26 16:35:00 -
[30] - Quote
Fix My Lasers wrote:- Making a PvP ship only is a fail. 80% of this game is about PvE. Carebears and others outnumber everything.
They'll be fine for belt ratting in 0.0
Just like stealth bombers, HACs, and other PVP focused speed/sig tanking glass cannon ships. |
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