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Pilgrim, Dual vs Single Rep?

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Bluestealth Minmatar Alcatraz Inc. Tactical Narcotics Team	Posted - 2006.08.19 16:02:00 - [61] Originally by: Kaylana Syi Originally by: Bluestealth You loose neglegible DPS even with good missle skills. Actually, 2 Siege w. thermal add signifigant DPS to your ship when your fighting an armor tanked apponent. Thermal torpedos will chew their shields down, will not hit a 70+ resistance barrier like EM on armor, and will work on the DCU as well as explosive and kinetic. It is how I have put some mega pilots in their place and gotton slaps on teh back by others who barely beat me. NOS won't do much to a mega or Typhoon since they can deal out massive damage before they run out of injectors. Close range BS fights truely are decided by who have the largest amount of injectors except for the NOS domi ( which should still have injectors imo ) Ok... occasionally I like to use hail, not that often, but I pretty much cant use it without the nos or I have severe cap issues. However if I am using hail, something probably has gone wrong or not going fast enough for my tastes, speed bonus sucks. It is about 50-100 DPS in total for 2 highslots, not completely without merit but considering the other 6 are doing 600-700 and drones 150-170 My setup is usually 6 x 650mm II/425mm II 2 Heavy Nos or 2 Cruise Launchers(could use siege but fights rarely last that long anyways) 100mn MWD or AB, Web, Disruptor, Tracking Disruptor/ECM/ECCM/SB2, Cap Injector Large Rep II, 3 x Hard II, 2 Gyro IIs 5 x medium tech2 drones, 5 x warrior II Originally by: Buraken v2 1on1 with me baby? I'll keep the loot though. Tempest vs Pilgrim, sure, someone already posted the stats of 425mm tracking though, I was not trying to say that it would be impossibe btw I am just trying to say you guys are making this ship out to be indistructable, which it hardly is. Originally by: Bluestealth A Muninn will rip you to shreads. Originally by: Buraken v2 If i was logged in atm I would pull out the ol' killmail but oh well, maybe some other time. And dont tell me the pilot was a noob either I guess it all depends on the fittings, I could see you easily outlasting me if you had a cap injector/large plate but I know that my cap would be dry after the second volley of nos and I would be passively tanking you and you might not be able to rep. I think muninn puts out half the damage of my tempest with tech2 heavys, hail, and tech2 drones and its tracking is much better. I have had a few fights on the test server with pilrims/curses and did quite well, sacrilidge is nearly impossible because I wont break its tank before mine fails, although I do come close. Of course if you hit me with a jammer(highly likely it wont miss with the sad state of the multispec2) you would definatly win. Pilgrims are a nice ship and I will give you that, I am just saying that autocannon ships are not a juicy target like a megathron or especially a geddon would be. Of course any long range battleships would be completly screwed unless it was a "terrible" curse pilot. A lot of flying a ship like the pilgrim is choosing your targets, and if I were pirating in a pilgrim I would probably avoid highly skilled tempest pilots, I mean there are plenty of ravens and other stuff to kill :) Sorry if anything I said sounded like smack, it was not my intention, its just the way I am. goes to take a breather. OK Forum tried to eat my post again.... calms down... see I sometimes write less the 2nd time... which might explain a bit.
CB Cyrix GeoTech	Posted - 2006.08.21 11:45:00 - [62] Multispec jammers are a MUST really on a pilgrim, the more they are jammed the less cap they take coz ALOT of people use nos now... -Taking Piracy To The Next Level-
KilROCK Minmatar Angel Deep Corporation	Posted - 2006.08.21 11:48:00 - [63] Originally by: CB Cyrix Multispec jammers are a MUST really on a pilgrim, the more they are jammed the less cap they take coz ALOT of people use nos now... Lol, I tried without multispecs tonight to take on something that wasn't exactly 'the best' to take on within web range. Ginger down X_x SMACKING IN A TOPIC NEAR YOU / WTS PILGRIM + CURSE + T2 DRONES PACKS
CB Cyrix GeoTech	Posted - 2006.08.21 12:07:00 - [64] Originally by: KilROCK Originally by: CB Cyrix Multispec jammers are a MUST really on a pilgrim, the more they are jammed the less cap they take coz ALOT of people use nos now... Lol, I tried without multispecs tonight to take on something that wasn't exactly 'the best' to take on within web range. Ginger down X_x HEHE, milti's 4tw! -Taking Piracy To The Next Level-
Spiff Starbuster	Posted - 2006.08.21 13:22:00 - [65] I use 2x Tracking Disruptors & 1x Hypnos. TD's will always affect it's target, while the ECM is chance based. NOS isn't that much of a problem.
CB Cyrix GeoTech	Posted - 2006.08.21 13:45:00 - [66] Edited by: CB Cyrix on 21/08/2006 13:46:59 Originally by: Spiff Starbuster I use 2x Tracking Disruptors & 1x Hypnos. TD's will always affect it's target, while the ECM is chance based. NOS isn't that much of a problem. They may be chance based, BUT multi's are good defence against nos, being jammed yourself, and generally anything with missiles. I see ALOT of ferox's and ravens about. Plus once they are jammed you have the entire cycle time to repair/warpout/kill etc. And its a nice time to remove the targets drones with Hobgoblin II's HEHEHE. -Taking Piracy To The Next Level-
CB Cyrix GeoTech	Posted - 2006.08.23 16:07:00 - [67] I wonder how the EWAR nerf will change the pilgrim...
Kaylana Syi Minmatar The Nest	Posted - 2006.08.23 16:22:00 - [68] Originally by: CB Cyrix I wonder how the EWAR nerf will change the pilgrim... Considering I only use 1 racial caldari... not much to me. Team Minmatar Carriers need Clone Vats
CB LoKi	Posted - 2006.08.24 13:40:00 - [69] Edited by: CB LoKi on 24/08/2006 13:39:54 What drones are people using on these? Im thinking a few heavys, few meds and a light? Thermal seems a good alrounder (saves training more than once race to spec 4)? Please resize your signature, oh and I love you - Jacques
Aramendel Amarr Queens of the Stone Age	Posted - 2006.08.24 13:55:00 - [70] Edited by: Aramendel on 24/08/2006 13:56:17 Well. 2 heavies, 2 meds and 1 light is the combo which gives the best dps, but for PvP 5 meds & 5 lights should be far better. If you run into frigates you will get problems with the 2/2/1 config and in 1v1 you rarely win by outdpsing the target, but by making it unable to dps you. Also, AFAIK lights are the best drones to kill enemy drones - if you go vs BSs a swarm of 5 heavies is the biggest danger to a curse/pilgrim. For lights exp are the best ones (fastest & best tracking), for meds therm or kin.
Hydrogen Art of War	Posted - 2006.08.24 14:01:00 - [71] Originally by: Bluestealth I want to see you fight a PvP tempest and come back with the same opinion, I am pretty sure you'll get torn to shreads. Tempest is pretty fast arround 450 m/s with an ab and good skills even faster with a mwd, doesnt use cap to fire its guns, can be fitted with a cap injector, and often has 2 heavy nos. You will NOT stay out of web range in a pilgrim, you will NOT disrupt its tracking enough to not get hit. It also has a decent size drone bay and can have a decent compliment of missiles. God help you if it has two webs fitted. Tempest = not juicy target for pilgrim or curse. A tempest has zero chance against a well fitted and skilled Pilgrim pilot. In best case it is a draw, but never a loss for the Pilgrim. But even then a draw is unlikely too if the Tempest is not heavily equipped with WCS. AF Guide
Julio Torres	Posted - 2006.08.24 14:06:00 - [72] Originally by: CB LoKi Edited by: CB LoKi on 24/08/2006 13:39:54 What drones are people using on these? Im thinking a few heavys, few meds and a light? Thermal seems a good alrounder (saves training more than once race to spec 4)? 5 Medium & 5 Light. Light vs drones and frigs. Medium for rest. Replace lost Mediums with Lights as the fight goes on. I pick drones for whats most usual for the area I'm stalking. Thermal is a good guess, when you dont know whats around.
Hydrogen Art of War	Posted - 2006.08.24 14:07:00 - [73] Back to topic on setup. My recommendation on a Pilgrim is as follows: Hi: 3x med dim, cov ops cloak Med: Webber, scrambler, and 3 EW/ECM to your liking Low: 2xSAR II (or better faction), 2xEANM II, 1600 mm Rolled Tungsten a decent setup for Energy management and huge Armor Points without any see-saw effect. AF Guide
Hydrogen Art of War	Posted - 2006.08.24 14:10:00 - [74] Originally by: Julio Torres 5 Medium & 5 Light. Light vs drones and frigs. Medium for rest. Replace lost Mediums with Lights as the fight goes on. I pick drones for whats most usual for the area I'm stalking. Thermal is a good guess, when you dont know whats around. Verified several times: 2 hvy T2, 2 med T2 and 1 Light T2. This drone layout offers the highest dps. The Mediums hit hard still versus frigs. I recommend Kinetic dmg in any case. AF Guide
CB LoKi	Posted - 2006.08.24 15:17:00 - [75] Originally by: Hydrogen Originally by: Julio Torres 5 Medium & 5 Light. Light vs drones and frigs. Medium for rest. Replace lost Mediums with Lights as the fight goes on. I pick drones for whats most usual for the area I'm stalking. Thermal is a good guess, when you dont know whats around. Verified several times: 2 hvy T2, 2 med T2 and 1 Light T2. This drone layout offers the highest dps. The Mediums hit hard still versus frigs. I recommend Kinetic dmg in any case. Whatever you are firing at will be webbed and nosed to hell so even heavys will hit frigs. Therefore the 2/2/1 setup with its near 300 DPS is far better than the normal 200 ish DPS. If your going up against a drones ship, in the time you get your drones back and release warriors and remove their drones you will be dead. So get the kill first with the 2/2/1 setup. Comments? Please resize your signature, oh and I love you - Jacques
Wolverine PL Gallente Bermuda Syndrome	Posted - 2006.08.24 20:46:00 - [76] Killing bs with dualrep pilgrim is easy. I killed few, even dominix, its all what setup you have. everyone here writes what in hi or low, but what with med slots, they keep you alive. Thats Tracking disruptor, AB, Web and 2xjammers (racials if you know what you hunting on) Dual rep keeps you live long enough to kill all his drones. Only missiles ships are pain in but (tracking disruptor dont works).
Bluestealth Minmatar Alcatraz Inc. Tactical Narcotics Team	Posted - 2006.08.24 21:16:00 - [77] Originally by: Hydrogen A tempest has zero chance against a well fitted and skilled Pilgrim pilot. In best case it is a draw, but never a loss for the Pilgrim. But even then a draw is unlikely too if the Tempest is not heavily equipped with WCS. LOL, my point exactly, you are vastly overestimating your ship, curse vs tempest I will give you, pilgrim vs tempest I wont. There is no pilot or setup that can guarantee success. Your arrogance over this issue is amazing, after all I was just trying to say of all targets, a Tempest is probably the most dangerous. This will be especially true after ECM nerf since you wont be able to keep him jammed all the time. Anyways the pilgrim/curse are terrible at engaging multiple targets, even if they are good at solo work.
Hydrogen Art of War	Posted - 2006.08.25 11:45:00 - [78] Originally by: Bluestealth Anyways the pilgrim/curse are terrible at engaging multiple targets, even if they are good at solo work. I bow to your wisdom and ask you most kindly to proove it to me. When and where - send me an ingame Mail. AF Guide
Leilani Solaris Gallente 0utbreak	Posted - 2006.08.25 18:41:00 - [79] Pilgrim can easily take on multiple targets, just depends on what they are. Setup i use is: High: 3 med nos (e50 or better), Cov ops cloak Mids: 2 Balmer tracking disruptors, 20km scram, web, Best named caldari racial jammer Lows: 800mm Plate II, MAR II, 2 EANM II, CPR Just about fits with recon lvl 4. Just be wary about what you take on... I found out that even while i had a vagabond nossed, webbed, orbiting it he could still fire and hit me pretty easily
Isonkon Serikain Gallente Band of Builders Inc. Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.08.25 19:40:00 - [80] Edited by: Isonkon Serikain on 25/08/2006 19:45:07 I'm pretty sure an ac tempest would eventually die to a skilled pilgrim, unless it had 2 webs fitted... Don't play... with 2 webs on the pilgrim will get torn apart, even with tracking disruptors on. And against a Raven? the only chance for the pilgrim is ew... really now. Pity the fool
Bluestealth Minmatar Alcatraz Inc. Tactical Narcotics Team	Posted - 2006.08.25 20:46:00 - [81] Originally by: Isonkon Serikain Edited by: Isonkon Serikain on 25/08/2006 19:45:07 I'm pretty sure an ac tempest would eventually die to a skilled pilgrim, unless it had 2 webs fitted... Don't play... with 2 webs on the pilgrim will get torn apart, even with tracking disruptors on. And against a Raven? the only chance for the pilgrim is ew... really now. Woohoo some one understood my point :).... After ECM nerf Ravens will be nearly impossible to kill unless you can tank them during the cooldown period and jam them 100% of the time during active cycles. It may be possible though. BTW I keep hearing about a NOS nerf coming as well, whats that about? I can't keep up with tuxford... btw apparently my alliance is in Stain atm Hydrogen.
Liet Traep Minmatar Black Lance Dusk and Dawn	Posted - 2006.08.25 22:06:00 - [82] Originally by: Ginaz single rep + 800mm plate and 2nos 1 neut in highs Same setup I use. Very happy with it.
Vicious Phoenix	Posted - 2006.08.25 23:53:00 - [83] Edited by: Vicious Phoenix on 25/08/2006 23:55:30 Originally by: Bluestealth Originally by: Hydrogen A tempest has zero chance against a well fitted and skilled Pilgrim pilot. In best case it is a draw, but never a loss for the Pilgrim. But even then a draw is unlikely too if the Tempest is not heavily equipped with WCS. LOL, my point exactly, you are vastly overestimating your ship, curse vs tempest I will give you, pilgrim vs tempest I wont. There is no pilot or setup that can guarantee success. Your arrogance over this issue is amazing, after all I was just trying to say of all targets, a Tempest is probably the most dangerous. This will be especially true after ECM nerf since you wont be able to keep him jammed all the time. Anyways the pilgrim/curse are terrible at engaging multiple targets, even if they are good at solo work. No, no and no again. Unless you double web me, you will have a snowball's chance in hell of landing a single shot seeing as my 3x .4 mod tracking disruptors will take you down to about a 10th of your original tracking (think even worse than 1400mm) And my nos will kill your cap fairly quickly especially if you're reping. The fight could last quite a while if you have a full hold of cap boosters, but you'd still die in the end. Edit: Originally by: Liet Traep Originally by: Ginaz single rep + 800mm plate and 2nos 1 neut in highs Same setup I use. Very happy with it. I use this setup too and tbh its the best I've found. BTW love your vid of the Pilgrim Ginaz, its what turned me on to this sexy ships in the first place. CFW (Certified Forum Warrior) I kill people ingame too.
Testicular Testes	Posted - 2006.08.26 00:12:00 - [84] Originally by: CB LoKi Originally by: Hydrogen Originally by: Julio Torres 5 Medium & 5 Light. Light vs drones and frigs. Medium for rest. Replace lost Mediums with Lights as the fight goes on. I pick drones for whats most usual for the area I'm stalking. Thermal is a good guess, when you dont know whats around. Verified several times: 2 hvy T2, 2 med T2 and 1 Light T2. This drone layout offers the highest dps. The Mediums hit hard still versus frigs. I recommend Kinetic dmg in any case. Whatever you are firing at will be webbed and nosed to hell so even heavys will hit frigs. Therefore the 2/2/1 setup with its near 300 DPS is far better than the normal 200 ish DPS. If your going up against a drones ship, in the time you get your drones back and release warriors and remove their drones you will be dead. So get the kill first with the 2/2/1 setup. Comments? Backup drones are nice, and with ~1.1k topspeed on Berserkers MWDing they're just terrible. Also additional training time (T2 Heavys) and the fact that if a frigate moves too slowly you won't hit it with heavys crimps that alot. Effectively it would just be launching 2 meds/1 light out for frigs. So in a Curse it's not very tempting due to having to scoop heavies under fire from ~18 out while moving and for the Pilgrim unwebbing the target is not an option (as you won't be able to hold it beyond 10k).
Bluestealth Minmatar Alcatraz Inc. Tactical Narcotics Team	Posted - 2006.08.26 00:34:00 - [85] Originally by: Vicious Phoenix No, no and no again. Unless you double web me, you will have a snowball's chance in hell of landing a single shot seeing as my 3x .4 mod tracking disruptors will take you down to about a 10th of your original tracking (think even worse than 1400mm) And my nos will kill your cap fairly quickly especially if you're reping. The fight could last quite a while if you have a full hold of cap boosters, but you'd still die in the end. No one in their right mind would fit 3 tracking disruptors, would be completly ineffective against raven/drone ships. Anyways in the end my point was your ship was not invincible, not trying to say tempest would win every time. Maybe I should stop responding because no one seems to get that? If I want to I can fit a retarted setup to my tempest like 3 tech2 sensor damps and possibly stay just out of your lock range(would be a few hundred to thosand km, but probably possible), but if I could what if setups all day I could win every fight. So amarr have two GREAT ships in a giant pile of mediocrity, awesome, but no ship is perfect for all situations, if you are really delusional enough to think that then I don't know what to say.
Aramendel Amarr Queens of the Stone Age	Posted - 2006.08.26 08:33:00 - [86] Originally by: Bluestealth No one in their right mind would fit 3 tracking disruptors, would be completly ineffective against raven/drone ships. Who says it has to be? It has a cloak, it can pick it's target.
Bluestealth Minmatar Alcatraz Inc. Tactical Narcotics Team	Posted - 2006.08.26 11:18:00 - [87] Originally by: Aramendel Originally by: Bluestealth No one in their right mind would fit 3 tracking disruptors, would be completly ineffective against raven/drone ships. Who says it has to be? It has a cloak, it can pick it's target. True but there are A LOT of caldari pilots out there.
CB Apollo	Posted - 2006.09.01 15:34:00 - [88] Edited by: CB Apollo on 01/09/2006 15:34:57 With skillz who multispecs arnt bad, not as urber as race specific, but still jams most things 40-50% of the time... But 2xreps+3x nos > rep+plate+2xnos+neut One rep just dont have to tank to last, plated you are still going down slowly, so against anything bigger than you a 2x rep is best.

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SMACKING IN A TOPIC NEAR YOU / WTS PILGRIM + CURSE + T2 DRONES PACKS