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Possible Dev Clarification: Removal of Courier Missions

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Idarana	Posted - 2006.08.23 08:27:00 - [31] For me the game becomes less fun with the missing of the Curier Missions (perhaps even to the point to quit eve) Non Combat Missions was around 2h/day of my playing time and in my option its was Fun but now with no where near enough combat skill to handle lvl 3 Combat Mission I have to look what I will do instead. I absolut hope CCP will make a rolback on this till they have enough non Combat missions to replace the old ones!!!
Loraen	Posted - 2006.08.23 08:33:00 - [32] The mission "Insane Industrialists" which involves hauling some 2.56M of tritanium is still in-game, at least. L4 mission. Gotten it twice from my manufacturing agent. And yes, I was going for the "peaceful researcher" too. Guess that's out for the moment. Well, I can visit my agents and decline kill missions every 4 hours and hope that the next offered mission is II or maybe some other courier still ingame..
Juwi Kotch Gallente VIRTUAL LIFE VANGUARD	Posted - 2006.08.23 08:40:00 - [33] Well just to add my voice and chime in: Deleting the courier missions destroyed a lot for me. My main job is that of a corp leader and research/production char. Besides that, I did courier missions. I have over 15mil skillpoints, but not battlecruiser or battleship skills at all, less then 2mil skillpoints combined in gunnery and drones, and 0 SP in missiles. I was on my way to get a jump clone solution with doing courier missions for a particular corp, what I cannot commence now. I have heftily invested in connection skillbooks to improve the courier mission results, which are now useless. Courier missions supported a complete major profession tree in EVE. This tree was now cut off, without planting replacement. Judging from my ingame experience, I'd say that at least 10 to 20 % of all chars ingame where focused on doing courier missions. They are all unemployed now. I would not be astonished when quite some of them just won't prolonge their subscription until the courier missions will be back. Having learned about the importance the Devs do give to courier missions, I'm afraid that those won't be back with the next Patch, since they will be priority number umphteen, and will just be put on the backburner, to give room for "more important" things. I don't have an alt. If I had, and if this char would not be needed to run the corporation, I would not play him until the courier missions are back. This decision will cost you serious money. Juwi Kotch
Marena Bijo	Posted - 2006.08.23 08:50:00 - [34] First mission with my regular Manufacturing Agent: Ritualist Raids. This character has no combat skills whatsoever. Sure I can do them with the help of one of my Combat characters but if I wanted to do things that way I'd be using a combat agent. I know they said they'd remove some courier missions, what they should have said is "We're changing courier only agents so they will start to give kill missions, so dont work for them if you cant do kill missions" Really a low blow. Hope this will be sorted soon.
Linerra Tedora Criss Cross	Posted - 2006.08.23 09:02:00 - [35] great move... just great... (major sarcasm here) i am running an alt to get to lvl 4 research agents in a corp... there is no way this alt can fly combat missions... sure by the time kali comes, you will have hopefully put courier missions back in... well by that time, i will be several months behind on Research points on agents... so right now i am paying for running a character, that can do nothing but sit and train skills... could you please put back in at least a few of the old courier missions??? and delete all the combat missions so those that do not understand our whining can learn to under stand? EvE-CCG Spoiler Database
Amara Takani Gallente Free-Space-Ranger	Posted - 2006.08.23 09:29:00 - [36] My R&D Agents doesn't give out a mission. So i think all (Courier AND Trade, R&D was 50% & 50% of that type) are gone beside some few (Insane Industrial as mentioned above). As it stands now, i can't do any missions to get new R&D Agents with better standing and my R&D Agents i have now, i cant get any bonus rp, because they dont give any mission out now!!
Hiro Yuki	Posted - 2006.08.23 09:45:00 - [37] Apparently the changes will be in the next patch, the Kali Patch. Don't know how long we'll be waiting for that. It's not like patches are common. Not all courier missions are gone anyway. A friend had one in offers and it's still there.
Vargrh Gallente Stupid People Always Need Killing	Posted - 2006.08.23 09:56:00 - [38] Yep, it seems rather then just add 'command and security' missions to these agents, both placating people with good standings with agents all over empire they've been doing manufacturing, administration, trade agent missions for, and at the same time reducing the INSANE lag in empire systems where you have 200+ people packed into any system with a level 4 security, internal security or command agent... (who will venture out to systems with new mission types thus reducing lag, it seems CCP devs have stuck two fingers up to the players again and nerfed one thing without doing anything to replace it. What you will have now is hundreds if not thousands of players realising they have really good standings with their faction as a result of all their courier mission running, and have all the faction navy level 4 agents available to them.... flooding into systems with those agents, putting even more lag and strain on the eve server. Thanks CCP. Take whats always been a good game content wise and graphically and ruining it every patch with ill thought out changes.
Lurtz Caldari Gunrunners and Gamblers	Posted - 2006.08.23 11:05:00 - [39] Originally by: Krav This "change" is not supposed to be permament, why do you insist on acting like it is? They're working to make courier missions even better than they were before, you should be rejoicing. Have some patience. Plz, I beg you all. -The guy tired of the whining, Krav Perhaps not supposed to be permanent, but CCP has a track record of not delivering things they promise. I expect we'll see comet mining, system-wide asteroid belts, an Amarr Emporor, and a Gallente President before they get to making courier missions again.
Miss Overlord	Posted - 2006.08.23 12:35:00 - [40] no offical response on this the insane industrialists will raise demand for tritanium which if theres enough of us might raise ISK - otherwise low combat players might switch to high sec NPCIng or mining. Will be lots of couriers around so if u need stuff around mgiht be a good time to rent out player courier missions

Vargrh Gallente Stupid People Always Need Killing	Posted - 2006.08.23 13:03:00 - [41] Someone must have realised that mass displacement of mission runners to systems with command and security agents would be a post patch issue. Having watched key systems for the effect on caldari and Gallente, its already happening. Systems that were unplayably lagged with 150 pilots are now groaning under the strain of 400+ pilots trying to run missions, and I doubt most mission runners have even relocated yet. I'm glad I only occasionally do missions, when security status allows, but for those that run missions as a substantial component of their game time, are gonna be pretty buggered by this.
Miss Overlord	Posted - 2006.08.23 13:19:00 - [42] aye yes agreed with last point - wonder how fast CCP will mve on this one. That said with the new optimisations even jita should react quicker so i guess that its a moot point - will be watching for consolidatoin of mission runners tho
Bermag Point-Zero	Posted - 2006.08.23 13:23:00 - [43] Originally by: Vargrh Someone must have realised that mass displacement of mission runners to systems with command and security agents would be a post patch issue. Having watched key systems for the effect on caldari and Gallente, its already happening. Systems that were unplayably lagged with 150 pilots are now groaning under the strain of 400+ pilots trying to run missions, and I doubt most mission runners have even relocated yet. I'm glad I only occasionally do missions, when security status allows, but for those that run missions as a substantial component of their game time, are gonna be pretty buggered by this. I don't understand why people would relocate to system with security/command agents? If courier mission agents now give out kill missions then they can be used for running kill missions instead so the effect should rather be that some underused agents might become more used instead.
Estan Drake	Posted - 2006.08.23 17:06:00 - [44] indeed, I see characters going away from security and internal security for combat missions and instead flocking to the systems whith high quality manufacture/production agents that were lightly used before. It is not a bad thing at all for kill mission runners. But give it a few days and see if we get some sort of official response. Things that were not intended seem to get fixed fairly quickly, i'm just concerned about courier agents because they were listed in the patch notes and might be working as intended.
Michael Snark Gallente	Posted - 2006.08.23 17:40:00 - [45] Almost excellent! I'm an industrial player and what i'm supposed to do now? Go kill myself onto lvl4 kill mission? Nice, pretty nice... Okay, if my corp will be at war will be in need of every gun they can i will join (PvP not a kill-mission btw). But I DON'T WANNA BE FORCED INTO A FIGHT BY OFFICIAL PATCH! Bring those courier mission back CCP!
Alejandro Zapata Minmatar PAK	Posted - 2006.08.23 20:31:00 - [46] Originally by: Vargrh Someone must have realised that mass displacement of mission runners to systems with command and security agents would be a post patch issue. Having watched key systems for the effect on caldari and Gallente, its already happening. Systems that were unplayably lagged with 150 pilots are now groaning under the strain of 400+ pilots trying to run missions, and I doubt most mission runners have even relocated yet. I'm glad I only occasionally do missions, when security status allows, but for those that run missions as a substantial component of their game time, are gonna be pretty buggered by this. This shouldn't increase the number of players in the mentioned systems, it should actually decrease it. I imagine that most of the players clogging these systems are doing kill missions. Now they will have more options for high quality Kill agents. The system I am in just went from 1 Quality 20 Kill agent, to 3. Works for me, but I dont' think it is right that so many people are going to be forced (hopefully only temporarily)out of their chosen trade.
herot Icarus Ascendant	Posted - 2006.08.23 20:42:00 - [47] Not all couriers have been removed however: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=383055
Pett Brenson Gallente Gallente Venture Inc	Posted - 2006.08.23 23:08:00 - [48] Edited by: Pett Brenson on 23/08/2006 23:15:32 Here we go again. It seems that with each major content oriented patch CCP moves the game closer to being a pure shooter and further minimizes rather than expands the non-combat content. This is a shame because shooters are a dime a dozen. Before I get a lot of people jumping on me let me note that I have been playing since launch (2003) so I am speaking from a long term and long suffering position with significant financial commitment. I have always respected others right to choose and champion the PvP/combat style of play even when it touched on my game play. When seen from the long term, the ship losses, though annoying where nothing more than the cost of doing business and a temporary annoyance. The system/gate campers couldn't be on 24/7 nor have they lasted very long, quickly getting bored and moving on to the latest and greatest hack and slash phenom. But this is the first time that CCP has taken away a major form of non-combat play. I created my character originally to be a diplomat/scientist, a style of play that has NEVER (other that in the RP chat channels) been a viable play style, though it has long been promised. In line with that the industrial/production/research type has been limited by the unavailability of research space, the long promised and never delivered ability to reverse engineer advanced technology, and the completely bolluxed R&D system. What good is a Tech2 BPO, assuming you get awarded one in a field that they haven't all been given out, when you can't get access to lab space to improve it's production value or even copy it. Okay there is mining to fall back on but with NO time frame this is not a very appealing alternative. Besides to be financially viable you have to go into those systems haunted by the trigger happy, who think it's "fun" to shoot someone who isn't shooting back, because you couldn't care less whether you were the uber killer or not. Then there is the faction factor. If you don't fly missions with an agent your standing with that agent/corporation deteriorates as does your standing if you refuse a mission. Has CCP frozen that? My guess is that they "forgot" about that after all they let the predominately courier type agents give out kill missions. Who cares whether you can or care to fly those missions or not. I have enjoyed this game for some time, but this could be the straw that breaks the camel's back. I'll wait a awhile to see what develops but not for long. Enough is enough. There are no limitions for the creative mind. What others see as limits are nothing but special tools in their hands.
Ashareth Caldari Disturbed Hoggs	Posted - 2006.08.23 23:55:00 - [49] From what i've read it's related to the new codebranch(Dragon) and the fact that most courier missions are not compatible with it. It's not a great thing(it's lousy if you ask me, even if i don't do courier missions....), but it's understable. They should come back soon(or not so soon:D). Too bad they didn't had time to make them compatible before patching.... ------------------------------------------------ "Heaven is for the Dead Hell is for the Living" Harrisson *Flowerchild* AndromFde
Eudyptes sclateri	Posted - 2006.08.24 00:27:00 - [50] Originally by: Suicidal Lemming ... oh, does skill training work if your account is inactive? I wonder... From what I understand, you can finish a skill on an inactive account. Haven't tried it though.

Roddic Gallente The Blood Roses	Posted - 2006.08.24 03:12:00 - [51] did any of you guys play 'star wars galaxies', before they put in the patch that killed it.... but according to them it was needed.... ye right. guess what, it looks like CCP has hired the same toss pot that made that stupid decision. Will this patch kill eve...i doubt it, but i find it highly unfair that all other missions other than fighting ones have been nerfed. remove them(missions) all to keep things fair, and reimburse all players 1 months subscription. then once the mission part of things is sorted out, put them all(the updated ones) back in at the same time. looks like im going to have to go back to mining :/
Valator Uel Caldari Pax Minor Asylum Confederation of Independent Corporations	Posted - 2006.08.24 05:34:00 - [52] or lol, how about this: use the 1-2 weeks it'll take to get courier missions back (according to Myphisto) to iron out bugs and then release the patch with a couple of courier missions... see, you kill two birds with one stone: courier mission runners are happy and damn obvious bugs (like overview settings, mission texts <= a single mission test would have found that one out) would have been fixed before releasing the patch. CCP stop trying to run faster than you can, you'll just end up tripping over your own feet. But then again I doubt CCP ever read threads like this, otherwse there'd be more than just "Courier missions will be replaced in the near future" in the dev blog and Known Issues.
Loraen	Posted - 2006.08.24 08:59:00 - [53] Originally by: Miss Overlord no offical response on this the insane industrialists will raise demand for tritanium which if theres enough of us might raise ISK - otherwise low combat players might switch to high sec NPCIng or mining. Will be lots of couriers around so if u need stuff around mgiht be a good time to rent out player courier missions Hmm? Raised demand for tritanium? I.I. is a fetch mission, not trade. You're supplied with the cargo by the agent. If you want to waste your standings, you can accept mission and then quit it, you'll get 2561179 units of trit for 2M (collateral). As an update, agent mission rolls are definitely weighted. After declining a couple more kill missions from my "main" agent (L4 Manufacturing) I'm churning away on courier missions again. I've done Insane Industrialists 8 times in a row. The mission has a decent time/reward ratio but I'm actually looking at doing some ratting or complex-running to break the boredom.
Rufus Kex Genco	Posted - 2006.08.24 11:13:00 - [54] Originally by: Bermag I don't understand why people would relocate to system with security/command agents? If courier mission agents now give out kill missions then they can be used for running kill missions instead so the effect should rather be that some underused agents might become more used instead. I suppose if people wanna do kill missions, it would suck if they were stuck with an industrial agent when the old/new missions are re/introduced. People don't wanna give up on their amassed LP on the agent. My guess. I agree with most of the posts here, that it's totally stupid to remove the haul missions. Exactly how much more exciting will the new hauling missions be anyway?
incheon	Posted - 2006.08.24 22:14:00 - [55] When does 'Vangaurd:Saga of Heroes" come out? : p
Macdorek Hackshield	Posted - 2006.08.24 23:44:00 - [56] I think removal of what can be coinsidered a key part of the game without a replacement is a bunch of,,, well not nice. One my players, that is all he ever done is courier missions. He does that for research agent factions. Ooo guess you don't care that also research agents won't give missions now so how the lotto for BPO gonna work now? I do not care about 0.0 space. I do not care about PvP. I do missions and let my corp bros deal with the rest. At this point I am not even bothering to log into game other then skills. Maybe your bean counters looking at who does what in game may not see any impact on just removing missions but I sure did. I trust you (CCP) will give back a part of the game that is for those who don't have the time or desire to get into mega wars.
Jager Steigman	Posted - 2006.08.25 04:40:00 - [57] Hmmm, it seems to me that they are not removing anything, just replacing it with yet to be developed content (and yeah the wait is mildly inconveniencing me). The big question I have is what will that be? How can you make courier missions more interesting? This is an exciting prospect from my point of view, as they were quite repetitive and boring (but ever so useful for getting LP's). Does anyone know what is proposed to replace the old courier missions? I think it would be interesting to have courier missions where the payload is small but NPC combat is required to acheive the delivery (fight your way to the stargate sort of style)? It seems tricky to me to try to make something like this, as people who do courier exclusively may not have the skills, but any variation would be appreciated. Any good ideas out there?
Lemoning Lemming	Posted - 2006.08.25 11:42:00 - [58] Edited by: Lemoning Lemming on 25/08/2006 11:42:52 Still begs the question, if you are going to remove something that is central to people's gameplay and not replace for several weeks, if not longer, what are those people supposed to do in the mean time ? If you had taken ECM out of the game for a few weeks to give it an overhaul would that have been ok also ? Or are you saying people who haul don't matter ? Because that's what this action says to me. Little or no prior notification and no alternate to tide people over until you eventually substitute what you have abruptly removed. Just does not seem acceptable in my opinion.
EVILSATAN Gallente Scotland Inc	Posted - 2006.08.25 21:25:00 - [59] Sounds to me like CCP are thinking "who does courier missions anyway?" totally unacceptable nerfing an entire career in EVE.
Miss Overlord Gallente Garoun Investment Bank	Posted - 2006.08.26 04:10:00 - [60] well i think the uproar has caught them off guard a lot of PVPers use em for semi afk or implant offers and something to do when camped in station. For those of us using them in low sec - the pirates have lost a lot of easy hauler kills now as we have shifted to kill missions (so indirectly this has affected them) heck if i am moving 2 mil trit and get named by a pirate his hauler alt has just found 2 mil trit at my expense (which is inconvient for me and good for him) now remove that outta game. Ok ive done piracy with another toon before so know both sides of coin - looking from outside it wil affect a lot more of the game - so CCP amke it a priority even bring back the old ones some players like it. Add some fancy new ones to make it exciting but leave the old ones in under new code as well not everyone wants uber complex PR type BS.



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