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Takseen
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
36
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Posted - 2011.11.27 13:14:00 -
[1] - Quote
Daedalus Arcova wrote:
Highsec incursions need a massive nerf, either to put their ISK/hr on par or below L4 highsec missions, or to make them truly dynamic (and therefore far less easy to farm). It's unlikely to happen though, as that might lead to fewer players using a feature that CCP dedicated an entire expansion to.
You seem like a smart guy, so I'm gonna assume you just overlooked the stupidity of having a *group* activity be on par or below a *solo* activity in terms of ISK/hr. |
Takseen
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
36
|
Posted - 2011.11.27 13:26:00 -
[2] - Quote
Zagdul wrote:
One thing I never understood was how Concord will come save your asses when a pirate ganks you in empire, but they won't shoot Shansha. IMO, Incursions need to be moved to low sec or Concord needs to take a break when they're in town. However, I'm not gonna lose any sleep if they stay in High Sec.
Same thing could be said for the existence of ANY pirate NPCs in highsec. Concord just doesn't make sense storywise. They're a game mechanic alternative to just not being able to shoot players at highsec. And I think most people would agree Concord are the less annoying option there.
Here's something I've been wondering about though. Why don't opponents of these "ISK fountains" do more to shut them down, or make life harder for the Incursion runners. Just off the top of my head, you could
-kill the mothership upon spawning to shut down the Incursion early
-suicide jam their logistics at a crucial moment
-outdpsing their fleet in a site and stealing the payout
Anyone not personally capable of these feats could always pay others to do it.
I mean its not like the Incursion runners would be hard to find, there's only a few systems with Vanguard sites up at any given time.
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Takseen
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
36
|
Posted - 2011.11.27 13:32:00 -
[3] - Quote
Zagdul wrote:Takseen wrote:Daedalus Arcova wrote:
Highsec incursions need a massive nerf, either to put their ISK/hr on par or below L4 highsec missions, or to make them truly dynamic (and therefore far less easy to farm). It's unlikely to happen though, as that might lead to fewer players using a feature that CCP dedicated an entire expansion to.
You seem like a smart guy, so I'm gonna assume you just overlooked the stupidity of having a *group* activity be on par or below a *solo* activity in terms of ISK/hr. It's the whole risk vs. reward thing that people are generally upset about. The fact that you can rat in complete safety in empire and make just as much isk per hour hitting your wallet plus loyalty points and salvage with less logistics and risk involved. EVE has always been designed where risk = reward. As it stands, empire is a safer and better source of income over null for a grunt. They really have no benefit for living in space they fight to hold. EDIT: However this will change a bit when alliances like mine add perks like 0% tax for PI.
Oh I agree, nullsec should pay better than empire to compensate for the risk and inconveniene. But the guy I quoted wanted incursions "on par or below L4 highsec missions", and that's just stupid. Its important to reward the people who actually take the effort to group up with more income/hr. Plus Incursions are probably harder, or atleast I can't imagine them being any easier than level 4 missions.
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Takseen
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
36
|
Posted - 2011.11.27 13:36:00 -
[4] - Quote
Zagdul wrote:
I can't answer for other alliances however for mine it's too much effort. The people who are mostly against the faucets in empire are busy running an empire of their own in null sec and don't have the time to invest the effort in griefing them.
I do know that many null sec alliances seek out and run incursions. In my coalition it's very common to have a standing fleet going 23.5/7 for them.
EDIT: From an RP stance, I'd think Sansha in high security space should spawn some kind of retaliation from faction police and concord. If not, than they should be completely neutered to the point where they don't cover the people running them. Similar to low sec.
The fluff reason is that Concord and empire navies are protecting the planetary populations from the Sansha abduction squads, so they're not available to go on the offensive. And all this happens "off-camera" so to speak.
It mightn't be a bad idea to give l+Św and null incursions a buff to the payouts and a nerf to the influence bar, to reflect the fact that there's fewer people available to push it to 0% and spawn the boss.
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Takseen
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
36
|
Posted - 2011.11.27 13:51:00 -
[5] - Quote
Tore Vest wrote:Im pretty shure most of you nullbears have an alt running highsec incursions 
Yes, and if they are then that *doesn't make sense* from a game design perspective. If these people have all this space they're quite literally paying for, why are they drawn back to highsec? The risk/reward balance must be off somewhere.
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Takseen
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
36
|
Posted - 2011.11.27 17:41:00 -
[6] - Quote
Kaivar Lancer wrote:Mirima Thurander wrote:its 1.2+ bill a day if you put in a 9 hour day and have a good fleet run
let me say this, that's before you convert LPs to isk, Wow, that's really impressive. You gotta feel sorry for those miners earning a paltry 5m per hour. A miner has to play 200 hours just to earn that much. Really CCP just delete half the occupations on EVE. They are completely unviable now since they have no chance of earning enough to buy a Plex. Sandbox my a$$... 
A 9 hour day of pure PvE would be pretty draining though. Its certainly far far more demanding then mining, so of course its going to pay better.
Now I'd love to see some more depth and thus more reward for mining. But every time a suggestion thread gets started up, the "hey I like mining cos its braindead and I don't have to pay attention" players show up.
Basically when miners need to band together in groups of 10, with a diverse mix of ship types and skill allocations, and stay moderately focused on their tasks and react to changing circumstances, they can think about earning the same kind of money.
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Takseen
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
36
|
Posted - 2011.11.27 18:04:00 -
[7] - Quote
I've yet to come across any PvE that *doesn't* get boring after a few months of running it. Your best bet would be to hope for a new variant on the existing Incursions in the summer expansion. Presumably by bringing in a new pirate faction but using the same basic model.
They could also balance the bigger site rewards so you'd get to see them more often. |
Takseen
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
36
|
Posted - 2011.11.27 20:03:00 -
[8] - Quote
grazer gin wrote:sooo many nullsec carebears whining and winging about this but forgetting ther precious sanctums,faction and officer spawns in BLUE space with free intel in local and intel channels for the next 20 systems 110% reward for 0% risk and yet they still winge about hsec
Hello, I'm from the Internet Police.
Due to your reckless and thoughtless use of numbers with a % after them, you are hereby restricted from using them in the future.
That is all. |
Takseen
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
36
|
Posted - 2011.11.27 20:17:00 -
[9] - Quote
Lord Zeel wrote:
Encouraging people into nullsec? Quit camping the effin pipes!
And scamming people who try to join nullsec corps.
And killing off famous NRDS alliances.
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Takseen
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
41
|
Posted - 2011.11.28 20:07:00 -
[10] - Quote
LacLongQuan wrote:
the same case for sleeper but I see no wh dweller complain about it and they dont even consider it's risk??
the pay out in wh after split isnt much greater than incursion
What definition of risk are you using then? Is the chance of your ship exploding not a risk just because its from an NPC and not a player?
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Takseen
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
41
|
Posted - 2011.11.28 20:36:00 -
[11] - Quote
Soi Mala wrote:
Correct. When you know exactly what is in a site and how to avoid triggers, and are backed up by a handful of logistics, fighting predicable enemies, then the risk of your ship exploding is pretty damn low unless you're a moron.
Ah right. So when people say highsec Incursions have "zero risk", they actually mean "low risk assuming a decently knowledgeable and competent group of players". |
Takseen
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
41
|
Posted - 2011.11.29 08:03:00 -
[12] - Quote
Onictus wrote:
Its not my fault
A) You don't know any FC's
B) Don't have a corp that does (for reference mine has 3 that can run vans, and there aren't many of us)
c) Can't get 10 people together that can tag and remember to kill the narij, scheaml, and tama usually more or less in that
order
Either way I can't be arsed to do your homework for you AND find you a fit. o/
And its those barriers to entry that justify the higher earnings for Incursion running. Plus there's a hard cap on how much they can pay out, based on the number of sites. If everyone in highsec suddenly took up the incursioning business, profits would dry up pretty quick. |
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