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Apocs new blasterthorn?

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Flaming sambuka IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2006.08.31 19:47:00 - [1] I was just dualing with my mate, mega v apoc, he has a range of 100+km mine is 15-km, he was hitting for 500damage with tachs, was it a glitch lol, i thought apocs wernt uber?
Verus Potestas Caldari Fiat Mort	Posted - 2006.08.31 19:50:00 - [2] You engaged an apoc 100km away in a blasterthron? Also, Amarr aren't anywhere near as broken as many people like to whine (just as caldari aren't as uber as many people without much clue repeatedly post, without much in the way of justification). Tachyon sniping is one of their great strengths.
Flaming sambuka IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2006.08.31 19:52:00 - [3] no thats the thing, he is setup for 100+km sniping with tachyons,i am in a blasterthorn with optimal of 3,600m, he can hit for 500dmg at 0km, wtf, i swear its a glitch.
dan santhums	Posted - 2006.08.31 19:57:00 - [4] were you sat still?
Draugz Caldari	Posted - 2006.08.31 19:58:00 - [5] If both of you we're at 0 velocity and the Apoc presumeably had Tracking enchancing devices he could have gotten some lucky hitts no? Please resize image to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 bytes, ty - Cortes
Dethis Caldari Eve University	Posted - 2006.08.31 19:59:00 - [6] Edited by: Dethis on 31/08/2006 19:59:36 Edited by: Dethis on 31/08/2006 19:58:53 Originally by: Flaming sambuka no thats the thing, he is setup for 100+km sniping with tachyons,i am in a blasterthorn with optimal of 3,600m, he can hit for 500dmg at 0km, wtf, i swear its a glitch. Didnt you hear lasers suck he must not have got the memo puts on flame suit and watches -------- Kill em all and let god sort em out
Sir Erighan	Posted - 2006.08.31 20:00:00 - [7] Turrets have no damage penalty if they attack within their optimal range. It just means they have a harder time tracking targets. Depending how fast the target is moving, tracking speed of gun, and the distance between each ship will determine the damage. Were you standing still? At least that's how I thought it worked...?
Ather Ialeas Amarr	Posted - 2006.08.31 20:09:00 - [8] The Amarr battleships are fine, the issues Amarr are having as a race effect just about everything else but bs:s and some T2 ships. I repeat, the Amarr battleships are fine. Sheesh.
Verus Potestas Caldari Fiat Mort	Posted - 2006.08.31 20:11:00 - [9] Edited by: Verus Potestas on 31/08/2006 20:10:44 Originally by: Sir Erighan Turrets have no damage penalty if they attack within their optimal range. It just means they have a harder time tracking targets. Depending how fast the target is moving, tracking speed of gun, and the distance between each ship will determine the damage. Were you standing still? At least that's how I thought it worked...? And tachyons shouldn't hit a barn at <5km if it's moving more than 20m/s.
Heartbreak Harriet	Posted - 2006.08.31 20:17:00 - [10] I think he's just upset that the Apoc is doing as much damage per shot as he is, not that it's hitting him. Just because a gun has long range and lower damage per second doesn't mean that it's going to have lower damage per shot, too. Considering that your buddy was using tachs, it's not that suprising that he'd be hitting you for loads of damage every shot. Have a look: Tachyon Beam Laser I: 4.5 damage modifier Neutron Blaster I: 3.5 damage modifier Tachyons are second only to 1400mm howitzers when it comes to damage per shot, it shouldn't come as much of a surprise that he has high damage per shot. However, the rate of fire on tachs is way slower than it is on blasters. That's where blasters get the edge. That, and it's not exactly a brilliant idea for a blasterthron to engage at 100km.

korrey Level Five	Posted - 2006.08.31 20:22:00 - [11] And to clear up one thing we 'Amarr Whiners' dont think every ship sucks. Ok granted some do but not the rest of us. And the 'issue' we have with the apoc isnt that its 'broken' per se...but it cant do its job as well as other BS's. So If the Apoc cant tank as well as another ship that can also dish out more damage...wouldnt you say something is wrong? The geddon can almost tank better and its a gank ship . -Level Five
LWMaverick	Posted - 2006.08.31 20:29:00 - [12] Does this get any more silly? <3
Verus Potestas Caldari Fiat Mort	Posted - 2006.08.31 20:33:00 - [13] Edited by: Verus Potestas on 31/08/2006 20:33:21 To be honest, no-one needs to argue against amarr boosts while this guy is arguing for them. No counterargument could outclass his own ability to fudge pointless, unrelated, trivial or just plain inaccurate maths onto conjecture and thus defeat his own arguments with more skill and effect than anyone else could manage.
Dethis Caldari Eve University	Posted - 2006.08.31 20:34:00 - [14] Originally by: Verus Potestas Edited by: Verus Potestas on 31/08/2006 20:33:21 To be honest, no-one needs to argue against amarr boosts while this guy is arguing for them. No counterargument could outclass his own ability to fudge pointless, unrelated, trivial or just plain inaccurate maths onto conjecture and thus defeat his own arguments with more skill and effect than anyone else could manage. The flavor of the month is to whine about amarr and throw in the random theoretical spreadsheet of dps then whine some more -------- Kill em all and let god sort em out
Verus Potestas Caldari Fiat Mort	Posted - 2006.08.31 20:42:00 - [15] Seriously, just read his balance and rolls [sic] thread. It does for braincells what the M25 does for hedgehogs.
Flaming sambuka IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2006.08.31 20:49:00 - [16] he still hits me at 0km for same if not better damage than at 5km, i tried orbiting him at 3km and he still hits me even when his optimal is 100km+, maybe he has officer mods he aint telline me bout , but seriously, this is insane, apocs shud be rubbish!!!
Verus Potestas Caldari Fiat Mort	Posted - 2006.08.31 20:50:00 - [17] If he hits you well with tachs with a reasonable transversal at <5km, something is broken.
Maralis Torrel Gallente MisFunk Inc.	Posted - 2006.08.31 20:54:00 - [18] Originally by: Flaming sambuka he still hits me at 0km for same if not better damage than at 5km, i tried orbiting him at 3km and he still hits me even when his optimal is 100km+, maybe he has officer mods he aint telline me bout , but seriously, this is insane, apocs shud be rubbish!!! The way you are explaining this leads me to believe you don't understand optimal range. If his optimal is 100km, then his optimal range is from 0, to 100km. It just means he has more trouble hitting moving targets as they get closer. He might have tracking mods, or maybe he is webbing you and has tracking? target painter? etc etc... Are you using a MWD and thus increasing your signature? There is a lot to factor in here that everyone seems to be leaving out.
Flaming sambuka IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2006.08.31 20:54:00 - [19] Originally by: Verus Potestas If he hits you well with tachs with a reasonable transversal at <5km, something is broken. I knew it!, hax!!!!
Sadayiel Caldari Tropical Killer Bananas	Posted - 2006.08.31 20:57:00 - [20] Edited by: Sadayiel on 31/08/2006 21:04:48 Rofl most of ppl just think optimal is everything. Okay apoc fit tachions long range right?, you blaster short range, you aproach under 5km, but hey you fly a friggin BS with same signature as the tachions, and even when you orbit around him your track speed it's still a joke you are just so big and slow to get a big track speed to make him miss, also you need to still track him to hit. Your mate just not need an awesome track to hit, your ship it's still to big to miss it as simply as that. About the ammar whine well it's rubbish all the apoc pilots i know use a dual repper tank with 2x heavy nos and lasers that deal an equal dmg to my ions blaster setup, with the difference they can hit me from 60km - 50km while i need to stay near 10km to start the fight. And there is where they get the Advantage of extra dmg done to the enemy. now people whine because ammar only can do thermal and Em dmg, Oh crap They must got envy from gallents kin and thermal dmg? (plz do not ignore gallent if only have 2x dmg types it's wrong) Ammar deal enough dmg and can handle enough dmg, everytime you face an apoc there is only a way to win, break his tank or burn his cap, but of course a 7500 cap BS with 2x heavy nos and 2x large repper can't do his job properly... -------------------Sig----------------------- WE ARE MERCS, Contact QUADIX LEIME OR ALEXIE STUKOV for further info.

Flaming sambuka IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2006.08.31 20:59:00 - [21] Originally by: Maralis Torrel Originally by: Flaming sambuka he still hits me at 0km for same if not better damage than at 5km, i tried orbiting him at 3km and he still hits me even when his optimal is 100km+, maybe he has officer mods he aint telline me bout , but seriously, this is insane, apocs shud be rubbish!!! The way you are explaining this leads me to believe you don't understand optimal range. If his optimal is 100km, then his optimal range is from 0, to 100km. It just means he has more trouble hitting moving targets as they get closer. He might have tracking mods, or maybe he is webbing you and has tracking? target painter? etc etc... Are you using a MWD and thus increasing your signature? There is a lot to factor in here that everyone seems to be leaving out. ah, i think your right. so optimal range is just were the gun has the best chance on hitting the enemy based on his tracking, if something is under his optimal range then he can still be hit for the same damage if he was at his optimal range so long as he can still be tracked? it would explain how he was hitting me at 0km when i wasnt moving, i just thought that if your range is like 200km then theres no way your gonna be hitting anything at say 20km
Verus Potestas Caldari Fiat Mort	Posted - 2006.08.31 20:59:00 - [22] Originally by: Flaming sambuka Originally by: Verus Potestas If he hits you well with tachs with a reasonable transversal at <5km, something is broken. I knew it!, hax!!!! That is hits you well, reliably. If it goes: miss miss miss miss miss miss miss HIT FOR 500 miss miss miss miss or something, that isn't a big issue
Flaming sambuka IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2006.08.31 21:01:00 - [23] Originally by: Verus Potestas Originally by: Flaming sambuka Originally by: Verus Potestas If he hits you well with tachs with a reasonable transversal at <5km, something is broken. I knew it!, hax!!!! That is hits you well, reliably. If it goes: miss miss miss miss miss miss miss HIT FOR 500 miss miss miss miss or something, that isn't a big issue btw it was more like HIT FOR 100 HIT FOR 400 HIT FOR 300 HIT FOR 600 HIT FOR 300 HIT FOR 100 HIT FOR 200
Verus Potestas Caldari Fiat Mort	Posted - 2006.08.31 21:02:00 - [24] Yeah, it's all about tracking. Thing is, shooting a target with the same transversal at 3km, you have to track about 100x faster than at 100km. On the other hand, Ion Blasters have about 4x the tracking of Tachyons. Not amazingly different (at least compared to the 100x), but they should hit much, MUCH more than tachs at close ranges.
Maralis Torrel Gallente MisFunk Inc.	Posted - 2006.08.31 21:02:00 - [25] Originally by: Flaming sambuka Originally by: Maralis Torrel Originally by: Flaming sambuka he still hits me at 0km for same if not better damage than at 5km, i tried orbiting him at 3km and he still hits me even when his optimal is 100km+, maybe he has officer mods he aint telline me bout , but seriously, this is insane, apocs shud be rubbish!!! The way you are explaining this leads me to believe you don't understand optimal range. If his optimal is 100km, then his optimal range is from 0, to 100km. It just means he has more trouble hitting moving targets as they get closer. He might have tracking mods, or maybe he is webbing you and has tracking? target painter? etc etc... Are you using a MWD and thus increasing your signature? There is a lot to factor in here that everyone seems to be leaving out. ah, i think your right. so optimal range is just were the gun has the best chance on hitting the enemy based on his tracking, if something is under his optimal range then he can still be hit for the same damage if he was at his optimal range so long as he can still be tracked? it would explain how he was hitting me at 0km when i wasnt moving, i just thought that if your range is like 200km then theres no way your gonna be hitting anything at say 20km You'd be correct.
Wulfgard Minmatar The Older Gamers Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.08.31 21:05:00 - [26] To summarize this insightful thread: Apoc need a serious NERF! This ship has the most dps of all tiers 2 BS This ship has the most flexible dmg types This ship has the most med slots making it the king of pvp BS. Tachyons hit all the time regardless of range for full dmg Armor tank is the best all around for pvp! Raven need a BUFF! This ship has the least dps of all tiers 2 BS This ship can only do 1 type of dmg This ship doesn't have enough med slots to be viable in pvp (specially the Scorp) This ship often miss his target unless in optimal and at low transversal Shield tank suxx!
Gariuys Evil Strangers Inc.	Posted - 2006.08.31 21:57:00 - [27] Originally by: LWMaverick Does this get any more silly? Amarrians saying the apoc doesn't suck, when it's clearly the worst damage dealing amarr ship around, which is also in the class where the 2x EANM DCU tanks are most common... nope doesn't get more silly then that really.
Ikvar Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2006.08.31 22:14:00 - [28] Was that hit on your unhardened shield by any chance?
Dethis Caldari Eve University	Posted - 2006.08.31 22:16:00 - [29] Edited by: Dethis on 31/08/2006 22:17:01 Originally by: Wulfgard To summarize this insightful thread: Apoc need a serious NERF! This ship has the most dps of all tiers 2 BS This ship has the most flexible dmg types This ship has the most med slots making it the king of pvp BS. Tachyons hit all the time regardless of range for full dmg Armor tank is the best all around for pvp! Raven need a BUFF! This ship has the least dps of all tiers 2 BS This ship can only do 1 type of dmg This ship doesn't have enough med slots to be viable in pvp (specially the Scorp) This ship often miss his target unless in optimal and at low transversal Shield tank suxx! I actually think this thread is more making fun of the OMG BUFF AMARR WE CANT EVEN KILL AN IB15 !!!oneoneeleventyone threads that popl up all the damn time. And mainly because i work soon so need feeding the trolls makes my web browsing at work o so much more fun :) -------- Kill em all and let god sort em out
webkert Amarr Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2006.08.31 22:43:00 - [30] Originally by: Sadayiel Edited by: Sadayiel on 31/08/2006 21:04:48 Rofl most of ppl just think optimal is everything. Okay apoc fit tachions long range right?, you blaster short range, you aproach under 5km, but hey you fly a friggin BS with same signature as the tachions, and even when you orbit around him your track speed it's still a joke you are just so big and slow to get a big track speed to make him miss, also you need to still track him to hit. Your mate just not need an awesome track to hit, your ship it's still to big to miss it as simply as that. About the ammar whine well it's rubbish all the apoc pilots i know use a dual repper tank with 2x heavy nos and lasers that deal an equal dmg to my ions blaster setup, with the difference they can hit me from 60km - 50km while i need to stay near 10km to start the fight. And there is where they get the Advantage of extra dmg done to the enemy. now people whine because ammar only can do thermal and Em dmg, Oh crap They must got envy from gallents kin and thermal dmg? (plz do not ignore gallent if only have 2x dmg types it's wrong) Ammar deal enough dmg and can handle enough dmg, everytime you face an apoc there is only a way to win, break his tank or burn his cap, but of course a 7500 cap BS with 2x heavy nos and 2x large repper can't do his job properly... Your ion mega setup must be pretty damn horrible if you get outdamaged by and apoc using 6 guns. Seven ions on a mega do about 38ish% more dps then an apoc using 8 dual heavy pulse, and you can use heavy drones in your mega.



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