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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Toriatrix The Blackwater Brigade	Posted - 2006.09.18 04:00:00 - [1] Call the current POS's for Tech 1 POS's and introduce Tech 2 POS'es.. That said i'll explain my views. I commented on Manus Ghostface's Thread regarding other nice ideas that would imporove the game here. Now T2 POS's.. ?? Lets say that today's POS's fulfill a multipurpose (like they do today). They are safe havens, thay are industrial and they are DeathStars. :) Lets also say they give you sovereignity points for their size. 1point for small, 2 for medium and 3 for a large one. So in order to get rid of those lets say that the Tech 2 POS'es give you more points and there are 3 diffrent (or more) types and with a difference in cost. Admiral IceBlock have a GREAT idea here. Lets devide the use for POS'es: -Industrial POS give you 1 sovereignity point, it can mine, build, research ect. and it can take a real beating for instance 2 times the hitpoints the large T1 POS got today. But it can only deal with lone BS's and other small ships on it's own, and maybe make it conquerable after the system sovereignity is lost. So: It's poorly armed with heavy shields and it's a asset to be taked not destroyed in most cases. -Logistics POS give you 2 sovereignity points, it can store ships and TONS of loot and equipment and you can repair stuff and refitt. (Conquerable or not? dunno.) :D It's moderaly armed and moderatly shilded. -Battle POS give you 5 (or whatever CCP thinks is fair) sovereignity points, it can dish out damage and take hell of a beating, and it should cost you lots to maintain, and buy. No other function, no refitting and no industrial, it's a pure System Holder (Not conquerable). It's got heavy guns and heavy shields + a few other combat bonuses maybe for friendly gangs?). Lets make the Dread/Carrier Fleets really fight for this one. So there you have it. A new use for POS'es without deleting the old. /me prepares to be spammed with the flaws i can't see atm -Toriatrix The Blackwater Brigade.
Toriatrix The Blackwater Brigade	Posted - 2006.09.19 19:23:00 - [2] Sorry for the long reply but read on and look at what we have and what we need in 0.0 to make our POS'es work like they should. Originally by: Agent Kenshin What needs to be done is to hard cap the number of POS that claim sovereignty at a set number with the current sovereignty rules. To hard cap the number of POS's that controll sov of the system is not the way to go imo. One should consider the real assets in a system and let the POS'es interact and in a way controll the sov this way. Candidates for assets are: Jumpgates, asterod-/ice-belts, complexes, planets/moons, stations/outposts and eventually gas clouds and comets. But the most important assets are stations and complexes. If a POS is to interact and/or control these it should be explained by some logic and one should encourage the players to protect the assets by putting up POS'es and thus improving their "Empire". As far as i see it EVE's corporations and alliances is going to build their own "empires" more or less. So the POS'es should have form and function, they do to some extent atm but not enough imo. So if one are to overhaul the POS system one needs to look at the reason for it and do it properly and logicaly. Radical Example: It dont help me to put up ten Norwegian flags in Alabama USA and claim it for Norway. I need to controll the land and it's resources to be able to claim Alabama for Norway, I need to be able to protect my assets and population. I need to be able to build a fortress to keep my stuff safe. Look at the means to take my stuff away. USA would roll over my little flags (POS's) with tanks and bomb me to pieces if they had botherd to move them there and spend the money. So in EVE the Dreads are litteraly tanks. They cost to operate, and so they should. I would say that todays fortreses (POS'es) are not strong enough, and not usefull enough to make your Empire last. In Short: Custom module based POS'es and more uses for the POS'es is in order. Tech 2 POS'es next in line after Kali. So the threads about POS haulover and POSs: Flogging the Dead Horse should contain most of the means to make all of the above happend. -Toriatrix The Blackwater Brigade. Support POS Overhaul - Read it NOW!
Toriatrix The Blackwater Brigade	Posted - 2006.09.20 11:23:00 - [3] Originally by: Agent Kenshin ... Its just one of the many problems because the current mechanics state the more POS the better but the servers go the less POS the better. Whether or not its completely accurate depends on how well the POS were coded but the more POS the more things the server has to caculate. So if the new POS systems are made scaleable and more versatile you would infact need less POS'es.. Depending on what solution you go for. The inital idea was to have diffrent POS types but as far as i see it should be enough to give players the option to choose diffrent modules. And make "Battle-POS'es" along with "Industrial-POS'es".. afterall it's a starbase and there should not be a "rule" to what modules go well together. Logic would be to have you decide what modules (guns/miners/powercores/CPU's/scanners/logistics) you want on your POS. Really there should be no limmit to how large you could make them. Reason for that: there are no limmit to how large a fleet can be. So why limmit one and not the other? IMO POS'es should be more skill heavy (when larger) than today (as with Dreads, and motherships). Today it's alot easyer to train for a large POS than a mothership. The POS'es my be strong enough, but they are not nearly filling their role imo. Many other areas of the game have evolved but i think the POS'es have been left behind. As for the computing calculation-requirements you could do well to take the static calculations like fuel consumption, production and all none-action/combat based calculations out of the main computers and run them on a diffrent computer with less priority. It's only the guns/shields and combat based things that need CPU priority (close to realtime) on the POS'es. -Toriatrix The Blackwater Brigade. Support POS Overhaul - Read it NOW!
Toriatrix The Blackwater Brigade	Posted - 2006.09.20 17:46:00 - [4] The current sovereignity system is a load of bull.. It dont make sense that who ever has sovereignity get reduced fuel consumption. Thats a fact. So instead make the sovereignity a trivial thing that only affects the Map, to see who has the major pressence. And if thats the only advantage of sovereignity the current system works. While the real benefit of strategical POS'es should not be how many you have, but where you have them and what they actually do or protect. So as I have said, remake the POS'es to "DO" more interesting stuff, make them modular and totally customized with no limmit to how large they can be (only skill limmits the POS size and modules). Screw sovereignity, it's only a trivial map issue imo. -Toriatrix The Blackwater Brigade. Support POS Overhaul - Read it NOW!
Toriatrix The Blackwater Brigade	Posted - 2006.09.21 01:20:00 - [5] Edited by: Toriatrix on 21/09/2006 01:21:41 Plz read the rest of the thread (yeah the current system needs adjustment to the new system, tought that was explained earlyer), if the POS where there to do MORE than function as a map holder, mining/production/reserach-base, like for instance: Station security.. or even remove the stations all together.. and make the new large T2 pos'es act as stations. Then the map would be a trivial thing.. I have ideas on how to change all of the 0.0 empires and POS stuff and make it locical but i'm not sure it's all in one post here atm.. POS'es would be the key to everything. All the resourses, all the production and mining and combat, and they would even function as stations do today.. if they are built large enough in my little fantasy future of EVE.. -Toriatrix The Blackwater Brigade. Support POS Overhaul - Read it NOW!
Toriatrix The Blackwater Brigade	Posted - 2006.09.21 17:51:00 - [6] What if the POS is attacked at 1600..? -Toriatrix The Blackwater Brigade. Support POS Overhaul - Read it NOW!
Toriatrix The Blackwater Brigade	Posted - 2006.09.22 23:06:00 - [7] Originally by: Evelgrivion Edited by: Evelgrivion on 22/09/2006 17:31:20 Ok, so lets review everyone's current complaints of POSs. 1. Deathstar POSs, while expensive, are indestructable to all but the most extended and ludicrously ISK and time and manpower intensive forces 2. POSs are spammed out the wazoo on places with moons and stations to prevent people from getting that one extra critical amount needed to seize a station 3. The warfare is incredibly lag intensive 4. All current situations and solutions only help the rich 5. No effective combat mechanism exists for anything but Dreadnought wielders for taking down another alliance's system sovereignty. Help me adjust this list for ALL SIDES grievances and we can go from there. 1. The Large POS'es are easy to take down, all you need is a few good dreads and pilots. They beat any POS setting today. 1 Large POS no matter what fitting can only stand alone against 2- possibly 3 dreads without asistance. Solution (IMO) is to re-do the POS'es (or make T2 POS'es) and make them module based with no limmit to how large and powerfull they might be. Or maybe a skill based limmit, say POS Design lvl 1-5 and Advanced POS Design 1-5 for really large super POS'es. 2. POS spamming is silly. There is no natural logic that says "IF i have 2 POS'es you cant kill my station, you need 3 to do it". IT MAKES NO SENSE IN THE WORLD PHYSICS. Solution: There should be a system that linkes 1 or more POS'es to the station if you want to keep the Station invincable. If you consider this a game instead of a space sim we probably want to have the stations invincable untill a few "buffers" like POS'es are dealt with. 3. Lag is a difficult thing to counter when you have lots of objects and ships, no matter if it's POS war or just Fleet combat. Solution: Better game engine is on the drawingboard. 4. The rich are able to spam out POS'es and build lots of dreads with good weapons, it's life. It's logical. Solution: No solution, the rich will allways have the avantage. 5. Dreads are huge they are the means to take down huge POS'es. Solution: No solution, it would be silly to let a hacker or lots of small ships to take down or incapacitate a POS. There should be realism and balance to what goes and what not. Limmits is something that i don't like. If you want limmits you should really limmit how rich alliances are allowed to get. If some alliance is to become super rich and buy all the T2 BPO's in the game, it would make the game unbalanced. That alliance can mount 100 or even 500 Dreads and take down ALL the POS'es in EVE. Because no other alliance can counter that many dreads and no POS'es can stand against it. But it's not a limmit there, so why should there be limmits to how big a POS can be? If you have a SUPER huge POS thats able to stand alone against 100 dreads. It would be nice, costly but realistic in the end. -It may be radiacal but it's how i see it. -Toriatrix The Blackwater Brigade. Support POS Overhaul - Read it NOW!
Toriatrix The Blackwater Brigade	Posted - 2006.09.23 01:52:00 - [8] Edited by: Toriatrix on 23/09/2006 01:52:46 Originally by: Maya Rkell Toriatrix, making invulnrable POS which insta-pop dreads is NOT a soloution. It dosn't matter HOW many you bring, if it can pop them unassisted. "Better game engine is on the drawingboard." For the Vista client only. I'm not suggesting an invoulnerable POS.. (read the post), i'm saying that the stations today are infact invulnrable, and it makes no sense unless you have a reason like a POS next to it giving it shields or something clever. I'm sure i read notes/devblogs/EON-mag that a new game engine is planned. And i'm sure it will come eventually. They have come as far as they want with this one, and a new engine could help Lag. Even with better graphics. As one have nothing to do with the other. And btw Maya, lighten up.. I'm sure the reason ppl are bad-mouthing you are just because they are feed-up with your negative attitude. -Toriatrix The Blackwater Brigade. Support POS Overhaul - Read it NOW!
Toriatrix The Blackwater Brigade	Posted - 2006.09.23 23:44:00 - [9] Originally by: Maya Rkell Toriatrix, yes you are. To quote you in this thread; "no limmit to how large and powerfull they might be" "a new game engine is planned" Yes, for Vista. Then whatever they can will be backported into the old client. (And no, I won't stop pointing out the flaws until they fix em. Their attitude is their problem) Evelgrivion, I'm not in an alliance, and I'M not pushing anything. It's not invoulnerable... Compare a large starbase to a large fleet of Dreads, motherships, and carriers. There is no limmit to how many you can put together in a system for an attack. Ofcourse thats theory... So what one should realize is that if you are actually putting up a super-huge-deathstar-pos it will cost you in terms of skill, isk and maintenance. So it can only become so-so big as to weather or not you make it bigger is just going to cost you more than it would benefit you. But in theory.. there should not be any limits to ho many power generators or computers you can link together with one starbase structure.. same as with guns.. (as long as you have power and CPU, AND fuel to run it all). See the Shield resistnace.. no matter how many shield hardners you slap on your ship, it's not 100% ... same as a super-huge-POS.. it will never be invincable. -Toriatrix The Blackwater Brigade. Support POS Overhaul - Read it NOW!
Toriatrix The Blackwater Brigade	Posted - 2006.09.24 17:14:00 - [10] Edited by: Toriatrix on 24/09/2006 17:14:55 Lag should be sorted out by new game engine or POS coding. Fear of lag should not be used as an argument to prevent making the game better. That is maybe an oxymoron to some of you, but i believe that the POS system will be re-done in some fasion to reduce lag (think i read a dev blog about it somewhere). So when you re-do some of the POS related code, you might aswell make some changes to how POS warfare and system sovereignity is at the moment. -Toriatrix The Blackwater Brigade. Support POS Overhaul - Read it NOW!

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