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Declaring war on NPC corps?

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Jesabell Junes Amarr Quam Singulari Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.09.17 15:30:00 - [31] and which bit of it was hearsay? http://www.freewebs.com/byrnes/sig.jpg Max dimensions for a signature are 400x120 pixels and 24,000 bytes in filesize. Please review the forum rules. -Eldo ([email protected])
Kerfira	Posted - 2006.09.17 15:32:00 - [32] Originally by: Jesabell Junes Stuff... I understand perfectly, but you still want to force players who have no interest in the combat part of the game into corp that CAN be war-dec'ed. Yes, that does make you a lame school-yard bully, beating up on people who can't/won't defend themselves. Stop preying on weak people and find someone who can put up a fight... General advice: Stop whining!
Jesabell Junes Amarr Quam Singulari Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.09.17 15:34:00 - [33] Originally by: Kerfira Originally by: Jesabell Junes Stuff... I understand perfectly, but you still want to force players who have no interest in the combat part of the game into corp that CAN be war-dec'ed. Yes, that does make you a lame school-yard bully, beating up on people who can't/won't defend themselves. Stop preying on weak people and find someone who can put up a fight... I dont want to force anybody into anything, if they dont want to, they have the choice to go where they want as advertised on the back of the game box, do not also forget it costs to war dec someone, imagine the cost of a wardec for the ishukone corporation based on their member size? every single corp in eve will not receive a war dec, FYI we have 4 active wars so findin fights isnt a problem, i just think itd be fun to jump into kisogo and have ishukone or someone spawn some NPC role playing officers to have a battle with http://www.freewebs.com/byrnes/sig.jpg Max dimensions for a signature are 400x120 pixels and 24,000 bytes in filesize. Please review the forum rules. -Eldo ([email protected])
Kerfira	Posted - 2006.09.17 15:37:00 - [34] Originally by: Jesabell Junes More stuff.... Yeah, right. You might not do it, but there are plenty of griefers in the game who will. Leave other people to play the game as they want, since EVE is not solely a PvP game (though that might surprise you). Do not try to force people to play on your terms! General advice: Stop whining!
Jesabell Junes Amarr Quam Singulari Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.09.17 15:41:00 - [35] Originally by: Kerfira Originally by: Jesabell Junes More stuff.... Yeah, right. You might not do it, but there are plenty of griefers in the game who will. Leave other people to play the game as they want, since EVE is not solely a PvP game (though that might surprise you). Do not try to force people to play on your terms! lol stop with the little snipes like (that might suprise you) im fully aware of the different sections of the game, they should not be alienated from each other it should all merge, and like i said, the cost would mean hardly anybody would do it, plus the NPC side of it would make it purely people vs npc, for the last time 1 day old noobs would not be in danger, why not change it slightly and make it so you could war dec say Ishukone Corporation if you wanted to and they can send a message out to all their members saying if you want to join the war effort click here, would that make you guys happy? then we all win, id of hated to see you lot post on the forums before empire war decs came into play http://www.freewebs.com/byrnes/sig.jpg Max dimensions for a signature are 400x120 pixels and 24,000 bytes in filesize. Please review the forum rules. -Eldo ([email protected])
Kerfira	Posted - 2006.09.17 15:48:00 - [36] Originally by: Jesabell Junes Even more stuff.. If it was voluntary for corp members to participate, then I'm all in favor There'd be no problem in that since people who didn't want to PvP could still have the choice not to. General advice: Stop whining!
Jesabell Junes Amarr Quam Singulari Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.09.17 15:52:00 - [37] yey finally, now lets make love again http://www.freewebs.com/byrnes/sig.jpg Max dimensions for a signature are 400x120 pixels and 24,000 bytes in filesize. Please review the forum rules. -Eldo ([email protected])
Galk Gallente Autumn Tactics	Posted - 2006.09.17 16:05:00 - [38] Originally by: Icarus Starkiller I agree that there should be NPC corps that can be declared upon, with all of the stipulated risks outlined by the OP. But not newbie corps, nor NPC holding corps. After a set ammount of time all new players should be shuffled to the declarable corp (3 to 4 months, for example). By this time most new players are looking to find another corp unless they're A) macro mining farmer trash B) complete and utter PvP cowards who should go play some other non-PvP game. NPC holding corps should offer a couple of months of protection, and then shuffle the player off to the declarable corp (it's unemployment, not welfare). The player would then be denied return access to the NPC corp for an equal ammount of time (if they were in the NPC corp for 30 days and then joined player corp for a week they would go directly to the declarable corp as they had 23 days before the holding corp became available to them again). And as for newbie schools... they should not be allowed to train any skill above tier 3. Thankfully ccp will Never listen to opinions such as yours. I know plenty of people in npc corps that have been playing this game for 3 odd years... non of them are macro users, non of them are people id call cowards. Id suggest you move along, eve will never be the game you wish.... Fyi... npc corps can have quite a social crowd.... thats the main apealing thing to most.. and ofc some people just like helping new guys out. Many times id wished id never left the npc corp tbh... If people like yourself wish to brand all people in the same tired boat, id suggest you step back and look at the bigger picture..... expand your mind, stop being narrow minded. ______
Cylynex	Posted - 2006.09.17 16:19:00 - [39] Is it really PVP if the person you're shooting at doesn't even shoot back or is dead so fast he didn't even know what happened? No. And thats what this thread is all about, finding another way to gank. If you want to play a pvp EVE, go do it, there's more than enough space already. Fortunately, the idea presented in this thread is so ill-conceived that nobody other than people who also want to gank in empire took it seriously.
Jesabell Junes Amarr Quam Singulari Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.09.17 16:30:00 - [40] Originally by: Cylynex Is it really PVP if the person you're shooting at doesn't even shoot back or is dead so fast he didn't even know what happened? No. And thats what this thread is all about, finding another way to gank. If you want to play a pvp EVE, go do it, there's more than enough space already. Fortunately, the idea presented in this thread is so ill-conceived that nobody other than people who also want to gank in empire took it seriously. lol, dude, god gave you eyes for a reason, the next time you read the forums try to actually read them... why not change it slightly and make it so you could war dec say Ishukone Corporation if you wanted to and they can send a message out to all their members saying if you want to join the war effort click here is what i said above, and we all got a peaceful result of it, the guy i was arguing with agreed, that is in absolubt no way listen to this bit carefully i may have to repeat myself because in 3 replies time someone will say the exact same as you "THAT IS IN NO WAY GANKING PEOPLE OR A NEW WAY TO GANK IF PEOPLE AGREE TO OPT INTO A WAR" we have said how many times now, "THEY SPAWN NPCS TO SHOOT AT" thats not ganking people... its npcs... npcs.... not people... npcs... it is partially what is coming out in Kali and a system thats had a lot of thought put into it, unlike say your forum reply http://www.freewebs.com/byrnes/sig.jpg Max dimensions for a signature are 400x120 pixels and 24,000 bytes in filesize. Please review the forum rules. -Eldo ([email protected])
Gamer4liff Caldari Metalworks THE INTERSTELLAR FOUNDRY	Posted - 2006.09.17 16:33:00 - [41] Not going to happen, ever. The only way this could conceivably happen is if there was an option to have no corp at all and be unable to be declared war on. But really, There must always, always, be somewhere to fall back to, or else this really will become greifer heaven. Also solo is a valid playstyle, and people have no right at all to criticize people for it.
Cylynex	Posted - 2006.09.17 16:34:00 - [42] Edited by: Cylynex on 17/09/2006 16:35:07 If you want to shoot npcs go ratting or do a mission, I don't see how tahts any different. Factional warfare might bring some of that in anyway.
Jesabell Junes Amarr Quam Singulari Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.09.17 16:38:00 - [43] what i have just brought up, is exactly faction warefare but with the rich NPC corps, only with the choice for players to get involved IF THEY WANT TO, therefore its not a stupid idea that is never going to happen, its an idea that is going to happen, so for everybody whos predicting and second guessing CCP guess again, all i added to it was maybe an option to allow players to join their faction side or corp they seem to love so much (again stressing IF THEY WANT TO) http://www.freewebs.com/byrnes/sig.jpg Max dimensions for a signature are 400x120 pixels and 24,000 bytes in filesize. Please review the forum rules. -Eldo ([email protected])
Scarib	Posted - 2006.09.17 16:50:00 - [44] Somebody picked up the point I made, if FW was brought in as suggested, then any player should be able to join a npc corp which was war dec/able then so choose if they want to engage in FW. So in effect you would leave the present starter and default npc corps alone. Join the new npc corp when /if your ready and willing to begin FW, then each race would have a faction war dec/able npc corp for any player regardless as to which race you are, so a caldari could join a gallente npc, then fight in FW. What rewards or standings this gives would effect their overall standing, could be used to repair standing to faction after mission running had lowered it. In effect you would be a merc for the faction you work for.
St Dragon Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2006.09.17 16:59:00 - [45] Edited by: St Dragon on 17/09/2006 17:01:00 So the way i see it is that people who are created get say for example upto 3 months learning time in a newbie npc corp while in this corp you cant get war decked on. Then after these 3 months you either join a player corp or get moved into a npc corp. When thi happens you get presented a choice of corps based on your faction standing's and a list of wars they are in and palyer numbers. When you have made your choice you are given a 24 hour countdown so that you ahve time to move your stuff to your new corp base, this also gives you time to studdy who you will be at war with. When that timer is gone you are in the new npc corp that xan be war decked on now when you join you are given the list of corps you are currently at war witha nd askled to select which corp you wish to be exempt from fighting. It is worth noting that for each corp you are at war with in this intial joining stage will give you a bonus faction boost that will give you access to high agents. Now for those fighting a npc corp they will ahve to face the npc corps fleet of faction ships as well as the assortment of palywers that are emmbers of that corp. Also the missions you get will be of 2 types. 1. the sort we get now. 2.Faction missions. Faction missions will give the solo npc'ers who dont want to fight wars something to do such as if you are in a amarr corp invade system A intercept transports and capture prisoners for processing in your corps slave pens. Of course you can bring friends and sometimes more than 1 person is doing the same mission for the same corp so you both gang up and if its a success you both pass the mission. But watch out thos transports belong to a mimitar corp and its agent amy ahve assigned some palyers to help protect it too. One thing of not to make it fare innpc faction missions you are prevented from locking pods to prevent griefing leave that for the faction wars or general PvP'ing. EDIT: i feel that is done carefully Factional warfare and its systems of operation will bring the worlds of eve together in harmany and genuine enjoyment [PvE\PvP\Solo] ----------------------------------------------- "Kill one man, and you are a murderer. Kill millions of men, and you are a conqueror. Kill them all, and you are a god." -- Jean Rostand
Jesabell Junes Amarr Quam Singulari Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.09.17 17:18:00 - [46] applause, very plausable version of what weve all been trying to say :) a system like that would be really good http://www.freewebs.com/byrnes/sig.jpg Max dimensions for a signature are 400x120 pixels and 24,000 bytes in filesize. Please review the forum rules. -Eldo ([email protected])
St Dragon Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2006.09.17 17:23:00 - [47] Originally by: Jesabell Junes applause, very plausable version of what weve all been trying to say :) a system like that would be really good Its worth noting that what i posted is what i call a bare bones system that needs a lot of work. Its also a system that should embrace all types of pley be it ganker or miner/lone wolfe. All are valid ways of playing, and should be supported. ----------------------------------------------- "Kill one man, and you are a murderer. Kill millions of men, and you are a conqueror. Kill them all, and you are a god." -- Jean Rostand
Jesabell Junes Amarr Quam Singulari Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.09.17 17:25:00 - [48] your right it needs work and its a good idea, what it doesnt need is people second guessing ccp and thinking they know exactly how the company works who wont give any support at all because they are afraid to get shot at without reading that it wouldnt include them, i hope the gms allow people to fight for factions in kali http://www.freewebs.com/byrnes/sig.jpg Max dimensions for a signature are 400x120 pixels and 24,000 bytes in filesize. Please review the forum rules. -Eldo ([email protected])
Malthros Zenobia Caldari Independent Navy Reserve Kimotoro Directive	Posted - 2006.09.17 17:49:00 - [49] Originally by: Raquel Smith I'm curious as to how 10 day old characters are flying battleships. To me this seems like a veiled attempted to get permission to grief newbies and people who specifically want to avoid PVP. EVE isn't made to allow you to avoid PVP, and tbh, it's almost impossible to avoid it. Unless you buy only from the NPC market, and build everything you use, you're PvPing in some way. Sorry you can't afford a dev so you get me instead ^^ - Xorus I hear Xorus is only 50 isk an hour - Immy Oooh that could get Suvetar for the day! - Cathath For 50, you can have my goat:P- Tirg
Veryez	Posted - 2006.09.17 17:52:00 - [50] This idea is foolish. Think through the logic for a moment. A player corp has a leader and a structure. These people have been playing together for months/years. There is a set structure of command. People have their role to play during wars and as a corp they play it. A well formed Corp is organized and a strong adversary. What would an NPC corp do? Do they use teamspeak? Do they practice at PvP and operate together as a fleet? Do they have a command structure? Who's the CEO? What challenge would this possibly give? More NPC's to shoot at? Try level 4 missions (and level 5 when they come out). This idea is so wrong on so many levels it can't be taken seriously. Besides it costs what 50 mil to war dec an alliance, why on earth would war decing an empire cost less? Sorry but this is NOTHING but a poor attempt to grief players. Oh but this wouldn't include "school corps", I have a better idea - starter ships should not be able to be targeted by players, how's that.
Jesabell Junes Amarr Quam Singulari Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.09.17 17:55:00 - [51] Originally by: Veryez This idea is foolish. Think through the logic for a moment. A player corp has a leader and a structure. These people have been playing together for months/years. There is a set structure of command. People have their role to play during wars and as a corp they play it. A well formed Corp is organized and a strong adversary. What would an NPC corp do? Do they use teamspeak? Do they practice at PvP and operate together as a fleet? Do they have a command structure? Who's the CEO? What challenge would this possibly give? More NPC's to shoot at? Try level 4 missions (and level 5 when they come out). Sorry but this is NOTHING but a poor attempt to grief players. another example of somebody who cannot read the 1000 posts of "give people the choice of wether they want to fight or not" prooving it isnt grieving players as they choose to be a part of it, obviously some of eves players need to leave the 30,000 limit, go back to school, and maybe itll stop us lagging a bit, Do concorde use teamspeak? or the faction navy? who is their ceo? That information is irelevant, you dont need it at all to be effective http://www.freewebs.com/byrnes/sig.jpg Max dimensions for a signature are 400x120 pixels and 24,000 bytes in filesize. Please review the forum rules. -Eldo ([email protected])
Bill Shankly	Posted - 2006.09.17 18:11:00 - [52] aw man i couldve done this post in one line, "Make it so i can kill more noobs!!"
Veryez	Posted - 2006.09.17 18:25:00 - [53] Originally by: Jesabell Junes another example of somebody who cannot read the 1000 posts of "give people the choice of wether they want to fight or not" prooving it isnt grieving players as they choose to be a part of it, obviously some of eves players need to leave the 30,000 limit, go back to school, and maybe itll stop us lagging a bit, Do concorde use teamspeak? or the faction navy? who is their ceo? That information is irelevant, you dont need it at all to be effective[/quote My mistake, I asked you to think it through. Let me help you. You declare war on a corporation that is part of an empire. The players opt not to help (in your example). The empire now has the option to respond, so yes now the entire Calderi State declares war on you. Every gun in every system and on every station held by that empire now holds you hostile. Your fleet enters a Calderi system looking for targets (on and if it's high sec space - you do this without capital ships) and you are attacked by the full might of the calderi empire (making concord look like a small gang). Where are you going with this? When you attack someone in empire, you have no chance against Concord. Why would you think that attacking an empire would be easier? Certainly it shouldn't be. Sure you may get some players who opt in. But how is this different from running missions, if all you want to do is kill NPC's? I guess from a role playing standpoint it has some merit, but what would be the gain you're trying to achieve? Do you think you should be able to conquer an Empire? In my view you war dec someone to gain something (money, POS, territory, experience, market advantage, something) so what do you hope to gain fighting NPC's that you don't gain from missions/complexes? Flames aside, what would be the motive to war dec the Calderi State (or any other)?
Jesabell Junes Amarr Quam Singulari Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.09.17 18:43:00 - [54] Originally by: Veryez Originally by: Jesabell Junes another example of somebody who cannot read the 1000 posts of "give people the choice of wether they want to fight or not" prooving it isnt grieving players as they choose to be a part of it, obviously some of eves players need to leave the 30,000 limit, go back to school, and maybe itll stop us lagging a bit, Do concorde use teamspeak? or the faction navy? who is their ceo? That information is irelevant, you dont need it at all to be effective[/quote My mistake, I asked you to think it through. Let me help you. You declare war on a corporation that is part of an empire. The players opt not to help (in your example). The empire now has the option to respond, so yes now the entire Calderi State declares war on you. Every gun in every system and on every station held by that empire now holds you hostile. Your fleet enters a Calderi system looking for targets (on and if it's high sec space - you do this without capital ships) and you are attacked by the full might of the calderi empire (making concord look like a small gang). Where are you going with this? When you attack someone in empire, you have no chance against Concord. Why would you think that attacking an empire would be easier? Certainly it shouldn't be. Sure you may get some players who opt in. But how is this different from running missions, if all you want to do is kill NPC's? I guess from a role playing standpoint it has some merit, but what would be the gain you're trying to achieve? Do you think you should be able to conquer an Empire? In my view you war dec someone to gain something (money, POS, territory, experience, market advantage, something) so what do you hope to gain fighting NPC's that you don't gain from missions/complexes? Flames aside, what would be the motive to war dec the Calderi State (or any other)? explain to me then the reason that CCP are implementing this idea into kali???? :) all were doing is adding an option for players to take part http://www.freewebs.com/byrnes/sig.jpg Max dimensions for a signature are 400x120 pixels and 24,000 bytes in filesize. Please review the forum rules. -Eldo ([email protected])
Veryez	Posted - 2006.09.17 19:04:00 - [55] Originally by: Jesabell Junes explain to me then the reason that CCP are implementing this idea into kali???? :) all were doing is adding an option for players to take part Ah, yes CCP is implementing missions against other factions, not war decs. Additionally I would be all for allowing players to choose to help the opposing side (assuming they have good standing with them) that would add to the role playing. But I can see the problems this would cause. Would you want to blow up your corpmate's freighter because he's Minmatar and you're Amarr? However CCP choses to implement Faction warfare, I hope it's fun and challenging. However running missions for an empire is not quite the same thing as allowing players to war dec them.
St Dragon Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2006.09.17 19:49:00 - [56] Originally by: Veryez Originally by: Jesabell Junes explain to me then the reason that CCP are implementing this idea into kali???? :) all were doing is adding an option for players to take part Ah, yes CCP is implementing missions against other factions, not war decs. Additionally I would be all for allowing players to choose to help the opposing side (assuming they have good standing with them) that would add to the role playing. But I can see the problems this would cause. Would you want to blow up your corpmate's freighter because he's Minmatar and you're Amarr? However CCP choses to implement Faction warfare, I hope it's fun and challenging. However running missions for an empire is not quite the same thing as allowing players to war dec them. I do sort of agree here and i do feel that most ideas concerning war declaring newbs and those who want to stay more or less solo [look under independent] a excuse to grief wraped up in good intentions but in the end if it ended up with a really great faction warfare system its a sacrifice im wiling to agree on, as long as the true newbies get adiquate protection. ----------------------------------------------- "Kill one man, and you are a murderer. Kill millions of men, and you are a conqueror. Kill them all, and you are a god." -- Jean Rostand
Wraithbane	Posted - 2006.09.17 21:45:00 - [57] Originally by: Jesabell Junes your right it needs work and its a good idea, what it doesnt need is people second guessing ccp and thinking they know exactly how the company works who wont give any support at all because they are afraid to get shot at without reading that it wouldnt include them, i hope the gms allow people to fight for factions in kali Chuckle...Talk about ironic...You yourself have been second guessing CCP...The current system works fine. It allows you gankers to play your games in low sec, and also allows people to play in high sec. Neither needs to bother the other. The motivations of this proposal are highly suspect, to say the very least.
Tradesman Mcgee	Posted - 2006.09.17 22:03:00 - [58] Foolish idea, not the part where people can join a (one specific perhaps) NPC corp that can be war-decced, but the part where you want to force people to leave the starter corp or holder corp. As another poster stated, some people have been in those for years, without being cheaters or macrominers or anything - let them stay there, its not hurting you in any way with them being there. Oh..except you might get fewer things to gank, thats all.
Sergeant Spot Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.09.18 00:04:00 - [59] Bad idea REALLY bad idea Pathetic cowards who like to shoot helpless targets ALREADY go to EXTREME efforts to try every imaginable possible (and impossible) method to shoot helpless noobs just for the pathetic fun of it. Anyone who thinks the pathetic cowards who prefer 0.5+ hunting will target only "macro users" and "veterans" is an idiot. I live mostly in deep 0.0, but the bit of time I spend in empire now and then makes this obvious. Anyone who does not see this is WILLFULLY blind. snip This type of comment has no place in a signature, please remain courteous - Pirlouit
Daryl Xero Caldari Independent Navy Reserve Kimotoro Directive	Posted - 2006.09.18 00:14:00 - [60] Love the idea, don't think it could be done without someone exploiting it. And wardeccing noob corps? Absolutely out of the question, no matter how the mechanics are structured. What doesn't kill you defines you.

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