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Blanco Nino
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Posted - 2006.09.18 19:48:00 -
[1]
I started playing EVE earlier this summer, and being the gamer that I am, I spent the last 2 months training my learning skills. My intention when I completed my learning skills was to train and specialize in Gallente ships. I was very happy with this decision as I like the look of the Gallente ships... but as I read more and more on these forums I can't help but feel disheartened by the seeming lack of balance between the different races in EVE. General consensus seems to be that Amarr sucks, Gallente and Minmitar are ok, and Caldari are king. Further evidence of this seems to be the relative distribution of players playing each race... an overwhelming majority are in fact Caldari. So:
Is there any truth to this?
and
Why does anyone fly anything other than Caldari? |
Jenny Spitfire
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.09.18 19:50:00 -
[2]
Gallente, Phantasm and Succubus. 
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Cruelty is God's way of showing kindness and God is kind.
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Locke DieDrake
Port Royal Independent Kontractors
Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2006.09.18 19:54:00 -
[3]
Are you planning on being an empire based player? Or do you intend to PVP in deep space?
If you plan to run plexes and missions and generally be a carebear, fly caldari.
If you plan to PVP, caldari are NOT KING. Far from it. Missles are generally frowned at in gangs because they are fairly slow. Even with uber skills. They certainly aren't instant hit like guns are.
I see alot of amarr, minny and gallente in PVP. I personally fly caldari in pvp, but I'm a black sheep for it in many gangs.
The "balance" you describe isn't balance. Balance doesn't mean making everything the same. It means that each has a stong point and a weak point.
Amarr are awesome at tearing thru shields. And not much else.
Gallente have drones, and also the Mega and really good AF's.
The minmatar have the Vagabond, which is by far the king of solo pvp.
The caldari have missle boats. Which are great for PVE, but less so for PVP.
___________________________________________
The deeper you stick it in your vein, the deeper the thoughts there's no more pain.
___________________________________________
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Xeliya
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Posted - 2006.09.18 19:58:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Xeliya on 18/09/2006 20:00:22
Reading the forums is a bad idea as most people complaining about balance are cry babies who want I Win buttons . . . Caldari isn't really the preferred choice in PVP as they really have nothing good other then EW ships and the Crow/Harpy/Eagle . . . The rest of the ships are low average. Ammar is hurting I will give you that as they shoot EM/Therm which most people are tanking pretty good. Gallente and Mimitar are your normal ships you see PVPing. Gallente can snipe or fight close and have hella drones where Minmitar hits hella hard.
If your going to do missions well ya Caldari owns missions but thats all they really have . . .
Plus they can't train other races as easy since all the gun and armour skills share across 3 races where shield and missiles are for Caldari only.
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Xelios
Minmatar
Rampage Eternal
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Posted - 2006.09.18 19:59:00 -
[5]
If all you're planning on doing is PvE then Caldari is pretty much king, both for their strong shield tanks and ability to pick any damage type.
If you're planning on PvPing the races are actually very balanced. Each race has its strengths and weaknesses, and each ship has its own strengths and weaknesses.
The new BFG.
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Kali Omega
Caldari
ISS Navy Task Force
Interstellar Starbase Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.09.18 20:02:00 -
[6]
A lot of people favor NPCing. Ratting, Agents and such and I personally find it much easier to do as Caldari.
In PvP I don't have to worry about transversal, etc. I kick my crow into microwarp bliss and orbit at 500m, gleefully laughing like a school girl.
That being said, I definately prefer to PvP as anything but Caldari. I hate it to be honest. I'd much rather fly a full blaster rack Megathron than a Raven.
That's just me. I've seen many Amarr pilots tear **** up on the battlefield too. People just like to complain I think.
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Phoenix Lonestar
Litanies of Hate
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Posted - 2006.09.18 20:12:00 -
[7]
 Originally by: Kali Omega
In PvP I don't have to worry about transversal, etc. I kick my crow into microwarp bliss and orbit at 500m, gleefully laughing like a school girl.
NOS ftw =P
I fly a Raven with 5/4 skills and adv. cruise spec. 4. For PVEing, there ain't nothing like it. You will pwn all *NPC* comers in a Caldari ship with missiles. But as has been posted... if you want to tear stuff up in PVP, then the Blasterthron (Megathron w/ full rack of blasters) is king. Try gatecamping in a Raven when it takes 30 seconds for your missiles to reach 160 km away. Pretty much the only thing you can take out is an AFK hauler.
And as it's been stated... it's a lot easier to switch between different race's ships when you're Amarr, Gallente, or Minnie. But when you have upwards of 4mil SP in missiles, and 30k in gunnery, it's kinda hard to say "Gee, I think I'll take my Mega out for a whirl."
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Gant Stryker
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Posted - 2006.09.18 20:29:00 -
[8]
Thats one thing I like about Eve, many games are balanced vs PVE and PVP suffers because of it. Eve, however balances for PVP and PVE suffers for it...
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Cmdr Sy
EUROPEANS
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Posted - 2006.09.18 20:40:00 -
[9]
Because if anyone out there has a free mid slot, Gravimetric ECM T2 is a no-brainer?
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leroy jinkens
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Posted - 2006.09.18 20:49:00 -
[10]
i have caldari bs lvl 5 and most of the missile skills maxed, mid range a raven with javelin torps can tear apart mostly anything cruiser + but the - side of it , with javelins u cant touch anything frig and below , so they are really good for basically any type of pvp ... or pve .. u just gotta know when to pick ur battles, personally it takes me 3-4 volleys to take a megathron down to 20% armor , gg
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Blanco Nino
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Posted - 2006.09.18 20:49:00 -
[11]
a lot of good responces here, thanks for the info.
one more question though... how do you counter a ECM Raven firing FOF missiles 1 on 1?
They are immune to EWAR so... Seems to me like a solo PVP "I win button"??? |
Xeliya
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Posted - 2006.09.18 20:54:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Blanco Nino
a lot of good responces here, thanks for the info.
one more question though... how do you counter a ECM Raven firing FOF missiles 1 on 1?
They are immune to EWAR so... Seems to me like a solo PVP "I win button"???
Most people won't carry FOF but if they do defenders will do the trick. Also FOF do crap damage so I really wouldn't worry about them. If you launch drones well it will shoot them too so his ****s will hit everything and do no damage . . .
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Ralara
Caldari
Green Peace Corp
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Posted - 2006.09.18 20:55:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Blanco Nino
I started playing EVE earlier this summer, and being the gamer that I am, I spent the last 2 months training my learning skills. My intention when I completed my learning skills was to train and specialize in Gallente ships. I was very happy with this decision as I like the look of the Gallente ships... but as I read more and more on these forums I can't help but feel disheartened by the seeming lack of balance between the different races in EVE. General consensus seems to be that Amarr sucks, Gallente and Minmitar are ok, and Caldari are king. Further evidence of this seems to be the relative distribution of players playing each race... an overwhelming majority are in fact Caldari. So:
Is there any truth to this?
and
Why does anyone fly anything other than Caldari?
heh are you kidding? Well it depends what type of player you are. For missions and ratting (NPS belt hunting) Ravens are the king, and thus caldari. For PVP something like a Thorax (gallante), a Dominix (gallante) or a cyclone are much more fun to play with. The only reason Caldari are so popular is the race descriptions (who wants to be a Slave (min), French (Gal) or a Relgious nutter (amarr) ??
Caldari are good at missions / ratting because of their long range missiles. The others are good at PVP because of ... well, everything else.
Caldari can pvp well, but not as well as a well trained gallante or amarr, imo. 
_-=-_-=-_-=-_-=-_-=-_-=-_-=-_-=-_-=-_-=-_
Green Peace Corporation
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Scorpyn
Caldari
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2006.09.18 21:00:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Blanco Nino
a lot of good responces here, thanks for the info.
one more question though... how do you counter a ECM Raven firing FOF missiles 1 on 1?
They are immune to EWAR so... Seems to me like a solo PVP "I win button"???
If you are gallente, try a domi with drones + ew + nos/neut.
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Malthros Zenobia
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
Kimotoro Directive
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Posted - 2006.09.18 21:01:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Blanco Nino
a lot of good responces here, thanks for the info.
one more question though... how do you counter a ECM Raven firing FOF missiles 1 on 1?
They are immune to EWAR so... Seems to me like a solo PVP "I win button"???
How do you counter FOFs?
It's called 'use light drones'. FOFs will go after the drones, and they will have a damn hard time killing them.
Sorry you can't afford a dev so you get me instead ^^ - Xorus
I hear Xorus is only 50 isk an hour  - Immy
Oooh that could get Suvetar for the day! - Cathath
For 50, you can have my goat:P- Tirg |
Naxxiz
GalacTECH Unlimited
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Posted - 2006.09.18 21:05:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Blanco Nino
a lot of good responces here, thanks for the info.
one more question though... how do you counter a ECM Raven firing FOF missiles 1 on 1?
They are immune to EWAR so... Seems to me like a solo PVP "I win button"???
Launch drones and laugh. Caldari BS should not win 1 vs 1. Its either draw because the other bs warped or the caldari bs looses. Scorp can jam for 90%(assuming tech 2 racial jammers and high jamming skills) of the time but lack the dps to do any real damage. Raven needs distance since if it gets in range of short range turrets(pulse lasers, or blasters), its going to get owned. For npc'ing, missiles own supreme since you can pick damage type and engage at any distance within range of the missiles. This and fleet battles is where caldari bs's shine.
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SonOTassadar
The Dead Parrot Shoppe Inc.
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Posted - 2006.09.18 21:07:00 -
[17]
Edited by: SonOTassadar on 18/09/2006 21:11:24
I think people just don't understand why Caldari are good for PvP. I've seen a few little tidbits in here for what they're good for, but nothing concrete.
In my opinion, Minmatar are by far the most powerful race in the game. They excel at both PvP and PvE. That's for another discussion, though.
It's true, Caldari do suffer from their ammunition having a delay before it hits. You cannot gatesnipe with a missile boat. However, this offers some advantages. Missiles always hit, and always do the same amount of damage. This damage can vary based on your missile type relative to your target's velocity and signature radius, but CCP has graciously offered a tool to figure out what damage you'll do in the ships and modules forum. So, you always hit, and you always do full damage. The problem is the delay. Where does that make Caldari suffer aside from gatesniping? One area of PvP: Medium ranged combat.
That's it. The only place Caldari are really weak is the 35-70km range. You get into fleet battles that are 100km out and it's just BSes and capital ships, Caldari can do steady, focused damage to big targets like a dreadnaught. Our own capital ships excel at taking out POSes, which, again, is a long range fight. In the 1 POS fight I've been in, ships targetting the POS were no closer than 110 KM from the POS, and I thought that was too close.
Then you get to short range. Well, missiles still aren't instant, but if your missiles travel at 2,000 M/S and your target is 8,000 Meters away, does it really matter? Get yourself in an assault frigate or an interceptor and not only can you avoid tracking of guns, but your missiles don't have to worry about tracking, and standard missiles do full damage to everything except maybe light drones.
On top of all that, a lot of our ships cater to ECM, namely jammers. People will tell you ECM is overpowered. A multispectral jammer disables a target from locking for 20 seconds on a successful jam. That's 20 seconds + relocking time. How much damage do you think you can dish out in 23 seconds? What if it's a BS? You now have 20 seconds + a 14 second like time. What can you do with a half-minute? What can you and 5 of your corp mates do in a half-minute? Do you know what a person is capable of doing while jammed? Warp out, if they aren't scrammed, hope that their drones do some damage, and use his smartbomb if he has one fitted and someone happens to be in range.
Caldari have their strengths. I wouldn't choose a Caldari pilot for battlecruiser fights, where engagements go from 40-60km, but close range and fleet battles, they are a force to be reckoned with. The only race that really has limited options in PvP is Amarr. They have a few good ships that can dish out a lot of damage, and some of their ships cater to warp disruption, but beyond that, they have too much of a niche for PvP combat.
-----
Griffin -- 100,000 ISK
ECM - Multispectral Jammer Is -- 20,000 ISK
Standar Missile Launcher Is -- 10,000 ISK
War target sobbing over losing a fight in his T2 fitted Battleship -- priceless |
Callisto Miir
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Posted - 2006.09.18 21:07:00 -
[18]
Hi,
I just wanted to point something out, and probably stating the obvious but it doesn't really matter what race you play, because you can specialize in any ships you want... right?
So you can create a Caldari Character that specializes in Gallente ships.
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Blanco Nino
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Posted - 2006.09.18 21:24:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Blanco Nino on 18/09/2006 21:24:31
SonOTassadar:
your reasoning is more or less what I had in mind when I started this thread. It seems to me like the fittings on Caldari allow extensive use of ECM, which is a huge advantage in PVP. Also not having to worry about tracking is a nice bonus too, and so to is the much lesser SP investment required for missiles compared to guns (+drones possibly). They just seem like THE elite race in terms of ships.
I'd really like to hear from someone who has PVP'd extensively in Caldari ships and feels like they are screwed or at least at a major disadvantage. Anyone? |
Blanco Nino
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Posted - 2006.09.18 21:31:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Callisto Miir
Hi,
I just wanted to point something out, and probably stating the obvious but it doesn't really matter what race you play, because you can specialize in any ships you want... right?
So you can create a Caldari Character that specializes in Gallente ships.
Yes. I for example am a Minmatar and trying to decide which race ship I want to fly. |
Arcadia1701
Gallente
Research Associates
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Posted - 2006.09.18 21:36:00 -
[21]
any gallente drone boat is a 1v1 i win button.
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DrDevice
The Priory
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Posted - 2006.09.18 21:43:00 -
[22]
caldari ships in pvp wise, you cant fault the scorp for obvious ew reasons. For actual combat how useful the raven is kind of depends on the battle size, if its small scale, 10 or less people, these tend to be close engagments anyhow, and ravens can really kick it. Ravens only really lose out in fleet-ops with lots of people, as even pretty close, primary is usually dead before the missiles can get there.
However all this is about to change when caldari get the uber long-range sniper boat as their tier 3 BS. Then, I wonder how more prolific caldari ships will be when you can have specialist BS's in pretty much all area's
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DrDevice
The Priory
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Posted - 2006.09.18 21:43:00 -
[23]
caldari ships in pvp wise, you cant fault the scorp for obvious ew reasons. For actual combat how useful the raven is kind of depends on the battle size, if its small scale, 10 or less people, these tend to be close engagments anyhow, and ravens can really kick it. Ravens only really lose out in fleet-ops with lots of people, as even pretty close, primary is usually dead before the missiles can get there.
However all this is about to change when caldari get the uber long-range sniper boat as their tier 3 BS. Then, I wonder how more prolific caldari ships will be when you can have specialist BS's in pretty much all area's
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Xeliya
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Posted - 2006.09.18 21:45:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Xeliya on 18/09/2006 21:50:57
Originally by: Blanco Nino
I'd really like to hear from someone who has PVP'd extensively in Caldari ships and feels like they are screwed or at least at a major disadvantage. Anyone?
Well I think I am qulified for that as you can see my last skills update here and they still arn't that good on the PVP field . . . On paper Caldari seems like they are gods but that just it, it's paper and not actually how it plays out. I have a new charcter who is tranning up Minmatar/Ammar.
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Serious Bob
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Posted - 2006.09.18 21:47:00 -
[25]
Heh, train Caldari and see how fun you have, or how succesful you are.
I decided to start a minnie alt for rifter pawnage. <3
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Tovarishch
Caldari
Body Count Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2006.09.18 22:37:00 -
[26]
As a 52 mill skill point Caldari/Missile PVP specialist... allow me to clear up some misinformation (featured on the forums in general... and in this thread specifically).
Caldari are not 'better' at PvE... they are easier. They require less attention because any ship firing missiles does not/cannot pilot their ship in any manner that will increase missile damage. However, missiles do not hit for full damage all the time... why people vomit that inane comment over and over... I have no idea. There are many factors that will effect missile damage (sig radius, target speed, resistances, etc)... none of which can be negated or made advantageous by increasing or decreasing transversal or radial velocity.
The bottom line is that missiles require less attention in PvE. They just make things easier.
In PvP... it's another story to some degree. Missiles, once again, require less attention in some manners... since, to restate it, a pilot cannot maneuver their ship in any manner that is going to increase missile damage... which also means that a missile jockey need not bother with paying attention to any of their relative velocities.
However, missile flight time is the bane of my existence in EVE. Bringing a Raven to a fleet fight is an invitation for mockery. EW does fare very well in fleets... but flying a Scorp into a fleet battle is like parking a pink moped in front of a biker bar - you will die... quickly.
At high skill levels guns have significantly better DPS than missiles... and the advantage of instant damage versus flight time cannot be overstated. Caldari are by no means horrible at PvP... but they do require patience... and are ultimately a niche role. I started out playing Caldari over three years ago... back when they STANK. Times have changed... and they certainly have their strengths... but they are by not UBER... by any stretch of the imagination. The current forum whine regarding Caldari is simply the result of people reading the forums and restating what they have read... ad nauseam.
Lastly... do not get caught up in judging the game according to what you read here. The vast majority of the player base does not even come here... in fact, many players might not even know that there is an official EVE forum. A very significant majority of what you read on these forums is regurgitated, anecdotal crap. Most people fixated with the forums spend more time 'playing the forums' than they do playing the game.
In the end... play the game a bit, find what you like, and stick with it... it only requires a little out of the way training. Don't get so caught up in 'powergaming' that you forget to have fun and do your own thing.
All life is sacred... until the client says otherwise. |
Ath Amon
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Posted - 2006.09.18 22:49:00 -
[27]
i don't agree that much that caldari are so weak in pvp, in small engagements ravens can be a good choice.
caldari have also veeery good ecm ships, and we all know how much ecm is over.. ehm important
also yes missiles are slow and is fleets they lose efficency... poof here the uber new caldari BS with 8 guns, uber shield tank and a lot of space for damage mods...
not to say that if weapon range is going to get nerfed (to try to break blobs and to make fleet battles nearer) both the new BS and the old raven will outrange every other ship...
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Tobias Sjodin
Caldari
Ore Mongers
Pirate Coalition
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Posted - 2006.09.18 22:52:00 -
[28]
3 x Sensor dampeners on any Raven is a sitting duck right there.
[ore mongers, recruiting] |
prathe
Minmatar
Total Warehouse Logistics
Dusk and Dawn
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Posted - 2006.09.18 22:53:00 -
[29]
TBH it all boils down to one thing
it's not the better ship that wins , it's the better pilot .
period
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Grimpak
Gallente
Celestial Horizon Corp.
Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.09.18 22:56:00 -
[30]
Originally by: prathe
TBH it all boils down to one thing
it's not the better ship that wins , it's the better pilot .
period
QFT
pilot > ship
-------
Originally by: Abdalion
Originally by: Jebidus Skari
What, in EVE, is a Tyrant?
Me. Especially when it comes to troll threads.
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DeadDuck
Amarr
DAB
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2006.09.18 23:04:00 -
[31]
Like in the previous post Caldari makes it easier to NPC and so on but the other races ships will do the same. TBH I prefer Amarr in that specific field (we dont need ammo). In the PVP kingdom you dont see many Caldari Ships, in fleet battles they are quite rare when compared with the Amarr (Apocs + armageddons) and Gallentean Ships (Megatron) or Minmatar (Tempest).
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Treitei
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Posted - 2006.09.18 23:15:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Blanco Nino
I started playing EVE earlier this summer, and being the gamer that I am, I spent the last 2 months training my learning skills. My intention when I completed my learning skills was to train and specialize in Gallente ships. I was very happy with this decision as I like the look of the Gallente ships... but as I read more and more on these forums I can't help but feel disheartened by the seeming lack of balance between the different races in EVE. General consensus seems to be that Amarr sucks, Gallente and Minmitar are ok, and Caldari are king. Further evidence of this seems to be the relative distribution of players playing each race... an overwhelming majority are in fact Caldari. So:
Is there any truth to this?
and
Why does anyone fly anything other than Caldari?
Partially: Caldari ships have an overwhelming advantage in PVE, PVP however I do not know as I do not have first-hand experience using their ships. They also have among the best characters attribute-wise, I think throughout the existence of Eve-Online. (Most recent incarnation being Caldari Achura Monks.)
I'm guessing other people fly other ships, other than for aesthetic/rp values, because the other races' ships have a combat style that is more appealing to them, or is simply more effective than Caldari ships'. (Because missiles are slow as all hell for ex.)
Trivia: IIRC ~40-50% of Eve-Online characters are Caldari.
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Ath Amon
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Posted - 2006.09.18 23:26:00 -
[33]
Originally by: prathe
TBH it all boils down to one thing
it's not the better ship that wins , it's the better pilot .
period
i like to think it too, but in the end is not that true, ship play an important part...
i'm not saying that a certain ship is overpowered or that the ship do all the job, just tha the ship is an important factor in the equation and that give a big advantage to the pilot.
i also think that eve in the end is quite balanced atm (for sure more than most game) but also i see caldari as an "easy" race with low sp requirement, a lot of versatility and not many drawbacks
the mayor one was probably to not have a ship that shine in fleet engagement and we know that this is about to change.
so to an extent i agree with the op, the fact that caldari is an easy race with almost no drawback makes it very noobfriendly.
this is actually what i see with new player, as i "lurk" in my language channel it happens to ask to noobs why they chose a certain race and generally the reply of caldari players is something like "is the best race", "my friend told me to chose it" and so on...
there are also some noobs that reroll a caldari pilot after a couple of days.
so i disagree with ones who say... noobs chose caldari because is the first race, or they liked the BG and chose it... for my experience most noobs chose caldari because this is perceived (right or wrong) as the best race.
also EvE is a world in constant evolution (even if sometimes a bit slowly) we also know that probably defenders are going to get revamped and maybe there will be an overall missile revamp in future... so we don't really know how things will evolve in the future.
but as said, atm, the situation imo is like that, a race easy to play that is able to do almost everything very well.
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Too Kind
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Posted - 2006.09.18 23:32:00 -
[34]
Edited by: Too Kind on 18/09/2006 23:36:36
Like someone else already said, the rokh is coming soon (tm), at least soon enough for newbies that she(?) will be available, when it makes sense for them to use a BS in pvp.
I think Gallente has the best mix of close-range, long-range, fleet and solo pvp ships/setups (snipertron, blastertron, domi, Ishtar, Deimos, Vexor, Ishkur, Taranis, Enyo .. etc., all good ships imho. ) and the BS are also good for PvE. At least with enough SP. My mate goes always ratting angels in 0.0 with his blasterthron with pvp fitting, doesn't even remove the scrambler.
Currently I ususally fly Tempest in fleets, but might change a bit with the rokh. In gangs lately often a caldari missile boats with EW. (I can't fly Gallente)
Tech-2 missiles are quite nice, except you try to kill a speedy interceptor. Last time I tried to kill a stiletto, I made only 6 damage with precision-cruise and 3 ballistic-controls-II.  But on the other hand, large turrets can't track high transversal velocities at all.
--------------------------
Post with your main !!!111 |
Blanco Nino
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Posted - 2006.09.19 03:13:00 -
[35]
speaking of the new Caldari BS... does it get bonuses to just rail guns or hybrid turrets in general? If its both railguns and blasters I think my decision will be made... Caldari BlasteRohk |
Blanco Nino
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Posted - 2006.09.19 18:21:00 -
[36]
anyone know^^^^? |
Kaiu
Hinkledolph and K Associates
The SUdden Death Squad
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Posted - 2006.09.19 18:28:00 -
[37]
Gallente own quite a lot tbh
Blasters+drones plus the ability to have super sick evil armour tanks makes them king all round imo
Raven fanbois are dieing off slowly but surely or at least quietening down on the forums
____________________
MOGarmy
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Hysenthlay
Minmatar
The Merchant Marines
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Posted - 2006.09.19 18:40:00 -
[38]
Me I fly Minmatar and Caldari, as I find the Missile and Shield skill sets from Caldari compliment my Minnie ships :)
____________________________
Silflay Hraka U Embleer Rah |
Jonas Darkstar
Amarr
Darkstar Services
Interstellar Starbase Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.09.19 18:43:00 -
[39]
I used to be Caldari but then i swaped to the Amarr race to be Unique.
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ElCoCo
Gallente
KIA Corp
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Posted - 2006.09.19 18:45:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Grimpak
Originally by: prathe
TBH it all boils down to one thing
it's not the better ship that wins , it's the better pilot .
period
QFT
pilot > ship
Yeah but if said pilot was fighting himself in another ship (with similar skills ofc), who would win? 
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Krulla
Minmatar
Queens of the Stone Age
Chimaera Pact
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Posted - 2006.09.19 18:48:00 -
[41]
Originally by: ElCoCo
Originally by: Grimpak
Originally by: prathe
TBH it all boils down to one thing
it's not the better ship that wins , it's the better pilot .
period
QFT
pilot > ship
Yeah but if said pilot was fighting himself in another ship (with similar skills ofc), who would win?
He'd probably cause some sort of paradox and erase the universe.
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Adonis 4174
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Posted - 2006.09.19 18:59:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Krulla
He'd probably cause some sort of paradox and erase the universe.
Quick! Nerf paradox!
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Russell T Davies is my master now. |
Jim McGregor
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.09.19 19:02:00 -
[43]
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 19/09/2006 19:06:16
Originally by: Blanco Nino
I started playing EVE earlier this summer, and being the gamer that I am, I spent the last 2 months training my learning skills. My intention when I completed my learning skills was to train and specialize in Gallente ships. I was very happy with this decision as I like the look of the Gallente ships... but as I read more and more on these forums I can't help but feel disheartened by the seeming lack of balance between the different races in EVE. General consensus seems to be that Amarr sucks, Gallente and Minmitar are ok, and Caldari are king. Further evidence of this seems to be the relative distribution of players playing each race... an overwhelming majority are in fact Caldari. So:
Is there any truth to this?
and
Why does anyone fly anything other than Caldari?
Caldari is pretty bad, but the Raven is very good. People will tell you they suck for pvp because they dont have instant damage, and often they use the example of being 160 km away to show how bad the ship is... all thats telling me is that the ship is bad for sniping. Nothing else. Most combat Im in is taking place at close to medium range, alone or in a small group. There the Raven rocks. The Mega have slightly higher damage, but will take a real beating while its closing distance so it can do damage with its guns. In the end, its the amount of time to close the distance that will decide the outcome between the two.
The damage of t2 torpedoes is devestating vs large ships, and still hit pretty good vs small ships as well. Personally i think Raven is very, very good in small groups with combat at close to medium range. It has a superior tank and t2 torps give it very high damage as well. These are basicly facts that can be shown using NB's dps spreadsheet. When people do, generally the arguments become "stop playing the game on paper"...so I dont know, what arguments should a guy use to show inbalance? The gut feeling? :)
There really is no point in arguing game balance, because people will use all sorts of strange arguments to support their own cause or race. Just trust ccp to balance the game and give up on trying to discuss it... thats my advice (which i dont follow unfortunantly). :)
I feel that gallente and minmatar is currently the best pvp races, with Amarr as 3rd and Caldari as 4:th. Simply because its really only the Raven I respect in the caldari lineup. I respect basicly all gallente ships for example and I think most players do.
Things will change for caldari though, with assault missiles coming in. Last patch buffed gallente and i think caldari is next.
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Eve Wiki | Eve Tribune | Eve Pirate |
Estelle Matsuko
Caldari
The Beiatch Corp Inc
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Posted - 2006.09.19 19:46:00 -
[44]
Edited by: Estelle Matsuko on 19/09/2006 19:47:34
Originally by: Ralara
heh are you kidding? Well it depends what type of player you are. For missions and ratting (NPS belt hunting) Ravens are the king, and thus caldari. For PVP something like a Thorax (gallante), a Dominix (gallante) or a cyclone are much more fun to play with. The only reason Caldari are so popular is the race descriptions (who wants to be a Slave (min), French (Gal) or a Relgious nutter (amarr) ??[quote
Cleanup on monitor one please
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coldplasma
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Posted - 2006.09.19 19:53:00 -
[45]
Edited by: coldplasma on 19/09/2006 19:55:37
Caldari have great ships, but in terms of solo gankability, the ships are not nearly as good as maybe gallente or minmatar unless you are using T2 ships. I'm caldari and I started training Gallente ships for the sheer gankability.
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See you in 0.0 kids... |
Roxors
Caldari
Solar Wind
Distant Star Alliance
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Posted - 2006.09.19 20:33:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Blanco Nino
Edited by: Blanco Nino on 18/09/2006 21:24:31
SonOTassadar:
your reasoning is more or less what I had in mind when I started this thread. It seems to me like the fittings on Caldari allow extensive use of ECM, which is a huge advantage in PVP. Also not having to worry about tracking is a nice bonus too, and so to is the much lesser SP investment required for missiles compared to guns (+drones possibly). They just seem like THE elite race in terms of ships.
I'd really like to hear from someone who has PVP'd extensively in Caldari ships and feels like they are screwed or at least at a major disadvantage. Anyone?
well.. i wont say i've pvp'ed "extensivly" in caldari ships.. but im an all caldari pilot and i've done some pvp and here is what i found... the time it takes for my missiles to get from my launchers to my target is a serious liability..
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Website
Your signature is too large. Please see the Forum Rules for the limits - Serathu ([email protected])
Originally by: jellybelly2
My alt has seen 9 titans.
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Phalyssa Truixim
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Posted - 2006.09.19 22:20:00 -
[47]
I am a new player (just under 3 weeks into the game). My brother had been playing the game awhile longer than I had. He really enjoys mining so we decided that it would be fun if I went combat to protect his mining ventures. The Caldari description sounded like it would be the correct race to do that. It would be nice if the descriptions actually stated what each race was good at (PvP/PvE). I know I can train the other ships, it is just a little disheartening to come here and read that I will be fairly ineffective at protecting my brother.
Is this really the case? Can I be ok with Caldari ships or should I immediately focus elsewhere?
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Sergeant Spot
Black Eclipse Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2006.09.19 22:26:00 -
[48]
Thank God that CCP has not made all ships and weapons into cookie cutter copies of each other.
Perfectly "equal" weapons would be the ultimate failure CCP could make.
Even better, what is a great weapon now might not be popular six months from now.
*snip*
This type of comment has no place in a signature, please remain courteous - Pirlouit
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Yarek Balear
Veto.
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Posted - 2006.09.19 22:36:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Phalyssa Truixim
I am a new player (just under 3 weeks into the game). My brother had been playing the game awhile longer than I had. He really enjoys mining so we decided that it would be fun if I went combat to protect his mining ventures. The Caldari description sounded like it would be the correct race to do that. It would be nice if the descriptions actually stated what each race was good at (PvP/PvE). I know I can train the other ships, it is just a little disheartening to come here and read that I will be fairly ineffective at protecting my brother.
Is this really the case? Can I be ok with Caldari ships or should I immediately focus elsewhere?
Yes - you can be effective in this role particularly with Caldari ships. Caldari are the king of EW, so you could fit jammers and jam anything that attacked him (or try). Probably the most effective way of protecting him if that's what you're doing...
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Torrence Osti
A.W.M
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Posted - 2006.09.19 22:57:00 -
[50]
I picked Gallente cause that chick on the character select screen is a hottie.
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Audri Fisher
Caldari
The Keep
THE R0CK
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Posted - 2006.09.19 23:28:00 -
[51]
Caldari pretty much suck tbh for solo PvP.
Jamming is king, and you simply cannot fit a decent ammount of EW in your mids and have any sort of a decent tank. If you armor tank it, at high level's of skill points the dps disparity between missles and guns really start to show. Since most combat is very close range, lack of extra dps because of the tiny or non existant drone bays also hurts.
You really got to be in a gang for caldari ships to be viable in PvP.
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Andreask14
Sensus Numinis
Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2006.09.19 23:58:00 -
[52]
Everybody is Caldri because they have the most appealing description on the race selection screen and other races¦ pilots train for caldari later because they have the best PvE ships.
I chose amarr because i was told they would have the best turrets combined with the best tank, focusing on pure might. Nowadays i wonder how i could fall for that.
Just because you are not paranoid, it does not mean that they arent after you.
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