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Victoria Zongo
Derelik Privateers
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Posted - 2006.10.03 14:35:00 -
[31]
Sure, it is a risky niche for small pirates.
It beats hunting in the over-fished belts for one measly cruiser kill per week. It is more feasible than fighting the big pirates for the gates. And if more people would put cargo in their holds, it might even be profitable.
But most importantly, it brought back the fun.
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flashfresh
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Posted - 2006.10.03 14:40:00 -
[32]
Yeah this sounds fun. Pickings in the belts are slim to say the least. Sentry tanking with a T1 cruiser sounds fun. Thanks to the OP for this.
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ôMe, I'm dishonest, and you can always trust a dishonest man to be dishonest. Honestly, it's the honest ones you have to watch out for...'ö
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Silane Daktor
Gelidity
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Posted - 2006.10.03 15:06:00 -
[33]
Ah, this reminds me.
If you do the same thing at a station, do you get more than 2 sentries firing at you? If not, how come you don't see station ganking so much (not people emerging from, but people warping to, then slowboating)?
Or does it happen, and I've just missed it?
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Eagle32
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Posted - 2006.10.04 03:39:00 -
[34]
 Originally by: Silane Daktor
Ah, this reminds me.
If you do the same thing at a station, do you get more than 2 sentries firing at you? If not, how come you don't see station ganking so much (not people emerging from, but people warping to, then slowboating)?
Or does it happen, and I've just missed it?
It happens and you missed it :p
Gates just have more traffic and if you get set up like the op advised your always in the right place if they ain't insta'd. With a station there are generally too many angles for them to come from and not al the many people actually stop at stations.
If you happen to see something jump to a station and you follow them thats when you generally kill stuff at stations.
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Famine Aligher'ri
V i L e
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Posted - 2006.10.04 04:16:00 -
[35]
Originally by: GenePool Chlorinator
Originally by: Famine Aligher'ri
To risky for the most part.
Risk is relative. I've lost exactly 1 cruiser doing this, and that was before I adjusted my tactics. The fittings on that cruiser cost me less than 3m after insurance. I've made over 500m isk in the last 2 weeks doing this. That's not a huge amount, but it was enough to buy me plenty more cruisers and even fit a few BS's to see what I can learn about BS tactics.
If the above risk/reward ratio seems unacceptable to you, I'd suggest you choose a profession other than piracy.
Risk in everything you do in EVE. Difference between risk and being to risky (stupid). Yes, it's good to be able to tank sentry long enough to kill smaller ships and or indy's. You still have to claim the loot. Which is something you don't have time to do unless you get right up on it and set to warp at a point on the way (Armor plate = slower agility). Though you can rely on alts for that part. Yay Alts 
There is an advantage to using lighter tanking ships for gate piracy. You have the agility to escape if you need to. You also have the agility to catch if you need too. Which are two major pluses when gate camping. Not to mention the tracking and all that goodness when using such tactics. However, it's just a hop and skip away from battlecruisers or for some HAC's. They do much better jobs and secure more tanked out indy's and ships with a kill than a loss. Which is something you will find to be worth more in piracy than hitting just the ave joe. Tanked out indy's usaly means better loot in my experience.
Anyways, what do I know eh? 
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Skybar
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Posted - 2006.10.04 09:21:00 -
[36]
It's also possible for a rupture with only a 800mm plate and not much else tanking to stay around long enough to pop an industrial. A gyrostab and some hail ammo will do your job.
But a larger plate offers more time at the gate, but I don't like the time to align. Of course, I haven't done this all too much, just the occassional hauler i'm passing by traveling between systems.
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Adoran Wa'alle
Caldari
Herzfall Armory
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Posted - 2006.10.04 11:39:00 -
[37]
It seems as if people do expect me to attack them in a cruiser at a gate. Indys always run when they warp in on me slowboating to the gates (stupid lack of instas). Anyway, I haven't tried this yet. Might try sometime. Which ship do you think is best suited for the role, Thorax or Maller? I can't fly a ruppy.
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CEO, Herzfall Armory |
GenePool Chlorinator
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Posted - 2006.10.04 13:00:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Adoran Wa'alle
It seems as if people do expect me to attack them in a cruiser at a gate. Indys always run when they warp in on me slowboating to the gates (stupid lack of instas). Anyway, I haven't tried this yet. Might try sometime. Which ship do you think is best suited for the role, Thorax or Maller? I can't fly a ruppy.
Personally? I'd go for the Maller... Better tank because of the resist mods, and with 5 guns the potential for better damage too if you stick a damage mod or two in its lows (of which it has one more than the Rupture). On the gate, I'm a fan of being able to comfortably stick around those few extra seconds as opposed for going for the highest damage... but either philosophy is acceptable and I've seen Thoraxes tear people up on the gates now as well!
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Crellion
Art of War
Cult of War
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Posted - 2006.10.04 19:42:00 -
[39]
Geenepool m8 do not attack inties like this cause there is this mod 20km disuptor that will drop your profitability dramatically. Otherwise good job in finding these things early in game for yourself without help.
Steer your second char towards pvp skills too and keep him above -1.9 sec if you want my advice. All aspects of pvp in eve are fun and with -10.0 sec you miss out on highsec warring (though thats arguably the less important / enjoyable) of the pvp alternatives.
Once you are bored with piracy and gate camping explore team based pvp that is rly cool. (Progress tree in EvE pvp looks like this: gang fights > solo fights > fleet fights > various types of ganks > noob pirating > dieing a lot to ganks > dieing a lot to solo peeps > POS defending > POS attacking)
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GenePool Chlorinator
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Posted - 2006.10.05 05:17:00 -
[40]
Crellion Mate... something tells me you didn't read my entire post. If inties are dumb enough to not MWD directly to the gate as soon as I jump in on them, they provide a large portion of my income.
You see.. there are these things called stasis webifiers.. and they slow you down. I have 2 of them. I start with those and make sure my target stays in web range before I ever open up with guns. Claws/Crows are some of my favorite targets because they die so fast to my AC's and drop such good loot. Inties tend to speed tank... and if I take that away from them.. they have virtually no tank at all!
That being said, I'm well aware of 20k disruptors and the fact that if something got into a wide orbit I'd be hosed. Thanks though....
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Liannah
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Posted - 2006.10.05 15:38:00 -
[41]
Great post Genepool. As you said this actually IS news to some, including me.
..always thought sentries were way out of my league!
I will definitly try out some of the tactics you described
may post some results here too 
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GenePool Chlorinator
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Posted - 2006.10.06 13:14:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Liannah
Great post Genepool. As you said this actually IS news to some, including me.
..always thought sentries were way out of my league!
I will definitly try out some of the tactics you described
may post some results here too
Thanks for the kind words.. glad you found it useful. And yes.. please do let me know how it goes for you.
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rharh
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Posted - 2006.10.08 22:45:00 -
[43]
Firstly: Sorry Im posting with an alt, my corp doesnt approve of piracy. however I was so boored that I have to try this out. If they get to know and it gets me kicked well thats ok I guess. I have to find a pirate corp then. For now I wanna keep carebearing awhile more if its possible.
After running some tests in qucikfit my calculations told me that my thorax would hold against sentry guns for about 35-40 sec. Enough time to kill hoarders, iterons I-III and haulers with similar stats.
My setup:
4 med neutrons + 1 light ion
webber + scram + med shiled extender (wasnt anything more suitiabe one market so I went with some more hp)
1600mm plate + therm and kinetic hardener + small rep + mag stab
10 light drones (figured they would soak upp some fire from the sentries)
Looking for a target for 3 hours and only seeing 3 industrials during that time, all using instas, I started to loose my courage. Maybe it isnt as profitable as some ppl claim? or am I looking in the wrong places? After mailing a friendly pirate whom I saw on the forums I got some advice where to look. After 5min in my new system of operation I found a target while still making my instas. "God damn it"!!! I was 27km away from him and he was in a iteron V heading for the gate. If only I were closer. My calculations told me I wouldnt be able to take an iteron V but since I had no target for more then 3 hours I told me self I should attack next industrial that I saw no matter what.
I set my scanning and escaping BMs upp. I waited awhile and the guy in the iteron V comes again! I miss calculated my camping spot, he was comming from a different angle. I approahced him slowly in my thorax with no velocity mods. Hes got a AB and approaching the gate pretty fast for a hauler. Hes probably 9000m from the gate when I get wihtin range to start firing. I see that I deal huge damage on him, his shields are down very fast. And I still havent got any damage from sentries, "wtf is going on" I think but I jinx it and just then they start firing on me. My shields go down very fast, but Im allready down to 50% of his armor when I start taking damage on my own armor. I tank the sentries pretty good. 60% resists in all dmg types except explosive works very well.
I get him to 10% structure when I suddenly loose target, I dont know why this happend if I clicked something or if he target jammed me, I was filled with adrenalin and couldnt controll myself to 100%, I did stand upp and shout though "nooo this cant be happening, wtf!" my armor reaching 70% and going down fast. Then I realize I have the drones \o/ but he is not very far from the gate (can he actually jump after using EW on me?). Finally -boom-, aaaah that nice blue light, thanks to my drones. Container is 3000m away from me and Im taking heavy damage - 30% armor :( I warp out to a SS nearby.
Lost one drone, now this could be a unexpensive experience if I didnt decide to try and get the container after repping to 60% armor with my small rep. I wanted to look in that can since he had some pretty nice stuff, a T2 mod and some nice stuff in cargo wich got destroyed. A combined value of 5mill in detroyed items. Trying to get the can lost me my ship as I fiddled around to much upon warping in, didnt even manage to look in the can because I didnt warp to my insta BM but to the normal stargate 15km. But also this time the guns were slow, maybe a 5-7 sec delay.
I want to thank op for making this thread, this was a totally new experience for me and lots of fun. I never realized you could do this in a cruiser.
I also would like to add that sentries seem to "wait" 5-7 seconds before firing atleast in these 2 cases.
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Tomohod
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Posted - 2006.10.09 13:03:00 -
[44]
Gotta love the way people write guides and then abbreviate every component in their setup so people looking for a guide are non the wiser ><
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Silane Daktor
Gelidity
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Posted - 2006.10.09 13:15:00 -
[45]
If you are referring to the OP:
1600mm RT plate = Rolled Tungsten
1 x SARII = Small Armour Repairer II
1 x EANM = Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
1 x RCU = Reactor Control Unit
1 x DCU = Damage Control Unit
Hope that helps
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Pichemanu
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Posted - 2006.10.09 21:25:00 -
[46]
I don't know if this thred accpets other t1 cruisers beside the rupture, but here goes :)
I am using a maller for gategcamping that is setup like this:
low:
-2*1600mm cristaline carbide plates (almost as good as rolled tungsten but much cheaper)
-2*energized adaptive nano
-1*damage control
-small armor rep (dosen't repair much but that's why u have 9500 armor hp :P)
med:
-2*x5 webbers (really upsets intys and stops industrials dead in the watter:P)
-1*warp scrambler (the 7.5 km type)
high:
-5*best small guns u can use: pulse lasers, blasters (t2 is great)
-1*small nosferatu (energy vampire)
I used no abreviations cose this is supposed to be a guide:).
I use a similar strategy with the op.
I camp a system with 2 gates that are about 24 au from eachother, and i made a bookmark right in the middle of warp from one to the other. I also created 2 bm that take me right at the gate.
I check local continuoasly and if someone new jumps in i scan on 360 degres, after i get the shiptype i scan on 5 degres (i keep the scan direction right on one of the gates for faster scaning). With the second scan i find out where the ship comes from so i can warp to the other gate (at the bm that lands me on top of the gate).
I warp to the other gate because the distances involved i can't usualy warp to the gate the target comes from intime to catch it, so i catch the target at the other gate (since there are only 2 it dosen't have many options:P). Oance there just w8 for the target to come and hope it dosen't have a bookmark to the gate.
Hope it helps.
*********
buhuhu...
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GenePool Chlorinator
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Posted - 2006.10.11 12:03:00 -
[47]
Definitely glad to see a Maller setup in here. I'll be training Amarr cruisers next specifically because the idea of the Maller with its 5 guns, extra low slot for tank or a damage mod, and inherent resists seems to be the best ship out there for this sort of thing.
I recognize I'll lose damage for not having the damage mod on the ship, but I think the extra gun + the extra low slot which would be damage or would allow you to stick around that much longer makes enough difference for it to be worthwhile.
I'm looking forward to trying out a Maller myself!
And just as an aside, I've finally gotten trained for BS's, but the lack of agility making it harder to warp out means that I still prefer my Rupture solo unless there is a group on the gate to prevent gankage. This is still loads of fun and the best profit:risk ration for me!
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Tareen Kashaar
eXin Alliance
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Posted - 2006.10.11 13:25:00 -
[48]
Edited by: Tareen Kashaar on 11/10/2006 13:25:50
Originally by: vile56
i always attack things at a gate in my maller.
Seconded, gotta lurv the Maller <3
Here's a setup that I've used a lot and that's been great fun, I've killed many things at a gate that went "WTF... but... you're in a cruiser!", but I haven't used it for stationary gate camping, just for roaming around.
Highs:
4x Medium Beam Laser II (w/ Aurora you can shoot out to ~35km)
2x Medium Nosferatu
Meds:
1x Afterburner II
1x Web
1x 20km Scrambler
Lows:
1x Medium Armor Repairer II
2x Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane I
1x 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates
...fill the remaining two lows with pg/cap/damage mods as you have to
Edit: All in all, this ship + setup + insurance should cost about 20-25mil.
So far it hasn't failed against a single t1 or t2 frigate, and it got a bunch of cruisers as well :)
Word of advice though, don't try to attack Megathrons in it when drunk. 
After reading this thread, I think I'm gonna try some solo gatecamping in it with an adapted fitting :D
---
WTS: Forum Signatures, 30mil a piece. Evemail me!
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General Coochie
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Posted - 2006.10.11 14:24:00 -
[49]
Edited by: General Coochie on 11/10/2006 14:24:51
Isnt 1 thermic + 1 kinetic better then 2 EANMs? Gotta take into calculations you allready have about 60 EM resist and 2 EANMs get a penalty - stacking. And that sentries deal far more damage in thermic and kinetic. But it does take some more SP to use hardeners.
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t'SunaMi
Imperial Shipment
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Posted - 2006.10.11 18:54:00 -
[50]
Nicely written man.
Originally by: GenePool Chlorinator
I've made over 500m isk in the last 2 weeks doing this.
What is this **** ? Are you telling me you've made all that in a rupture ?
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GenePool Chlorinator
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Posted - 2006.10.12 07:25:00 -
[51]
Originally by: General Coochie
Edited by: General Coochie on 11/10/2006 14:24:51
Isnt 1 thermic + 1 kinetic better then 2 EANMs? Gotta take into calculations you allready have about 60 EM resist and 2 EANMs get a penalty - stacking. And that sentries deal far more damage in thermic and kinetic. But it does take some more SP to use hardeners.
From what I've read, you are correct. I've yet to switch my setup over to the Therm/Kinetic hardeners, but I believe that it will actually tank better that way than with 2 T1 EANMs. I'll probably do that soon.
And about all the isk... yes.. I got VERY lucky my first 2 weeks of this. Popped a frig full of megacyte, a hauler with a Domi Gyro (among other things) and snagged a cloak or two off some unwary cloakers. Because I had just started gate camping, I didn't have the perspective to realize that I'd just gotten lucky. My last week or so of this have been more reasonable and I've averaged about 10m loot a day or so depending on how much I play.
It's still great fun, and I have learned to especially enjoy doing my part in gangs of BS's. I've actually been able to stay on the gate long enough for the guns to shift off me on at least 2 different times which is pretty cool for a cruiser.
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tiller
Beer and Kebabs
Pirate Coalition
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Posted - 2006.10.12 10:38:00 -
[52]
Best cruiser for the job is a raven
ohh wait 
Click me for Pirate Coalition Website of Gankage |
GenePool Chlorinator
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Posted - 2006.10.13 09:16:00 -
[53]
Edited by: GenePool Chlorinator on 13/10/2006 09:21:09
Well.. I had the honor of camping some with Tiller last night and modified my mids to include a sensor booster and a 20k scram so I could help nab the faster ships at gates. This worked famously and we made a fair amount of isk while having some good fun. I took the above suggestion and swapped my 2 x EANM's for 2 x hardeners (Therm and Kinetic) and that worked really well. With a few BS's on the gate I was 'almost' able to stick around without warping off while flagged. I made it through 4 rotations of the guns swapping to me before I had to go and I left at half armor!
/me is glad Tiller is on my side! Unfortunately, Tiller was afk when the best fun of the evening came along.
The real test of my tank came when 2 x War Targets warped into system. The 2 BS's with me had just initiated warp across an 80 AU system when they spotted them at a gate. I warped in solo on a Stabber and Brutix not realizing that my BS firepower had just left.
I tried to get out when I got there, but with a 1600mm plate attached, the Ruppy is none too agile. The Brutix and Stabber quickly achieved a lock and started to close. Both were emplying ECM, and I was instantly jammed, finally on the 4th cycle, they both missed and I was able to lock, web, scram and begin to pummel the Stabber. I had gotten him to about 75% armor when the jams kicked in again but my armor was still at about 50% (over 1.5 minutes into the fight).
At this point I'm starting to get frantic and my BS support is telling me they are 30, 20, 10 AU out. My armor tank is dropping faster now that both the Brutix and the stabber have closed to optimal range, and I enter structure just as the first BS finally shows up. Jedi Masterpimp instapopped the Stabber.. but given that my structure was dropping I was sure it was me in the explosion. I was already spamming 'warp to' to whatever planet I'd randomly chosen on the overview to get my pod out.
As my second friend, PCaBoo, showed up in his Raven, the Brutix barely got aligned and warped out. And me... well.. my little Ruppy survived with 22% structure.
The best part was Gus Preston (the owner of the Brutix) complaining about how much he hated the Brutix and was going to sell it because it couldn't even break a Rupture's tank.
In any case, kudos to both Angry23 (Stabber) and Gus Preston (Brutix) for a great fight with minimal smack on either side. And a bigger kudos for Jedi Masterpimp and PCaBoo for arriving to save the day at exactly the right time to give this young Rupture pilot maximum excitement with minimal loss.
This one will definitely go down in my young, 4 month old, book of Greatest Fights.
Not exactly a solo cruiser on the gate story, but a testament to a great (and surprising) tank and the capabilities of this setup.
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Silane Daktor
Soar Angelic
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Posted - 2006.10.13 10:48:00 -
[54]
Excellent story! Sounds like a great fight I am loving my gatecampy Rupture
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GenePool Chlorinator
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Posted - 2006.10.16 19:59:00 -
[55]
Ok.. so I tried using similar tactics in BS's and learned that the agility and tracking of BS's make the tactics a bit different. Similar stuff would probably still work, but the first time I tried it on a frig it made me warp back out because it orbited me at 500m and I still couldn't hit it! (I'd forgotten to load drones) How embarassing is that?
After playing with BS's awhile, I've decided I honestly have more fun on gates in my solo Rupture. At least until I get some more skill points trained. So, having (finally) trained Engineering to 5 (but still with relatively poor gunnery skills) I've adapted my setup.
Highs: 3 x 425mm Autocannons, 1 x 220mm Autocannon, 2 x Standard Missile Launchers
This deals the most DPS of any available options for me (my missile skills are even lower than my gunnery skills). As an alternative, I could go with smaller guns and put a Medium Armor Repper on, but even with the T2 variety fitted, the armor repper doesn't seem to give me enough extra time on the gate to justify the lower DPS.
Meds: Still the same... 2 x Statis Webifiers and a 7.5km scrambler
As mentioned in my post about working together with Tiller above, fitting 2 x Sensor Boosters and a 20km scram means you can even nab frigs as they come through the gate we're sitting on top of on some occasions. I think if I trained signature analysis higher and wasn't dealing with a 2-3 second module delay from a crappy connection I'd get them almost every time.
Lows: Damage Control Unit, 1600mm Rolled Tungsten, Small Armor Repper II, Thermic Hardener and Kinetic Hardener
As someone had mentioned in previous posts, the hardners are better than the EANM's and this DOES appear to buy me a few extra seconds on the gate. I think Sanguine Legion may have also suggested using hardeners, so I probably should have listened the first time around. Since I've fitted this I've started killing pods along with the frigs/shuttles/haulers I've been targeting. I think that is in large part due to the extra tanking ability. However, it might also be a result of the higher DPS from swapping around the guns to account for the more power grid.
As a side note, I was experimenting with more flexible setups and came up with the following:
Highs: Medium Nosferatu / Standard Missile Launcher / 4 x Dual 180mm Autocannons
Meds: Micro Warpdrive / Warp Scrambler / Stasis Webifier
Lows: Damage Control Unit / Small Armor Repairer II/ 1600mm Rolled Tungsten / Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane I / Reactor Control Unit
This setup is much more flexible and has allowed me to belt hunt and still target things I see on the gates while out hunting. And because the tank is still surprisingly deep, I'm able to take some things by surprise who don't anticipate me sticking around long enough to do them in.
Thanks again to Sanguine Legion for being the first to demonstrate to me that Cruisers could even survive on a gate. I ended up developing the tactics involved and adapting the fittings (not that either the tactics or the fittings are anything revolutionary) on my own, but I'm sure had I stuck around Sanguine longer they could've shown me all this and more.
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Portios Smith
Sanguine Legion
Pirate Coalition
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Posted - 2006.10.16 20:58:00 -
[56]
Our old Zen master showed me a better way to camp in a battleship, after the first pod goes plop! I knew right then I had found the perfect hobby I will never be bored again 
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Zerker
Caldari
The Yarrmada
Pirate Coalition
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Posted - 2006.10.16 23:17:00 -
[57]
Anyone got a setup for a MOA for this?
Cheers
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GenePool Chlorinator
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Posted - 2006.10.17 09:11:00 -
[58]
Portios, I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that the 'Sanguine Zen Master' probably showed you what I pretty quickly figured out after my kestrel incident. I went back to Quickfit to check optimals and tracking thinking I needed to warp in at a different range to make sure I could hit them well. What I realized though, was that as long as I could keep them outside of 6km, I could double web even Inty's and get the fastest of them down to about 40m/s. At those speeds, I could hit them as long as I kept them beyond 6km's. This made Smart Bombs the semi-obvious choice to make sure they stayed outside that range.
I ended up fitting 2 x Smart Bombs (faction type for the extra range) and left the rest of my setup the same. I've had great fun with it and insta pop most shuttles/frigs/pods etc. Plus, because I didn't go with a full smartbomb setup I can still take out cruisers and BC's solo because I can hit them at range. It's been great fun and gives me the best of both worlds. I've even gotten Covert Ops ships with this setup. It's a blast!
So.. was I right? Is this what the great Sanguine Zen Master shared with you?
I've also considered a full rack of Smart Bombs, but they are CPU heavy and so I need to train some more fitting skills first. Should be fun once I get there though.. I'll just have to work on my target selection again.
As for a Moa, I will qualify everything that follows by pointing out that I have ZERO operational experience from the inside of a Caldari Ship. That being said, I think the principles should be the same and I've given it my best shot.
Highs: 4 x Blasters (highest damage you can fit) / 2 x Standard Missile Launchers
In all honesty, because their is no damage bonus to med hybrid weaponry, I'd probably fit Projectile Weaponry to the Moa and save on grid if it were me, but I'm going to assume you are asking about the Moa because you haven't trained the skills for the other ship / turret types. You'll also have to play with ammo to setup for a range that allows you to hit well from 2km - 8km or so based on your skills.
Meds: 2 x Large Shield Extenders / Stasis Webifier / Shield Booster
The natural bonus to shield resists on the Moa practically demand that it be shield tanked. I didn't list a size for the shield booster, because the size will be dependant upon the leftover grid from the blaster fittings above. Don't worry about it too much though because the main purpose is to clean up after the fight. Without the shield booster, you'd have to wait almost as long (with my skills) as the 15 minute agression timer for your shields to recharge. There have been numerous times I've jumped back in in my Rupture while still flagged and I'd assume you'd want the same capability in your Moa.
The fact that you only have 1 Webifier means you'll want to leave inty's alone because you won't be able to slow them enough for your tracking if they decide to fight. And the lack of a scram is not a huge deal because most people don't try to warp anyway.
Lows: Damage Control Unit / Small Armor Repper / 2 x Mag Stabs
The Damage Control Unit will boost your resists slightly and give you some extra peace of mind. The Small Armor Repper is only to clean up from the inevitable armor damage you'll take without having to dock, and the Damage Mods are there to make sure you kill them quickly and get out before you take too much for your Armor Repper to manage!
The above setup will give you comparable hit points, a bit lower resists, and comparable damage to my Rupture setup. On the plus side, it's CHEAPER! Not the perfect choice, but it should be doable. There are probably some other things that could be tweaked based on experience, but I don't have any in Caldari ships so the above is the best I could come up with based on theory as opposed to practical experience.
Anyone else please feel free to shoot me down or offer advice.
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Zerker
Caldari
The Buccaneers
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Posted - 2006.10.26 01:57:00 -
[59]
erm wrong toon :P
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bumblebeawasp
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Posted - 2006.10.26 01:57:00 -
[60]
Cheers gonna have a bash at that tommorow :)
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