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Aven Valkyr
Digital Goods Apocalypse Now Alliance
2
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Posted - 2015.02.07 00:02:24 -
[1] - Quote
Now here is an idea I'm sure most will agree on.
We have all done it, especially in our younger years as eve pilots. We have all ruined our reputation with certain factions due to missioning, not realizing that "gallente" is actually "The Gallente Empire". So ruining your reputation while trying to run missions results in getting you blown up while traversing gallente space. Of course, as a caldari pilot, I'm using gallente as an example.
I understand that there are empires at war and that it's important to be able to lower your faction standings towards another faction in order to partake in faction warefare. So here is my proposal:
Separate agents that offer missions against your standard NPC/Rat factions from the playable faction races. Make your standard missions only deliver missions of NPC/rat factions, and create new agents that deliver missions against the warring empires. This will do several things:
-Keep people from ruining their reputation for declining missions within the 4 hour time limit -Keep people from turning the game off due to having turn down missions and having nothing else to do -Makes the mission turndowns less frequent since a lot of people also avoid low sec missions as well -Gives people who are looking to enter into faction warfare an available set of agents they can run to target a specific player faction -Gives players more control over who they are warring against.
Please consider this proposal. Thanks |
Lugh Crow-Slave
676
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Posted - 2015.02.07 00:35:39 -
[2] - Quote
A.) even if you just do distribution missions and kill no one as your caldari goes up your amarr will also go up and you gal and minm will go down
B.) This is a core part of the game you make a choice and live with the consequences
Fuel block colors
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Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
3427
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Posted - 2015.02.07 01:22:25 -
[3] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:A.) even if you just do distribution missions and kill no one as your caldari goes up your amarr will also go up and you gal and minm will go down
B.) This is a core part of the game you make a choice and live with the consequences
A thing regarding A) that I would like to point out is that unless you are killing a faction's ships, your standings towards any particular empire will not go below -5 and thus you will not reach "kill on sight" standings. |
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Farsaidh's Freeborn
944
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Posted - 2015.02.07 03:03:59 -
[4] - Quote
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:A.) even if you just do distribution missions and kill no one as your caldari goes up your amarr will also go up and you gal and minm will go down
B.) This is a core part of the game you make a choice and live with the consequences A thing regarding A) that I would like to point out is that unless you are killing a faction's ships, your standings towards any particular empire will not go below -5 and thus you will not reach "kill on sight" standings.
I've been practically genocidal towards Amarr due to their slavery yet through diplomacy i can still travel there in safety. This is a non-issue if you use the skills available. |
Aven Valkyr
Digital Goods Apocalypse Now Alliance
2
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Posted - 2015.02.07 03:15:46 -
[5] - Quote
I have not yet seen my standings go down for the opposing factions due to my main faction standings go up. I'm talking regular L4 combat missions here. I always declined any mission that goes against any other empire since I realized that my gallente standings got so bad I couldn't fly thru their space. All I'm asking for here is a separation between agents who give regular missions vs NPC factions and agents who give missions against the 4 main dominant factions. It's not too much to ask.. |
Iain Cariaba
1031
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Posted - 2015.02.07 17:43:30 -
[6] - Quote
Aven Valkyr wrote:I have not yet seen my standings go down for the opposing factions due to my main faction standings go up. I'm talking regular L4 combat missions here. I always declined any mission that goes against any other empire since I realized that my gallente standings got so bad I couldn't fly thru their space. All I'm asking for here is a separation between agents who give regular missions vs NPC factions and agents who give missions against the 4 main dominant factions. It's not too much to ask.. I ran l4 Caldari Navy missions for years, not caring what my standings with the other factions were. Now that I don't run them anymore, I find absolutly no problems flying around wherever I want. FacPo doesn't bother me at all, even in Gallente space, so I really don't see what you're asking for to be very important.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
"This reminds me - I must complain to my local butcher about him not catering to vegitarians." - admiral root responding to someone whining about too much PvP in Eve Online.
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Aven Valkyr
Digital Goods Apocalypse Now Alliance
2
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Posted - 2015.02.07 20:41:14 -
[7] - Quote
my standings went to -7.98 with gallente for running caldari missions throughout my career :( |
Lugh Crow-Slave
681
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Posted - 2015.02.07 20:52:26 -
[8] - Quote
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:A.) even if you just do distribution missions and kill no one as your caldari goes up your amarr will also go up and you gal and minm will go down
B.) This is a core part of the game you make a choice and live with the consequences A thing regarding A) that I would like to point out is that unless you are killing a faction's ships, your standings towards any particular empire will not go below -5 and thus you will not reach "kill on sight" standings.
this is true
Aven Valkyr wrote:my standings went to -7.98 with gallente for running caldari missions throughout my career :(
get your diplo skill up and it should become almost above -5.0
and if you need to fix your standings go run SOE they will more or less lower/raise your standings to 0.0
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Ix Method
Shadows Legion High-Sec Tomfoolery
399
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Posted - 2015.02.07 21:03:36 -
[9] - Quote
Making people run around in their fat-arsed battleships just for tags is a bit daft.
Wouldn't be adverse to removing the decline timer for Anti-Empire missions though, mechanics that effectively stop people playing are pretty terrible.
Travelling at the speed of love.
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Celthric Kanerian
Ascendance Of New Eden Workers Trade Federation
224
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Posted - 2015.02.07 21:42:10 -
[10] - Quote
There is a reason behind the Diplomatic skill books... |
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Aven Valkyr
Digital Goods Apocalypse Now Alliance
2
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Posted - 2015.02.08 00:25:55 -
[11] - Quote
my diplomacy is trained to 4. Look this is a simple matter that should meet little to no resistance. The point is, having to decline missions simply because they are against a majour faction really sucks. That 4 hour cooldown timer makes me stop playing the game. Does that sound reasonable to you? This is an issue and it needs to be addressed. Not everyone plays in faction warefare. Not everyone plays in lowsec. Laugh and scoff all you want but I play the game mainly in empire and I'm sick of my standings going up and down they way they do.
Also, if I am not mistaken, Sisters of Eve is to fix your concord status, not your faction standings. I have done everything I can possibly do and now I'm stuck running hundreds of L1 missions to get the menial storyline missions that increase my standings by .04 each time. It's a brutal grind to fix standings. If you guys really LOVE the system the way it is then cudo's to you. At the very *very* minimum CCP should at least allow the selling of tags to L2 data center agents at a standing of below +1. Those agents should be available to anyone with a status of -5 or better. If I can't fix my standings any other way than grinding the hell outta L1 agents then there should at least be a way for me to buy my way up to better standings. Also realize these agents can only be used once in a lifetime.
But the ideal fix would be to fix the way empire missions are granted to begin with. My idea of moving factional missions over to agents that are specific to faction warefare should be looked at. If you are in to faction warefare then great. This system I'm trying to get across here would be better for everyone. Less frequent mission declines for the carebears, the guys in FW win, and the data center agents are used for their correct purpose. To increase the hell out of already positive standings. |
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3198
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Posted - 2015.02.08 00:38:51 -
[12] - Quote
If you're on decline cooldown or whatever you call it, can't you just take your officer fir raven or whatever to another agent? There are hundreds of the buggers around. |
Tiddle Jr
Galvanized Inc.
37
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Posted - 2015.02.08 06:43:46 -
[13] - Quote
Gallente always was and is a Federation, remember this.
As an option you could have two alts running missions for you and never bother about your main. |
Nebaile Sharisa
Annoying Flies At A Barbecue
3
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Posted - 2015.02.08 13:17:00 -
[14] - Quote
Why not spend the money for the tags to do the faction rep missions that every faction has for one time only. |
Lugh Crow-Slave
688
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Posted - 2015.02.08 13:23:20 -
[15] - Quote
if you don't want to decline missions you risk dropping standings with other factions faster if you don't want to do that you are going to need to decline some missions or as i said go run missions for SOE
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Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
3433
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Posted - 2015.02.08 14:00:33 -
[16] - Quote
Aven Valkyr wrote:my diplomacy is trained to 4. Look this is a simple matter that should meet little to no resistance. The point is, having to decline missions simply because they are against a majour faction really sucks. That 4 hour cooldown timer makes me stop playing the game. Does that sound reasonable to you? This is an issue and it needs to be addressed. Not everyone plays in faction warefare. Not everyone plays in lowsec. Laugh and scoff all you want but I play the game mainly in empire and I'm sick of my standings going up and down they way they do.
Train your Diplomacy to Lv5. This is a no-brainer that should have been done even before you made a thread on the forums. The point is, you're coming around here asking for changes to the game that will strip away the need to make decisions and the consequences of those decisions and then you're surprised when you don't get a resounding vote of agreement. At its very core, EVE is a game about choices and consequences. You're asking to alter the very thing that brings many of us here in the first place, to change the nature of the game on a fundamental level just because of missions. Does that sound reasonable to you? Nobody's forcing you to stop playing. Nobody's forcing you to only do missions. Nobody's forcing anything on you or taking away other options you can choose to spend your time on except you. You are the one who is choosing to only play in highsec, to only do missions and to only do those missions for one agent. The entire scenario you're saying needs to be changed is built on brick after brick of choices that you have made.
Quote:Also, if I am not mistaken, Sisters of Eve is to fix your concord status, not your faction standings. I have done everything I can possibly do and now I'm stuck running hundreds of L1 missions to get the menial storyline missions that increase my standings by .04 each time. It's a brutal grind to fix standings. If you guys really LOVE the system the way it is then cudo's to you. At the very *very* minimum CCP should at least allow the selling of tags to L2 data center agents at a standing of below +1. Those agents should be available to anyone with a status of -5 or better. If I can't fix my standings any other way than grinding the hell outta L1 agents then there should at least be a way for me to buy my way up to better standings. Also realize these agents can only be used once in a lifetime.
SoE missions do not "fix" CONCORD standings. They - and all other missions - slowly increase security status by virtue of shooting pirate NPCs. It's the same "fix" you would get by ratting in low/null asteroid belts. You can already give tags to datacenter agents for a substantial standings boost and they're already once-in-a-lifetime. You made your choices. Live with them. Don't ask CCP to fix your mess because you were too lazy/ignorant/shortsighted to not make that mess in the first place.
Quote:But the ideal fix would be to fix the way empire missions are granted to begin with. My idea of moving factional missions over to agents that are specific to faction warefare should be looked at. If you are in to faction warefare then great. This system I'm trying to get across here would be better for everyone. Less frequent mission declines for the carebears, the guys in FW win, and the data center agents are used for their correct purpose. To increase the hell out of already positive standings.
Why should it be looked at? What makes you so sure your idea deserves to be looked at more than someone else's? Or at all? Anti-faction missions are fine where they are; some people don't care about their standings and this would serve only to decrease the pool of missions they can draw from - something nobody wants or needs. Others who do care about them can easily decline the mission and most dedicated mission-runners have multiple agents in case they pull two bad missions in a row from one agent. Obviously you don't and feel you shouldn't have to have more than one agent, but other missioners have more than one agent.
The system is perfectly fine the way it is. The only things that particularly need changing are how god-awful boring and farmable missions are and how predictably self-entitled carebears are.
Are we done here? |
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Farsaidh's Freeborn
945
|
Posted - 2015.02.08 14:13:37 -
[17] - Quote
I'd also point out that th COSMOS missions are the fastet way to repair your standings for any one given faction should the need arise. No change necessary, simply rotate through your agents when the faction missions come up and go try something new if they all lock out for a bit. |
Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
2261
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Posted - 2015.02.08 18:06:34 -
[18] - Quote
Faction Standing Repair Plan
However, the ability to decline faction missions without an agent standing loss would be nice. You can get a few of these buggers in a row.
EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided" "So it will be up to a pilot to remain vigilant wherever they may be flying and be ready for anything at any time"
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Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
3437
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Posted - 2015.02.08 18:58:18 -
[19] - Quote
Daichi Yamato wrote:Faction Standing Repair Plan However, the ability to decline faction missions without an agent standing loss would be nice. You can get a few of these buggers in a row.
Multiple agents. It's uncommon for two agents to give you a bad mission followed by another bad mission and even if it happens, you can still go run some PI or something. |
Aven Valkyr
Digital Goods Apocalypse Now Alliance
2
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Posted - 2015.02.16 01:48:18 -
[20] - Quote
Well my other mission agent has given me a faction mission. So I go to the 2nd agent.. run one pathetic little L4. Great. Cashin.. next mission is against amarr. Then 3 in a row that force u to use an assault frig. Turned those ones down. No harm no foul. Then another mission against caldari. UGH. Incursions are down. Everyone in corp is offline so no pvp either. Game is now being shut off. I'm a 2006 player and I have been frustrated over this mechanic for a long time. Yeah I could spend my time flying around eve pulling missions from multiple agents. the only problem is that over half of them are in low sec. not going there with my shiny. The other ones that are in empire are so close to low sec that half the missions they give you send you to low sec. Turning those down too. Then I get another faction mission. Only about 15% of agents are "safe". But they offer many faction missions. Getting tired of it. I'm serious. CCP needs to look at this. I know you PVP guys are all about it. Well good for you. I still think something needs to be done. Switch the faction missions over to agents that are there to give you the faction missions. Reduce the frequency of faction missions. Eliminate the 4 hour cooldown time. Do SOMETHING to fix it. |
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Colette Kassia
Kassia Industrial Supply
53
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Posted - 2015.02.16 03:16:36 -
[21] - Quote
If you can turn in tags for CONCORD rep then it seems reasonable that you should be able to do the same for the four major factions. Perhaps you could turn in a truckload of mission insignias to get you rep up to, but not above, 0.0 |
Jeaile
OCBF
8
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Posted - 2015.02.16 04:01:25 -
[22] - Quote
If this has been an issue for so long, I don't get how you are yet to overcome it, must be lazy or stupid I guess.
If you have one faction that your standings are too low for, then fly missions against their opposite, yes that means the opposite one will drop a little, but your biggest faction increases come from flying faction missions.
Or, what I think is the case her is that you want to have super high standings for all factions, and rather than doing the hard yards to try and get there, you want someone to gift it to you.
toughen up |
Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
154
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Posted - 2015.02.16 04:34:50 -
[23] - Quote
Your last post reminds me of a line from an old country song "if it weren't for bad luck I'd have no luck at all." If your run of luck is that bad with mission agents perhaps it is time to find something else to do when you cannot PvP.
Agents from the same NPC tend to give missions from the same sub-set of the available pool, they also tend to fall into about the same frequency of giving out faction mission. Get a faction mission do not just move to another agent move to another NPC, and it is even better if you change to one that is not affiliated with the same faction. You claim to have been in this game since 2006 and yet you have not figured out one of the most basic aspects of running missions.
If you care about standings you should be rotating between factions anyway since doing so tends to keep you standings balanced. Any negative you take here balances out when you run them over there.
So welcome to the missions club, all of us face the same issues. We have figured out how to make it all work out for us, perhaps you are not really of the mind set to be a missions pilot.
Even though we all face the same issues we still say no to separating the faction missions out of the normal pool, having to deal with them is just one of the "risks" or hassles if you prefer of running missions.
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Aven Valkyr
Digital Goods
2
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Posted - 2015.02.16 07:25:00 -
[24] - Quote
Donnachadh wrote:Your last post reminds me of a line from an old country song "if it weren't for bad luck I'd have no luck at all." If your run of luck is that bad with mission agents perhaps it is time to find something else to do when you cannot PvP.
Agents from the same NPC tend to give missions from the same sub-set of the available pool, they also tend to fall into about the same frequency of giving out faction mission. Get a faction mission do not just move to another agent move to another NPC, and it is even better if you change to one that is not affiliated with the same faction. You claim to have been in this game since 2006 and yet you have not figured out one of the most basic aspects of running missions.
If you care about standings you should be rotating between factions anyway since doing so tends to keep you standings balanced. Any negative you take here balances out when you run them over there.
So welcome to the missions club, all of us face the same issues. We have figured out how to make it all work out for us, perhaps you are not really of the mind set to be a missions pilot.
Even though we all face the same issues we still say no to separating the faction missions out of the normal pool, having to deal with them is just one of the "risks" or hassles if you prefer of running missions.
Because having to leave my mission hub where I have all my fittings and ships to go 30 jumps to the next agent is extremely time consuming and not profitable. I get you guys feel like you are beating your heads against a wall here. But I am not standing down from my suggestions. CCP needs to look at changing the system in some way. I keep saying it. Deliver faction missions through agents that only give those missions. Eliminate the 4 hour cooldown time. Do *something* to change the system. At the end of the day running all around the galaxy to pull missions from one agent to the next because they are giving me faction based missions is incredibly time consuming and IMO not really an option. Instead of saying "you are right, I give up" I would like a CCP dev to read this post and at least consider changing it. Imagine if they did change it. in the short run it might hurt FW gankers. But in the long run it might actually be better for FW. They could create a whole system to support it. Even introduce a "faction warefare" starter agent. Give ppl the option to PVP the carebear way. Why is it so f*ing difficult for you ppl to get this. Yeah I hear what you are saying. Go from agent to agent. I've done that. It sucks. IT'S NOT AN OPTION. PPL leave the game for various reasons. Destroying their rep with a faction is one of them. Don't you realize there are ppl who play this game for the PVE content and have NO INTEREST in PVP? This suggested change would help the game immensely IMO. It would keep ppl from turning the game off. Every time I get another faction mission within my cooldown I come back to this thread.. angry.. ready to shut the game off.. and then I read you ppl saying how dumb I am for not spending hours flying around looking for the next agent. Instead of supporting the idea that hey.. maybe it could be different? I am not throwing this suggestion out to the community to scrutinize. I want the DEVS to see it and maybe act on it. If you hate the idea so much.. then maybe start your own thread. |
Juan Mileghere
Incident Command Southern Star Dominion
3
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Posted - 2015.02.16 13:46:48 -
[25] - Quote
There's all of these nice Incursions and Combat Sites but you still do missions... you don't sound like a mission runner, they... they find a way... |
Anthar Thebess
866
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Posted - 2015.02.16 14:06:52 -
[26] - Quote
Actually running missions for Caldari should totally ruin your standing towards Gallente and Amarr even when you don't hit those faction ships. Simply because you are supporting their enemy.
This could actually put more life in eve and make choices you make more demanding.
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Corraidhin Farsaidh
Farsaidh's Freeborn
964
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Posted - 2015.02.16 14:13:06 -
[27] - Quote
Aven Valkyr wrote:
Because having to leave my mission hub where I have all my fittings and ships to go 30 jumps to the next agent is extremely time consuming and not profitable. I get you guys feel like you are beating your heads against a wall here. But I am not standing down from my suggestions. CCP needs to look at changing the system in some way. I keep saying it. Deliver faction missions through agents that only give those missions. Eliminate the 4 hour cooldown time. Do *something* to change the system. At the end of the day running all around the galaxy to pull missions from one agent to the next because they are giving me faction based missions is incredibly time consuming and IMO not really an option. Instead of saying "you are right, I give up" I would like a CCP dev to read this post and at least consider changing it. Imagine if they did change it. in the short run it might hurt FW gankers. But in the long run it might actually be better for FW. They could create a whole system to support it. Even introduce a "faction warefare" starter agent. Give ppl the option to PVP the carebear way. Why is it so f*ing difficult for you ppl to get this. Yeah I hear what you are saying. Go from agent to agent. I've done that. It sucks. IT'S NOT AN OPTION. PPL leave the game for various reasons. Destroying their rep with a faction is one of them. Don't you realize there are ppl who play this game for the PVE content and have NO INTEREST in PVP? This suggested change would help the game immensely IMO. It would keep ppl from turning the game off. Every time I get another faction mission within my cooldown I come back to this thread.. angry.. ready to shut the game off.. and then I read you ppl saying how dumb I am for not spending hours flying around looking for the next agent. Instead of supporting the idea that hey.. maybe it could be different? I am not throwing this suggestion out to the community to scrutinize. I want the DEVS to see it and maybe act on it. If you hate the idea so much.. then maybe start your own thread.
I just did a quick check and have at least 24 level IV agents within 4 jumps of me at any time and I've never yet run a level IV mission. How in Eve do you need to go 30 jumps for the next agent??? |
Xe'Cara'eos
A Big Enough Lever
225
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Posted - 2015.02.16 18:06:44 -
[28] - Quote
clearly someone is in the wrong spot - he needs to move and/or get an alt - also, find an agent who was 'internal security' before the agent type change hit..... I think they still tend to give less faction missions.....
For posting an idea into F&I:
come up with idea, try and think how people could abuse this, try to fix your idea - loop the process until you can't see how it could be abused, then post to the forums to let us figure out how to abuse it.....
If your idea can be abused, it [u]WILL[/u] be.
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Michael Ignis Archangel
Caveat Emptor Technologies LP Liberti Fidelis
86
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Posted - 2015.02.16 18:45:41 -
[29] - Quote
Sounds like you're in the wrong spot. I don't always run missions, but I have done a good amount of it and this has quite literally never been a serious issue for me.
Even if it were, though, as a 2006 player I'm surprised you need reminding that Eve isn't a game where you get to do whatever you want and only accept the consequences you want. You can either do whatever you like, and accept the consequences, or define your acceptable consequences and do the things that bring those, and only those, about.
Shooting other empire's ships causes a tag drop, which is redeemable via LP stores for a good amount of ISK; what you are suggesting would void the efforts of those who knowingly sacrifice their standings to obtain such items.
L4 missions very rarely draw anti-faction missions as it is; from my experience they are far more common from L1-L3. In addition, there are L1 agents from all factions strewn about high security space that you can grind to repair your standings.
If I might speculate a bit, it sounds like this ran away from you while you weren't paying attention, and now you're upset about it.
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Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
160
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Posted - 2015.02.17 04:01:54 -
[30] - Quote
Not going to bother quoting your wall of text. Paragraphs please to make it easier to read.
This goes to answer the question from Corraidhin Farsaidh as well. If you need to go 30 jumps to get to another lvl 4 agent then you must be running for SOE since they are the only faction that has lvl 4 agents spread that far apart. There are ways to deal with this that do not require you to go 30 jumps if you are not willing to take them that is your choice.
All I am getting from your posts is essentially a temper tantrum over the way missions have been since I started this game and you want daddy CCP to fix it. My answer was, is and always will be deal with it. no matter where you are there are ways to work around these faction missions and thiey do not require you moving your base 30 jumps. So even though I dislike the faction aspect of missions I still say no you cannot have them separated out from the normal pool of lvl 4's and the reason is decisions and the consequences of making them. |
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