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To Exploit or not to Exploit!???

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Noggy	Posted - 2003.10.30 13:58:00 - [1] O.K I am sorry but I need to vent off a bit here. I usually don't post much to this forum as I use it to learn about the game and progress as I am relativly new. I have been an avid gamer for eons and have had my fair share of experience in Mmporgs. The thing I need to vent on is the attitude of some of you guys and the people who make this game, this including our helpful GM's on the acceptance of exploits. Now I already know from the previous posts what kind of replies I am going to get here and thats exactly why I need to vent. Let me just start off by saying that I agree that this game needs pirates, I am no care bare and have no problems in people being pirates or blasting ships away, I agree that this is needed to make this game a bit more interesting and the politics always bring a sense of community. What I do not agree with is the communites acceptance of exploiting in this game: Last night after reading my post on how to progress in the factories section on the fact that you can progress in this game without needing to mine for bistot. I decided to actually buy my megacyte and zydrine to build my first ship. Guess what? I had to go to a 0.4 system to get it, because even after 4 days I had none in my system. Now I understood the dangers of going into 0.0 space and know that you can get ganked in 0,4 too so I insured my ship and clone. Now here I am zoning into a system next to Torrinos and all I see after a bout a few seconds of loading is my pod just floating about in space!! I hear a smartass comment about, " Was that enough lag? Hehehehe" Yes thats right, some loser players decided that they would use the good ol Drone exploit again! Now before you start lecturing me on security zones and comming out with comments like " oh well thats your fault for being in 0.4 space" or " Well thats the game, stop whining about it" let me tell you that using drones to slow the game down IS AN EXPLOIT. YES Look up exploit Exploit = A vulnerability in software that can be used for breaking security or code bugs to benefit oneself to have an advantage of another person. I am sorry, but there is no argument here. Lagging up a system so badly on purpose and then bragging about it is indeed a griefer and indeed exploiting. The thing is I actually was prepared for a battle and prepared for the consequences but I am not prepared to just lie back and take it when someones clearly expoloiting the game mechanics. Then they had the cheek to turn around to me and start *****ing and moaning about the fact that "well you guys have sentry guns in 1.0 areas and I think thats an exploit". I was also told to contact any GM in game as this was considered acceptable and part of the Game by the Gm's!!!??? WTF?? No wonder people leave this game in droves when they get that kinda attitude. So what is basically being said is this: If you are a newbie then you can't do anything but mine veldspar in your own zone because if you try and do anything else we will use an exploit to kill you instantly and we can get away with it because thats the way the game is. So what do you think?? Bring on the flames :) Noggy
Fausto	Posted - 2003.10.30 14:50:00 - [2] Edited by: Fausto on 30/10/2003 14:50:02 There is something you can do. Arm your ship and join a group that is hunting pirates. and then you get to camp jump points and wait for pirates And you get them to scream: Exploit!!! Try it, will make you feel much better. ______ <brainpodder>
Zeldania	Posted - 2003.10.30 14:54:00 - [3] Noggy, Drones are a integral part of the game. Depending on the types of drones used, I see no exploit involved. If they were mining drones, then indeed it is a bit of a shady tactic but not classified as an exploit per se. You say the persons involved were bragging about it in local. Therefor you could copy the chatlog and send it in asan exploit. I doubt you will have success though as chat logs can be falsified. In any event, good luck in the future. You can console yourself in the knowledge that you had a good clone and insurance so your losses should be minimal.
Viceroy	Posted - 2003.10.30 15:11:00 - [4] Its not an exploit, have a cookie -
Avon	Posted - 2003.10.30 15:17:00 - [5] Quote: If they were mining drones, then indeed it is a bit of a shady tactic but not classified as an exploit per se. Actually, it is. ______________________________________________ Never argue with idiots. They will just drag it down to their level, and then beat you through experience.
Darrin Tobruk	Posted - 2003.10.30 15:44:00 - [6] i wouldn't mind hearing from a GM on this. or someone from ccp. i would like to hear their reasoning as to how this is not an exploit. _______________________________________________ Eris Discordia: On the scale of funny and constructive it scores low, real low.
Zarquon Beeblebrox	Posted - 2003.10.30 15:55:00 - [7] Quote: Noggy, I doubt you will have success though as chat logs can be falsified. Rest a sure that the chat logs are loged server side aswell =) -- Lady Beeblebrox Teddybears movies
Bexxly	Posted - 2003.10.30 16:06:00 - [8] [13yo mentality] Noggy stop being a whiney little ****head who needs to learn to STFU, so you were ganked, big deal, who cares, get over it, how can deploying drones be an exploit fool! [/13yo mentality]
SuicideFred	Posted - 2003.10.30 16:10:00 - [9] Quote: [13yo mentality] Noggy stop being a whiney little ****head who needs to learn to STFU, so you were ganked, big deal, who cares, get over it, how can deploying drones be an exploit fool! [/13yo mentality] Noggy is right. It's an exploit and everybody knows it. You're the one that needs to STFU.
Corpsicle	Posted - 2003.10.30 16:11:00 - [10] The reason this isnt clasified as an exploit is because CCP would be flooded with claims and they would not be able to verify most of them. So for the time being they're turning a blind eye to this. Once they change the way that spawn points are handled and add in the new code for preventing lagging then this will be a thing of the past. The reason that so many folk spawn camp is because its just about the only way to ensure a kill. Before they put gate guns everywhere there was very little spawn point camping.
Lord Guerdo	Posted - 2003.10.30 16:32:00 - [11] here we go again. USING OGRES WASPS OR ANY KIND OF ATTACK DRONES / SCOUT DRONES IS NOT AN EXPLOIT!!! USING HARVESTER / BASIC MINING DRONES IS!! that clear enough for yah??????? Few of us in Biomass have spoken to GM's ingame regarding this issue and they confirm that using those types of drones is not an exploit so please shut this **in thread up!!!! Lord Guerdo Biomass Cartel I mean c'mon, just think about it. What would make more sense then the 3 most hated alliances teaming up to lay waste to the people they all hate anyways? CA is already allied with PA, and TPS lies between the two alliances. Natural allies to be sure. But it's not just that, all but PA (and even some of them) have adopted a "stfu and die, or come and fight us, we don't give a ** what you think or do" philosophy, as well as a PvP Kill everyone not friend kind of mentality. These are the people in eve that kill or convert, the ones dedicated to the death of others, because history, circumstance, and the rest of eve have driven then to do so (except TPS, who are just cool ass pirates ).
XpoHoc	Posted - 2003.10.30 16:45:00 - [12] Using drones is no exploit => Drones need to be in space before the fight begins, because you have other things to do during a fight => deploying drones out of your bay before battle is no exploit => camping jump ins is no exploit. Even that you "exploit" a bad designed aspect of the game you still need your drone out before the fight begins.
Noggy	Posted - 2003.10.30 16:48:00 - [13] Strange how the guilty party considers this to not be an exploit eh? Though everyone else does? Also strange how you got so defensive and aggro about this. Maybe feeling a bit guilty? Where do GM's say this is not an exploit? Its so obviously an exploit it has exploit written all over it in bold neon lighting!! How can you say that lagging the server down so much that the person has absolutley NO way of doing jack about it is fair and part of the game? Thats BULL man! And you know it. Oh and besides, I am not 13 and I do not have a 13year old mentality. I am not crying cause I got ganked I am complaining about the fact that some people here are doing these deeds by cheating and they blimming well know it. Noggy
Noggy	Posted - 2003.10.30 16:51:00 - [14] Quote: Using drones is no exploit => Drones need to be in space before the fight begins, because you have other things to do during a fight => deploying drones out of your bay before battle is no exploit => camping jump ins is no exploit. Even that you "exploit" a bad designed aspect of the game you still need your drone out before the fight begins. \| TunDraGon \| Huh??? Tell me on what planet does this logic make sense?? I never said deploying your drones before battle is an exploit you fool! I am saying deploying many many many drones and leaving cargo lieng around by the masses specifically to cause LAG is an Exploit!
Bexxly	Posted - 2003.10.30 16:58:00 - [15] Quote: Quote: [13yo mentality] Noggy stop being a whiney little **head who needs to learn to STFU, so you were ganked, big deal, who cares, get over it, how can deploying drones be an exploit fool! [/13yo mentality] Noggy is right. It's an exploit and everybody knows it. You're the one that needs to STFU. no you are, moaning **
Avast Ye	Posted - 2003.10.30 17:47:00 - [16] Edited by: Avast Ye on 30/10/2003 17:55:21 Edited by: Avast Ye on 30/10/2003 17:49:08 Quote: Strange how the guilty party considers this to not be an exploit eh? Though everyone else does? The GM's are the guilty party? Quote: Also strange how you got so defensive and aggro about this. Maybe feeling a bit guilty? Probably sick of hearing carebears whining about it Quote: Where do GM's say this is not an exploit? Its so obviously an exploit it has exploit written all over it in bold neon lighting!! Read Lord Gueardo's post, he told you Quote: How can you say that lagging the server down so much that the person has absolutley NO way of doing jack about it is fair and part of the game? Thats BULL man! And you know it. If you don't want killed don't got to dangerous places, if you autopilot through them you are usually ok though Quote: Oh and besides, I am not 13 and I do not have a 13year old mentality. I am not crying cause I got ganked I am complaining about the fact that some people here are doing these deeds by cheating and they blimming well know it. Noggy IT ISN'T CHEATING Just a tip - if you are going to a system that may be unsafe then check the number of ship kills in the last 24 hours on the map, then decide whether to go or not.
Viceroy	Posted - 2003.10.30 18:02:00 - [17] GMs have confirmed it is not an exploit: using drones is not an exploit using mining drones is not an exploit CCP says so, so have a cookie -
Dolemite2K	Posted - 2003.10.30 18:14:00 - [18] can I have a cookie too? ----------------------------------------------- Life is like a long poo that you have to take a bite of every day
pooti	Posted - 2003.10.30 18:14:00 - [19] It may not be an exploit, but it's a pretty lame tactic.
Elmar Solderi	Posted - 2003.10.30 18:22:00 - [20] Edited by: Elmar Solderi on 30/10/2003 18:39:05 hey moron, try fighting in drone ships whit out useing drones, what did you say you cant? oh then stfu If it aint nailed down its mine. --------- kil list: 3 thorax's 1 moa 2 pod's 1 repunter ------- 1 death
Scragg	Posted - 2003.10.30 18:27:00 - [21] "When a player jumps into a system, he is loaded into the system before he sees space and his options load on-screen. This is how the gameplay is implemented. The spawnpoints, where the ships re-appear in the jumped-to-system, are few and that makes it easy for soulless pirates to target and kill defenseless pilots before they can do anything. Some pirates have used numerous battle drones, causing even more lag, which can make your spawntime even longer and thus easier for the pirates to kill you. Since it has been decreed by CCP that this is a gameplay issue and the lag is player created, we are not able to reimburse players that get hit this way." So basically... player created lag is perfectly within the rules. My opinion... CCP made a hosed up game and can't fix this exploit nor can they prove after the fact that people do it. So, they just say it's a player created situation well within acceptable play guidelines. LAME............ They just need to fix this feature and be done with it. I'm ok with gate camping nad even spawn point camping but when you do things to create lag on purpose to trap people thats just wrong. Scragg, Tyrell Corporation Vice-Director Military Operations
Clintus McGintus	Posted - 2003.10.30 18:39:00 - [22] This is the first time I have heard of this, but it makes sence. I flew through some heavy pirate space the other day and 4 systems in a row I had pirates at my jump in points. But I had it on auto pilot and was out before they had time lock onto me. However only once did they have drones deployed. I didn't see any lag. We shall see what CCP will do. Until then there is nothing any of us can do. So just deal. ________________________________________________ May the Force be with you.
RazorDreamz	Posted - 2003.10.30 18:55:00 - [23] Boo hoo. If people didn't whine about pirates at gates then they wouldn't need to camp spawn points, they would still be sitting at gates. Blame yourself. --------------------------------------- CSM Chat Log September 25, 2003: Fuhry> Some things we simply cannot test, and therefore we just put it on Tranq. cross our fingers and then get into panic m
Shamis Orzoz	Posted - 2003.10.30 19:18:00 - [24] Edited by: Shamis Orzoz on 30/10/2003 19:22:18 CCP needs to change this. Call it whatever you want, the people that jump into the system don't have a chance. Granted, the map can be used to protect yourself against most of this, but if you're in a dangerous area, anytime you see a pilot in the next system you have to wonder if you will get killed when you jump. What CCP needs to do is figure out a way to make sure your ship does not appear until you are finished loading. Then you will have as much time to get away as they have to target you. Along with this, they should apply the same principle for people coming out of warp. You should not appear until you finish loading, but they should get rid of the 10 second delay on locking so that once you do load, people can lock you immediately. This would promote more fighting, which is good, but everyone would be on equal footing. I was happy about the jump in point exploit/whatever at first because it is so hard to kill people due to the 10 second delays after warp. Finally there was a way to actually kill people that weren't asleep at the wheel. But it is just too easy to kill people with this. You could be the best fighter pilot in the world, but if you jump into a system by yourself, and there are 2 guys there you could be webbed, warp scrambled, and jammed before you load the screen. This is lame.
Torik	Posted - 2003.10.30 19:42:00 - [25] Just because this tactic is not illegal it does not make it right. There is a basic assumption in a game like this that the outcome of PvP combat is to be determined by the skill and preparation of the participants. Anything else makes the PvP a farce. As a matter of fact jump-in camping is not really an exploit. Exploiting involves abusing small flaws and loopholes in an otherwise working system. This system is such a failure that you can't really say what is a flaw and what is intended.
Noggy	Posted - 2003.10.30 20:07:00 - [26] Edited by: Noggy on 30/10/2003 20:09:38 Quote: The GM's are the guilty party? No the person that was acting up was the guilty party. Sheesh Quote: Probably sick of hearing carebears whining about it Look pal, this isnt a carebears issue, its not a blimming blue rinse brigade issue and its not a dog farms issue, its EVERYONES issue mate! This could happen to YOU next time you warp into a 0.4 zone. Quote: Read Lord Gueardo's post, he told you Yeah well whoever said that was not necesarrily CCP and besides as someone mentioned. It is SO obvious that its some bollox ramble that some guy has said to keep people from flooding them with complaints until they fix the problem. What do the goverment do when theres a problem? Yepp, they deny knowledge. Trust me, they will admit theres a problem when they fix it. Also TomB said in his Dev talks that this is a problem they intend to fix. Do you think they would need to fix the warp in time if it wasn't a problem? Do the maths.. Quote: If you don't want killed don't got to dangerous places, if you autopilot through them you are usually ok though Man, this was a .4 system!! Am I supposed to stay in 1.0 space all my life? I have no fear of getting killed I told you that, I even anticipated it. Though not through cheating and exploits!! Besides, I had my autopilot on but you know the bit when you just warp in and it needs to realign?? Well I was doing that in a pod! Quote: IT ISN'T CHEATING errrm.. YES IT IS!!!! Look people. Those of you that get all defensive about this are obviously a guilty party doing this and dont like getting backed up against the wall. This isnt about pirates this is about people using exploits!! OK? Oh and trust me, I got a super fast pc and internet connection. This is no client side lag, its the game mechanics like it or not. I have played other mmporgs in rooms with over 2000 people and not had this lag, this is in a game where there are 6 people using ways to create lag.. IE a Game flaw Anyway.. The GM is currently investigating this case so they havent dissmissed it as you all suggested. Thanks Noggy
Ruce	Posted - 2003.10.30 20:13:00 - [27] Is it an exploit? Yes per the definition of the word absolutely. Is it bannable or punishable? Apparently not. Arguing the letter of the law will just be an exercise in frustration as those who use the tactic know full well what their intentions are however because of their cowardly nature will never cop to it. You will get similar attitude from all online games. Ever since BBSs were the main online arenas there were individuals who felt empowered by the anonymity. They act like true adam henrys because there is a severe lack of reprucussion for their actions / attitude. It's actually mathematical. The less able a person is in RL physically weak or ugly, dimwitted etc... The bigger jerk he is online. This is a proven fact. I will get a link to the study that was done. The choice then becomes yours. Do you want to be part of that environment or no? Because you certainly aren't going to change it anytime soon.
Osash	Posted - 2003.10.30 20:40:00 - [28] It's simple really. I got sick of this tactic as well. So, I picked a pirate infested area (Obe), and now camp the warp in spot and kill Biomass. My buddy and I killed 3 of them yesterday, although we had no drones deployed :), but I plan on using drones in the future, because they can help in combat, not because they cause lag. It is quite refreshing hearing the pirates yell explote, while I'm picking up their loot. Of note, this path of mine was chosen because the pirates chased my out of my mining area. Thus, my recommendation to you; go get some drones and lets kill some pirates!!!
SuicideFred	Posted - 2003.10.30 20:43:00 - [29] Exploit. It's an exploit. People use this exploit to kill players before they have a chance to respond. There's no skills, modules, guns, tactics, or anything else the victim can use to fight back. And don't even consider calling it anything that touches on game play. It's not game play. One side sure as hell ain't playing when this exploit is used. Nobody can tell me CCP had this type of thing planned for jump in points when they wrote the code for Eve. Some players have found the flaw in the jump in logic and are exploiting it to rack up kills they wouldn't otherwise get. It's an exploit.
Dolemite2K	Posted - 2003.10.31 01:42:00 - [30] Quote: It's simple really. I got sick of this tactic as well. So, I picked a pirate infested area (Obe), and now camp the warp in spot and kill Biomass. My buddy and I killed 3 of them yesterday, although we had no drones deployed :), but I plan on using drones in the future, because they can help in combat, not because they cause lag. It is quite refreshing hearing the pirates yell explote, while I'm picking up their loot. Of note, this path of mine was chosen because the pirates chased my out of my mining area. Thus, my recommendation to you; go get some drones and lets kill some pirates!!! An inocent miner forced to leav his profesion, cause of evil pirats is on a quest for revenge. wow this story has made for tv movie written all over it ----------------------------------------------- Life is like a long poo that you have to take a bite of every day
Beseb	Posted - 2003.10.31 02:10:00 - [31] Damn straight Dolomite! The count now stands at Biomass Cartel with 4 losses and us at zero losses in 24 hours. Expect this number to improve shortly. Just to stay on topic - leveraging zone in lag to your advantage is an exploit. Trying to argue that it's not an exploit does nothing but expose your idiocy. The only caveat to that of course is that as long as CCP gives it a green light, I won't call people cheaters. Because really, who wouldn't take any advantage they could get as long as it was acceptable to CCP?
Boneca	Posted - 2003.10.31 02:14:00 - [32] Quote: [13yo mentality] Noggy stop being a whiney little ****head who needs to learn to STFU, so you were ganked, big deal, who cares, get over it, how can deploying drones be an exploit fool! [/13yo mentality] The only 13yo mentality here is by those that think this is actually PvP. please explain your definition of the v. CCP knows this is wrong/an exploit other wise why would they be trying to fix the lag and instigate gate to gate jumping The problem is they seem to be overloaded with stuff to fix to actually make PvP work
Mongo Peck	Posted - 2003.10.31 08:21:00 - [33] Edited by: Mongo Peck on 31/10/2003 08:23:15 You all know the rules and how the games works ..... Is gate gaming a pain ... yes Is it cheating ... no Does combat need correcting ... yes Are CCP listening to you ... no Are you still here ... who cares .... Ps R.O.T .... a few cruisers .... yawn ... welcome to the NO 1 podding list ... run run run to empire space !!! Mongo speaks !!
Infinity Ziona	Posted - 2003.10.31 12:24:00 - [34] Edited by: Infinity Ziona on 31/10/2003 12:32:57 Well I think its an exploit too Noggy. However you have to understand a fundamental truth about PvP MMOG's. They're full of stupid stupid F***** whose only goal is to act like F** D**** and make you feel unhappy so that they can feel special and unretarded for 5 seconds. Most states wouldn't let kids like these drive a motor vehicle but CCP's giving them freaking monster battleships for gods sake. Makes you wonder . God help us all when they get Titans Infinity Ziona My Kill List ------------ 3 Rupture 1 Stabber 1 Rifter 1/2 a Thorax 2348 Scordites 497 Veldspars 77 Ombers 16 Gneiss 1/4 of a Typhoon 1 death - to aforementioned Typhoon and Thorax 1 Pear tree
Chai N'Dorr	Posted - 2003.10.31 12:39:00 - [35] Quote: GMs have confirmed it is not an exploit: using drones is not an exploit using mining drones is not an exploit CCP says so, so have a cookie Funny... as when I petitioned to get info on a Jump-In kill, I was told: "As long as they didn't do it with mining drones, it is not an exploit" ie., when you do use mining drones it IS an exploit. But... exploit or not, what CCP needs to fix is a. the lag in battles or b. putting your ship where it is before the player has control over it
Lord Guerdo	Posted - 2003.10.31 12:50:00 - [36] Edited by: Lord Guerdo on 31/10/2003 12:52:19 who the ** are R.O.T ah well let them boast about 4 cruiser kills soon they are gonna feel several battleships up their arses and my armageddon is shaped just right for easy yet painful entry. time to die tossers and all those crying about this so called exploit. correct we are exploiting a flaw in the game mechanics that is well within CCP laws. SO DEAL WITH IT! you guys are just peeved that you havnt found one that benefits you thats within CCP law. Lord Guerdo Biomass Cartel I mean c'mon, just think about it. What would make more sense then the 3 most hated alliances teaming up to lay waste to the people they all hate anyways? CA is already allied with PA, and TPS lies between the two alliances. Natural allies to be sure. But it's not just that, all but PA (and even some of them) have adopted a "stfu and die, or come and fight us, we don't give a ** what you think or do" philosophy, as well as a PvP Kill everyone not friend kind of mentality. These are the people in eve that kill or convert, the ones dedicated to the death of others, because history, circumstance, and the rest of eve have driven then to do so (except TPS, who are just cool ass pirates ).
Noggy	Posted - 2003.10.31 16:52:00 - [37] Guys Seriously.. Hands up those that see that this is an exploit? I dont care about fair etc etc or who does it and who doesnt. All I want is an honest answer from those that have just read this. Do you think warping into a system that is intentionally made laggy by the player so much that it takes your system (any system no matter how fast your cpu/graphics card or internet connection is) so long to load that by the time you load you are dead. I dont want to hear about drones or weither they are useful or not blah blah blah... Think about this as a game design view not as a personal ingame character view. Bottom line IS THIS AN EXPLOIT?? Thanks Noggy
Torik	Posted - 2003.10.31 19:34:00 - [38] Quote: Guys Seriously.. Hands up those that see that this is an exploit? I dont care about fair etc etc or who does it and who doesnt. All I want is an honest answer from those that have just read this. Do you think warping into a system that is intentionally made laggy by the player so much that it takes your system (any system no matter how fast your cpu/graphics card or internet connection is) so long to load that by the time you load you are dead. I dont want to hear about drones or weither they are useful or not blah blah blah... Think about this as a game design view not as a personal ingame character view. Bottom line IS THIS AN EXPLOIT?? Thanks Noggy Sure. Using a known flaw in the system to lag out the other player to give you a combat disadvantage would be by most MMORPG definitions an exploit. This does not mean that CCP is going to declare it an official exploit or that you can always tell 100% whether someone is doing that intentionally.
Beseb	Posted - 2003.10.31 19:44:00 - [39] Quote: who the ** are R.O.T Nobody in particular, just some pilots growing bored with the game and wanting have some fun. Quote:** ah well let them boast about 4 cruiser kills Correction, 2 BS, 2 cruisers.
toaster	Posted - 2003.11.01 06:26:00 - [40] Noggy, your absolutely right. It is an exploit and I can't see how it can be argued otherwise. I think perhaps to make those that use it feel better about using it. I also feel that if it is not addresses soon, more will leave. I have trained and mined for 4 months to become a player in the PvP game, and once I realized how the use of expoits was commonplace and accepted by CCP, it was a big letdown. I have since learned to deal with it by avoiding these situations/systems, but it is still clearly a problem. ------------------------------------------------
Lottsa Pox	Posted - 2003.11.01 07:52:00 - [41] Quote: Strange how the guilty party considers this to not be an exploit eh? Though everyone else does? Also strange how you got so defensive and aggro about this. Maybe feeling a bit guilty? Oh and besides, I am not 13 and I do not have a 13year old mentality. I am not crying cause I got ganked I am complaining about the fact that some people here are doing these deeds by cheating and they blimming well know it. Noggy Hey Noggy news flash, Pirates arent the only ones using jump in points(drones, mines, left over remains of previous victims) so i guess you think the entire server that are involved in some kind of war is an EXPloiter as you define it. SO here is a though get a paper bag and breathe in it several times. Thats right you need to calm down. Someone might think your a hardcore carebear that has never left a station. As jade constantines previous post (history of piracy in eve) its people like you that dont know how to adapt that whine the loudest. Not sure where the link is but its a well written and slightly biased opinions that generally describe how eve has matured into certain types of players. Try reading it. PS sorry jade if i misspelled you name but hey i dont claim to have a college degree either. :) Enjoy the game, I know I am Lottsa Pox Pox to ya pod BioMass Cartel Podding a system near you
Lottsa Pox	Posted - 2003.11.01 08:01:00 - [42] Quote: Quote: who the ** are R.O.T Nobody in particular, just some pilots growing bored with the game and wanting have some fun. Quote:** ah well let them boast about 4 cruiser kills Correction, 2 BS, 2 cruisers. Hey beseb you forgot to add your lose in there didnt you and the fact that you couldnt pull a simple mining party ambush off. Heck you need to PM darth solo and ask him how do do it. At least darth solo registered a kill. You registered what a set armor and hull damage and your friends osash openingly admitting to running with his tail between his legs. At least bring both sides to the table. You see we arent claiming to have owned you at the failed ambush. We are just plain laughing at you. Nice to see you have declared war on us. Not that we needed it to shoot at you but hey it makes it easier to take you out at gates now and such. Enjoy the game, I know I am Lottsa Pox Pox to ya pod BioMass Cartel Podding a system near you
Capt Darius	Posted - 2003.11.01 11:34:00 - [43] this is an exploit outright... my first question is if you use this than you must have no pvp skills because of course how can any real pvp skills be used this way....so kudos to all you lame no skill jerks that have to resort to using exploits....so you use your drones to fight thats np but you fathom the idea that its WRONG!!! it is only proof that either you have no real pvp skills or that you are bored with the game which is no excuse.... on another note i see the use of carebear as being someone who mines in empire space...well if people didnt mine in empire space you folks wouldnt have your bs's...there is a purpose for these so called carebears....its to help get commons for your ships i mean wtf is wrong with you people....you call people carebears for mining is empire space but if anyone goes to .4 or less you exploit to kill them... i dont blame them for staying in empire space...i mean you so called pirate/exploiters have no valid argument.... think about it lamers and get a life that involves reasonable thought
cold lazarus	Posted - 2003.11.01 14:06:00 - [44] Quote: Edited by: Fausto on 30/10/2003 14:50:02 There is something you can do. Arm your ship and join a group that is hunting pirates. and then you get to camp jump points and wait for pirates And you get them to scream: Exploit!!! Try it, will make you feel much better. i agree gang up with mates and hear the pirate scream Quote ________________________________________________ [ 2003.11.01 04:49:38 ] The General > hey pls stop i will pay u [ 2003.11.01 04:50:06 ] The General > i will pay 10mil [ 2003.11.01 04:50:12 ] The General > damit pls [ 2003.11.01 04:50:23 ] The General > 25mil ________________________________________________ ohh how i laughed when i read that
Othnark	Posted - 2003.11.01 14:55:00 - [45] Quote: Quote: Using drones is no exploit => Drones need to be in space before the fight begins, because you have other things to do during a fight => deploying drones out of your bay before battle is no exploit => camping jump ins is no exploit. Even that you "exploit" a bad designed aspect of the game you still need your drone out before the fight begins. \| TunDraGon \| Huh??? Tell me on what planet does this logic make sense?? I never said deploying your drones before battle is an exploit you fool! I am saying deploying many many many drones and leaving cargo lieng around by the masses specifically to cause LAG is an Exploit! Noggy, Obviously the advantage gained by having your drones out BEFORE someone shows up is that you can instantly start doing damage. They are not trying to lag you, they are trying to kill you as fast as possible. You cannot dispute this. Its not their fault the client loads slower because they have drones out in an attempt to kill you with them. About having mining drones out, yes that is shadier, but even they server a purpose in combat. Have you ever tried to target someone with their drones orbitting around them? Having the drones clutter up the screen causes at least another 1 second delay that you cannot find them to lock on them. I would submit this is another tactical advantage to drones whatever their type may be. They are not exploiting a "bug" or "flaw" in the software. If you want to hear it from a GM petition it. -Othnark
Beseb	Posted - 2003.11.01 17:39:00 - [46] Pox, sigh, I guess it really is true that being dense as stone is a pre-requisite to being a pirate (at least one employed by Biomass). If you paid attention, you'd have already seen that I gave proper credit for your kill yesterday morning. I guess your urge to gloat overwhelmed your senses. You should have that looked into. As far as a "simple mining party ambush". Please, you try and insult the readers intelligence even further. You know as well as I do that you guys were just waiting for us to hit that mining op. We gave it a go to see if we could knock out a ship before you could react, but you were quite ready for us. Despite your force of 5 battleships and a couple cruisers, you barely dropped my shields before I casually left the scene. If anything, you should feel rather embarressed that you couldn't score a kill with your superior numbers and the fact you were just waiting for us. Shame really. And of course, the last blow to your shallow cognizance is your pearls of wisdom regarding the war declaration. That has to be the biggest "duh" I've heard in a long time. You have the obvious advantage on a neutral battlefield in that wanton murder is your trade, it's not ours. To perserve what's left of our security rating, it was neccessary to level that playing field out. Pretty obvious isn't it? Now run along Pox and see if you can do better next time. Oh, and to stay on topic. For a period of nearly 5 hours yesterday, our good friends in BMC had upwards to 30 drones and 29 mines deployed in the warp in spot into Obe. At least one of them had the cashews to admit they were doing it for the sole purpose of lag. And there you go - confessed exploit.
Lottsa Pox	Posted - 2003.11.01 20:43:00 - [47] Quote: Pox, sigh, I guess it really is true that being dense as stone is a pre-requisite to being a pirate (at least one employed by Biomass). If you paid attention, you'd have already seen that I gave proper credit for your kill yesterday morning. I guess your urge to gloat overwhelmed your senses. You should have that looked into. As far as a "simple mining party ambush". Please, you try and insult the readers intelligence even further. You know as well as I do that you guys were just waiting for us to hit that mining op. We gave it a go to see if we could knock out a ship before you could react, but you were quite ready for us. Despite your force of 5 battleships and a couple cruisers, you barely dropped my shields before I casually left the scene. If anything, you should feel rather embarressed that you couldn't score a kill with your superior numbers and the fact you were just waiting for us. Shame really. And of course, the last blow to your shallow cognizance is your pearls of wisdom regarding the war declaration. That has to be the biggest "duh" I've heard in a long time. You have the obvious advantage on a neutral battlefield in that wanton murder is your trade, it's not ours. To perserve what's left of our security rating, it was neccessary to level that playing field out. Pretty obvious isn't it? Now run along Pox and see if you can do better next time. Oh, and to stay on topic. For a period of nearly 5 hours yesterday, our good friends in BMC had upwards to 30 drones and 29 mines deployed in the warp in spot into Obe. At least one of them had the cashews to admit they were doing it for the sole purpose of lag. And there you go - confessed exploit. Beseb i wasnt gloating about the kill or i would have said something about SO and SO got owned. Merely present the fact that your record against us isnt perfect. Matter of fact i didnt even mention class of ship or person. But to go onto honesty lets see you state that we had done some shield damage but it was nice to see a 75 percent red circle on you. Also nice to know you carry at least one if not more warp core stabilizers on. The duh part of the war statement. Wanton murder is our trade plain and simple. You made it easier we dont even have to travel away from gates and stations to take you on now. So are you stating that running into a mine wont damage you beseb?? I didnt place the mines but hey I made sure I knew there locations. Providing too many choices to your enemy is a well concieved tactic. To bad your still learning. Enjoy the game, I know I am Lottsa Pox Pox to ya pod BioMass Cartel Podding a system near you
Beseb	Posted - 2003.11.01 22:25:00 - [48] That's actually interesting that you saw a 75% red circle. No kidding, my shields had just gone down as I warped away. No armor, no hull damage. As far as mines ago, sure they'd inflict damage, but you and I both know that they rarely, if ever get detonated to your advantage. So again, please spare us, they are deployed for one reason only - lag.
silenced	Posted - 2003.11.01 22:46:00 - [49] Quote: Does combat need correcting ... yes Are CCP listening to you ... no this is eve... But we love it, it wouldnt be eve if you could fire a tachyon with 2000 capacitor left (sorry to activate module requires 85 capacitor you only have 2130) I have had ships vanish from the hanger .. main point if your not willing to loose it dont get in it, or buy it perhaps the last line: If CCP listen can they affort to pay programers to change it ... no If you get wound up by a game that was released early cause they needed the money to carry on developing it then stop playing!
Darth Vodka	Posted - 2003.11.01 23:28:00 - [50] having mining drones out at a camp-in point. Hello dip-lemmings no asteroid belts. i really don't care if they've said it isn't an exploit. It damn well is. tell me any other reason why pilot would deploy mining drones at a spot where no mining takes place. going to mine the pod of the unfortunate victim that got ganked before he/she got control of their ship i suppose for f sake, people put a lot of effort and time in to get their new ships and so forth, one hell of a way to lose that hard work Taking out ships before they've loaded up (client side), is griefing, it ain't pirating, or whatever you want to call it One day this little loop-hole will be filled in, and then the idiots that resort to this lame tactic will have to fight, and fight means taking it, as well as dishing it out

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