It would be an SBU by another name. Every sov holding alliance would anchor them on their structures, much as they do now with SBUs on every gate. We need a system that's balanced for both attacker and defender, not one or the other.

If you can't muster 136 mauluses a night you own to much sov. As if quickly reshiping to a defense fleet would take 4 hours a day!
This beeing said by a 15K man alliance makes me puke! Sry no offense intended.

Same could be achieved under Dominion sov just by reducing the HP on all structures. The entire point of this is to remove the necessity of shooting structures.

It would require a small fleet to disrupt sov which in itself would be seen as a threat and therefore require a response which would lead to more content. But what's to stop the defender from undocking 150 angry dudes? Doesn't this just lead to escalation which is what the proposed change is meant to remove?

Yes. It is exactly asymmetric warfare. It does create a massive asymmetry, but, it counters the massive asymmetry in resources that exists in the game at present. An asymmetry that, if left unchecked, grows trillion after trillion. How many months of trillion isk income do you need before you are, for all intents, untouchable by anyone other than someone else who has trillion isk income?

It's better, but I wouldn't say it makes isk irreverent either. How many entosis fit cruisers can you buy for a trillion isk?

CCP has the info and they are seeing boat loads of ISK being made in null. As in a LOT! Sorry this ruins your argument.

I think Damps will be a pretty hard counter to any trollceptor.

Maybe a frigate that can lock to 80km and and move 8km/s sounds scary but a cheap Celestis dunks it completely. Just sit on the beacon and damp it, the ceptor has to come to within 20km and all sorts of tactics will kill a tankless frigate 20km away.

Ok, but how many different "troll" doctrines are you demand be nerfed? You know that someone can do the same thing to you with a "frigs and recons" black ops gang, right? Frigs for the links covered by falcons to shut down a few defenders. Things get hot, just cloak up and bounce.

They have the hard data, you don't. I get your trying to spin this to make it sound like everyone in null is going broke, yet evidence is shown this is not the case. Not just hard data for CCP's eyes, but as a normal player I see coalitions full of super capitals and other 'bling bling' type stuff. You guys even refer to losing 250 billion ISK to a thief as 'chump change and doesn't affect the goon bottom line.'

So tell me, which is it. You are rich or you are poor? Because you can't flip flop around depending on the subject. If you are the later then maybe you should start to question why your leadership is hording all the money while you starve.

The fact that it can't "disengage at will" while an Entosis Link is active? Which gives a defender up to 2 minutes to close and kill it? Especially when the fight starts at less than 80km due to combat probes?

Unless they're linked, drugged and on high grade slaves, a Cerberus will ruin their day. So will a cloaky recon.

But let's not let realities get in the way of the propaganda machine.

It comes down to you CCP Fozzie thinking whether having people able to RF stuff with interceptors to grief balances off against the inability to get into Deklin space in any meaningful way.

[We do, we have pvp'ers at home, running bubbled gatecamps with instalockers and even they are unable to catch the interceptor gangs that come through. How would you suggest we counter the interceptor gangs?

Smartbomb camps will pop up. I GUARANTEE it.

As I said its not Grr Goons, but when you are off on campaign one strategic option a defender has is to do a rush assault on your space and the interceptors would enable this. I meant to explain this in detail, but with the censoring I keep getting I was loath to write it all out.

If this isn't a design goal, it should be. The largest player organizations shouldn't be able to control more than the largest named area to begin with.

so come out and fight...it will be YOUR choice to defend YOUR space or not..... maybe you will have to PvP instead of ratting 24/7?

So.... your area of control shrinks to something manageable and the downside is that you get lots more good fights close to home with people you've likely never seen before?

Doesn't sound like it.

Interceptors destabilize sov, and the threat of losing sov DOES generate fights, with plenty of advance notice.

FUTURE.... at least we can deny YOU (CFC/GOONS) all/most of your sov... save a few systems that you can 24/7 monitor (and even then we will offline your station services cause we can) and or cloaky camp you and strike when you move your "entosis guards"

see we are a Guerrilla force... we strike and move....strike and move... we dont bash our heads into your 30,000 man alliance head on.... why would we?

Deklin is a barren wasteland of empty useless space..where you could literally search for hours looking for targets outside of the main staging systems of the CFC and goons...and Deklin is the poster child for exactly what is wrong with the current SOV mechanics.

by occupied do you mean eyes in every system to warn the ratters that a gang is coming? so they can dock up? since almost every system now has a station in it?

Thank you very much for helping EVE....and our small alliance.

The funny thing is, from reading some of the posts against this system, one gets the impression that it's you guys that don't want to commit a single cruiser to defend a constellation.

No I think it opens up options to smaller groups... perhaps on the level of... you roll thru our SOV with your blob fleet.... we RF 20 of your systems ..basically an eye, for 2 legs a hand and 2 ears

What we have now is a bore-off. How can this new system be any worse? We're already at 100% at the boredometer for stagnant null and structure shoots.

Sure, but I don't agree that interceptors lead to a bore off.]

Paying the pilots from the war chest to be active in these systems is out of the question?

And your stubborn claim that everyone shares your particular views of "Grrrrrrr In-terrr-sep-torrrrrrrr, Grrrrrrrr," or that those views are correct, make for humorous reading material.

Prove it.


Obligatory: Grrrrrrr In-terrr-sep-torrrrrrrr, Grrrrrrrr.

Please remind me how your 42 minutes orbitting a structure in your trollceptor isn't undone by 12 minutes of me in a maulus?

Oh right, we wrecked you a few pages back, why come back for more?

Ceptor orbits structure for 30 minutes. Maulus comes by, damps it to hell, leaves. Ceptor's got another 40 minutes to go.

Done.

Nope, I didn't say that at all.

Personally I'd use a stealth bomber with rockets though rather than these long range fits.

Different folks, different strokes and all that.

How is a maulus putting damps on an inty for 1 cycle a bore off?

I find blowing people up to be very fun.

There's been dozens of ways to kill it already presented on this very thread. Your response has generally amounted to "Nuh Uh!!!"

Putting damps on someone is as un-fun as pointing someone. Nice Try.

If the limit of your argument is "I find it boring to apply an ewar module to someone for a cycle," well .... it's good to see you have no arguments.

The counter to your "bore-off" is that the attacker spends 30 minutes while the defender spends 2. You'll tire of that quickly and bring bigger guns eventually. Unless you think you want to make a carreer out orbiting and jumping through gates?

It seems like the goons story is going from "It's overpowered and we'll burn down null with trollceptors" to "it's a boring stalemate where the attacker wastes a ton of time compared to the defender and we don't like it." Is that about right?

45 DPS at 124km, your interceptor is dead in under a minute (55.5 seconds, yes I did the math)

It's also a fifth the cost. Your move. Also, yes it has remote sebos. If you can't get two guys together to defend your space against an interceptor in your prime time, what are you doing in sov?

UNFUN? undoing all of CFC and goon sov.... while endlessly sov trolling your area of influence into smaller and smaller chunks?

while collecting all the goon PVE tears?

Interceptor has another 40 minute timer in which his sov lazor gets damped.

It's like you are fundamentally unable to concieve of a situation where an interceptor won't waste 40 minutes after 40 minutes of his life in a futile attempt to capture an occupied system.

Troll ceptor only viable for unoccupied and undefended systems. You not being able to hold unoccupied and undefended systems is a good thing. Ergo, troll ceptor not problem.

Idk what any alliance is planning, but the fact that their interceptors scarred you lot for life is hilarious.

Well, if he's not there then he's someone else's problem.
If you are in an alliance that actually only claims the space people live in, that's not an issue.

"Hey Fred, he's headed your way. Let him waste about 30 minutes before you stop him eh? I've got a couple of things to do first".

or alternatively.

"Wow, these 50 trollceptors have been in and out of here a lot over the last hour. Made me come out and stop them twice already. Whose got the next hour?"

"Sigh, that's me. I'll finish up what I'm doing and head over there in a half hour to take over. Steve, you're up after me".

"Sure, be glad to... I"m just surfin' pron at the moment anyway".

Post type 4: Cycling my damps once is too boring!!!

I'll throw in another one free of charge:
Post type 5: Grrrrrrr In-terrr-sep-torrrrrrrr, Grrrrrrrr.

I'm out - was glad dismantling you today, look forward to doing it again in 3 months :)

40 minute capture time.

Well said. They had better happy with what they have. CCP is definitely waging an income nerf war. The NullSec trough has been way to generous for years compared to CCP's bottom line.

You are not understanding the goons fear.... they know what will happen...just like the way we hunt thier ratters....

I'm using the maximum for effect - we can do 27minutes instead and still have a 29:12 ratio of time wasted by the trollceptor pilot versus the defender. Point still stands.

edit: And just done with replying to the ship-toaster not the thread in general :)

The other nice thing is disrupting PvE in a system to lower the indices making it much easier to cap at a later date...

Trollceptors won't work for actual pvp like that but an afk cloaky will :)

If someone chooses to engage in trollceptor fleets - it's them that's forcing the boredom on each other - there's no rule that says you may only use a trollceptor to attempt a sov take over!

It sounds like the kind of attritional grinding that some Sov holders enjoy participating in tbh.

I'll ask again, who, exactly, do you think they are going to do it to who cant return the favor in spades? .

Sure, you guys can spend other people's primetimes just trolling them - idk maybe people that actually want to take sov will turn up with fleets or put a cyno on their ceptors.

Which part of "Death to Rentals" did you miss?

What has been proposed is a great place to embark on the journey. Ship it, Fozzie.

hey, we are one of the highest paid "mercs" in eve currently...and all we have to do is kill CFC/goons..which was already our natural disposition.

and you are facing a group that cant be bought off..or weaseled in any other way like the goons usually do.

do you see anyone else living beside you? no

Yes!!! and guess what.... we already have the whole cloaky alt thing in place !!!! :)

Uh.....math huh. So what happens when you sit there for 30 minutes with you link active only to have some noob frigate come in and halt your progress? You magically get that time back?

C'mon now, this is EVE.

You know full well that most of the EVE player base is more interested in tearing bloody bits off of your Sov holdings than they ever will be holding Sov of their own.

and dont even talk about the POS's you blow up..... with all our moon goo operations.... ohh wait a sec.... we dont hold any moon goo...

Really? And as has been discussed in other threads, that will probably be adjusted. Don't be dense. A heavily occupied system will probably end up near the top, and the defending force is going to know how much time they have......which is alot more than you. 15, 20, 30.....doesn't matter. Takes only 2 minutes of link activation to cancel you out. Congratulations.....you have chosen to waste hours accomplishing taking a few minutes of a defenders time......have fun with that.

Again.....don't be dense. They asked for feedback and they are going to make adjustments.....that's a given. I never said the link "resets" I said it cancels you out so you run away in your trollceptor to repeat the process all over again.

Lets focus on your earlier post where you ask for people to suggest ways to kill an interceptor

Not only is this important, it's fundamental. However, the idea that ANY large bloc would be able to refrain from attacking each other once trollsov goes live is simply laughable. The decision will no longer be in the hands of bloc leaders because it will no longer be relegated to a relatively small group of cap pilots flying ships very few people can afford to individually lose without SRP/alliance support.