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How "science proof" is EVE?

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 4 post(s)
Sophie Mahler Hedion University Amarr Empire 26	Posted - 2015.03.13 08:00:34 - [1] - Quote Hi, maybe it's a topic for out of pod section, maybe it isn't. Keep in mind that I barely understand what I'll talk about here (probably not even enough to say I'd understand it at all). But I was wondering, since the latest advancement in physics, the understanding our brightest scientists are beginning to have about space, time, matter and whatnot. How does EVE hold its own when it comes to ""realistic" simulation" of space travel and interaction (aside of the clich+¬s, such as "there's no sound in space", thank god they still put sound in the game for enjoyment reasons even tho there shouldn't be) if there are people who understand this (there has to be) and who are playing eve. 1. so how "realistic" is this game, is it "up to date" with modern, 2015 science regarding time & space travel? 2. this is more for the dev team, even tho they probably won't bother to read this (maybe they will), but are there plans to further improve the game in order to make it closer to what "real life space travel" could be? obviously, wormholes are present, which, by itself, says alot. Do CCP have actual science consultats? I'm sure many renowned scientists would be more than happy to lay down some serious math. I have recently been to a conference by french PHD and engineer Philippe Guillemant, researcher at CNRS (National Center for Scientific Research) Marseille who is working on a perfect field (quantum physics AND engineering -and some other fancy stuff) and would be able, and possibly even willing to collaborate with CCP regarding Space travel and space engineering "real life" science applications. as far as I've seen, Eve, obviously, is mostly based on materialistic science, now that we realize through science that there may very well be a "consiousness" part of science as well, it would be properly amazing to, one day, see consciousness oriented skills and gameplay appear in such a huge and complex game. anyway, just a piece of my mind for those who may be interested in. much love <3
Asmodia SPECTRE Syndicate 8	Posted - 2015.03.13 08:10:22 - [2] - Quote CCP consult only scientists for economics.
Gregor Parud Ordo Ardish 1291	Posted - 2015.03.13 08:12:27 - [3] - Quote Not.
ChromeStriker Out of Focus Odin's Call 853	Posted - 2015.03.13 08:13:05 - [4] - Quote Its all good from sound in space, to wormholes, to submarine mechanics.... If in doubt just say "because of Quantum" and it makes sense... I mean whos to argue? its the future... who knows whats possible if you can manipulate or perseive quantum entanglement within objects... theres already instentanious travel (jump drives), artificial gravity, direct neural interfaces... imagination is the limit lol No Worries
Another Posting Alt Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 68	Posted - 2015.03.13 08:14:50 - [5] - Quote I think you'd be hard pressed to find much accurate science at all. Even down to the basics like it uses the physics of submarines rather than space ships, the ammo weights don't match the gun sizes, etc.
Serene Repose 2374	Posted - 2015.03.13 08:24:40 - [6] - Quote Our "brightest scientists" think there's a copy (or two or three) of themselves somewhere else, doing exactly what they're doing here...where ever? whatever THAT may be. Only, they can't say exactly where....or what.... SO... "scientist?" I'm not impressed. "Scientist" is beginning to sound like "The High Priest" says.... EVE physics is as real as it can be and have a playable game that doesn't have players quitting, climbing the walls or face-rolling it. I should think someone could figure this part out if they've set their course for a planet, and an hour later they haven't "gotten there yet." Physics, of course, would have you smash into the surface - gravity and all that. Did you miss the "clone" part, perhaps? So, how many "is the physics of EVE scientifically comparable" posts is this so far this year? (And, it's still March.) PS I have to say I AM impressed that "science" has finally decided to accept the fact that consciousness does indeed exist. I know it's not apparent to everyone, (especially the brain dead.) Good to see they're coming around...or coming to, whichever applies. Treason never prospers. What is the reason? Why, if it prospers, none dare call it "treason."
Sequester Risalo Significant Others 78	Posted - 2015.03.13 08:46:11 - [7] - Quote - Ships flying around at warpspeed without using any kind of fuel. - Caroline's star seen exploding at the same time lightyears apart. - Endless resources (Asteroid belts spawning at the very same place every day at noon). - Asteroid belts' ores depending on the sec status of the system they spawn in. - Ships colliding at high speeds without getting damaged. - Packaging and unpackaging spaceships in seconds thereby reducing the volume incredibly. - Storing thousands of ships in stations big enough to house a few dozen. Those are all good decisions for gameplay reasons. But it's not science.
Jade Blackwind Alexylva Paradox Low-Class 287	Posted - 2015.03.13 08:55:59 - [8] - Quote Eve Online is about as scientifically accurate as Asteroids.
War Kitten Panda McLegion 5919	Posted - 2015.03.13 10:12:05 - [9] - Quote <--- Kerbal Space Program is that-away We don't do science here in the land of space-gravy. I find that without a good mob to provide one for them, most people would have no mentality at all.
Delt0r Garsk Shits N Giggles 320	Posted - 2015.03.13 10:32:25 - [10] - Quote The problem with real physics is that it would be very very very very boring. Really. Space fights won't be a thing just because the way physics works. We often think that 200km is long range. While if your in orbit your typically looking at distances of 20-50 000km being more typical. You always going to see the "bullets" coming and your always going to be out of the way. And no lasers don't give you infinite magic range. Maneuvering would take hours to days and there is no stealth in space. It is interesting to note that quite a lot of "good" classic Scifi is rife with inaccuracies and misunderstandings about physics. Yea i have a masters in physics, laser and Astrophysics to be exact. Death and Glory! Well fun is also good.
Ralph King-Griffin Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance 9037	Posted - 2015.03.13 10:35:33 - [11] - Quote They're loose and fast with the laws of physics so not very. "I'm also quite confident that you are laughing and it's the kind of laugh that gives normal people shivers." =]I[=
xxxTRUSTxxx Galactic Rangers 229	Posted - 2015.03.13 10:39:49 - [12] - Quote not even a little. it's an mmorpg not a sim. KSP
Vyl Vit 1085	Posted - 2015.03.13 10:42:09 - [13] - Quote I'm so sorry to learn all this. I thought I was exerting my deific nature in EVE just as I do in the real world! Shucks! To think it's all been imagined. What will my followers say?? Anyone with any sense has already left town.
embrel BamBam Inc. Outlanders United 222	Posted - 2015.03.13 10:56:28 - [14] - Quote science rolls off of EVE like poo does on a nanocoated toilet, so quite scienproof.
xxxTRUSTxxx Galactic Rangers 230	Posted - 2015.03.13 10:58:00 - [15] - Quote Vyl Vit wrote: I'm so sorry to learn all this. I thought I was exerting my deific nature in EVE just as I do in the real world! Shucks! To think it's all been imagined. What will my followers say?? they shall say,, nik nik bokalota tum tum tum,,, weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee. ,,,,,,,,,,, pop! just around dawn,, naked and very drunk nothing is real the moon is a hologram and the sky isn't blue,, it's orange. they just told us blue is orange. lol
Ka'Narlist Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 331	Posted - 2015.03.13 11:14:35 - [16] - Quote Sophie Mahler wrote: 1. so how "realistic" is this game, is it "up to date" with modern, 2015 science regarding time & space travel? If it would be, Eve would be a game playing on earth and not in space wouldn't it?
Nalia White Tencus 83	Posted - 2015.03.13 11:25:55 - [17] - Quote "Yes sir, this ammunition will work for all your medium sized guns. from 180mm dual AC up to 720mm artillery!"
xxxTRUSTxxx Galactic Rangers 231	Posted - 2015.03.13 11:29:49 - [18] - Quote Nalia White wrote: "Yes sir, this ammunition will work for all your medium sized guns. from 180mm dual AC up to 720mm artillery!" sweet i'll take 500k of the red with the yellow spots and 500k of the green ones.. st patricks day is coming after all
Sophie Mahler Hedion University Amarr Empire 26	Posted - 2015.03.13 12:45:02 - [19] - Quote Ka'Narlist wrote: Sophie Mahler wrote: 1. so how "realistic" is this game, is it "up to date" with modern, 2015 science regarding time & space travel? If it would be, Eve would be a game playing on earth and not in space wouldn't it? well for example, the movie "interstellar" is science fiction, but with a more "solid" scientific ground than Sci Fi flicks of the 60s in EVE, we got wormholes, that's something already down in theory and not that far fetched from what science has discovered rather recently.
War Kitten Panda McLegion 5921	Posted - 2015.03.13 12:53:46 - [20] - Quote Nalia White wrote: "Yes sir, this ammunition will work for all your medium sized guns. from 180mm dual AC up to 720mm artillery!" It's more of a grapeshot charge than precision fit rounds. What did you expect from the Minmatar? :) I find that without a good mob to provide one for them, most people would have no mentality at all.
Mindseamstress Jovian Labs Jovian Enterprises 16	Posted - 2015.03.13 13:20:30 - [21] - Quote uhh you realise that this game does not take Newtonian physics very seriously right?
Syrilian Ascending Angels 49	Posted - 2015.03.13 13:36:04 - [22] - Quote I've always wondered why they decided to make most ships fly more like trucks than ships and that space in the Eve universe is apparently has some gravity.
stoicfaux 5518	Posted - 2015.03.13 13:43:59 - [23] - Quote There is zero real world "science" in EVE. Even things based on real word science, such as railguns, make absolutely zero sense in EVE. Explain to me why a railgun would need such dramatically different ammo types. Why would an anti-matter railgun round and a lead railgun round have different ranges or require different amounts of energy to fire? Why would you even use something as soft (and non-magnetic) as lead as railgun ammo? If EVE ships can bounce off of each other and objects in general (i.e. they're immune to kinetic impacts) then they would probably be immune to real world railguns which rely on kinetic energy to do damage. Which thus implies that EVE railguns aren't kinetic kill weapons and instead rely on some exotic process to damage targets. i.e. they're not railguns as we know them. Now excuse me while I bit-slap my inner OCD into submission. Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
Agent Known Night Theifs 44	Posted - 2015.03.13 13:53:22 - [24] - Quote stoicfaux wrote: There is zero real world "science" in EVE. Even things based on real word science, such as railguns, make absolutely zero sense in EVE. Explain to me why a railgun would need such dramatically different ammo types. Why would an anti-matter railgun round and a lead railgun round have different ranges or require different amounts of energy to fire? Why would you even use something as soft (and non-magnetic) as lead as railgun ammo? If EVE ships can bounce off of each other and objects in general (i.e. they're immune to kinetic impacts) then they would probably be immune to real world railguns which rely on kinetic energy to do damage. Which thus implies that EVE railguns aren't kinetic kill weapons and instead rely on some exotic process to damage targets. i.e. they're not railguns as we know them. Now excuse me while I bit-slap my inner OCD into submission. If I remember correctly, there was an explanation for the ships never colliding. The ship's navigational system instantly reacts to a collision attempt and overrides our own commands to get the ship out of the way. Of course, this doesn't explain why a damn freighter moves like a slug but can be bumped around at 200 m/s+.
stoicfaux 5518	Posted - 2015.03.13 14:08:07 - [25] - Quote Agent Known wrote: If I remember correctly, there was an explanation for the ships never colliding. The ship's navigational system instantly reacts to a collision attempt and overrides our own commands to get the ship out of the way. Of course, this doesn't explain why a damn freighter moves like a slug but can be bumped around at 200 m/s+. Or why we can't maneuver like that at will. Seriously, instead of a MWD, I would have a button that spoofs my ship's sensors with a fake ramming attack to trigger the ship's collision avoidance routines, and use that to move around. Never mind, that such a collision avoidance routine should work on missiles and bombs as well. Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
Agondray Avenger Mercenaries VOID Intergalactic Forces 234	Posted - 2015.03.13 15:54:51 - [26] - Quote -Ships flying around at warpspeed without using any kind of fuel. = nuclear reactors and fusion doesn't require that much, out rovor on mars is running off of Plutonium 238, and operates on the basis of the radiation providing heat which provides power. - Caroline's star seen exploding at the same time lightyears apart.= yeah not so much on this one, everywhere should be seeing it at different times, but that would also take hundreds of years, I don't think eve will be around that long - Endless resources (Asteroid belts spawning at the very same place every day at noon).- this is a game world and you need resources. Would you prefer all of empire run out and the superblocks control the last of the asteroids thus controlling the minerals. The ore must flow, ships and ammo must be built. Ever seen the Fallout series intro describing war? - Asteroid belts' ores depending on the sec status of the system they spawn in.= would be right to find rare minerals to mine in a downtown area now would it? or somewhere like your backyard of a place you rent which is a sub division is a town, who does the ore belong to? - Ships colliding at high speeds without getting damaged.= this because it would be abused by using numbers of cheap small ships to take out much larger ships...rookie ships with 1mn ab or mwd could be used for this, they have ganked freighters with rookie ships. - Packaging and unpackaging spaceships in seconds thereby reducing the volume incredibly.= repacking ships does make them smaller because you remove all of the empty space the ship contains. ever buy an entertainment system that comes in a box and you set it up and its much bigger than the box it came in? yeah repacking and unpacking works like that. the time though...would you like to spend a few days waiting for the battleship you bought to unpack so you can do missions? - Storing thousands of ships in stations big enough to house a few dozen.= Maybe not thousands but the stations are very large and contain multiple areas for docking, not just 1 large room. Ill take a look at station dimensions sometime but im pretty sure they are bigger then the overall area of out military bases. Just because something may or may not make sense to a RL situation in a game, there may still be a reason for it. For zero, the rail guns using less energy t doesn't make sense but the ammo weight and size would affect range...just not so drastically. Even in space there is particles that will collide into a moving object making it slow down over time, but would take a very very long time. Also rail gun ammo, only the core of atoms in the material, the whole shell is something else. "Sarcasm is the Recourse of a weak mind." -Dr. Smith
Altirius Saldiaro Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 319	Posted - 2015.03.13 16:04:03 - [27] - Quote EVE a space simulation? Hahahahahahahahahaha OP, EVE is no where close to being a simulation.
Lfod Shi Lfod's Ratting and Salvage 231	Posted - 2015.03.13 16:05:38 - [28] - Quote Agent Known wrote: stoicfaux wrote: There is zero real world "science" in EVE. Even things based on real word science, such as railguns, make absolutely zero sense in EVE. Explain to me why a railgun would need such dramatically different ammo types. Why would an anti-matter railgun round and a lead railgun round have different ranges or require different amounts of energy to fire? Why would you even use something as soft (and non-magnetic) as lead as railgun ammo? If EVE ships can bounce off of each other and objects in general (i.e. they're immune to kinetic impacts) then they would probably be immune to real world railguns which rely on kinetic energy to do damage. Which thus implies that EVE railguns aren't kinetic kill weapons and instead rely on some exotic process to damage targets. i.e. they're not railguns as we know them. Now excuse me while I bit-slap my inner OCD into submission. If I remember correctly, there was an explanation for the ships never colliding. The ship's navigational system instantly reacts to a collision attempt and overrides our own commands to get the ship out of the way. Of course, this doesn't explain why a damn freighter moves like a slug but can be bumped around at 200 m/s+. Is that what happens? I always thought the ships were just bumping shields. Giggity. GÖ¬ They'll always be bloodclaws to me GÖ½

CCP Darwin C C P C C P Alliance 1209	Posted - 2015.03.13 16:15:30 - [29] - Quote Sophie Mahler wrote: 1. so how "realistic" is this game, is it "up to date" with modern, 2015 science regarding time & space travel? 2. this is more for the dev team, even tho they probably won't bother to read this (maybe they will), but are there plans to further improve the game in order to make it closer to what "real life space travel" could be? Speaking as a member of the development team with an academic background in physics and a period working as an engineer in the space launch field, I'd say that EVE strives to have a scientific "feel" without even attempting to be actually accurate. Furthermore, I would argue that this is exactly the right route to take in developing a game that's meant for entertainment rather than an educational tool. EVE borrows far more from tropes of science fiction media than it does from the science itself, and that's fine. The game is, in my opinion, more entertaining as a result of that choice. If you want to have a game experience that will teach you a ton about real-life space travel, I recommend checking out Kerbal Space Program. This cartoon pretty much says it all about KSP. CCP Darwin GÇó Senior Technical Artist, EVE Online GÇó @mark_wilkins

Memphis Baas 210	Posted - 2015.03.13 17:02:16 - [30] - Quote No, CCP made an effort to have EVE be somewhat scientifically accurate 12 years ago when the game was launched. Since then, there has been almost no progress and they haven't put in much effort to upgrade scientific background of the game: - We live in a 5000+ star "galaxy" with a void around it, nothing there. - All the dots in the sky box are stars (no other galaxies). There is no mention of orbital telescopes or their resolution, so I guess we're limited to eyeball observation. - One star going supernova was seen at the same time across however many hundreds of light years the EVE cluster is. - Absolutely every single star system, all 5000 of them, are SINGLE STAR with planets in orbit. All the stars appear to be main sequence G. - Planets don't actually orbit, they are fixed in space. Space stations don't actually orbit, they are fixed in space. - If you turn off your engines, you stop moving (in space). - Spaceships turn and maneuver without attitude thrusters, and their mass center isn't aligned with their thrust center. - A lot of the explosions (missiles) are rings, rather than expanding spheres.

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