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Navy Raven - what's all the fuss?

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Seriya Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2006.10.22 14:33:00 - [1] I've compared the stats of Raven and Navy Raven and they don't seem to be THAT far apart. Are there any hidden bonuses, or is there something I'm missing.
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.22 14:34:00 - [2] Yeah, a 7:th launcher. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Dixon Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.22 14:40:00 - [3] I hate it... damn cruise missile boat. - - - - - - I have no strong feelings one way or the other...
Shin Ra BURN EDEN	Posted - 2006.10.22 14:51:00 - [4] It also has a lot of extra shield HP.
Leandro Salazar Aeon Industries	Posted - 2006.10.22 14:56:00 - [5] Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 22/10/2006 14:56:45 That 7th launcher is the difference between one-volley or more than one volley for many CA/BC sized enemies (at least when using Jav torps). Thats what makes it so great for PvE. --------- ZOMG my sig was concordokkened! Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
LaCoHa Caldari Deep Space Navy Caldari Deep Space Industral	Posted - 2006.10.22 14:56:00 - [6] and it costs a iteron V full of Isk... so its a status symbol too.
Iudex Caldari Perkone	Posted - 2006.10.22 14:57:00 - [7] Originally by: Seriya I've compared the stats of Raven and Navy Raven and they don't seem to be THAT far apart. Are there any hidden bonuses, or is there something I'm missing. Yes, i agree it's just too less to have the proud name "Caldari Navy". The black paining and the few more hitpoints don't make a big diffrence. I think it should get a 8. launcher, so the pilots flying it can use 8 weapons of their main weapon type. Other races can use those 8 weapons of the weapon class they concentrated their training on even on simple non-navy battleships. So if there is no tier 3 missile battleship for caldaris, at least the navy raven could get 1 more missile hardpoint - would be nice
Old Geeza The Retirement Home	Posted - 2006.10.22 15:20:00 - [8] Originally by: Iudex Originally by: Seriya I've compared the stats of Raven and Navy Raven and they don't seem to be THAT far apart. Are there any hidden bonuses, or is there something I'm missing. Yes, i agree it's just too less to have the proud name "Caldari Navy". The black paining and the few more hitpoints don't make a big diffrence. I think it should get a 8. launcher, so the pilots flying it can use 8 weapons of their main weapon type. Other races can use those 8 weapons of the weapon class they concentrated their training on even on simple non-navy battleships. So if there is no tier 3 missile battleship for caldaris, at least the navy raven could get 1 more missile hardpoint - would be nice Congratulations, you have about as much idea about game balance as this guy: Linkage _______________________________________ Sign the petition against jump queues!
Mihae Bad Karma.	Posted - 2006.10.22 16:16:00 - [9] I think Gallente should have 8/8/8 slot layout and 100000m3 of dronebay, oh and a 100% dmg bonus/level. Only then this game is truly balanced. _____ Adapt or Die!
Paigan Amarr Katsu Corporation	Posted - 2006.10.22 16:24:00 - [10] In my opinion, the CNR isn't worth the deal at all. The more shield is irrelevant as you do the tanking with a gist booster and your cap anyway. As long as you have cap, no stage ever breaks your shield, even if you only had half the shield. I personally couldn't use the 7. launcher either. Because i need a TB to collect what's in range during the mission. And going in with a looter afterwards isn't worth the time. Abnd the 8th slot always is a heavy nos as an tanking insurance for all the bling bling stuff fitted. So whats left for the CNR? 20 more CPU isnt worth 1200mil. And the texture is even more ugly that that of the raven. I'd rather buy another faction module stuff for 1.2bil instead of paying for a uglier version of what i already have. -- This game is still in beta stage
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2006.10.22 17:22:00 - [11] Regular Caldari Raven -vs- Caldari Navy Raven <weapon name> I -vs- 'Arbalest' <weapon name> Look at the prices, look at the stats. In this game, a nearly insignificant increase in "something" is worth many times more ISK, and a significant (read +10%) increase is usually worth more than ten-fold the ISK. Now, CNR has +50% HP vs a regular Raven, it has (from the start) +16.67% more firepower (the extra launcher), and so on. I'm actually surprised it doesn't go for much over 1.5 bil ISK, given the circumstances. __ Always question everything. Including yourself. My skills (on BIG public site)
Jaeuhl	Posted - 2006.10.22 17:37:00 - [12] The other bonus is the CNR has a missile bonus, not specific to cruise and torps only. I've seen ppl fit CNR's with heavies along with torps. With implants and skills the heavy missile stream is quite impressive. Besides, generally it's used for just mission running, and you can get away with using heavies for a lot of the lvl 4's and just like any game, having a ship that the general populous doesn't have (yet) makes them feel better.
Ortu Konsinni KIA Corp	Posted - 2006.10.22 17:40:00 - [13] Originally by: Jaeuhl The other bonus is the CNR has a missile bonus, not specific to cruise and torps only. I've seen ppl fit CNR's with heavies along with torps. With implants and skills the heavy missile stream is quite impressive. Besides, generally it's used for just mission running, and you can get away with using heavies for a lot of the lvl 4's and just like any game, having a ship that the general populous doesn't have (yet) makes them feel better. Cool, I didn't know that... I'll bet it's an omission though, they must have forgotten to change the CNR when they changed the Raven's bonuses to apply only to cruise missiles and torpedos. --- High quality pics of ALL EVE ships!
Rafein Eye of God Axiom Empire	Posted - 2006.10.22 17:41:00 - [14] actually, the normal Raven should get another launcher. It's kinda depressing the Caldai's Tech 1, tier 2 BC will have more launchers thant the tech 1, tier 2 BS :( Drake gets 7 launchers
welsh wizard Celestial Apocalypse Insurgency	Posted - 2006.10.22 18:38:00 - [15] Originally by: Rafein actually, the normal Raven should get another launcher. It's kinda depressing the Caldai's Tech 1, tier 2 BC will have more launchers thant the tech 1, tier 2 BS :( Drake gets 7 launchers 6 is plenty, the Raven is up there with the best of them atm. If they nerf Javelin then maybe I'd reconsider that opinion. It seems the days of the armour tanked Raven will be coming to an end due to the shield/armour HP changes, the possibility of an extra launcher may become even more valid then. Originally by: anonymous If you're being chased by a police dog, try not to go through a tunnel, then on to a little seesaw, then jump through a hoop of fire. They're trained for that.
Scordite	Posted - 2006.10.22 18:57:00 - [16] Originally by: Paigan I personally couldn't use the 7. launcher either. Because i need a TB to collect what's in range during the mission. And going in with a looter afterwards isn't worth the time. In that case, you're probably doing it wrong. Using a dedicated loot ship (correctly) saves a huge amount of time. As an extra bonus, you'd be killing faster with another launcher instead of the tractor. Even more time saved. ----------------------------------------------- The only legitimate use of the BLINK tag: Schr÷dinger's cat is [BLINK] not [/BLINK] dead.
Paigan Amarr Katsu Corporation	Posted - 2006.10.22 20:45:00 - [17] Originally by: Scordite Originally by: Paigan I personally couldn't use the 7. launcher either. Because i need a TB to collect what's in range during the mission. And going in with a looter afterwards isn't worth the time. In that case, you're probably doing it wrong. Using a dedicated loot ship (correctly) saves a huge amount of time. As an extra bonus, you'd be killing faster with another launcher instead of the tractor. Even more time saved. I have a looter sigil that does over 1000m/s with the agility of a frig and of course 2 TBs. Loot collecting goes quite fast with it. The question is more like: Do i get more money in the same time than just doing another mission by collecting 99% crap loot with 1% loot worth collecting? The answer is no. If you do 30-50mil per hour, extra looting can only drain your income. So i collect what i can during the mission, the rest is left to explode. -- This game is still in beta stage
Scordite	Posted - 2006.10.23 04:27:00 - [18] Originally by: Paigan I have a looter sigil that does over 1000m/s with the agility of a frig and of course 2 TBs. Loot collecting goes quite fast with it. I find it much more effective to use a large cargo hold cruiser with more tractors (vexor for example), and a mix of nanos and cargo expanders. Also, timestamping your first bookmark and doing several missions until it's ~1h40m old before swapping to loot ship and rounding it all up helps as well. Anyways, each to his own. You can't deny that kill speed is better in the CNR though. ----------------------------------------------- The only legitimate use of the BLINK tag: Schr÷dinger's cat is [BLINK] not [/BLINK] dead.
tiller Beer and Kebabs Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2006.10.23 05:14:00 - [19] Originally by: Paigan Originally by: Scordite Originally by: Paigan I personally couldn't use the 7. launcher either. Because i need a TB to collect what's in range during the mission. And going in with a looter afterwards isn't worth the time. In that case, you're probably doing it wrong. Using a dedicated loot ship (correctly) saves a huge amount of time. As an extra bonus, you'd be killing faster with another launcher instead of the tractor. Even more time saved. I have a looter sigil that does over 1000m/s with the agility of a frig and of course 2 TBs. Loot collecting goes quite fast with it. The question is more like: Do i get more money in the same time than just doing another mission by collecting 99% crap loot with 1% loot worth collecting? The answer is no. If you do 30-50mil per hour, extra looting can only drain your income. So i collect what i can during the mission, the rest is left to explode. Spot on If you loot up your actually wasting time and losing isk. Do the mission as fast as you can and go on to the next. Click me for Pirate Coalition Website of Gankage
Riho Mercenary Forces	Posted - 2006.10.23 05:26:00 - [20] Edited by: Riho on 23/10/2006 05:31:09 CNR is freaking ACE 7x siege and 1x large smartbomb ftw :D + the extra shield is nice :) edit: and i lol at ppl who use TBs on theyr ravens :P i personally use 6 siege, large nos, large smartbomb. get a looting ship... there are few great ones, like i use exequror whit 4 TBs :D
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.23 05:47:00 - [21] Edited by: Jim McGregor on 23/10/2006 05:49:40 Originally by: Rafein actually, the normal Raven should get another launcher. It's kinda depressing the Caldai's Tech 1, tier 2 BC will have more launchers thant the tech 1, tier 2 BS :( Drake gets 7 launchers Drake might get 7 heavy launchers. Raven has 6 cruise/siege launchers ffs, and its already one of the best ships for small group pvp in the game. And as for the CNR, its just silly compared to the rest. Do you know what the faction version of the Tempest gets as extra? 1 extra medium slot. Not even an extra turret. It really is a shame. With 7 turrets, it would become much more popular and even challenge the CNR at some things. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Tarty	Posted - 2006.10.23 11:23:00 - [22] The CNR is just mint. I pvp in mine and lets just so say if you dont like the CNR you have no isk to fly 1 or just dont understand the power of ravens anyway
Butter Dog The Dead Miners Society	Posted - 2006.10.23 11:27:00 - [23] Edited by: Butter Dog on 23/10/2006 11:27:21 Originally by: Iudex Originally by: Seriya I've compared the stats of Raven and Navy Raven and they don't seem to be THAT far apart. Are there any hidden bonuses, or is there something I'm missing. Yes, i agree it's just too less to have the proud name "Caldari Navy". The black paining and the few more hitpoints don't make a big diffrence. I think it should get a 8. launcher, so the pilots flying it can use 8 weapons of their main weapon type. Other races can use those 8 weapons of the weapon class they concentrated their training on even on simple non-navy battleships. So if there is no tier 3 missile battleship for caldaris, at least the navy raven could get 1 more missile hardpoint - would be nice I suggest you read the other racial battleship stats in the 'Item Database' link in the upper left hand corner of your screen, before making any more posts.
Mazare Mircea Gallente Delta team Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.10.23 11:31:00 - [24] Originally by: Iudex Originally by: Seriya I've compared the stats of Raven and Navy Raven and they don't seem to be THAT far apart. Are there any hidden bonuses, or is there something I'm missing. Yes, i agree it's just too less to have the proud name "Caldari Navy". The black paining and the few more hitpoints don't make a big diffrence. I think it should get a 8. launcher, so the pilots flying it can use 8 weapons of their main weapon type. Other races can use those 8 weapons of the weapon class they concentrated their training on even on simple non-navy battleships. So if there is no tier 3 missile battleship for caldaris, at least the navy raven could get 1 more missile hardpoint - would be nice You can have it ... but you will have to give up 10% of the base CPU. Good luck. ----- Do androids dream of electric sheep ?
Leandro Salazar Aeon Industries	Posted - 2006.10.23 11:57:00 - [25] Originally by: Paigan Do i get more money in the same time than just doing another mission by collecting 99% crap loot with 1% loot worth collecting? The answer is no. If you do 30-50mil per hour, extra looting can only drain your income. So i collect what i can during the mission, the rest is left to explode. Originally by: tiller Spot on If you loot up your actually wasting time and losing isk. Do the mission as fast as you can and go on to the next. Actually in some cases looting is very isk-efficient. You just have to know which missions are worth looting and which are not. For example in Infiltrated Outposts I loot like 10 mil stuff in less than 10 minutes (I name the cans of the good rats after killing them and come back to only collect those). That is definitely a good isk/time ratio. There are even more profitable missions to loot out there. The recent mission deadspace nerf just made them more rare. Generally you are right though, stuff like Pirate Invasion or The XXX Spies is not worth looting, even if you throw the occasional arbie cruise into the equation. --------- ZOMG my sig was concordokkened! Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
DarkElf Caldari Euphoria Released	Posted - 2006.10.23 13:08:00 - [26] If anyone has ever took fire from a CNR with javelin torps and good skills they would know they are worth the money. As for ppl saying extra HP don't really make much difference, are you saying you never fit shield extenders to ships? The CNR has what most faction ships have. extra dmg and extra hp. makes a whole lotta difference. DE
Leandro Salazar Aeon Industries	Posted - 2006.10.23 13:51:00 - [27] Originally by: DarkElf If anyone has ever took fire from a CNR with javelin torps and good skills they would know they are worth the money. As for ppl saying extra HP don't really make much difference, are you saying you never fit shield extenders to ships? The CNR has what most faction ships have. extra dmg and extra hp. makes a whole lotta difference. DE It is missions (And I bet 90% of the CNRs are used for those) where extra HP don't make much of a difference. Stupid PvPer! --------- ZOMG my sig was concordokkened! Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
DarkElf Caldari Euphoria Released	Posted - 2006.10.23 16:04:00 - [28] Originally by: Leandro Salazar Originally by: DarkElf If anyone has ever took fire from a CNR with javelin torps and good skills they would know they are worth the money. As for ppl saying extra HP don't really make much difference, are you saying you never fit shield extenders to ships? The CNR has what most faction ships have. extra dmg and extra hp. makes a whole lotta difference. DE It is missions (And I bet 90% of the CNRs are used for those) where extra HP don't make much of a difference. Stupid PvPer! aha i see your point. Well actually i don't cos i know feck all about missions so i'll shut up. stupid mission runner DE
Sexorella hotz	Posted - 2006.10.23 16:20:00 - [29] Originally by: DarkElf If anyone has ever took fire from a CNR with javelin torps and good skills they would know they are worth the money. As for ppl saying extra HP don't really make much difference, are you saying you never fit shield extenders to ships? The CNR has what most faction ships have. extra dmg and extra hp. makes a whole lotta difference. DE /emote Raises Hand Extenders are meaningless on a battleship, much better turnover for hardeners. Also, extenders on something like a ferox(most common use) make it a battleship sized target which can be rather problematic against...battleships. There you go, my thoughts:)
Nocturnal Avenger	Posted - 2006.10.23 18:02:00 - [30] Originally by: Leandro Salazar Actually in some cases looting is very isk-efficient. You just have to know which missions are worth looting and which are not. For example in Infiltrated Outposts I loot like 10 mil stuff in less than 10 minutes (I name the cans of the good rats after killing them and come back to only collect those). That is definitely a good isk/time ratio. I only brought "enough ammo+10%" or so and picked up the best compounds. Thus I had 650 M^3 high-end compounds from 4 (5?) drones, before that mission was nerfed a few months ago. Time is money. Rate your time.

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