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I've never played a game that cators to grief play as much as this one

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 2 post(s)
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 12:15:00 - [1] I'm starting to think that maybe a lot of the DEV's are suicide gankers, because maybe they suck at real PvP, hence the reasoning this ****ty game mechanic is allowed to stay in the game... They were all PK'ers in UO you know. That's why they made EVE a griefer haven... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 12:26:00 - [2] Originally by: James Duar Originally by: Bhaal I'm starting to think that maybe a lot of the DEV's are suicide gankers, because maybe they suck at real PvP, hence the reasoning this **ty game mechanic is allowed to stay in the game... They were all PK'ers in UO you know. That's why they made EVE a griefer haven... Ok, for the last time, if all they want is your stuff then it's not griefing, they just want your stuff and are going to take it. Much like alliances seize space from each other - or is that supposed to be griefing to? PvP'ing with the intent to lose your ship to Concord, a game mechanic whereby you must lose your ship or face bannage, then to swoop in with a hauler alt to take the loot, where the only one who has the ability to avenge the loot stealer is already sitting in a POD due to the suicide ganker, is utilizing poor game mechanics to *an individual in high sec. If you're such a moron that you can't see that this is blatant abuse of faulty game mechanics, than you're either a child and don't know better, or a griefer yourself, which still classes you as a child anyways. This tactic is a cute little way for players to act like immature children in high sec and get away with it. Similar to what that lofty child does with his expoiting technique, same **... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 12:33:00 - [3] Originally by: Twilight Moon Quote: I've never played a game that cators to grief play as much as this one Yeah.....its great isn't it? At least as time goes on, CCP removes more & more of the griefing, which kind of proves that it's it griefing in the first place, unlike what many of you try to argue... CCP just takes way too long to act on this stuff... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 12:42:00 - [4] Edited by: Bhaal on 07/11/2006 12:44:12 Originally by: Dee Ellis Originally by: Bhaal At least as time goes on, CCP removes more & more of the griefing, which kind of proves that it's it griefing in the first place, unlike what many of you try to argue... CCP just takes way too long to act on this stuff... Because obviously we must base change on the presumption that it is made for the sake of our personal view and for no other reason whatsoever.... If CCP states it's griefin, it's griefing, if not, it's not. CCP once said JIP camping was NOT an exploit or griefing, yet they removed the ability to use that tactic eventually. Don't be silly, CCP is like the Catholic Church, they take a while to come around to reality... Eventually suicide ganking will probably be trashed, as it is an expoilt whether CCP currently states it is or not... You're all a bunch of foolish children if you believe this is valid gameplay for an MMO. ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 13:02:00 - [5] Originally by: Rod Blaine No Bhaal, suicide ganking won't be abolished. ctr+q-ing will however. Whiners like the op should stop whining about features existing and start argumenting about how features should be balanced. at least that could lead to something, this thread isn't even going to make any CCP dev think about it. We'll see... Tell that to the guys in Space Invaders and talk to them about JIP camping, oh wait, both of those don't exist anymore, my bad... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 13:09:00 - [6] Quote: I will. I have no interest in suicide game myself, as should be apparent, but I do have an interest in making sure I fit my transport vessels to protect against it. Remove suicide piracy from the game and thats one less thing to worry about and one more thing that will make eve increasingly stale and uninteresting. EVE could be so much more interesting if ppl didn't spend so much time trying to grief in empire, and they got out into 0.0 & low sec & PvP'ed the way they should... To many spineless players, and CCP allows them to flourish in empire, It's CCP's fault. It's been a griefer heaven since day one, and as time goes on, less and less outright griefing is allowed, which is a good thing IMO. I'd say the game is more interesting now then it was at release, but griefers long gone obviously don't agree, as they quit and went on to some other game where it's easier for them to cheat. EVE will get better with age, and these griefer tactics will always come and go. As long as they continue to go, I'm fine with that... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 13:15:00 - [7] Originally by: Dee Ellis So it's better that they grief in 0.0, and get away with it, including their ship, then? Atleast Empire Space punish them... There is no griefing in 0.0, that's the ** point. Which means these chicken griefers are hiding in empire space looking for PvP with vast reward, and only taking a known calculated risk, plus getting ** insurance for their ship! It's the definition of lame if you ask me... At bare minimum, CCP need to take away insurence for death by Concord, and by corp warfare in the NEXT patch. And that's just the start IMO. ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 13:29:00 - [8] Quote: Consider this: The game is exactly the way the creators envisioned it. You can do certain things in this game that you cant do in others. Thats what makes it great. I would argue that the game is NOT exactly what the DEV's envisioned... That's why they have to keep changing major game mechanics that players find a way to exploit... Since day 1 the DEV's have had to deal with this... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 13:44:00 - [9] Originally by: Lorn Yeager Originally by: Bhaal I would argue that the game is NOT exactly what the DEV's envisioned... That's why they have to keep changing major game mechanics that players find a way to exploit... Since day 1 the DEV's have had to deal with this... If they didnt want people to shoot other people in high-sec space they would have jammed all guns by default in theese systems. They have not, and dont intend to as far as I know. as someone said, its high-security... not complete security. Dude, gimme a break. I'm not against firing a gun on another player in empire. What I'm against is players allowed to kill a hauler, use an alt to get the loot, the only one that can fire at the alt legally is in a pod with no guns, and the original attacker gets a full refund on his ship for getting killed by the police for commiting a crime. There is a very specific procedure involved to get around the Concord game mechanic. it's an obvious exploit. At the very least it's insurance fraud... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 14:02:00 - [10] Quote: Lets have a look at it then. What would you propose we did about it. Impose more penalties: 1) No insurance for death by Concord. 2) No insurance for corp war death, in empire or anywhere else, you're at war, no insurance company should want to insure a ship being used in warfare, that's for alliances & corps to handle, not an NPC insurance system. 3) Along with the sec hit, impose a system arrest warrant for the attacker, if he shows up in the system where the last crime was committed within 7 days, Concord blows up his ship. Remove the repetitive/farming nature of this tactic. Impose more severe penalties so only the extreme cases/targets are hit with this method, and not allow it to occur as an every day farming technique for haulers in empire space. This is too rampant, and players are flocking to this method of gameplay, when CCP needs to provide them with more pirate/ganking opportunities elsewhere. If you think lvl 4 agent mission farming in empire is a joke, I don't see how you can't similarily call this a joke... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 14:10:00 - [11] Edited by: Bhaal on 07/11/2006 14:11:31 Originally by: James Duar How in god's name can you conclude that high-sec piracy is a 'farming' activity? Go to Jita and take a look at all of them hanging at gates, it's absurd. These "pirates" hang out in front of the cops all day out in front of wal-mart picking ppl off and stealing their goods... Can you honestly say that this is what CCP envisioned 1.0 space to be? Really? If so, you're foolish... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 14:16:00 - [12] Quote: Hmmm... worth thinking about. Makes it more real. If this is instituted though, you'de have to institute a similar response from NPC pirate corps. Say a mission runner gets "Pirate Invasion". He completes it and the next day he gets it again, only this time the pirates in the mission got smart and lay a trap for the mission runner. Would make it more real too, right? Anything to make the PvE in this game less monotonous is good I think... I'm not a big time mission runner, just doesn't fit in an MMO too well... Anything to liven up missions would be good, as they are certainly repatative & over farmed, same with plexes... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 14:29:00 - [13] Quote: Can you honestly say that 500 people in Jita, flying around with billions of ISK worth of cargo with absolutely no risk what-so-ever is what CCP envisioned? Uhm, YES! It's a freaking 1.0 trade hub! What would you expect? If CCP didn't expect trade hubs to develop, and very rich industrial corps/individuals to come to power and trade in those hubs, they are in the wrong business... Piracy & crime is primarily for lower sec, corporate espionage, takeovers & market PvP etc are for higher sec. Since there are no real good mechanics for white collar crimes, everything is shootie shootie... Even where it's not supposed to be... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 14:47:00 - [14] Originally by: Aodha Khan Edited by: Aodha Khan on 07/11/2006 14:43:35 Originally by: Bhaal Quote: Can you honestly say that 500 people in Jita, flying around with billions of ISK worth of cargo with absolutely no risk what-so-ever is what CCP envisioned? Uhm, YES! It's a freaking 1.0 trade hub! What would you expect? There is no such thing as zero crime. The game was designed in certain way to offer an amount of freedom and creativity. If someone is stupid enough to walk around central station with their wallet sticking out their back pocket they are bound to have it stolen. Why should Eve be any different? Eve is unique and people play this game because of the way it was designed. There are plenty of dumbed down games on the market. Go play one of those if that's what you really want. Freedom & creativity? That's what you'd call suicide ganking? Now I've heard it all. By the way, more restrictions & penalties on the criminals is not going to eliminate suicide ganking, just make it much less prevalent. Right now it's the flavor of the month piracy, you call that freedom? ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 14:58:00 - [15] Originally by: Lorn Yeager Originally by: Bhaal Right now it's the flavor of the month piracy, you call that freedom? Its allways been around you know... But more players = more crime. It has not always been around, 2 years ago it was virtually unheard of, griefers were too busy using JIP camping & other exploits... As CCP has taken away one griefing method after another, these players move to the next easiest "tactic", the one that requires the least risk for most reward. They simply need to pay more for their crime, there needs to be more deterrents. Calculating a known loss through a game mechanic to steal is not what I'd call free form profession, I'd call it bad game design... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 15:06:00 - [16] Edited by: Bhaal on 07/11/2006 15:07:52 Originally by: Lorn Yeager Originally by: Bhaal It has not always been around, Wrong ;-) sorry man, but you are. Originally by: Bhaal 2 years ago it was virtually unheard of, griefers were too busy using JIP camping & other exploits... Indeed, it was unheard off. And yet... I heard of it as I started playing. Allmost 2 years ago. But as the number of players grow - so does this behaviour. As the number of mindless afk hauling alts with billions in cargobays increases - so does this behavior. Yes, the behavior grows because it's a tactic that is out of control, and many wannabe pirates see it as an easier way to make ISK than any other form of "piracy" Broken... If you can't see it's broken, you're blind, just like those who don't see it as griefing... In one form or another, this tactic will be forced to change by CCP, we'll just have to have patience... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 15:16:00 - [17] Edited by: Bhaal on 07/11/2006 15:18:45 Originally by: Omuro Takeda Originally by: Bhaal Freedom & creativity? That's what you'd call suicide ganking? Now I've heard it all. By the way, more restrictions & penalties on the criminals is not going to eliminate suicide ganking, just make it much less prevalent. Right now it's the flavor of the month piracy, you call that freedom? Giving a player the choice to try and blow up somebody else in what seems secure space, with a 100% chance of him loosing his ship - THAT's called freedom, yeah. Figuring out how to profit from it is the creative part. Using an alt to loot & circumvent the system put in place by CCP is not creative, it's an exploit... If it's so **** creative, why don't you and your buddy go down to the local bank & try it. Make sure the cops see you holding the money bag. Then come back and tell us all how creative that is. ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 15:53:00 - [18] Originally by: Jenny Spitfire Originally by: Bhaal Yes, the behavior grows because it's a tactic that is out of control, and many wannabe pirates see it as an easier way to make ISK than any other form of "piracy" Broken... If you can't see it's broken, you're blind, just like those who don't see it as griefing... In one form or another, this tactic will be forced to change by CCP, we'll just have to have patience... Login traps and logout saves are also grief tactics. Login traps - Login out of no where and gank enemies. Counter - Mass logouts. Logout traps - Logout of bubbles to save ships and pods. Killers can not get kills. Counter - Nothing. Empire suicides - Take sec hits, lose ships. Can make some ISKs. Counter - Do not put valuables in crap ships. All login & logout tactics are chicken ** tactics, doesn't make suicide ganking any less of chicken ** tactic... I want to see a punishment that more fits the crime of all parties involved, the suicider and looter. Using a crap ship in 1.0 space is not a crime, sorry. It may be foolish, in low sec, but it's not a crime. Me taking the convenient store earnings to the bank in broad daylight where many cops patrol is not a crime, nor is it foolish. Me taking the earnings to the bank down a back alley at night is not a crime either, although it may be foolish. Jita is not a dark back alleyà EVE doesn't discriminate in this manner as it should... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 16:08:00 - [19] Edited by: Bhaal on 07/11/2006 16:09:29 Quote: I'll say again, its not an exploit, because the players can take measures to guard against it. Its not like spawn camping in an FPS where there is nothing you can do to get rid of the guy killing you each time you spawn. Then why was JIP camping removed from EVE? You didn't have to fly through the gate did you? No matter what you say, the tactic is lame, and the calculated loss before the crime is commited system is bogus, no matter how you slice it. How you can justify Concord getting fooled day after day letting the same ppl get away with this as not being a broken game mechanic in some form or another is beyond me... I've never lost anything this way, never will, but I can certainly see something is wrong and needs to be fixed... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 16:19:00 - [20] Originally by: Rekindle Edited by: Rekindle on 07/11/2006 16:17:01 A lot of you have lost sight of what pvp is, really you have. PvP is player vs player combat. Its not logging off, its not mass logins/mass log outs, its not book mark copying, and its not sitting in front of the police to suicide gank haulers as they come through other wise secure space in Jita so the defender has no recourse. I'm over the fact I've lost my stuff - I have to be or there is no point for me to post here or even log on tonight. It sucks and I think its lame. I do question how long I will play now because I can't get over how much time its taken to acquire that stuff. Yes it was stupid of me to take that type of risk within the dynamic of the game. That doesn't change the fact its lame. What is more lame is that there is a subset of the community that think this is what pvp is. Give your heads a shake ffs. Do you want a balanced pvp community where you fight other people in the spirit of competition or do you want more options to gank hauler noobs moving through "secure" space? The same type of element existed in UO and there were those that claimed to be elite PvP'rs. If you're looking for ways to suicide gank yourself to kill haulers through empire space IMHO you're not a pvp player and you dont deserve the title. A game doesnt have to be unfair to be hard core pvp, a game doesnt have to be endorse griefers to be non care bear. Let me buy you some tin foil hats. From the very beginning, most PvP'ers had a very very hard time with a balanced PvP system, they chose grief tactics over PvP, because CCP allowed them to... 3 years later, CCP still allows it in various forms... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 16:28:00 - [21] Originally by: Santa Anna Originally by: Rekindle Edited by: Rekindle on 07/11/2006 16:17:01 A lot of you have lost sight of what pvp is, really you have. PvP is player vs player combat. Its not logging off, its not mass logins/mass log outs, its not book mark copying, and its not sitting in front of the police to suicide gank haulers as they come through other wise secure space in Jita so the defender has no recourse. At its core, a PVP game is one where the players create the tactics, the rules, the environment in which the other players play. There's no "right" way to PVP. Clearly there's a style that you or I or anyone else prefers, but that style is slightly different for everyone. I shouldn't not use tactic X just because you don't like it -- my choices make your game environment, just like your choices make mine. I can choose how to use the environment my fellow players have provided, and how to contribute to it, but I can't choose to make my own environment. There is also a vision for what the DEV's want PvP to be. Gamers by nature will try to exploit the game by any means possible to not conform to the DEV's vision, but to make their chances of easily obtained rewards more accessible. It's up to the DEV's to modify the game when necessary to keep the game on track, and fulfill their vision... I highly doubt they wanted suicide ganking to be so prevalent, unless they truly are all griefers from UO... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 19:32:00 - [22] Edited by: Bhaal on 07/11/2006 19:33:49 Originally by: Matrix Aran In responce to the OP, if you'd have taken the care of reading most of the Dev's comments about Eve over the past three years you would realize that they do consider the game to be a 100% PVP game. The problem is suicide ganking in high sec empire is not really PvP'ing, it's PK'ing... There's a difference. No one develops a game and envisions PK'ing as the main form of PvP. Only 0.0 alliances & some RP and Merc corps in empire utilize the true PvP CCP envisioned, the rest of the players are PK'ing.. They don't deserve to be called PvP'ers IMO. Pirating is PK'ing, and I don't care what anyone says, pirating should not be the main form of PvP in an MMO where corp & alliance warfare was the dream... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 19:46:00 - [23] Originally by: Sendraks Originally by: Bhaal Pirating is PK'ing, and I don't care what anyone says, pirating should not be the main form of PvP in an MMO where corp & alliance warfare was the dream... This actually makes sense and I agree. However, the solution isn't to "nerf piracy" but to change the game so the other forms of PvP become more popular again. This has been the problem since the beginning. Everyone in EVE who wanted to PvP was a pirate, and really didn't PvP for anything other than to *****easy targets. This mentality set in, and has been with the game ever since. The initial direction CCP gave us for PvP was wrong to begin with. And as time went on, the word spread, and EVE has continually attracted PK'ers, and not enough PvP'ers who fight for a greater cause than just kicking some carebears around... I think it's getting there, but tactics like suicide ganking need to be abolished, and pirating needs to become only for the top cream of the crop, not every shmuck under the sun who can say YARRRRR. EVE needs more PvP'ers & less PK'ers, CCP has to make PK'ing less prevalent so there is more competition and the pool of pirates is thinned down, and the fat is removed. ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 19:56:00 - [24] Quote: As it stands, the general thrust of a lot of comments in this thread is that players think they should just be able to fit ships to haul as much as possible, with no defense, and be able to fly safely through empire. If thats not a free ride, I don't know what is. So why is it that the suicide ganker only has to use a calculator to figure out his profits, then F1, F2, F3... Who should have it easier in a well policed city, the truck driver or the criminal? You guys make no sense, talk about free rides! I sure wish I could steal in front of the cops after my buddy whacked a guy and just walk away, all the while talking about how much of an ass that guy was for driving down the street without a military escort Carebears get ZERO free rides in low sec & 0.0, criminals should get ZERO free rides in empire... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 20:04:00 - [25] Originally by: Dee Ellis Originally by: Bhaal Carebears get ZERO free rides in low sec & 0.0, criminals should get ZERO free rides in empire... In WoW, this is fine. In EVE, we don't believe in a game for carebears. K? No, it's not K you retard... Hence the whole reason for the thread, idiot. If it was ok, we wouldn't be discussing this... Bottom line is, there is a problem, and PK'ers are afraid if the problem is solved, the game will become harder for them... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 20:20:00 - [26] Edited by: Bhaal on 07/11/2006 20:21:21 Quote: I see what you're saying Bhaal and it makes ALOT of sense, but frankly it goes strongly against the grain of getting people to take some goddam responsibility for themselves. I'm sorry, but we're living in a world where people increasingly whine and expect others to solve their problems for them instead of solving them theirselves. This is a problem players can solve and so they should get on with it. It does not change the fact the criminals are getting away with this too easily, and there are game mechanic issues. Carebears not equipping their ship is not a game mechanic flaw, getting insurance for a ship blown up by Concord is. Being able to loot a can in front of Concord, who just blew up the ship that forced the drop of said can, is a game mechanic flaw. Carebears can loose ships all they want like this, but not in high sec empire, not at the current frequency... Make this a once a week or month occurrence by a great group of pirates, not something that happens 10's of times a day... It's too prevalent, PvP in high sec empire should require more effort than this. Pirates in low sec need to put in little effort, while carbears need to put in a lot. The opposite should be true in high sec. That's the point of the **** sec system... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 20:26:00 - [27] Originally by: DefJam101 Originally by: Bhaal Originally by: Dee Ellis Originally by: Bhaal Carebears get ZERO free rides in low sec & 0.0, criminals should get ZERO free rides in empire... In WoW, this is fine. In EVE, we don't believe in a game for carebears. K? No, it's not K you retard... Hence the whole reason for the thread, idiot. If it was ok, we wouldn't be discussing this... Bottom line is, there is a problem, and PK'ers are afraid if the problem is solved, the game will become harder for them... Shut the hell up pirates and PvPers have life a lot harder and more unfair than you just to be able to play the way we want. We can be attacked anywhere. We are ALWAYS getting ganked by an opposing force much greater than our own. The even matched run from us where the overpowered attack. You just fly around and whine where respectful PvPers keep their mouths shut and let you play the way you want. No offense... What are you on about, I'm attacked anywhere and everywhere I go, but by other alliances & corp war targets, how is that different? At least I don't try to cheat the **** game at every turn and fire at targets who are 100% guranteed to not fire back... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 20:28:00 - [28] Edited by: Bhaal on 07/11/2006 20:28:24 Originally by: Dee Ellis Originally by: Bhaal *snip - Such words.. Bottom line is, there is a problem, and PK'ers are afraid if the problem is solved, the game will become harder for them... We ain't got no problem unless CCP says we do And they clearly state we DON'T have a problem, but you skillfully dodged that post didn't you. How long have you played? How many griefing tactics did CCP openly say were an exploit months or years b4 they removed it from the game? A small percentage. You know the deal, they take their sweet old time. This is to a problem, and I'm sure the DEV's at least talk about it, doesn't mean they have to tell us... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 20:30:00 - [29] Originally by: Jenny Spitfire Originally by: Bhaal At least I don't try to cheat the **** game at every turn and fire at targets who are 100% guranteed to not fire back... but but but ... that is the pretty side of EvE, is not it? No rules except you do not force someone to quit the game. No rules until CCP decides you're breaking them... You have been around long enough to know CCP changes the rules as time goes on. You'd rather have all this blatant suicide PK'ing going on instead of more PvP'ers in 0.0? I don't think CCP does either... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 20:34:00 - [30] Originally by: Alowishus I think some of you should quit Eve and play a different game. You don't join a basketball game and complain when it's not football, do you? So are the rules the same today, as when basketball was first invented? Did they add more rules/fouls over the years, to promote better play out of the athletes as opposed to cheating street ball players? ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 20:35:00 - [31] Quote: "The players are shooting at eachother!" "eachother" You just busted your own argument... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 20:44:00 - [32] Originally by: Jenny Spitfire Originally by: Bhaal Originally by: Jenny Spitfire Originally by: Bhaal At least I don't try to cheat the **** game at every turn and fire at targets who are 100% guranteed to not fire back... but but but ... that is the pretty side of EvE, is not it? No rules except you do not force someone to quit the game. No rules until CCP decides you're breaking them... You have been around long enough to know CCP changes the rules as time goes on. You'd rather have all this blatant suicide PK'ing going on instead of more PvP'ers in 0.0? I don't think CCP does either... It is the player own responsibility to protect ownself. If you want to wear diamond neckless, diamond chain, prada handbag and flash them around in the city and not expecting to be mugged, you must be kidding. City is safer but not 100% than some sub-urb alleys. If high secs are supposed to be safe, CCP can remove activation of hostile mods in high secs unless you are at war. Does not have to be 100%, but cops don't allow criminals to loiter outside the doors of a store in broad daylight mugging ppl like Concord allows at the gates Jita... Maybe in your neighborhood, but certainly not mine... The suicide concept can stay, the rate at which it occurs due to lack of deterrents is not ok. CCP needs to make it a whole lot harder to do, they need to make it as hard as they plan to make invention... ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 20:52:00 - [33] Edited by: Bhaal on 07/11/2006 20:53:36 Quote: When CCP changes the game I'll believe you. Until then, you're an idiot. CCP has changed many things I have *****ed about for the last 3 years. Not saying I had anything to do with it, but yeah, I pay for and play this game, and I'll use the forums however I want. If PK'ers can play however they want, I can certainly use the forums to talk about whatever I want until the MODS ban me for good. If you don't like what I'm saying, too bad for you, deal with it or ignore me... If you don't like to argue, why are you here? I play the game to have fun, and use the forums to lobby for changes that I deem neccessary to make EVE a better game. ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 20:55:00 - [34] Originally by: Alowishus Edited by: Alowishus on 07/11/2006 20:54:51 Originally by: Bhaal If you don't like to argue, why are you here? I love to argue. But I'd prefer it be with people of at least average intelligence. So because my opinion is different than yours, I'm of lesser intelligence? Sure, ok ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 21:08:00 - [35] Edited by: Bhaal on 07/11/2006 21:08:50 Originally by: Alowishus Originally by: Bhaal So because my opinion is different than yours, I'm of lesser intelligence? No, it's because I can argue against your points with historical facts, evidence and sane analogies. All you can do is say "PK'ers are bad!" I have viewed many things in EVE as being bad for the game over the years, and I've had countless ppl like you telling me how wrong my viewpoint is/was. However I'm happy with a lot of the changes I have seen CCP make in relation to those "bad things" So I'm going to keep expressing my opinions... IMO PK'ers are bad for an MMO, PvP'ers are not... Suicide gankers are PK'ers. ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus
Bhaal Minmatar M. Corp Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 23:17:00 - [36] Quote: There you go again with the exploit talk. CCP tells you what the exploits are in this game. CCP also tells you what griefing is in this game. As of now this tactic is neither. You need to learn what an exploit is. Now who's showing lack of intlligence How long have you played this game? ------------------------------------------------ Current Hobby other than EVE My Hero I give this sig 3/10 for creativity and 10/10 for having me in it :) - Xorus

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