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Mar vel Caldari H.Y.D.R.A. GoonSwarm	Posted - 2006.11.07 05:33:00 - [1] Yet another in a long series of Interdictor rants.... q: where's the nerf bat / balance fairie for dictors? thinking back on ship losses over the last 3 months, almost every ship I have lost has been to an interdictor-related incident. oh, that's right - natural selection - get over it. Interdictors are probably one of the most grossly un-balanced things I have ever seen in Eve. What's the antithesis of an Interdictor? A weapon with a 20km radius? No chance-related effects, no skill-related balancing? no defense? Pfft - might as well make a 200,000 sig radius target painter while you're at it - cause that's essentially what this turns into. And since WCS have no effect - what's the possibility of escape? How about given WCS upcoming nerfs. Bah. MWD you say? - MWD is essentially useless unless you nano the snot out of anything larger than a frigate. Even then it's pretty much blind shthouse luck if you get away. The fact that you can shoot a dictor is a pointless argument, since they can drop a bubble and then leave. You're dead before they even take any damage, and certainly you jest about the probability of finding a dictor pilot without EW support, let alone the possibility that they have significant firepower and a reasonable tank. Pursuit! - Oh yeah, following them through gates is a pointless arguement, since they drop their bubble and jump to the other side safely, leaving pursuers vexed and humping air. A moot point. Go ahead and try to escape the bubble - by the time you attempt* to warp out of a 20km sphere - painfully difficult in anything other than an inty, POW! - you're webbed, scrammed, jammed AND bubbled - AND, so is your Pod - OOPS! Roughly translates to horrid death with no chance of flight or fight and total ownage. Wonders what a*ss-monkey thought up a weapon with a 20km attack RADIUS and no possible way to defend against? Oh wait, starts with a "T" ends with a "D"- 'natch. Wonders how so much attention can be given to future* imbalances when the old ones remain imbalanced. Oh wait, that's..... Might as well create a 20000000 target painter while you're at it. Gross imbalances need more cousins. Not to be one to bith* without remedy - how about some bubble-dropping skills other than the obvious - Perhaps a random chance for, say, dropping the bubble in the wrong place? Or, a size constraint - say unless you totally PWN in skills you can only drop a 5m radius bubble? Something - ANYTHING other than its current implementation would be an improvement. Thanks, CCP for taking the MASSIVE amount of skills training the veterans have out of the game and then forgetting to apply it to perhaps one of the most powerful ships/weapons to come out of the last dev cycle. "sorry, no defense" should not be an option here, Folks. Or I guess I can just go logon my alt, train dictors and be an uber-fleet-ganker-pwnmobile-'o-death. Pretty much makes my 2m SP character a Hero - but how about my 35m SP character that can't escape a weapon weilded by a 6 month old character? Basically erases the skill component out of the game, dontcha think? Not to mention insulting, to say the least. Thanks for yet another I-Win button that has no remedy. Flame away.
themule Caldari Insane Decision	Posted - 2006.11.07 05:49:00 - [2] Your post formatting hurts my head.
Ephemeron Pelennor Swarm	Posted - 2006.11.07 05:50:00 - [3] Interdictors are good, but not godly. I have escaped small gang dictor camps many times. Dictors drop their bubble at center of the gate. People that jump in will appear very near the edge of the dictor sphere. Usually you just need to travel a few KM outward before you can warp. If you have MWD/AB, you can often escape, unless the gate camp is big or just plain uber. One time, my Blackbird cruiser jumped into a dictor bubble with Sabre, Dominix, Scorp camping.. I started moving away from the gate, managed to jamm all 3 on first cycle, missed the scorp on 2nd cycle but it was out of scrambler range already. I warped off with shield damage Interdictors are not overpowered. They bring some sense of balance to grossly overpowered tactic of "running away" from combat. It shouldn't be so easy to avoid combat in low security areas.
Bazman Caldari Shinra Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.07 05:50:00 - [4] Thats rich. Your alliance are the kings of escaping from dictor bubbles, why don't you go ask them how? Interdictor bubbles are one of the most notoriously buggy PVP items in EVE right now, you pretty much have to rely on your enemy having the integrity to accept that he's been caught by a dictor bubble and not log off to avoid a loss. Unfortunately, the red X is far too tempting for 99% of people ----- Hi TUXFORD! Blasterboat for tier 3 Gallente battleship please! Make it look cool too. Thanks. I am a Gallente Whiner. Minmatar Whining is currently in training.
Ceramik Black Avatar Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.11.07 06:21:00 - [5] I think the problem here is that you are angry that you can't solopwn people, yes? Start getting in a nice big gang and your problems should be solved.
twit brent Dark Centuri Inc. Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.11.07 07:03:00 - [6] Oh no, I flew blindly into a gate camp which had ships dedicated to stopping people from running and my WCS didnt save me /cry
Mar vel Caldari H.Y.D.R.A. GoonSwarm	Posted - 2006.11.07 07:08:00 - [7] Hmm. Re-read OP. Did I mention Alliance, Politics, or any of that crap? Nope. The Dictor analysis for gate camps is relevant - if you're dealing with gate campers - and you're chance of succesffuly getting away is pretty slim. I've gotten out of a few bubbles - but again, pure luck and a particular instance of static game-play. How about when the dictor pilot warps into range of your group? Say, @ 15km, dropping bubble and happily warping away? How about when they ****-bubble a gate as they roll through - negating any chance of pursuit. Apparently the OP didn't enumerate enough imbalanced scenarios And the original topic is - where is the balance? Where is the antithesis of a dictor? - cause I don;t see any way to defend against it unless you're in a gank squad that have roughly even numbers. Otherwise, OP as stated. Flame away.
Deva Blackfire DAB RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.07 08:14:00 - [8] 1. Why are you complaining abt dying to "dictor camp"? Its MEANT to kill soloers. Bring friends, have party, kill campers. Problem solved. 2. Abt dictor dropping bubble and running - do you know they are made out of paper? Can be 1salvoed by most BS/command ships and sometimes BCs. Only 2 dictors (catcher and sabre) can actually fight off ceptors without bigger problems and still should lose to AFs. And if you want to bubble to aggro - sure. Most dictor pilots will like this chance, but only IF: they get on killmails (txh to bubble aggro) and bubble aggroes ppl who log off (or just stops em from emergency warp).
goodby4u	Posted - 2006.11.07 08:19:00 - [9] Yes,bubbles are buggy,but interdictors themselves can still escape,the setup of our interdictor pilot does infact include a cloaking device,bubble up,cloak if all goes wrong jump.
Grimpak Gallente Celestial Horizon Corp. Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.11.07 08:30:00 - [10] Originally by: Mar vel Yet another in a long series of Interdictor rants.... q: where's the nerf bat / balance fairie for dictors? thinking back on ship losses over the last 3 months, almost every ship I have lost has been to an interdictor-related incident. oh, that's right - natural selection - get over it. Interdictors are probably one of the most grossly un-balanced things I have ever seen in Eve. What's the antithesis of an Interdictor? A weapon with a 20km radius? No chance-related effects, no skill-related balancing? no defense? Pfft - might as well make a 200,000 sig radius target painter while you're at it - cause that's essentially what this turns into. And since WCS have no effect - what's the possibility of escape? How about given WCS upcoming nerfs. Bah. MWD you say? - MWD is essentially useless unless you nano the snot out of anything larger than a frigate. Even then it's pretty much blind shthouse luck if you get away. The fact that you can shoot a dictor is a pointless argument, since they can drop a bubble and then leave. You're dead before they even take any damage, and certainly you jest about the probability of finding a dictor pilot without EW support, let alone the possibility that they have significant firepower and a reasonable tank. Pursuit! - Oh yeah, following them through gates is a pointless arguement, since they drop their bubble and jump to the other side safely, leaving pursuers vexed and humping air. A moot point. Go ahead and try to escape the bubble - by the time you attempt* to warp out of a 20km sphere - painfully difficult in anything other than an inty, POW! - you're webbed, scrammed, jammed AND bubbled - AND, so is your Pod - OOPS! Roughly translates to horrid death with no chance of flight or fight and total ownage. Wonders what a*ss-monkey thought up a weapon with a 20km attack RADIUS and no possible way to defend against? Oh wait, starts with a "T" ends with a "D"- 'natch. Wonders how so much attention can be given to future* imbalances when the old ones remain imbalanced. Oh wait, that's..... Might as well create a 20000000 target painter while you're at it. Gross imbalances need more cousins. Not to be one to bith* without remedy - how about some bubble-dropping skills other than the obvious - Perhaps a random chance for, say, dropping the bubble in the wrong place? Or, a size constraint - say unless you totally PWN in skills you can only drop a 5m radius bubble? Something - ANYTHING other than its current implementation would be an improvement. Thanks, CCP for taking the MASSIVE amount of skills training the veterans have out of the game and then forgetting to apply it to perhaps one of the most powerful ships/weapons to come out of the last dev cycle. "sorry, no defense" should not be an option here, Folks. Or I guess I can just go logon my alt, train dictors and be an uber-fleet-ganker-pwnmobile-'o-death. Pretty much makes my 2m SP character a Hero - but how about my 35m SP character that can't escape a weapon weilded by a 6 month old character? Basically erases the skill component out of the game, dontcha think? Not to mention insulting, to say the least. Thanks for yet another I-Win button that has no remedy. Flame away. clueless post? flying an interdictor requires balls tbh, since you are flying a paper-thin coffin that only has lots of small guns. also warp spheres, wich are supposed to work like the warp bubbles, can be popped by a large smartbomb. and also, the FC that doesnt' call dictors primary is not a good FC tbh. in a battle they will be the first to go down. ------- Originally by: Tiuwaz for caldari perception weapons that hit up to 100km are short range weapons

Rafein Eye of God Axiom Empire	Posted - 2006.11.07 09:57:00 - [11] OMG, so your saying you were flying with a fleet, and a lone dictor flew by, and WTFPWNED the fleet all by itself, not needing any support??? Why didn;t anyone tell me they were this strong???
Awox Finite Horizon The Red Skull	Posted - 2006.11.07 12:03:00 - [12] Originally by: Rafein OMG, so your saying you were flying with a fleet, and a lone dictor flew by, and WTFPWNED the fleet all by itself, not needing any support??? Why didn;t anyone tell me they were this strong??? I think FCs calling dictors primary is mostly insurance so his fleet wont be (re)bubbled if they want to escape in their pods / with their stabs. Also means long range ships warping back to the fight wont get sucked into it with the tacklers. I only recently started flying Sabres and I have to say.. they kick ass. They're almost as fast as an Interceptor - faster with gang skills and the damage isn't too bad either. Mind you I use mine in small gangs usually, never big fleet stuff. - Logoffski Name & SHAME
Laboratus Gallente BGG Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.07 12:22:00 - [13] Interdictors are paper thin and very expensive... Interdictor drones (the bubbly thing that makes your warp drive sad) have very low HP. Even though they are not targetable. Answer. Large Smart bombs. Got in a bubble? hit F1 to destroy bubble. And dictor. Then possibly hit alt-F1 to fire up your MWD to get out of web range, and last but not least warp away, or just blaster anything you see to bits. Not that difficult I assure you... Everything in this game has a counter for it. Find them, use them. ___ P.S. Post with your main. Mind control and tin hats
Haruko Red Caldari Xenobytes Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2006.11.07 12:25:00 - [14] Originally by: Rafein OMG, so your saying you were flying with a fleet, and a lone dictor flew by, and WTFPWNED the fleet all by itself, not needing any support??? Why didn;t anyone tell me they were this strong??? Yes. Singe dictor can change an outcome of battle. The fact about dictor being made of paper changes nothing. It's suicide ship anyway. I agree with OP - balance of dictors is questionable. Reducing sphere radius to 10km can solve a lot of problems. Gate camping still possible, but will requre more then 1 dictor, or more then just sitting at the center of the gate. ________________________________________________ "I dont smoke." (C) William Blake
Jon Hawkes ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.11.07 12:42:00 - [15] Edited by: Jon Hawkes on 07/11/2006 12:45:22 Interdictors are very flimsy and die extremely easily. I will not mention names, but in one week, one of our pilots used a solo T1 Frigate to kill one, and the next day, me and a gangmate took another down using nothing but a pair of haulers! Don't forget that Interdictor bubbles do not discriminate: I've been responsible for the loss of a couple of friendly ships in a gate camp by dropping an Interdictor bubble at a gate, only to have underestimated the numbers coming through the other side (MWD saved my own skin, to add insult to injury!). They are also extremly buggy - I've seen numerous hostiles insta onto a bubbled gate because there were more than one bubble on it. At the end of the day, they are only allowed in 0.0, and flying solo in anything other than a Covert Ops or perhaps an Interceptor without a scout or up to date intel, is just asking for trouble. EDIT: Originally by: Haruko Red Reducing sphere radius to 10km can solve a lot of problems. Gate camping still possible, but will requre more then 1 dictor, or more then just sitting at the center of the gate. Interesting idea, but it would only work if the cycle time of the Interdictor Probe Launchers was vastly reduced to allow a more rapid deployment.
Ramuh BURN EDEN	Posted - 2006.11.07 12:54:00 - [16] Originally by: Jon Hawkes Originally by: Haruko Red Reducing sphere radius to 10km can solve a lot of problems. Gate camping still possible, but will requre more then 1 dictor, or more then just sitting at the center of the gate. Interesting idea, but it would only work if the cycle time of the Interdictor Probe Launchers was vastly reduced to allow a more rapid deployment. Currently if you drop two spheres in range of eachother, the second sphere does not work.
Sexorella hotz Beasts of Burden Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2006.11.07 15:09:00 - [17] Overpowered? I can't count how many goons I've seen logoffski in bubbles, so what's the problem??? Just dangle your fingers over ctrl+q wherever you go instead of using scouts and you'll be fine.
Sexorella hotz Beasts of Burden Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2006.11.07 15:33:00 - [18] Originally by: Mar vel Hmm. Re-read OP. Did I mention Alliance, Politics, or any of that crap? Nope. The Dictor analysis for gate camps is relevant - if you're dealing with gate campers - and you're chance of succesffuly getting away is pretty slim. I've gotten out of a few bubbles - but again, pure luck and a particular instance of static game-play. How about when the dictor pilot warps into range of your group? Say, @ 15km, dropping bubble and happily warping away? How about when they ****-bubble a gate as they roll through - negating any chance of pursuit. Apparently the OP didn't enumerate enough imbalanced scenarios And the original topic is - where is the balance? Where is the antithesis of a dictor? - cause I don;t see any way to defend against it unless you're in a gank squad that have roughly even numbers. Otherwise, OP as stated. Flame away. Antithesis of a dictor is realising you can't go anywhere you want in 0.0 without scouts and the like. A gate camp is easy to spot, check your map, that's the antithesis, just going wherever the hell you want and stumbling on to a dictor gate camp, well, you deserve to get pwned. Now, lets thing about this "antithesis"...how many weeks and months of skill training does it take...oh wait! none! how many weeks does it take to fly a dictor with a bubbles, 4-6? Seems you have the upper hand already, maybe you should use it?
Berrik Radhok GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2006.11.07 15:34:00 - [19] Interdictors are fine. They almost always get called primary if they pull a fleet out, so I'd say the high loss rate more than compensates for their utility. Heck, if I get one, I won't even fit guns, just a proto cloak. Originally by: Khavi Vetali Oh don't worry, the goons are just as suicidal with their battleships as they are with their frigates.
Galen Silas Gallente Digital assassins	Posted - 2006.11.07 15:41:00 - [20] I say that they are made good for what they are supposed to do, and they are only able to launch the bubbles in .0 space. Thats the whole point of interdictors is to launch that purty bubble, and there are ways of getting aorund it, if your traveling alone in .0 space and not prepared for a fleet I don't know what to tell ya. Although you can never be fully prepared for one, but just because you died in .0 don't get mad about it, train for one yourself

Marine Raider Minmatar Black Lance Dusk and Dawn	Posted - 2006.11.07 16:40:00 - [21] Edited by: Marine Raider on 07/11/2006 16:45:28 Dictors are far from being overpowered. There is no way a dictor can both tank and gank and most have to fit some form of rapid escape kit which destroys lows and cuts at least one mid. Standard sabre setup for me is 7x200II, bubbler, mwd, 2 webs, medium extender, 2 nanos. The only tank there is a extender, but matched with the large sig radius of them since they are destroyers, and the pretty crappy resists for being a T2 ship, someone who gets ****ed enough can obliterate a dictor. They are meant to alliance and corp warfare in 0.0 and that is why they can't be dropped in empire. If you really wanna get upset, get a decent arguement and go cry on the caldari threads (sry, couldn't resist, no offense ment). Cut the destroyer sig radius and increase its resists, and then it will be a uber mobile. EDIT: Forgot to mention that I love when small ships get within 10km of me. 2x X5 webs FTW. And any person who waits and trains for 20 odd days for a deadend skill (Propulsion Jamming 5) that only matters in frigs, should get a ship like the dictor. _______________________________________________ Raiders Company - WE SET THE PACE USMC
Milkminer InterGalactic Corp.	Posted - 2006.11.07 17:20:00 - [22] My only griped with dictors is that from what ive seen and heard so far they can drop their bubble after decloaking without any timer like normal ships. I understand that smartbombs work in the same way but id like to see a timer added to make the cloaked gang dictor sitting on gates (pirates mostly) then decloaking, bubbling and running. This is the only thing about the dictor class that gets to me. Everything else is fair game, and as its been stated above, its a 0.0 ship not a empire one. 0.0 isnt secure and as such life can be harder. Originally by: John Moscroft Goons are a renewable resource. There are no recruitment problems.
DHB WildCat BURN EDEN	Posted - 2006.11.07 17:50:00 - [23] Do what everyone else does and log out. If you dont like interdictors or are one of the few pilots that dont log out of the bubbles, then fly with a scout or a gang. Flying alone in 0.0 means you take risks.
Old Geeza The Retirement Home	Posted - 2006.11.07 17:58:00 - [24] This isn't an interdictor moan, this is a "why can't I run through a well-organized gate-camp and not get ganked" moan. _______________________________________ Sign the petition against jump queues!
xenodia Gallente RONA Corporation	Posted - 2006.11.07 18:10:00 - [25] Interdictors are a double edged sword. Ive lost more ships due to friendly interdictors than I have enemy ones, when an FC ordered the dictor pilot to bubble at a bad time. Like right when the fleet gates through a gate. That kind of thing is usually bad for ships that rely on distance to survive (my arazu for instance). This signature space for rent
Fenderson Finite Horizon The Red Skull	Posted - 2006.11.07 18:28:00 - [26] Originally by: Mar vel q: where's the nerf bat / balance fairie for dictors? thinking back on ship losses over the last 3 months, almost every ship I have lost has been to an interdictor-related incident. MWD you say? - MWD is essentially useless unless you nano the snot out of anything larger than a frigate. Even then it's pretty much blind shthouse luck if you get away. Learn to play the game better instead of whining. You will have much better results that way. I routinely escape dictor camps in cruisers and blockade runner transports. you just need to work on the techniqe of alligning, MWDing out of the bubble, and warping. Use a scout and you can avoid 90% of dictor bubbles. Oh yeah and thats not to mention everyone's favorite tactic, logoffski! (which works almost every time despite being a totally pansy maneuver) Also your argument about soloing is pure crap. Dictors cant solo. They die to anything larger than a frig every time. Dictors are meant to be a component of a GANG and if you dont have a GANG to counter it, you are supposed to die. Thats how this game works. real men structure tank*
Folstrum	Posted - 2006.11.07 18:30:00 - [27] Edited by: Folstrum on 07/11/2006 18:32:51 Quote: Thanks, CCP for taking the MASSIVE amount of skills training the veterans have out of the game and then forgetting to apply it to perhaps one of the most powerful ships/weapons to come out of the last dev cycle. "sorry, no defense" should not be an option here, Folks. Or I guess I can just go logon my alt, train dictors and be an uber-fleet-ganker-pwnmobile-'o-death. Pretty much makes my 2m SP character a Hero - but how about my 35m SP character that can't escape a weapon weilded by a 6 month old character? Basically erases the skill component out of the game, dontcha think? Not to mention insulting, to say the least. Thanks for yet another I-Win button that has no remedy. Alright, just for you man, since I am a nice guy, I will explain to you my uber secret method for avoiding bubble camps. Ready for this? Its called THE SCANNER. When you use the scanner, and you see y'know, A FLEET, go around that gate. You should also consider using a) the map b) local And consider the following, you are not supposed to be invulnerable to non-consensual pvp in 0.0.
Cividari Caldari Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2006.11.07 18:39:00 - [28] Originally by: Ephemeron Interdictors are good, but not godly. I have escaped small gang dictor camps many times. Dictors drop their bubble at center of the gate. People that jump in will appear very near the edge of the dictor sphere. Usually you just need to travel a few KM outward before you can warp. If you have MWD/AB, you can often escape, unless the gate camp is big or just plain uber. One time, my Blackbird cruiser jumped into a dictor bubble with Sabre, Dominix, Scorp camping.. I started moving away from the gate, managed to jamm all 3 on first cycle, missed the scorp on 2nd cycle but it was out of scrambler range already. I warped off with shield damage Interdictors are not overpowered. They bring some sense of balance to grossly overpowered tactic of "running away" from combat. It shouldn't be so easy to avoid combat in low security areas. Problem is if the dictor got half a brain and fits more then one sphere launcher or if he got a buddy in a frig to tackle you. I personaly lost a deimos (my own mistake for not scouting ahead) when I jumped into a camp of sniping tempests a dictor and a t1 frig. Managed to get out of the bubble just fine but by then the frig (an incursus I think it was) had gotten enough time to scramble me.
Adoran Wa'alle Caldari 5punkorp Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.11.07 19:24:00 - [29] You want 'dictors to be nerfed? We had a dictor pirate roaming our spacelanes preying on our haulers (he'll remain anonymous for the sake of, well...embarresment. And no, I can't spell). Know what we (well, not me) did? sent two haulers after him. guess who came out on top? NERF HAULERS! ----------------------------------- Rawr. awrarawr!
Mihae Queens of the Stone Age Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2006.11.07 19:34:00 - [30] Edited by: Mihae on 07/11/2006 19:35:34 Mar vel you are a nutcase. I don't see any please we can lock you in so we will have to execute you. Im sorry but thats just the way it is. And as other people says it's just to press the ******* Controll + Q...



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