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Adoran Wa'alle Caldari 5punkorp Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.11.10 11:31:00 - [1] Yeah, I know there has been a thread already called "the SWG effect" or something like that. but that's not the same as the point I'm trying to make here. This forum reminds me of the SWG forum when the first Combat Uprade hit. Not as much whining and breaking stuff as the NGE, but enough to make a few vets mad and get them to leave. I personally endured the CU, and adapted my playstyle to fit it. I had a good time. But when the NGE came, it was over for me. To me it seems like EVE-Online is going through its "CU". CCP, this is a slippery slope. Don't let this game go through an NGE in the future. God I miss SWG Other than that...Adapt, Adopt, Survive. It's not the end of the world, you just need to change your playstyle a little bit. ----------------------------------- Rawr. awrarawr!
Jeryko Gallente FireStar Inc Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.10 11:38:00 - [2] Edited by: Jeryko on 10/11/2006 11:38:57 Same boat. Played right up until the NGE. From my experince though, CCP has done a good job with damage control. I hope they continue to please.
Ath Amon	Posted - 2006.11.10 12:04:00 - [3] nah... huge difference in SWG there where tons of people totally hating the CU, mostly because it was a fundamental change of game philosophy (from SWG to EQ/WOW) here there is some (natural) whinage and people that don't like an aspect or another but is not a fundamental change in the way game is played... even for me there are things that need to be looked at but that doesn't necessary mean that the game will be totally ruined (as it was clear for SWG)
Adoran Wa'alle Caldari 5punkorp Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.11.10 12:25:00 - [4] Originally by: Jeryko Edited by: Jeryko on 10/11/2006 11:38:57 Same boat. Played right up until the NGE. From my experince though, CCP has done a good job with damage control. I hope they continue to please. Indeed they have. I feel dirty for comparing CCP to SOE ----------------------------------- Rawr. awrarawr!
Sir Drake	Posted - 2006.11.10 13:28:00 - [5] NGE was the death sentence to SWG. (I left very shortly afterwards myself) Giving ppl starting char options others had worked their asses off to get was extremly stupid. (eg Jedi or Bounty Hunter) And not to forget the really annoying problem with bugged missions.
Corman Lietflyer	Posted - 2006.11.11 02:51:00 - [6] I remember swg when i started before the CU. it was fun, had a master CH for a friend helping me level carbineer on ahazi, then i moved to goraht after my break and coming back to the CU, i played as msmuggler and mcm pistoleer xxx4 for awhile until the nge hit, in which i tried most of the classes, and found most of them lacking. Anyway, i gave my account to a friend shortly after and never got on again... Hope this doesnt happen to eve....
MissileRus	Posted - 2006.11.11 03:16:00 - [7] Edited by: MissileRus on 11/11/2006 03:21:49 Edited by: MissileRus on 11/11/2006 03:20:48 its EVUL comparing CCP to SOE their nothing alike! SOE are idiots, CCP are gods and this stuff about gamebreaking hp boost... they will change other things to upset it, ccp arent idiots and i find it sad ppl think they will just keep stuff as it is and especialy vets. and quiting for something thats not final and wont stay like it is is stupid tbh! more spots for newer people though Tier3 ammo=insta pop anything? NO thx, gief hp boost... --------------------------- 4. i like pizza
Ishmael Hansen No Quarter. Axiom Empire	Posted - 2006.11.11 04:00:00 - [8] Less players = less lag, yay, as long as they don't increase subscripion :P This is my first mmorpg, and the only game I play in more then two years now. I trust in ccp, they done amazing job so far, always some whinning, but nobody can please everyone.
Khralen	Posted - 2006.11.11 18:39:00 - [9] Originally by: Ishmael Hansen Less players = less lag, yay, as long as they don't increase subscripion :P This is my first mmorpg, and the only game I play in more then two years now. I trust in ccp, they done amazing job so far, always some whinning, but nobody can please everyone. So true. It seems to me that the complaints are only more numerous because there are a lot more people than before. When Cold War hit, we had about 1/3 of the number of people, and that was the missile nerf. I recall the forums being bombarded with whining and flames about the nerf. It seems like there are more people are whining, because there is, but, I suspect that per capita whining is about the same level. I suspect that the same % of people will throw up their hands in disgust and quit the game, and that the void that they leave will be filled. Note to all disgrutled players: If you decide to quit, I'll take all your stuff.
Malthros Zenobia Caldari Independent Navy Reserve	Posted - 2006.11.11 18:49:00 - [10] How can people compare an HP boost to NGE? Boost in HP isn't a massive overhaul of something, it's a step in making fights take longer, and a precursor to tactical combat, like shooting subsystems. Originally by: kieron The Carrier was never intended to be a solo OMGWTF mission-farming PWNmobile.
Wrayeth Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.11.11 19:12:00 - [11] Originally by: Malthros Zenobia How can people compare an HP boost to NGE? Boost in HP isn't a massive overhaul of something, it's a step in making fights take longer, and a precursor to tactical combat, like shooting subsystems. It's quite easy to compare it to the NGE - it destroys entire playstyles. Those who prefer solo and very small group combat will be screwed with this patch. When a battleship 1-v-1 takes 10 minutes or more, it will cease to be a 1-v-1 and become a 5-v-1 when four of the target's buddies show up and gank you five minutes into the fight. Moreoever, it really hurts low DPS races like Minmatar, who will now be entirely unable to defeat properly set up ravens adn the like with ships such as the AC tempest. -Wrayeth "Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!" R.I.P. AC tempest R.I.P. Torp raven R.I.P. Solo PvP R.I.P. My account, after the next cycle. Thanks, CCP.
Captain Raynor Caldari	Posted - 2006.11.11 19:13:00 - [12] Edited by: Captain Raynor on 11/11/2006 19:14:27 stuff dies pretty fast even with the hp boost tbh, maybe just not 1v1 besides, sisi setups are generally quite a bit more rugged than normal tranq setups when you need afterburners, mwds, scramblers, webs and such =================== snip Please do not discuss moderation in your sig -Eldo
Wrayeth Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.11.11 19:15:00 - [13] Originally by: Captain Raynor stuff dies pretty fast even with the hp boost tbh, maybe just not 1v1 Of course it does...in gang and fleet combat. That was what the hitpoint boost was design to increase - fight times in large-scale combat where people die instantly. Instead, it had little to no effect on large-scale fight durations and completely screwed small-scale combat. People who fly in blobs have no reason to dislike the hitpoint changes since it really doesn't affect them; in contrast, solo and very small gang PvPers are *****. -Wrayeth "Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing* to this thread!" R.I.P. AC tempest R.I.P. Torp raven R.I.P. Solo PvP R.I.P. My account, after the next cycle. Thanks, CCP.
Captain Raynor Caldari	Posted - 2006.11.11 19:21:00 - [14] Originally by: Wrayeth Originally by: Captain Raynor stuff dies pretty fast even with the hp boost tbh, maybe just not 1v1 Of course it does...in gang and fleet combat. That was what the hitpoint boost was design to increase - fight times in large-scale combat where people die instantly. Instead, it had little to no effect on large-scale fight durations and completely screwed small-scale combat. People who fly in blobs have no reason to dislike the hitpoint changes since it really doesn't affect them; in contrast, solo and very small gang PvPers are *****. i dont mind longer fights so long as people cant make invincible 1v1 setups, and since wcs are getting nerfed hard, people wont be able to escape so easily anyways. besides solo pvp has been dead for a while now anyways, wcs killed it and the hp boost just makes it a tad harder.. so does warp to 0km really since everyone has instas now (not that everyone with a clue didnt already anyways) =================== snip* Please do not discuss moderation in your sig -Eldo
Wrayeth Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.11.11 19:30:00 - [15] Originally by: Captain Raynor i dont mind longer fights so long as people cant make invincible 1v1 setups, and since wcs are getting nerfed hard, people wont be able to escape so easily anyways. It's not their escape I'm worried about - it's their 5246 buddies who will arrive during the longer fight and turn the 1-v-1 into a many-v-1. Quote: besides solo pvp has been dead for a while now anyways, wcs killed it and the hp boost just makes it a tad harder.. so does warp to 0km really since everyone has instas now (not that everyone with a clue didnt already anyways) Solo PvP has most emphatically NOT been dead. I PvP solo all the time to good effect. The hitpoint boost does not make it "a tad harder", it makes it impossible. As for warp to zero, I PvP in battleships, mostly, so I don't have an uber lock time. As such, it won't affect my ability to catch people at gates since I never get the smaller stuff anyway - I can still lock larger ships after they come out of jump cloak, and warp to 0km won't change that. Moreover, not all fights happen at gates. -Wrayeth "Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!" R.I.P. AC tempest R.I.P. Torp raven R.I.P. Solo PvP R.I.P. My account, after the next cycle. Thanks, CCP.
Leverton Caldari AWE Corporation Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.11.11 22:20:00 - [16] Frankly, I don't really see that happening. I'll bet there were people just like you who said in older patches that "this is the END of EVE!", when that was not the case at all. -- The universe is governed by the aggressive use of force. Hows this for a little note! Oh, and YARRRRR!! - Petwraith I prefer the term RAWR - Xorus
Adoran Wa'alle Caldari 5punkorp Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.11.11 22:45:00 - [17] Originally by: Leverton Frankly, I don't really see that happening. I'll bet there were people just like you who said in older patches that "this is the END of EVE!", when that was not the case at all. Not sure if you're referring to me or the poster above you, but... I'm not saying it's the end of EVE. At the very end of my post I get to that people should quit whining and adapt to the new changes. I'm just saying that it affects some playstyles very heavily. Personally, I don't mind the changes at all (what do you expect? I'm caldari ). ----------------------------------- Rawr. awrarawr!
ManowarX Caldari Red Horizon Inc	Posted - 2006.11.12 00:32:00 - [18] As people have said, this happens all the time when a major patch comes. When the missile nerf came everyone who played Caldari whined about how they wouldn't be able to instapop frigs anymore and how much a timesink it was going to be to train all the support skills to bring the damage back to what it was pre-nerf. The sky was falling and people were talking about walking away from the game. What ended up happening is that the player base continued to grow at record paces and people now whine how overpowered Caldari and missiles are......again. So take all of the "improvements" with a grain of salt and realize that if CCP screws up something they will be quick to balance it and if not, we will adapt as we always have. There are some very cool things coming in Kali with new areas to explore, new ships and new professions. Let's enjoy it and be thankful that CCP continues to try to improve their game.
Krist Valentine Amarr Freelancing Opportunists	Posted - 2006.11.12 01:28:00 - [19] Originally by: ManowarX So take all of the "improvements" with a grain of salt and realize that if CCP screws up something they will be quick to balance it and if not, we will adapt as we always have. There are some very cool things coming in Kali with new areas to explore, new ships and new professions. Let's enjoy it and be thankful that CCP continues to try to improve their game. Yeah, I agree with you here, but I don't think they would have put this health increase in without thinking about it. They've considered it enough to keep it in for a while at least, and considering solo pvp is pretty much all I enjoy, this, if it's as bad as it's ****ed up to be, will probably totally ruin EVE for me. :( From what I've heard, there'll be no more Farjung style antics. The only viable pvp is sitting in an alliance fleet clicking on the primary target and watching it dissolve instantly. - - - - - ISD r teh pwn -- Oh yeah? Come back here and be a man, whoever modified that! I have my duelling glove!*
Yee Do	Posted - 2006.11.12 02:29:00 - [20] I honestly can't believe anyone is trying to compare the changes in Kali to the NGE. Perhaps if CCP got rid of the amarr and caldari races while removing all ships but frigates and cruisers you might be on to something, but really, there is simply no comparison. Yes there will be changes to how some people play the game, but it will still be the same game for the most part. You won't be asked to play a twitch fighter game where the guy with the good connection clobbers you everytime.
F'nog Amarr Celestial Horizon Corp. Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.11.12 04:28:00 - [21] Warning Derailment in progress! I know what the NGE involved, but what changed in the CU that I keep hearing about? Back on topic: As others have said, before every major patch people have complained that the game would be ruined and Eve would die. So far that hasn't happened, and I've been through every major change since shortly after Castor hit. Originally by: DB Preacher The only time BoB's backs are to the wall is when backdoor bandit is in local.
Sexorella hotz Beasts of Burden Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2006.11.12 06:19:00 - [22] The CU was a first complete change to SWG combat, followed of course by the NGE which was a second change that completely revamped the game. Kali brings in some balance issues, some ships people don't like or think should've been better, so on and so forth, but they are not changing the game mechanics. Yes, people have to learn rigs, and the new probing, and the new gangs, and so forth, but its still the same game with the same equipment, the same strategies, and no matter what, EVE will best PVP MMO I've ever seen, there are no parallels to galaxies in EVE, no one likes change, that's a fact, and there are always people freaking out when expansions happen, but this is by no means anything like the CU or the NGE that galaxies went through. They're adding content that not everyone agrees with, they aren't changing the fundamentals of the game.
Aries Acheron Caldari The Valour	Posted - 2006.11.12 07:32:00 - [23] I wish people would stop comparting altering HP and nerfing some t2 ammo types the 'doom of the game'. Same with warp to 0. The SWG thing was a completely different effect. It went from an MMORPG style 'auto attack + special ability' game to a click-on-the-target-faster game, where your player's shooting actually mattered. Rather like their awful space combat, which was a waterred down flight sim without any fun. It's like if you turned EVE into Space Diablo, where whoever clicked faster and ran faster won. As it is, this is just a rebalancing as all games tend to do. ~~~ Action! Suspense! Jita! http://survive-eve.blogspot.com/
Victoria Zongo Derelik Privateers	Posted - 2006.11.12 11:46:00 - [24] Hitpoint changes and warp to 0 destroy some fun playstyles. Just because you like some other things in the game, doesn't mean there is no problem.
Audri Fisher Caldari The Keep THE R0CK	Posted - 2006.11.13 01:57:00 - [25] Don't even go there. the NGE destroyed everything that had been done before. SOE never asked for anyfeedback about the nge, and used deceptive marketing to sell ToOW. SOE deleted and banned just about every naysaer on there forums. CCP on the other hand, announces changes well in advance, ask for feedback, and has made some adjustmenst based on that feedback. These are pretty big changes, but they are being upfront about it, and it is still the same game. the NGE was a completley differnt game.
Ruze No Applicable Corporation	Posted - 2006.11.13 03:36:00 - [26] I really and truly hate SOE. With that in mind, I felt they were in a bad situation with bad office politics, and their 'ruining' of SWG was as much the fault of George Lucas' want for money as it was SOE's limited interaction with their playerbase. Their customer service sucked, their forum manners sucked. H-ll, they even bragged about how hard it was to design SWG, and then were shownup by a bunch of amature programers. Now, I like CCP. I do sometimes get the feeling that the guys at CCP are less professional, like they would be the types of people to jump online in a 'discretely' upgraded alt and grief a player who talked bad about them on the forums, but then again, they've done great things. Eve is going to continue growing, cause it's a great game. It's going to continue to change, cause it's going to continue to grow. And at some point, there will be players who have been around since beta who look back and think 'I don't like this game anymore.' Sometimes you just have to ask yourself ... is the game still fun? If it's not, then by all means, petition or quit playing. It is your money, after all. But some people seem to find that asking that question makes them realize that, though it may not be fun in the same way, it's still fun. Up to the individual. And for those about the HP boost? Bah, they're funny to listen to. White noise in the background, really. Combat will go just as fast, and people will find a way to push it to its limits, just like it is now. It ALWAYS works that way, and soon the naysayers become those defending the matter. A good player adapts and learns to kick -ss in new ways. A poor player blames the equipment and the surroundings. Which are you? Kali isn't CU or NGE. It's a bunch of tiny patches that have been put off for the end of the year to be pushed as an expansion. And EvE isn't SWG. Genesis Project
Acheron Cyc Caldari	Posted - 2006.11.13 04:30:00 - [27] Funny how all the whinners have this amazing capability of seeing into the future and know what exactly will happen when the changes are implemented. Pft. ------------------------------------------ "To do something right it must be done twice. The first time instructs the second." Simon Bolivar.
Krist Valentine Amarr Freelancing Opportunists	Posted - 2006.11.14 16:11:00 - [28] Originally by: Acheron Cyc Funny how all the whinners have this amazing capability of seeing into the future and know what exactly will happen when the changes are implemented. Pft. Funny how the only people not complaining are blobbers or non pvp'ers. I don't know anything about you, but from what I've seen I'm gonna guess you fall into one of the two above categories. - - - - - ISD r teh pwn -- Oh yeah? Come back here and be a man, whoever modified that! I have my duelling glove!
Kristoffer Amarr Blackguard Brigade	Posted - 2006.11.14 17:17:00 - [29] Originally by: Krist Valentine Originally by: Acheron Cyc Funny how all the whinners have this amazing capability of seeing into the future and know what exactly will happen when the changes are implemented. Pft. Funny how the only people not complaining are blobbers or non pvp'ers. I don't know anything about you, but from what I've seen I'm gonna guess you fall into one of the two above categories. QTF
Isyel Minmatar Masuat'aa Matari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2006.11.14 17:49:00 - [30] Edited by: Isyel on 14/11/2006 17:50:19 Edited by: Isyel on 14/11/2006 17:49:51 Originally by: Krist Valentine Originally by: Acheron Cyc Funny how all the whinners have this amazing capability of seeing into the future and know what exactly will happen when the changes are implemented. Pft. Funny how the only people not complaining are blobbers or non pvp'ers. I don't know anything about you, but from what I've seen I'm gonna guess you fall into one of the two above categories. Aw, thanks. You make me feel special. I'm a PvPer and hate and don't participate in blobs (not like my alliance actually ever even had a proper blob ), yet i'm not complaining about the HP boost. Go figure. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I be needin' some sig love. sigh

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