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Pantalala	Posted - 2006.11.11 02:48:00 - [1] Hi all, I've been doing to research into mining and I've heard of people who will come in and take your ore from your can and there's nothing you can do. Is this true? If it is, how often does it happen? What can I do about it?
Michelle Deathmind Amarr The Merchant Marines Miners With Attitude	Posted - 2006.11.11 02:58:00 - [2] Ore thieves, a type of griefer. But you can do something about them. When someone steals from your can, they get flagged, which means they start flashing red on your overview, and you can shoot them without penalty. Be warned though, they can shoot back. They are thankfully rare.
Benglada Finite Horizon The Red Skull	Posted - 2006.11.11 04:28:00 - [3] Originally by: Michelle Deathmind Ore thieves, a type of griefer. But you can do something about them. When someone steals from your can, they get flagged, which means they start flashing red on your overview, and you can shoot them without penalty. Be warned though, they can shoot back. They are thankfully rare. The word Greifer doesent exist in eve, greifer basically states that someone is doing something just to annoy/harass you, not the case here, he is doing it to sell the ore to make money. --------------------------- Originally by: Arkanor 0.0 is the Final Frontier. Bring money and friends.
Kumu Honua	Posted - 2006.11.11 04:28:00 - [4] The best defense to an ore thief is to have a friend nearby with a combat ship. Have HIM drop the cans. Then when an ore thief shows up, he will end up stealing not from the mining ship, but the one that is ready for combat.
Cerfain	Posted - 2006.11.11 05:53:00 - [5] Have you not heard of a locked can?? i sware... YaR its like leaving ur diamond ring on the public bathroom sink when you go in and drop a duce...
Athena Starfire Gallente	Posted - 2006.11.11 06:05:00 - [6] Edited by: Athena Starfire on 11/11/2006 06:07:03 If you have the capability you can use the 'dump truck' method. This is one person in a miner, the other in a industrial. And a can used only to transfer between the miner and the indy. when the indy get full it goes and drops it at a dock or sells it, and the warps back for the next load, waits until full, rinse and repeat. (I have 2 accounts and 2 computer systems so I operate both at the same time when none of my mates are around) People like to mine to 'jet cans' (jettison cans) because they can hold 27,000 m3, secured can can only hold 3000 m3, but you still have to empty the can somehow. Some low-life ore thieves are not thieves at all, they a pathetic pirates that try to goat a fight out of a newbie or unarmed miner. (ie: Fight me or lose your ore) because they are to much of a wimp to go PvP normally. Don't trust anyone you don't know coming toward you. A badger or largish frieghter can come in an pick up the entire can and put it in a cargo hold and never be seen by the game as 'stealing'..Never seen this but heard of it. If your going to mine to a 'jet can' you take the chances of scum robbing you.
Augusto Tobias	Posted - 2006.11.11 10:10:00 - [7] Hey Athena Starfire, does this affect Giant secure containers too?
Athena Starfire Gallente	Posted - 2006.11.11 10:24:00 - [8] Edited by: Athena Starfire on 11/11/2006 10:25:59 Originally by: Augusto Tobias Hey Athena Starfire, does this affect Giant secure containers too? A normal indy can snatch up a giant secure if its in .7 or greater as cans can no longer be anchored in .7-1.0 space It dosent matter if its secure, if a thief can take the entire can he can just 'reprocess' it and get the stuff that way at a dock. The only sure way to keep your ore safe is in a ship..of course then some butt-head priate can come in and suicide gank you... but that is kinda rare. I think most thieves will only go after the ores like Omber and those in Jita. I don't go to low-sec (AND DON'T CARE TO) so I have no idea about there. If your mining Scord or Veldpar I doubt anyone will care..
Orion Shurtak Amarr Free Player Corp	Posted - 2006.11.12 11:54:00 - [9] If you make easy for a thief to get your ore, then they probably will. If they actually have to work to get it or have to think it through, then your probably safe. After all, they have limited intelligence which is why they take your ore rather than mine it themselves. Can't figure out all the buttons to push. -------------------------------------------------- Free Player Corporation
Rotag Amarr	Posted - 2006.11.12 15:48:00 - [10] Why are ore theifs so despicible? You jettison (definition: to cast (goods) overboard in order to lighten a vessel or aircraft or to improve its stability in an emergency. 2. to throw off (something) as an obstacle or burden; discard. Source So by jettising, you are effictively throwing away unwanted goods. I come in my shuttle/mwd frigate, set up a few instas, come in my industrial, and scoop them up.
Lithalnas Amarr Hadean Drive Yards	Posted - 2006.11.12 18:57:00 - [11] i mine with something that can use a launcher, lock the thief, then shoot a missile at the asteroid, he will most likely think you are shooting at him and when he shoots back, concord will take care of him. Got a bs that way, only cost me one heavy missile. ------------- Cadet Lithalnas - Logistics Division - Hadean Drive Yards
Athena Starfire Gallente	Posted - 2006.11.12 21:36:00 - [12] Originally by: Lithalnas i mine with something that can use a launcher, lock the thief, then shoot a missile at the asteroid, he will most likely think you are shooting at him and when he shoots back, concord will take care of him. Got a bs that way, only cost me one heavy missile. Well, the person was/is an idiot...because a warning pops up if you are about to attack an object that CONCORD will fry you for...
Athena Starfire Gallente	Posted - 2006.11.12 21:39:00 - [13] Originally by: Rotag Why are ore theifs so despicible? You jettison (definition: to cast (goods) overboard in order to lighten a vessel or aircraft or to improve its stability in an emergency. 2. to throw off (something) as an obstacle or burden; discard. Source So by jettising, you are effictively throwing away unwanted goods. I come in my shuttle/mwd frigate, set up a few instas, come in my industrial, and scoop them up. Come in and scoop my can scum..you will get 1 round of ammo. Transfer only..
Enotz Amarr Terminus Est Incorporated	Posted - 2006.11.13 10:06:00 - [14] A lot of ore theives only intend to steal from macro miners. If you say something in local, like "Hey man, what's up?", they're less likely to steal your ore. This also has the benefit of letting them know you're there; which also scares people who steal from everyone, as it's almost a sort of bluff. Apart from that; the best way to handle it is to put a scrambler on your mining vessel if you can; and have backup at around 300-500km out with instas. Lock them if they even come close; they take the can, you scramble them (They will hardly ever expect this), and your buddy warps in right on top of you, locks and kills. This will work for most theiving ships; as they typically aren't setup for combat; but rather to hold and run. Although you should be careful they don't have WCS, as that throws the plan off somewhat.
Caleb Paine ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.11.13 10:10:00 - [15] Originally by: Enotz A lot of ore theives only intend to steal from macro miners. If you say something in local, like "Hey man, what's up?", they're less likely to steal your ore. This also has the benefit of letting them know you're there; which also scares people who steal from everyone, as it's almost a sort of bluff. Apart from that; the best way to handle it is to put a scrambler on your mining vessel if you can; and have backup at around 300-500km out with instas. Lock them if they even come close; they take the can, you scramble them (They will hardly ever expect this), and your buddy warps in right on top of you, locks and kills. This will work for most theiving ships; as they typically aren't setup for combat; but rather to hold and run. Although you should be careful they don't have WCS, as that throws the plan off somewhat. huh? -------------------------------- ISS Navy Task Force; Protecting your interest.
Hesod Adee Bright New Dawn	Posted - 2006.11.13 10:18:00 - [16] Originally by: Augusto Tobias Hey Athena Starfire, does this affect Giant secure containers too? Only if they haven't been anchored. Originally by: Caleb Paine Originally by: Enotz A lot of ore theives only intend to steal from macro miners. If you say something in local, like "Hey man, what's up?", they're less likely to steal your ore. This also has the benefit of letting them know you're there; which also scares people who steal from everyone, as it's almost a sort of bluff. Apart from that; the best way to handle it is to put a scrambler on your mining vessel if you can; and have backup at around 300-500km out with instas. Lock them if they even come close; they take the can, you scramble them (They will hardly ever expect this), and your buddy warps in right on top of you, locks and kills. This will work for most theiving ships; as they typically aren't setup for combat; but rather to hold and run. Although you should be careful they don't have WCS, as that throws the plan off somewhat. huh? When you steal from a can owned be someone in a player corp, everyone in that player corp gets to shoot you for 15 mins, not just the person you stole from. So when they steal from the can, not only does it allow the BS sitting just outside scanner range to shoot them, but the miner has gone and scrambled the thief so he can't escape the BS that just warped in. ----------------- My door is always open, just don't go in.
Ansuru Starlancer The Phoenix Rising Distant Star Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.13 14:31:00 - [17] There is something you can do: Come back in a combat ship better than theirs and steal it back. If they shoot you, pop them. If you haven't got a decent combat ship, hunt them down with your corp members. A gang of frigates is more than a match for most single pilots.
Ansuru Starlancer The Phoenix Rising Distant Star Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.13 14:34:00 - [18] Originally by: Athena Starfire Originally by: Lithalnas i mine with something that can use a launcher, lock the thief, then shoot a missile at the asteroid, he will most likely think you are shooting at him and when he shoots back, concord will take care of him. Got a bs that way, only cost me one heavy missile. Well, the person was/is an idiot...because a warning pops up if you are about to attack an object that CONCORD will fry you for... Hon, a lot of people disable that because CCP was too stupid to make it NOT pop up in 0.0, where seconds mean life :p
Miner Ed	Posted - 2006.11.13 18:24:00 - [19] I have to say, I am a new player too. And I have tried mining on my own. Last night I joined a small corp, and went out with another mining frigate size dude and a battleship (I don't know what ship exactly, cause I'm new). We mined into a container, then they hauled the container back to the station. The dude in the battleship blew up the NPC pirates that spawned, and chased away a couple of would be theives. I made way more money in the same amount of time that way, and I had people to chat with. I highly recommend mining as a team.
Dust Rocket	Posted - 2006.11.13 19:20:00 - [20] Freighters cant scoop up anything from space and this is a fact. Mining into sec cans is waste of time. 1 cycle of 3 strips is more then 3000m3 of ore. Same with u mine into hauler ship, Max 6 cycles and its full, then u just need to wait. Just find system with less people in it and orethiefs not as sommon as u may think.
Matalino Gallente	Posted - 2006.11.13 19:54:00 - [21] Edited by: Matalino on 13/11/2006 19:56:27 Originally by: Dust Rocket Same with u mine into hauler ship, Max 6 cycles and its full, then u just need to wait. Yes it is full in ~6 cycles, but the hauler should be able to make the round trip to the station and back to unload while the next set of cycles is running. Base cycle time is 3 minutes for a strip miner. You may as well have your buddy/alt-account haul while you mine. It has to be hauled to station at some point. Its not like you are going to just leave it there in space until the can pops.
Dust Rocket	Posted - 2006.11.13 20:04:00 - [22] Ok have u ever heared that named cans last longer then 1 hour? By that time i can have 3 of them next too me and haul them then. Even better u can just move ur ore from one can to another. So u can have plenty of cans next too u and then haul.
Athena Starfire Gallente	Posted - 2006.11.13 22:30:00 - [23] Edited by: Athena Starfire on 13/11/2006 22:37:40 Well, I mine from a Covetor to a MKIV Indy (Gallente MKV in about 2 weeks) the Indy has 12,091 m3 takes me about 15 mins to fill the Indy (when doing Scordite, less when there is Omber around) and the can is stated as 'Transfer only - Not for storage', We can pretty much keep up with the Covetor when we have more than 1 Indy around. I have 2 systems and 2 accounts (As a matter of fact my Covetor is on the other screen at the moment minng and the MKIV is windowed and minimised on this system while I'm writing this) I don't have to worry about ore thieves because the can is always empty. What really rocks is when a corpmate beings out his Oblisk (750,000+ m3) not sure what the actual capacity is. He parks it and we all just dump to it, we have never been able to fill it :D You can avoid most ore thieves by mining in a secluded system..Go to Jita and you can be assured of ore thieves and the occasional 'suicide gank' ..especially if you are mistaken for a macro miner. When 'Warp to O' comes in this will be even better because I dont have to wait to dock from 15m or to jump back to Gang Member at 15m. Can't wait! :D
Matalino Gallente	Posted - 2006.11.13 22:39:00 - [24] Edited by: Matalino on 13/11/2006 22:40:40 Originally by: Dust Rocket Ok have u ever heared that named cans last longer then 1 hour? By that time i can have 3 of them next too me and haul them then. Even better u can just move ur ore from one can to another. So u can have plenty of cans next too u and then haul. The more full cans you have floating in space the more stuff there is for someone else to take. Switching ships takes about 20 seconds. As long as your hold is full, the time travelling between the station and your can doesn't count as a penalty because you have to do it. If you do it once, or you do it ten times, you still have to do it to get your ore back to the station. The question is do you want to invest that 20 seconds every 20,000 m3 or every 100,000 m3. The bigger the batch, the greater the potential loss. The smaller the batches the more times you have to spend that 20 seconds to switch ships and another 20 to switch back. How big of a load you are willing to risk is up to you. If you want minimal risk, load directly into a waiting hauler. If you want, you could keep dozens of cans full by switching stuff between named cans, but if someone takes it all your out of luck.
Dust Rocket	Posted - 2006.11.13 23:31:00 - [25] Edited by: Dust Rocket on 13/11/2006 23:32:15 Edited by: Dust Rocket on 13/11/2006 23:31:56 Originally by: Athena Starfire What really rocks is when a corpmate beings out his Oblisk (750,000+ m3) not sure what the actual capacity is. He parks it and we all just dump to it, we have never been able to fill it :D Freighters As Obelisk cant scoop up things from space When i have more can i have less chance too loose my ore cause u can flip one of my cans and have some from other in ur cargohold. Cant set ourt other jetcan in 3 mins. And i have better chance to find u in belt with my other ship when u try to jet another can.
Athena Starfire Gallente	Posted - 2006.11.13 23:42:00 - [26] Originally by: Dust Rocket Freighters As Obelisk cant scoop up things from space No, but they can take stuff out of a transfer can :)
Dust Rocket	Posted - 2006.11.14 01:42:00 - [27] Explain it too me please what is the transfer can? Is it jetcan or is it GSC or freighter can. Pleas what is this mystical transfer can?
Athena Starfire Gallente	Posted - 2006.11.14 02:22:00 - [28] Edited by: Athena Starfire on 14/11/2006 02:25:11 Just your normal jettison can, like you use when you normally mine.. you put one out ..miner puts ore mined into the can..Indy or freighter takes ore out of the can..its just for transfering stuff from one ship to another...You keep maybe a piece of ammo or something in the can in order to keep it 'open' as once everything is take out it explodes.
Dust Rocket	Posted - 2006.11.14 16:31:00 - [29] Edited by: Dust Rocket on 14/11/2006 16:32:08 Originally by: Athena Starfire Just your normal jettison can, like you use when you normally mine.. you put one out ..miner puts ore mined into the can..Indy or freighter takes ore out of the can..its just for transfering stuff from one ship to another...You keep maybe a piece of ammo or something in the can in order to keep it 'open' as once everything is take out it explodes. So i guess u dont now much about freighters then. Please dont speak about things u dont now. Freighter cant take anything out from any form of can what floats in space. It can be filled with things in station and also emptyed in one. And no mather what u rename ur can does not change the thing. Yes u can put things from jetcans to Industrial or transport ship but not into freighter. So to make sure u are talking about right thing http://www.eve-online.com/itemdatabase/ships/freighters/gallente/20187.asp Crap this link making is hard
Billy Sastard Amarr Zephyr Enterprises Inc. Astral Wolves	Posted - 2006.11.14 18:42:00 - [30] Originally by: Athena Starfire (..blah..blah..) takes me about 15 mins to fill the Indy (when doing Scordite, less when there is Omber around) (..blah..blah..) Do you actually mine?? Mining lasers mine in m3 per cycle. So your going to mine the same volume of ore in a set amount of time no matter if you are mining veldspar or Arkonor, the only thing that will change is the # of units it takes to make that volume. And please stop using the word freighter, maybe you are thinking of transport ships (the t2 variant of the industrials). A freighter is a very specialised ship which can only be loaded with cargo inside of a station, and does not have any ability to scoop or jettison items while in flight. -=^=- My Bookmarking Guide
Dust Rocket	Posted - 2006.11.14 18:57:00 - [31] Thank God someone else told him it also
Billy Sastard Amarr Zephyr Enterprises Inc. Astral Wolves	Posted - 2006.11.14 19:19:00 - [32] Originally by: Dust Rocket Thank God someone else told him it also LOL soz 'bout the echo ^^, I didnt make it past that post when I made my reply ;). -=^=- My Bookmarking Guide

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