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Think I'm wasting time and being greedy?

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Gerell Mai Caldari	Posted - 2006.11.13 09:25:00 - [1] Hello, I'm thinknig of making a reimbursement petition due to the loss of my ship. I'm wondering if I should even bother though, because it was not CCPs fault my ship was lost. But I feel if I was playing a single play game and something like this happend, I'd reload my game ot the last save point even if I'm playing 100% fair and not powergaming etc. Anyways, I'll explain what happened by letting you read what I may or may not include in my petition depending on what you, the community, think of the situation. ------------------- Dear CCP I was playing EVE, traveling in my Cerberus in high security space, when my brother triped over the keyboard and mouse wires, ripping them out of the computer. When he was plugging them back in my mouse and keyboard freaked out and my cursor started pointing all over and my keyboard started pressing random buttons. Amazingly, all this random key pressing and mouse moving activated a medium nosferatu I onto a STARGATE, even bypassing the warning message that briefly popped up. I recognize it is 100% not your (CCPs) fault my ship was lost. But given the nature of this loss (I was not killed by a player or even by an NPC that I was figthing) I am hoping you could restore my ship loss. A cerberus is sooooo expensive and it just seems like such a waste that one could be lost to such a simple out of game thing. I hope you can help, but I will understand if you cant. Thank you. --------------------------------- So what do you fellows think? Please, dont flame me. I'm here to ask your opinion.
Golerre Evraun	Posted - 2006.11.13 09:27:00 - [2] Edited by: Golerre Evraun on 13/11/2006 09:30:36 that's your problem not CCP's and honestly, with the backlog of petitions that already exist you would only be wasting precious resources on filing one for this issue <edit> if this happens again you need to pull the ethernet cable out from the back of your pc and whip your brother with it, this serves two purposes, first it will alleviate a bit of stress and second it will force a disconnect from eve, after eve disconnects you can safely reinsert all 3 ---------------------------------------- If you ain't dyin, You Ain't tryin.
Xaroth Brook Minmatar Doomcraft	Posted - 2006.11.13 09:29:00 - [3] I'd say you won't get anything back, it was an error on your side, not theirs. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Xaroth Brook Brainiac of Doomcraft Member of R I S E
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.11.13 09:35:00 - [4] Edited by: Jim McGregor on 13/11/2006 09:36:33 It was your fault. Please dont petition stuff like that, you have no chance of getting the ship back due to your mistakes. Sorry to hear about the loss though, Cerb is very expensive. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Valan	Posted - 2006.11.13 09:37:00 - [5] I don't know whether to laugh at a joke and shake my head in disbelief. I love old characters that post 'I've beeen playing the game three years' when I know their account has been sold on.
Brutor Shaun Minmatar Freelancers UK Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.13 09:38:00 - [6] 1. Buy an Indy and a miner II, and make your brother mine veld until you can afford a new ship and fittings. 2. Save up in RL for a computer desk so that you don't have wires trailing across the floor.
Sakura Nihil Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.11.13 10:25:00 - [7] 1) It was your brother's error, not CCP, so it won't work 2) Kill your brother "Titans were never meant to be cost-effective, they're a huge ****" - Oveur
Plutoinum German Cyberdome Corp Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2006.11.13 10:28:00 - [8] Edited by: Plutoinum on 13/11/2006 10:28:25 Originally by: Sakura Nihil 2) Kill your brother But ask him, if he has an up-to-date clone before, otherwise your parents notice the difference.
Gerell Mai Caldari	Posted - 2006.11.13 10:39:00 - [9] Ok. I've seen some statements on how you feel CCP staff will respond. It would be interesting to hear hoew you think CCP Staff -should- respond. Probably most people will still say the same thing, which is understandable, but I ask you to consider what happened and think about it deeply. If I was playing a single player game that has save points and something like that happened I'd restore the game to the last save point, even if I was totally playing the game fairly and not using the save ability as a means to make up for my own tactical/playing ability related mistakes. If I was playing monopoly and my brother accidentally stepped on another players money pile, pushing some of the money into the bank pile, I'm sure we would pause the game and sort out the players money. EVE is an online computer game, and what happened is not as easily fixed I imagine, since it requires some people I dont know to look into some logs to verify what happened, but I think as long as CCP does not think I'm lying (and the logs would go to show there is really no other solid explination), I don't see why they wouldnt refund the ship loss, eventhough it clearly is not their fault. It is not due to any in game rules/mechanics that my ship was destroyed, and no one in the game will lose anything or benefit in any way (other than myself, but thats justifiable) if the ship is restored. If a GM knows that I lost my ship to a fluke I/O error, and he knows no other players will be impacted, and all he has to do is push a button, why not push it? I'm not even sure if I agree with my own reasoning above. Like I said from the beginning, I fully 100% understand its not CCPs fault my ship was destoryed. I suppose I'm just playing a little bit of devils advocate and trying to encounrge people to see past "what CCP will do" (which I admit if they dont refund my ship it is perfectly fair) and begin to think about "what CCP should do".
Biarch	Posted - 2006.11.13 10:47:00 - [10] Your comparisons with Monopoly and single players games are so far off the mark. That's the point. If you could "save" in Eve then there'd be no risk. Their logs will show that you activated a NOS on a stargate in hi-sec, and got Concorded accordingly. How it was activated they won't show. So please don't waste valuable resourced petitioning something that shouldn't and won't be refunded.

Thelgor Caldari Chosen Path Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.13 11:01:00 - [11] Just pretend a crewman on your ship went suicidal. Imagination is fun. Caldari for the noobs!
Miss Overlord Gallente EUROPEANS	Posted - 2006.11.13 11:04:00 - [12] well the answer is obvious if u get youre stuff back eveyrone will use the same excuse - CCP can we get this locked as pretty well offtopic or moved over to the out of pod forum
Dee Ellis	Posted - 2006.11.13 11:06:00 - [13] How do you 'waste' time? It's a obscure as 'saving' time..
Miss Overlord Gallente EUROPEANS	Posted - 2006.11.13 11:08:00 - [14] waste or save its a split decision ( time to drive this offtopic)
Tao Han Caldari Perkone	Posted - 2006.11.13 11:11:00 - [15] Tbh, I dont buy any of this. Its really far fetched and as stated earlier, its your own fault, not CCP's so why should they reimburse you? Infact, petitioning that is just a waste of time, time that could have been used for real petitions. Sorry, dont mean to sound harsh.
Miss Overlord Gallente EUROPEANS	Posted - 2006.11.13 11:13:00 - [16] just sound harsh CCP will give him the same response
Caleb Paine ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.11.13 11:24:00 - [17] "no officer, it was my brother" -------------------------------- ISS Navy Task Force; Protecting your interest.
Wild Rho Amarr Black Omega Security	Posted - 2006.11.13 11:34:00 - [18] Think this post shows the current problem with the reimbursment petition system. These days people will file a reimbursement in the hope they will get their stuff back for free regardless. If it works they have their ship back for basically nothing, if they don't they have lost nothing but have used up a gms time and resources that would have been better allocated to somthing more productive while slowing down the petition system in general. I don't mean to sound like I'm having a go at the OP here because I'm not, just making a general statement using this situation as an example. I have the body of a supermodel. I just can't remember where I left it.
Queranna	Posted - 2006.11.13 11:37:00 - [19] i think you may as well try to petition, after all what good reason is there to nos a stargate? none, so it was clearly an accident. but it is CCP's decision and it may come down to what particular GM answers your petition. Just live with whatever decision they give you. I don't agree that the game is like monopoly or others with save points though and that creates thrill. But in these situations i don't see any good reason why, when it is clearly an accident, CCP should not give you your ship back. If they just put a blanket statement and say we don't refund ships when it was not our fault then so be it.
Ozzie Asrail FATAL REVELATIONS Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.13 11:45:00 - [20] Originally by: Wild Rho Think this post shows the current problem with the reimbursment petition system. These days people will file a reimbursement in the hope they will get their stuff back for free regardless. If it works they have their ship back for basically nothing, if they don't they have lost nothing but have used up a gms time and resources that would have been better allocated to somthing more productive while slowing down the petition system in general. I don't mean to sound like I'm having a go at the OP here because I'm not, just making a general statement using this situation as an example. yea I gotta agree, lots of people simply petition 99% of losses and hope they get a ship back. It was obviously the OP's fault and nothing to do with ccp, suck it up and move on. Just a waste of time for the GM's when they could be dealing with much more important issues. 500mil fine for every failed reimburment petition i my opinion. That'll sort em -----

Pehova Mindtriq Celestial Apocalypse Insurgency	Posted - 2006.11.13 11:54:00 - [21] Originally by: Ozzie Asrail 500mil fine for every failed reimburment petition i my opinion. That'll sort em Sounds bad imo. I've recieved several mails from ccp saying "Our logs doesn't show this and that so you can't have your ship back" even though my ship was lost due to bugs or lagg. A 500 mill fine would just add salt to the wound in that case. Celes/Toxin vs BOB
Roshan longshot Gallente Ordos Humanitas	Posted - 2006.11.13 12:05:00 - [22] LOL OP your luck has just ran out. As for the rest of ya disbeleavers, Yeah OP go ahead and make that petition, stranger things have happened. The Flying Dutchman...I...II...III...IV. Hint I only paid for one of those. Free-form Professions, ensure no limetations on professions. Be a trader, fighter, industialist, researcher, hunter *pirate* or mixture of them all. [i]As read from the original box.

Eldo Davip Forum Moderator Interstellar Services Department	Posted - 2006.11.13 12:07:00 - [23] Well CCP can't tell if it was your brother who made you lose your ship or if you activated the Nosferatu on purpose. Even if it was your brother the Cerberus will not be returned since it wasn't CCP fault. Tough luck, be more careful next time. ___ Email Us (Report a bad post) \| Forum Rules - Read 'em! \| Website EvE ONLINE - T+TALHELLDEATH SUPPORTER

Valan	Posted - 2006.11.13 12:19:00 - [24] The main reason is because we have to take you at your word. You may be lying if you aren't then are 30 people that will. The next time there are posts with crap customer service plastered all over them this thread ought to be raised. Not that you have wasted CCPs time just to illustrate why the Q is now a 30 year waiting list. I love old characters that post 'I've beeen playing the game three years' when I know their account has been sold on.
Rod Blaine Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.11.13 12:19:00 - [25] Sorry, but if you petition that I'd personally ban the crap out of your account if i was the GM that got the petition. Old blog
Ortu Konsinni KIA Corp	Posted - 2006.11.13 17:41:00 - [26] Yet another case that speaks in favor of disallowing players from locking objects that under any circumstances should never, ever have to be locked, stargates and NPC stations in particular, or even sentry guns. It would be easy to implement and save everyone a lot of trouble. The only argument in favor of allowing people to lock a gate is the comical nature of a pilot who clicks too fast and starts warp scrambling a gate instead of a real target. Which we can easily do without. --- High quality pics of ALL EVE ships!
Araxmas Caldari Imperial Space Corporation	Posted - 2006.11.13 18:47:00 - [27] Originally by: Tao Han Tbh, I dont buy any of this. Its really far fetched and as stated earlier, its your own fault, not CCP's so why should they reimburse you? Infact, petitioning that is just a waste of time, time that could have been used for real petitions. Sorry, dont mean to sound harsh. I have to agree, sounds a bit too much like a coincidence. Not saying you lieing i mean i have had some crazy things happen but that just sounds a bit wacky. --------
Danton Marcellus Nebula Rasa Holdings	Posted - 2006.11.13 18:53:00 - [28] Get your brother a barge and check in with him in a few weeks to see if he made it up to you. Something's rotten with the state of the servers.
000Hunter000 Gallente Leviathan Corperation LTD	Posted - 2006.11.13 19:13:00 - [29] hehehe, this was my LOL thread for today. 'Dear CCP, My corpmate was gangleader of my gang and warped me into a fleet of enemy ships, who promptly destroyed my cerberus with T2 fitting, as this was not of my own doing, can i please have the ship and fitting back? thnx' this isn't even a lie, my corpmate actually did warp us into an enemy fleet and we even held on nicely for a min or 2 untill he ran away and i was destroyed
Hydraxian Gallente Momentum.	Posted - 2006.11.13 20:41:00 - [30] Dear CCP Today i flew my officer fitted Smartbomb fitted megathron into a ASCN blob and got blown up, can i have it back? Regards Hydraxian

podadot	Posted - 2006.11.13 21:06:00 - [31] aw come on! the guy nos'ed a gate. do you really think this could have been anything other than a freak accident? i say give him a break. really, explain what the scam is? why should he be so severely penalized. it isn't as if he was killed by an enemy ship or even a rat. there is no benefit to him to nos a gat and no logical reason to intentionally do so. lighten up people!
Driven Caldari Mass Produced Venturi Starea	Posted - 2006.11.13 21:11:00 - [32] This is indeed a good one :) I bet if you petition CCP for a new brother you might get one. A cerb - what a shame.
Xenofur Di-Tron Heavy Industries Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.14 01:50:00 - [33] i like to web gates. makes nice lights. ^_^
JForce The Arrow Project The ARR0W Project	Posted - 2006.11.14 02:23:00 - [34] Originally by: podadot aw come on! the guy nos'ed a gate. do you really think this could have been anything other than a freak accident? i say give him a break. really, explain what the scam is? why should he be so severely penalized. it isn't as if he was killed by an enemy ship or even a rat. there is no benefit to him to nos a gat and no logical reason to intentionally do so. lighten up people! Life's hard. **** happens. There are consequences when you make a mistake, just like in real life. As it should be.
Weirda Minmatar Queens of the Stone Age Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2006.11.14 02:36:00 - [35] Originally by: Eldo Davip Well CCP can't tell if it was your brother who made you lose your ship or if you activated the Nosferatu on purpose. Even if they knew it was your brother the Cerberus will not be returned since it wasn't CCP fault. Tough luck, be more careful next time. this Weirda thought too... real question though: Why on EARTH can you do things that only result in concord at all? IE shooting gate/sentry/station in high sec? really no point to it except insurance fraud tbh... there was bug before (about a year) that reloading missile caused it to 'target' (but without showing crosshair)... so you click on station, blam, insta-lock... dead. it was acknowledge bug in petition and fixed. question THEN was "why can Weirda even TARGET npc station... gun... etc..." could save time. __ Weirda Join QotSA
GPerson Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2006.11.14 03:04:00 - [36] Edited by: GPerson on 14/11/2006 03:05:31 Quote: You are walking down a street. For some reason you are carrying a gun. You trip, hand slips, and gun goes off. You kill a cop. "Sorry officer, I didn't mean to kill your partner, it was an accident, I swear! Can I go home now?" Let's play spot the difference between that and the original post! . I like my sig... ~~~Sig Stuffs Here~~~ I highly recommend drunken posting. Oh yeah, you just lost The Game
Dark Kavar	Posted - 2006.11.16 07:34:00 - [37] I attacked a can in low sec then warped near some sentry guns, the lag kept me from warping away in time, can i have my caracal with T2 fittings back?
Latex Mistress Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2006.11.16 08:11:00 - [38] I feel for the OP, but it's a tough lesson to learn and what you can afford once you can again. Slightly off-topic, but while there are some that argue that pilots ought not be able to target Stargates under any circumstances, I'm all for swift pwnage by CONCORD for not being able to use your overview effectively. If you want to take the risk of flying a combat ship in High-Sec, accept the repercussions if something tragic happens. (lol, "risk of flying combat ships in High-Sec") LM Latex Mistresss: bringing truth to the truculent one post at a time
Miss Overlord Gallente EUROPEANS	Posted - 2006.11.16 08:13:00 - [39] sad story but a lesson learned pehraps it should be in the tutorial
Gerell Mai Caldari	Posted - 2006.11.17 09:19:00 - [40] Update: The ship was restored, including all fittings that were destroyed. Everything else was left behind in a can after the explosion but, luckily, no one grabbed it before I came back in a ship suitable to get it all. So the overall outcome, I lost nothing. To be honest I am surprised that CCP was kind enough to do that. But I can understand why they did it. No one killed my ship. My ship was not lost to combat with npcs or anything like that. And even if I am a 100% flaming liar, why would I target and NOS a stargate? You see, CCP does not have to trust my word on this one. Because even if I'm lying there is no better possible explination than what I already told them. Now, if there are 300 other people who lost ships due to similar circumstances and petitioned for them back and got nothing, I see that my ship replacement could be a bit of a customer service problem, in that CCP did not treat everyone equally. I hope that is not the case, and those who are reading this will use sound judgement (comparing my case with the case they know about where the person did NOT get refunded) before accusing CCP of favoritism.

Valerie Ganor Minmatar Defile.	Posted - 2006.11.17 09:55:00 - [41] Originally by: Gerell Mai Update: The ship was restored, including all fittings that were destroyed. Everything else was left behind in a can after the explosion but, luckily, no one grabbed it before I came back in a ship suitable to get it all. So the overall outcome, I lost nothing. To be honest I am surprised that CCP was kind enough to do that. But I can understand why they did it. No one killed my ship. My ship was not lost to combat with npcs or anything like that. And even if I am a 100% flaming liar, why would I target and NOS a stargate? You see, CCP does not have to trust my word on this one. Because even if I'm lying there is no better possible explination than what I already told them. Now, if there are 300 other people who lost ships due to similar circumstances and petitioned for them back and got nothing, I see that my ship replacement could be a bit of a customer service problem, in that CCP did not treat everyone equally. I hope that is not the case, and those who are reading this will use sound judgement (comparing my case with the case they know about where the person did NOT get refunded) before accusing CCP of favoritism. And this is why the reimbursement petitions need to go.... I can't beleive they gave you back the ship including fittings just because you made up the worst excuse ever for loosing a ship (be it true or false is not the question here). Now i know why people are willing to fly high end ships in pvp. They can just make up stupid reasons to get back their ships. CCP i would reconsider your reimbursement petition if i were you. Your ruining your own game by giving in to whiners. Regards, Valerie Ganor +=+=+=+=+=+=+ Win the crowd...
00Dead FATAL REVELATIONS Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.17 10:06:00 - [42] I have never made a petition for a ship loss and I am truly dissapointed in the outcome of this. Getting a ship back for pilot error is not something that should become common place but I am seeeing it more and more now. But if this got rembursed I cant think of a single ship loss I have had that shouldnt be re-imbursed.
News Minmatar Slacker Industries Exuro Mortis	Posted - 2006.11.17 10:21:00 - [43] Originally by: Gerell Mai I got my stuff back If this is true, than CCP needs to fire the GM that handled your petition.
Rod Blaine Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.11.17 11:17:00 - [44] Edited by: Rod Blaine on 17/11/2006 11:18:26 in ***** credible I've got an idea, I'm gonna start a GM school. GM's clearly know ** all about the game, so let them come to me on IRC and they can consult me on petitions, for free even. Then when they've learned they can go and play at gm again without me. Old blog
Sciencey Person	Posted - 2006.11.17 11:36:00 - [45] Congratz on getting your stuff back. Quite obvious this is a plain accident, ignore the general hardcore Eve mentality that the game is so rough that even customer support wont help you. Ive lost ships to bugs, and always got them back, like once a few years back, entered warp as a Blackbird, left in a pod. Turns out the Caldari Navy blew me up mid warp, got sorted. Not sure why you people are whining, the OP isnt, so you cant counter whine, so I presume you are whining about customer support supporting their customers in a nice and helpful manner. All of you can go on about how bad this is and how it hurts the queue, yet one of you said CCP should fire a GM. Im sure that would REALLY help things. I hate Eve forumers sometimes, I really do.
News Minmatar Slacker Industries Exuro Mortis	Posted - 2006.11.17 13:45:00 - [46] Originally by: Sciencey Person stuff Please tell me where it says in the Reimbursement Policy that ships can be reimbursed if you lose them due to something totally unrelated to the game? If a GM doesn't play by the rules set for him, he needs to be let go. Quickly.
Volar Kang	Posted - 2006.11.17 14:20:00 - [47] Gerell, Let me ask you a question. If I bought a TV from a store and 6 months later I was vacuuming the floor and I knocked in off the stand and it broke, would it be fair of me to ask the store to replace it? This is exactly what you are asking.
Nardon Gallente	Posted - 2006.11.17 14:32:00 - [48] Originally by: News Please tell me where it says in the Reimbursement Policy that ships can be reimbursed if you lose them due to something totally unrelated to the game? If a GM doesn't play by the rules set for him, he needs to be let go. Quickly. Since you have a hard time reading these rules here you go: Originally by: Rules Note that this policy is not all inclusive. Other situations outside this policy may be deemed eligible for reimbursement if circumstances warrant such a decision. I think I don't need to highlight the relevant part as I did include only the very part that matters. You hardliners really ***** me up. Rules are made for a generally fair environment. But usually you give yourself some leeway for deciding some matters that aren't covered by said rules. And that is exactly what happened here. Obviously CCP did believe it or did not found enough reasons to doubt it. And afterwards deemed it reasonable to reimburse the ship. NOSing a stargate - which probably has been documented in the logs - seem good enough for me.
Taedrin Gallente Mercatoris Technologies	Posted - 2006.11.17 14:37:00 - [49] Unwritten rule of EVE #1: "Never undock a ship that you can't afford to lose"
Nardon Gallente	Posted - 2006.11.17 14:43:00 - [50] Originally by: Volar Kang Gerell, Let me ask you a question. If I bought a TV from a store and 6 months later I was vacuuming the floor and I knocked in off the stand and it broke, would it be fair of me to ask the store to replace it? This is exactly what you are asking. No it's not. If the OP would ask for a refund of the already paid monthly fee you might have a point. But he did not. Second the ship got destroyed by concord. Do you let somebody else clean your house? Would you not ask for a compensation if that person would damage your TV set? And how is it when you caused the person to trip and break the TV set then? Is it really all your fault? Or would you settle for 50:50 or 70:30? I've seen cases in court that did arise over less. It's funny that most people just argue black or white.

00Dead FATAL REVELATIONS Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.11.17 14:57:00 - [51] Next time I accidently shoot/scram/web/ecm a gate instead of a wartarget - i'll have to try this ;) And there was me thinking its my fault - but appearntly CCP re-emburse now when it is pilot error.
Charles Yeager V I R I I Center for Disease Creation	Posted - 2006.11.17 15:02:00 - [52] During my 'Botox' days I lost 6 Zealots to CTDs, and all were in situations where I was winning the fight when the CTD happened. I petitioned them all, and never got any back. If this guy gets his ship back I am quitting the game.
Smagd Encina Technologies Namtz'aar k'in	Posted - 2006.11.17 15:09:00 - [53] Originally by: Golerre Evraun <edit> if this happens again you need to pull the ethernet cable out from the back of your pc and whip your brother with it, this serves two purposes, first it will alleviate a bit of stress and second it will force a disconnect from eve, after eve disconnects you can safely reinsert all 3 Best post in this thread so far, also a very helpful tip for the future. -- Thukkers do
News Minmatar Slacker Industries Exuro Mortis	Posted - 2006.11.17 15:15:00 - [54] Originally by: Nardon Originally by: News Please tell me where it says in the Reimbursement Policy that ships can be reimbursed if you lose them due to something totally unrelated to the game? If a GM doesn't play by the rules set for him, he needs to be let go. Quickly. Since you have a hard time reading these rules here you go: Originally by: Rules Note that this policy is not all inclusive. Other situations outside this policy may be deemed eligible for reimbursement if circumstances warrant such a decision. I think I don't need to highlight the relevant part as I did include only the very part that matters. Originally by: The reimbursement policy The general rule is that we must be able to verify that your loss should not have occured during normal gameplay. There, I can do selective quoting too.
Andy Roo Caldari Lunar Dawn	Posted - 2006.11.17 15:22:00 - [55] Originally by: Charles Yeager During my 'Botox' days I lost 6 Zealots to CTDs, and all were in situations where I was winning the fight when the CTD happened. I petitioned them all, and never got any back. If this guy gets his ship back I am quitting the game. Bye then, read up, he got it back. Glad he got it back, good to see the GMs are decent. If logs show someone nossing a stargate, it obviously wouldnt happen during normal gameplay, obviously a mere bad happening, and got their ship back. Logs show it, whereas a CTD is no different than a ctrl-q, so theres no evidence to support it isnt intended. All seems fine to me. ---- Not from Omicron Persei 8.
Charles Yeager V I R I I Center for Disease Creation	Posted - 2006.11.17 15:35:00 - [56] Edited by: Charles Yeager on 17/11/2006 15:37:38 Edited by: Charles Yeager on 17/11/2006 15:37:02 Originally by: Andy Roo If logs show someone nossing a stargate, it obviously wouldnt happen during normal gameplay, obviously a mere bad happening, and got their ship back. Logs show it, whereas a CTD is no different than a ctrl-q, so theres no evidence to support it isnt intended. All seems fine to me. Its always nice and convenient when the 'logs' show something in one instance and show nothing in another. I would like to see these alleged logs. Once I CTD'd in a belt while flying a Muninn, when I logged back in the NPCs were scrambling and webbing me, and I could not target them. The target counter would count down to zero and then nothing would happen, no lock. So I could not break free and I could not shoot them, and I slowly died. The 'logs' in that case did not show anything I was told. I asked specifically what kinds of data were logged, and got no response. As for the 6 Zealots, just like he had no reason to nos the gate, I had no reason to hit CTRL-Q just as my enemy is about to die. So please don't quote the logs you didn't see to me, it seems that the logs show something when they want to help out and show nothing when they want to say 'tough luck'. Its about time for an ISO 9000 certification so that the GMs can offer a uniform level of support. Oh and yeah, suscription ends 17th of Dec.
News Minmatar Slacker Industries Exuro Mortis	Posted - 2006.11.17 15:58:00 - [57] Originally by: Andy Roo If logs show someone nossing a stargate, it obviously wouldnt happen during normal gameplay, obviously a mere bad happening So you're in a high sec system, during an empire war. A hostile gang jumps in and finds you, but you manage to escape to a gate. You nos the gate, get blown up by Concord before your enemies arrive. And you get your ship back, because the logs show you nossed a gate, and that can only be a mistake. Right? The point is, the GM has no way of knowing why the gate was nossed. All he can, and should say, is 'sorry, being blown up by Concord for nossing a gate is not a known bug in the game, hope you can recover from your loss'.
Volar Kang	Posted - 2006.11.17 16:10:00 - [58] Originally by: Nardon Second the ship got destroyed by concord. Do you let somebody else clean your house? Would you not ask for a compensation if that person would damage your TV set? And how is it when you caused the person to trip and break the TV set then? Is it really all your fault? Or would you settle for 50:50 or 70:30? I've seen cases in court that did arise over less. It's funny that most people just argue black or white. Nardon your silly, where in your example does it show that the store should pay? Your example says maybe split 50/50 with the guy who tripped over the cord, which is the guys brother NOT the store. Concord did not trip over the cord, why is it their fault? If we follow your example every person who loses a ship can safely argue that they tripped over the cord and that caused the action that got them killed. It is black and white, he did something illegal to the gate and Concord responded. It does not matter what caused him to do something stupid, the issue is he did something stupid and paid for it.


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