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Sakura Nihil
Tabula Rasa Systems
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2006.11.20 08:49:00 -
[31]
I am quite surprised that no Amarrian zealots have made comments on your sermon yet, Revan  .
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Revan Neferis
Amarr
Bloodveil
The Sani Sabik
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Posted - 2006.11.20 10:27:00 -
[32]
 Originally by: Sakura Nihil
I am quite surprised that no Amarrian zealots have made comments on your sermon yet, Revan .
The Sermon of Bloodveil is far too advanced for the small minds of fanatic zealots. If they do have something to say, I would expect some words of low grade to be used as offensive to my person, but nothing really worth as a positive criticism or support to the subject attended.
Revan Neferis Verisum
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Inistis
INTAKI UNION
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Posted - 2006.11.20 12:51:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Revan Neferis
Originally by: Sakura Nihil
I am quite surprised that no Amarrian zealots have made comments on your sermon yet, Revan .
The Sermon of Bloodveil is far too advanced for the small minds of fanatic zealots. If they do have something to say, I would expect some words of low grade to be used as offensive to my person, but nothing really worth as a positive criticism or support to the subject attended.
**** baby, its true. You really did put the c-r-a-z-y in crazy.
Cute does go a long way though. Enjoy the ride while it lasts.
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Solusar
Amarr
Auctoritan Syndicate
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2006.11.20 12:57:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Sakura Nihil
I am quite surprised that no Amarrian zealots have made comments on your sermon yet, Revan .
Most of us have learnt to tune out the insane ramblings of Revan.
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Ethidium Bromide
ZEALOT WARRIORS AGAINST TERRORISTS
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2006.11.20 13:08:00 -
[35]
Ethidium Bromide sits in his study in a black fur easychair, a copy of the scriptures is positioned on his lap and an unshackled brutor male is standing next to the easychair presenting a goblet of wine
Revan you never fail to surprise me!
i have to say these are the most logic and straight forward thoughts you have ever voiced...
i have to say the following though:
i am not forced to do his will, i do not have visions that tell me what to do.
i feel Him in me, not as a voice or 'dictator taht orders me around'.
if i think about what to do there will always be one line of thought that shines a little brighter than the others.
it is this thought i take as the one He would like me to follow.
for a pietous and zealotous(sp?) being every moment of life is a test.
a test of faith and a test of your willingness to NOT choose the easy way.
i am free to decide as i want to and it is not fear that makes me follow His path. it is the joy that i see in service.
the joy of the picture i carry in my mind...
a universe in peace, a universe where everyone knows he is loved and blessed by Him.
Revan, you and all the other heretics, do as you wish i could not care less.
i will follow the way that is outlined for me and i will take as many as possible with me to the light.
for all the unpure and subhuman races: i have seen them enlightened and i will work on my slavestock at least to show them the true meaning of faith.
for once a man has nothing to hold on to but his thoughts he will see that one of them shines a little brighter than the rest....
enlightenment comes at a price and only to the willing and openminded but it is worth it!
Originally by: George Petsch
Nochricht: Dei schwarer StroinlSser trifftn Karli[Baatzis] und ruiniert erm so richtig de Dosn, 1343.7 schhodn, oida.
My sig is blue not pink although i can't argue with the slave part - Xorus
wth whats this blue stuff all of a sudden? Did I miss a mail? -eris
Bwahahahaha!11 Immy was here
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Sakura Nihil
Tabula Rasa Systems
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2006.11.20 13:08:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Solusar
Originally by: Sakura Nihil
I am quite surprised that no Amarrian zealots have made comments on your sermon yet, Revan .
Most of us have learnt to tune out the insane ramblings of Revan.
Originally by: Revan Neferis
Originally by: Sakura Nihil
I am quite surprised that no Amarrian zealots have made comments on your sermon yet, Revan .
The Sermon of Bloodveil is far too advanced for the small minds of fanatic zealots. If they do have something to say, I would expect some words of low grade to be used as offensive to my person, but nothing really worth as a positive criticism or support to the subject attended.
It appears as though you were correct Lady Revan.
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Rodj Blake
Amarr
PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2006.11.20 13:14:00 -
[37]
Tell me Revan, do you give this sermon to your victims just before you drain them of blood?
Dulce et decorum est, pro imperator mori
It's great being Amarr, ain't it? |
Orionn Treet
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Posted - 2006.11.20 13:37:00 -
[38]
Edited by: Orionn Treet on 20/11/2006 13:38:11
Methinks Revan has yet to address BranBresil's criticism...
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BranBresil
Caldari
Omerta Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.11.20 13:38:00 -
[39]
Edited by: BranBresil on 20/11/2006 13:42:39
So Revan, by your reply, (which by the way was utterly devoid of any justification of your beliefs) am I to assume you will not address the valid (at least in my opinion, please feel free to point out where I might be wrong however) issues I raised?
Also, I'm curious, do you now consider me to be a "small minded fanatic zealot"? If so you'd probably be the first. Though I'll admit it does have a nice ring to it.
So in essence all I'm asking is for you to specifically address the questions I raised. Even if your reply simply consists of a "you bore me BranBresil" At least at that point I will know that you will not deign to reply further in any useful manner.
And I can consider my input on the subject at an end.
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Octavinus Augustus
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Posted - 2006.11.20 14:33:00 -
[40]
Where to start?
It seems clear to me that Revan at least has realized that her actions are clearly in outright defiance of the edicts of GOD. Fearing the unavoidable consequenses of her actions, she has convinced herself that GOD is dead and that she herself is immortal. Is that hybris or just plain stupidity?
It seems to me that she (rightly) fears the wrath of GOD so much, that she has to trick herself into a false sense of security - not that it will help her in the end.
True freedom lies in devotion to the cause of GOD. When I enter combat I know that I cannot ever loose. Should my ship explode in flames, should my pod succomb to the rigors of space and should my clone fail to function, I will stand to be judged in the knowledge that I fought for the noblest of causes - what more can any man wish for?
Whether I live or die, I am free of fear and doubt. Revan and the Sani Sabik will forever be slaves of both their fear and their self delusions.
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Nooey
Omerta Syndicate
Exuro Mortis
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Posted - 2006.11.20 14:43:00 -
[41]
Nooey chuckles
You've raised some good points Bran, at the very least they deserved a reply. I think your problem is that you raised them a little too well, sarcasm and rhetoric aside. Maybe offer an easier target next time and your opponents wont get "bored" or suddenly quiet all of a sudden.
I'll see you back at HQ tomorrow, I owe you a drink or three for the laughs you brought me here.
Nooey grins and fades out
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Garreck
Amarr Border Defense Consortium
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2006.11.20 14:58:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Revan Neferis
The Sermon of Bloodveil is far too advanced for the small minds of fanatic zealots. If they do have something to say, I would expect some words of low grade to be used as offensive to my person, but nothing really worth as a positive criticism or support to the subject attended.
How...objective. Let's try something here:
"The rebutal of the Loyalists is far too advanced for the small minds of heretics and non-believers. If we did rebut, I would expect some words of low grade to be used as offensive to our Holy Cause, but nothing really worth as a positive criticism or support to the subject attended"
See how that works, Sakura? Arguing with Revan is like arguing with a wall. As far as I'm concerned, she can spout her obvious lies. And when she raises up arms against the Empire again, I'm sure the CVA will be there to hammer her back down. Again.
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Elsebeth Rhiannon
Minmatar
Gradient
Namtz'aar k'in
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Posted - 2006.11.20 15:20:00 -
[43]
And here I was thinking why this preaching sounds so familiar. Thanks for pointing it out...
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BranBresil
Caldari
Omerta Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.11.20 16:14:00 -
[44]
Point well taken Nooey, I suppose not everyone considers those rhetorical flourishes to simply be part of the art of reasoned debate. I can indeed see how they could be unwelcome were one to view them as an insinuation of a personal attack.
I will do my best to avoid them in the future.
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BranBresil
Caldari
Omerta Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.11.20 16:33:00 -
[45]
Edited by: BranBresil on 20/11/2006 16:36:13
And a quick update after a discussion with the leaders behind the sermon, perhaps I should clarify that, they don't state that God never existed (I know, I too thought that was pretty clear when they said he was a fake crutch who couldn't exist because he was an evil dictator, but let's give them the benefit of a doubt here).
Instead God used to exist but something killed him, what or who they won't say. Whoever/whatever it is, I'd like to meet them and find out how he/she/it did it, God killing powers seem like they could be extremely valuable in a standard dogfight.
Though they failed to specifically answer any of my questions other than to state that what they say isn't the only truth but that there is no one truth (yeah yeah, I know, it doesn't make sense to me either).
Also, they assured me that they were not seeking converts. While I think that begs the question of why the sermon in the first place, that is apparently a fact so I'll take it at face value.
Finally however, I secured assurances that more sermons WOULD be forthcoming, so hopefully all will be revealed eventually. (Well one can hope... Right?)
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Davlos
Caldari
Omerta Syndicate
Exuro Mortis
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Posted - 2006.11.20 21:33:00 -
[46]
* Davlos breaks into a wide smile
Very well done, Bran. I think I owe you a drink or five back at the bar tonight.
---------------
Davlos Cain
040 |
Revan Neferis
Amarr
Bloodveil
The Sani Sabik
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Posted - 2006.11.20 23:24:00 -
[47]
Originally by: BranBresil
Finally however, I secured assurances that more sermons WOULD be forthcoming, so hopefully all will be revealed eventually. (Well one can hope... Right?)
Bloodveil will release more Sermons and portions of their holy book at propper time. It pleases me to see that comments and questions has been raised by the community, positive or negative matters little.
You are thinking, it is a great step towards freedom.
Revan Neferis Verisum
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Darth Revanant
Amarr
1st Praetorian Guard
Vigilia Valeria
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Posted - 2006.11.21 00:31:00 -
[48]
I didn't bother to read your drivel, but it appears your supporters and the only ones who agree with you are anarchists and fractionalists. Perfect company for your insane ramblings.
And you're not immortal. I've known many pilots who have died. In fact, the most recent was caused by you and your psychosis.
_______________
http://www.vigilia-valeria.org/images/sigs/1PG_darth_new.png
signature removed (max size 24000 bytes) - please email us (with the
signature URL) if you want to know why - Pirlouit([email protected])
Recruitment Office
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Tecam Hund
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2006.11.21 01:37:00 -
[49]
Edited by: Tecam Hund on 21/11/2006 01:40:45
Most brilliant sermon. Some attempted to question it, but none directly challenged the logic of it.
I am proud to have Bloodveil and The Sani Sabik among our allies.
Join Star Fraction. Be yourself. |
Aria Jenneth
Caldari
The Society of the Black Bell
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Posted - 2006.11.21 01:44:00 -
[50]
I really must be missing something here.
Speaking as an absolute heathen, since I'm neither Amarr nor well-educated in their religious principles beyond the most basic ... if God is dead, what exactly is the point of all the blood draining the Raiders make a habit of? I could have sworn it was religious in origin.
Is there some scientific purpose? Symbolic? Political? If God is dead and all existing beings are gods ... what is the point of killing "gods" and draining their blood? Some sort of occult experimentation?
It seems as though this philosophy would lend itself to the elevation of individual lives, not their exemplarily executed extinguishing by exsanguination.
In short, why does a group that apparently makes a creed out of atheism need the horrific trappings of a blood cult?
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Archbishop
Amarr
PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2006.11.21 02:48:00 -
[51]
Edited by: Archbishop on 21/11/2006 03:02:25
Quote:
The Sermon of Bloodveil is far too advanced for the small minds of fanatic zealots. If they do have something to say, I would expect some words of low grade to be used as offensive to my person, but nothing really worth as a positive criticism or support to the subject attended.
Another "Sermon" I seem to have started a trend. Imitation is the greatest form of flattery especially when carried out by the unimaginative. But I myself am waiting for the first sleeper cell activation before sharpening my pen.
Archbishop
PIE WEBSITE & FORUMS
PIE INFORMATION CENTER |
Auele
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Posted - 2006.11.21 03:17:00 -
[52]
Edited by: Auele on 21/11/2006 03:24:12
Hmmm... Interesting, for an Amarrian to say something like this. I have to say that it is a breathe of fresh air, which is very different from the stale air most Amarrians call "faith." It is an impressive statement; however, it is not without its critics.
" In the end, people think of the beginning "
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BranBresil
Caldari
Omerta Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.11.21 04:35:00 -
[53]
"Most brilliant sermon. Some attempted to question it, but none directly challenged the logic of it"
Um.... Excuse me, but I'm pretty sure that that's exactly what I did. Please explain how I failed to challenge the logic of it, or did you simply read the sermon, and none of the commentaries?
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Jasmine Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2006.11.21 06:17:00 -
[54]
Originally by: BranBresil
Um.... Excuse me, but I'm pretty sure that that's exactly what I did. Please explain how I failed to challenge the logic of it, or did you simply read the sermon, and none of the commentaries?
Your "commentary" was too full of ripe sarcasm and congratulatory self-indulence for me to take seriously ... perhaps this is the case for others too?
Star Fraction is recruiting
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Aodha Khan
Minmatar
The Paratwa Ka
Namtz'aar k'in
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Posted - 2006.11.21 08:39:00 -
[55]
Edited by: Aodha Khan on 21/11/2006 08:43:14
Originally by: Archbishop
Another "Sermon" I seem to have started a trend. Imitation is the greatest form of flattery especially when carried out by the unimaginative.
You were the first person in history to perform a sermon? Your the only person in the universe performing sermons? I must say, I'm amazed at how delusional your mind really is.
This latest incarnation of PIE, someone forgot to put in the filling.
So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong and to strike at what is weak.
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Tecam Hund
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2006.11.21 11:54:00 -
[56]
Originally by: BranBresil
"Most brilliant sermon. Some attempted to question it, but none directly challenged the logic of it"
Um.... Excuse me, but I'm pretty sure that that's exactly what I did. Please explain how I failed to challenge the logic of it, or did you simply read the sermon, and none of the commentaries?
You based your main argument on questioning the dictator status of God as if it changes the core of the matter. To acknowledge existance of God is to acknowledge existance of a higher form of intelligence above you. Does not matter if you see God as a dictator or a creator who is inside every one of us. Either way with presense of God we become inferior.
All that separates us from being a flock of sheep and free men is our mind set. Start thinking freely and take full responsibility for your actions and suddenly concept of God becomes pointless.
Your other comments were merely based on logic loops of the wording and possibly your personal opinion of Revan. Jasmine summed up my opinion of your commentaries pretty well.
Join Star Fraction. Be yourself. |
BranBresil
Caldari
Omerta Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.11.21 15:40:00 -
[57]
Quote:
Your "commentary" was too full of ripe sarcasm and congratulatory self-indulence for me to take seriously ... perhaps this is the case for others too?
Well Jasmine, I think you’ll be hard pressed to find any sarcasm or indeed even “congratulatory self-indulence (sic)” within the entry I was referring to, which was my very first, the one where I dismantle Revan’s sermon.
My debate with YOU happens to be an entirely different matter, mainly because your position is ludicrous and you have yet to make an even semi-coherent defense of your belief system. Now previously, I had conceded that perhaps my discussion with you, (not the one with Revan) had been too full of rhetorical flourish. I acknowledged that when one is not as capable in the composing of such (referring to you here since you apparently have a hard time differentiating between when I address you as opposed to Revan), it can be frustrating to constantly find not only ones facts refuted, but to have it done in a cutting and mocking manner.
Also, since I had thought the matter was at an end I hadn’t brought this up, but since your evasive “you bore me,” you still haven’t addressed the last questions I posed. I find it telling, as I’m sure do others, that you seem to only be capable of attacking the style of my dialogue, while leaving the substance unaddressed? Am I to assume from this that you simply can’t respond to the substance? In which case, might I offer some advice? Petty and vindictive sniping at the style does nothing to make you more credible when you constantly evade the questions, it might be a good idea to quit while you are ahead and save yourself further embarrassment.
But, since you seem to be intent on pursuing the issue via snide asides, still lacking in any actual substance, perhaps you’ll check to make sure you even know what your target is next time. If you had taken the time to consider what I had said, and realize which commentary I was actually responding to, perhaps you would have realized that your remark was completely irrelevant, and I would not have been forced to answer your baseless accusation, in which case we could have left the issue where I thought it was, buried.
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Jasmine Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2006.11.21 16:09:00 -
[58]
Originally by: BranBresil
Well Jasmine, I think youÆll be hard pressed to find any sarcasm or indeed even ôcongratulatory self-indulence (sic)ö within the entry I was referring to, which was my very first, the one where I dismantle RevanÆs sermon.
I think I'd be hard put to find a sentence in your writing that wasn't tainted to the degree I describe.
Quote:
My debate with YOU happens to be an entirely different matter, mainly because your position is ludicrous and you have yet to make an even semi-coherent defense of your belief system.
Weasel words wormling. Care to back them up with specific criticism? Or perhaps lacking that pleasure you'd prefer to expound upon your own personal system of belief and throw it out to open critique. Its easy to be the cynic preying upon alleged logical flaws in the words of others. Not nearly so easy to express your own understanding of the universe in honest bold and forthright terms. The fact you have completely failed to understand my opinions shows only your own blinkered nature. There is no great mystery to ignorance.
Star Fraction is recruiting
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Kaleigh Doyle
Rho Dynamics
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Posted - 2006.11.21 16:29:00 -
[59]
And so we are immortal, godlike in physical form and yet like infants when it comes to the application. Fabulous, I wasn't looking forward to aging anyway.
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Arges
Freelance Unincorporated
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2006.11.21 17:39:00 -
[60]
I will say right now that I have very little interest in the debate that has been going on here, if there is even a debate to speak of. The only reason I have followed this discussion is in hope of getting a better underestanding of your belief system, Mrs Constantine. On this matter I must say that, so far, I have sided with Mr. Bresil. Although his eloquence may have nade him sound a little pompous, I think the point he adressed and questioned merits some development on your part.
I have found your first hint at Fractionnist philosophy to be most intriguing but it let me on my apetite. You seemed to prone absolute relativism by saying that both statements were right. Now... what was it exactly... ah yes, here we are:
Quote:
Originally by: BranBresil
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Now it should be obvious to you of course that they cannot both be true, so which, pray tell, is the one by which I might consider you to be immortal? I simply wish to fully comprehend this delightful little notion of post-humanism.
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Unless you can comprehend that they are indeed "both true" and that the very notion of objective "truth" is meaningless in this matter you are doomed to ignorance.
So, an objective point of view is meaningless and you are immortal since the sequential continuity of the "Jasmine Constantine" personna is unbroken through the upkeep of a clone.
The whole sequential continuity thing, I can understand. I have considered the matter thoroughly after having being subjected to my first clone activation and have decided since then to leave the matter of soul and indentity to people with more interest and understanding in these philosophical puzzles. I am who I am and that will suffice for me.
I am still wondering what you mean when you say the objective truth is irrelevent. If this is truely the case, the only truth comes from, as I said earlier, absolute relativism and can only be based on personnal experiences and the perceptions of each and every individual.
Is it so?
Complete freedom of thought and belief is a most commendable ideal but it's great flaw is that it validates any point of view as being equaly true to any other. This would mean that to be a true post-humanist, as I understand it, you would have to accept and understand each and every point of view as being true and valid from the perspective of the beholder and could in no way contest it, even though it might not fall within the parameters set by your own personnal beliefs and experiences. In the end, relativism is the death of any debate. Structure may lead to stagnation and entropy but chaos and absolute freedom only leads... well it leads nowhere and everywhere all at once since it has no direction and all directions simultaneously. Is it better? I don't believe so.
This request I make with the least sarcastic of intents. Please, Mrs. Constantine, do enlighten me on the belief system of the Fractionnist philosophy. Although I have no intentions of joining your group, this little "terrorist" is eager to learn more, if only to broaden my intellectual horizons.
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