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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
Nikolai Konakov
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Posted - 2006.11.23 19:18:00 -
[1]
Hello there. I purchased the game last week and am anxious for confirmation as to wether or not Kali starting characters will infact get the 800k starting sp?
If this is the case then i will hold off making my combat character and just buzz around mining for cash on an alt untill the release, otherwise i will dive into combat now.
Could someone please give some form of solid confirmation with regards to this issue ? As i know my self and tens of other new starters that i have spoken to would appreciate some feedback.
Thankyou
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Baleorg
Gallente Guys of Sarcasm
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Posted - 2006.11.23 19:21:00 -
[2]
reading the forums might help :-p
try this link ---
BTW: A GOOD Cache-Cleaner |
Nikolai Konakov
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Posted - 2006.11.23 19:38:00 -
[3]
I have sadly already read that post and fail to see any form of developer/ production team eployee confirmation that 800k sp starting characters arn't just a testing fascility on the test realm.
All i do see in that post are the belated opinions of "vets" trouncing a new players opinions. Of course they feel the way they do, some of them have over 5 mill sp, 800k is insignificant. But for me, who would by kali release be struggling to top 300k, it is a massive boost.
All i am asking for is some confirmation that this is going to hapen, not an expansive discussion thread on the pro's/ con's of the new system should it go live.
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Skid Pants
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Posted - 2006.11.23 19:45:00 -
[4]
While things can and often do change last minute, i'd hedge a bet that yes, new characters will get the 800k boost in revelations.
anyone who's played the game for more than a few months will tell you 800k isnt really all that, and the first month or so in eve can be a bit of a slow slog. Especially if you hit the learning skills first.
800k is a nice leg up to get things kicking and is no way a 'threat' to vets... the only people i do think are mildly affected by this are people similar to yourself who are creating characters/joining the game around now.
And yes, sometimes the smack from vets can be off-putting, insulting, childish...
Were not all like that though
Enjoy your time and welcome to eve
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Nikolai Konakov
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Posted - 2006.11.23 19:51:00 -
[5]
Cheers Skid ^_^
I don't suppose you know if Kali is definately confirmed as being released on the 28th do you ? or if that is just speculation ?
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Jiekon
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Posted - 2006.11.23 19:57:00 -
[6]
yes, new players made in Kali will start with 800k SP's
Kali is so far looking good for a November 28th release. ___________________________ ~Jiekon
Known Issues Bug Reporting
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Nikolai Konakov
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Posted - 2006.11.23 20:02:00 -
[7]
Thankyou Jeikon, you just made my day
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Saetix
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Posted - 2006.11.23 20:13:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Jiekon yes, new players made in Kali will start with 800k SP's
Kali is so far looking good for a November 28th release.
Has CCP even considered the effect this will have on players 1-2 months old?
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Baleorg
Gallente Guys of Sarcasm
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Posted - 2006.11.23 20:13:00 -
[9]
quick! edit your post, hes named jiekon ^^ ---
BTW: A GOOD Cache-Cleaner |
sugark
SOTI Inc. Combined Planetary Union
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Posted - 2006.11.23 20:19:00 -
[10]
What Saetix said! Please tell me you have something for fairly new players up your sleeves...that would be so unfair to have someone who has been training for a month or two just lose out like that. I can suck it up for my main char, even though IŠm not happy about it, but feel really bad for our noobs in the corp. ________________________________
SOTI recruiting |
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Skid Pants
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Posted - 2006.11.23 20:27:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Skid Pants on 23/11/2006 20:29:44 Sugark, don't worry.
People aren't just pulling your leg when they say experience > skillpoints in eve.
When you've been playing for over 6 months or so, create yourself a little trial alt and have a bash at some pvp, you'd be surprsied what you can achieve, especially now you will be starting with 800k sp.
On top of that you also have amassed assets and standings with agents which no amount of sp can achieve.
Also, everything will eventually become relative. When you are nursing your 20mil + sp's, feeling short changed over 800k at the start of your eve life will really feel insignificant. 800k is a nice leg up, but I promise you, the longer you play the game and the more sp you amass, the less that will matter...
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Fliewatuet
Angelus dos Business
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Posted - 2006.11.23 20:36:00 -
[12]
Its still interesting how selfabsorbed a lot of ppl are. Just because THEY didn't get something good doesn't mean, the same thing has to be applied to everybody who came after them. *sigh* Instead of being happy that it will be easier for a newbie to start playing in the future they cry that it is a disadvantage for themself. -- |
Matalino
Gallente
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Posted - 2006.11.23 20:42:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Matalino on 23/11/2006 20:43:02 For all those who are worried about new players after Kali starting with more SP, if you don't have 800K SP at that point, just make a new character and transfer your goods to him. If you have more than 800K SP at that point then you have lost nothing as you still have a better character. The fact that someone who is brand new is starting a little better off than they previously would have, does not take anything away from you.
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Saetix
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Posted - 2006.11.23 20:45:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Saetix on 23/11/2006 20:44:52 Eh... I can totally agree Flie.
800k is $20, one months game time. That is the aprox amount I have now after playing for one month. Now I discover that new players will start at the same level (if not better) as me, and im self absorbed to be annoyed?
It means that all my effort over the last month is for nothing. It is worthless. Thats hundreds of missions to work up my standing and working towards jump clones.
It may not seem anything to veteran players, but to a new player is a big deal. It takes a long time to get to a point where you can have fun in EVE. A month matters.
This said, I agree its a nice change and it should go ahead. But the effect it has on existing players should not be overlooked.
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Nikolai Konakov
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Posted - 2006.11.23 20:52:00 -
[15]
Saetix, you for some reason seem unable to grasp the concept of all this. You are complaining about having wasted a month doing hundreds of missions for standings and jump clones ?
Kali players wont start with that standing, nor the jump clone fascility, nor will they start with the millions of isk and equipment that you have amassed. The only thing new players are gaining is the 800k starting sp, if you have that now then you are at a far greater advantage than a starting character due to your standings and cash.
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sugark
SOTI Inc. Combined Planetary Union
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Posted - 2006.11.23 20:52:00 -
[16]
Edited by: sugark on 23/11/2006 20:52:52 @skid and @flie...I wasnŠt talking about myself when I said I think it is unfair. I am WAY beyond 800k sp and I wouldnŠt say a word if it was only affecting me. IŠm talking about the new players in my corp. Those that reached about 800sp now after a month or more of training and are getting screwed. And yes, I do care about them. ________________________________
SOTI recruiting |
sugark
SOTI Inc. Combined Planetary Union
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Posted - 2006.11.23 20:58:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Nikolai Konakov Saetix, you for some reason seem unable to grasp the concept of all this. You are complaining about having wasted a month doing hundreds of missions for standings and jump clones ?
Kali players wont start with that standing, nor the jump clone fascility, nor will they start with the millions of isk and equipment that you have amassed. The only thing new players are gaining is the 800k starting sp, if you have that now then you are at a far greater advantage than a starting character due to your standings and cash.
what do ISK, standings, and experience have to do with skillpoints? ________________________________
SOTI recruiting |
Isyel
Minmatar Masuat'aa Matari Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2006.11.23 21:00:00 -
[18]
Not to mention the people screaming "unfair!" forget one thing.
Sure they will start with Missile op. 5, Frig 5 (just throwing some names out there) but. Will they have all the support skills you trained? Don't think so.
Have a look at WHAT skills they actually get before whining. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I be needin' some sig love. *sigh* |
Mila Prestoc
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Posted - 2006.11.23 21:09:00 -
[19]
Your paying to play a game and have fun.
You are not paying for SP's, how you can waste time having fun is beyond me.
As a side note advanced learning skills are being reduced to needing level 4 of the basic skills, so thats 30 days saved over most players with 5m sp or more...
So the people who've played for a month are actually getting an advantage over older players even if people who start after them get a larger advantage. -------------------------
Originally by: "Lord Violent" EvE is slowly becoming a game for the stupid, catered to by devs as they lack ability to kill/survive anything.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2006.11.23 21:10:00 -
[20]
Actually, MUCH more important...
Can we get a confirmation on wether learning skills prerequisites will change from L5 basic to L4 basic ? And wether there will be any "Advanced Learning" skill (the 12th) in the Learning tab ? And if yes to the above, will it also have Learning L4 as prerequisite ? _____ -sig-
This is my only char. These are my skills
Always question everything, including yourself |
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Nikolai Konakov
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Posted - 2006.11.23 21:11:00 -
[21]
Sugart, he said in his own words that he has amassed 800k sp, he also said that his month spent earning standings, jump clones and cash were a waste. They arn't. He would have no advantage in re rolling, he has already surpassed the 800k sp that a kali player would start with and has gained much more along side that.
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sugark
SOTI Inc. Combined Planetary Union
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Posted - 2006.11.23 21:23:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Mila Prestoc Your paying to play a game and have fun.
You are not paying for SP's, how you can waste time having fun is beyond me.
You know - thatŠs actually a good statement ;D
Despite what others said I stick to my opinion. Sp are sp and how they are distributed or what other things you gained in game is beyond the point. *sugark out* ________________________________
SOTI recruiting |
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Jiekon
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Posted - 2006.11.23 21:38:00 -
[23]
In the bigger picture of things, 800,000 skill points is nothing, once you train the learning skills and get implants, etc. You can be pulling in over 2,000 skill points per hour. I know people who have lost a few million skill points by being podded (one guy opsted on the forum that he's had to train BS lvl 5 something like 3 times because he got podded without a clone)
I know i've lost more than 800,000 sp's by forgetting to set long skills / skill finishing before i realised. Your own experience in eve is greater than any amount of skill points. Theres been more than a few stories on the Crime and Punishment forums of 3 or 4 month old characters who specialised quickly and learned how to fight, taking on 2 year old "vets" and beating them hands down.
EvE is about much more than mere skill points, there is a whole community out there and they can teach you more than a few thousand skill points can.
(please note that the above statement is my own personal opinion on this matter and not an official stance of CCP) ___________________________ ~Jiekon
Known Issues Bug Reporting
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Jim McGregor
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.11.23 21:44:00 -
[24]
I think players need to get on the test server more tbh. There you can fight any player and take on both 3 year old veterans and newbies, and see for yourself that what Jiekon says is very true.
--- Eve Wiki | Eve Tribune | Eve Pirate |
Loraen
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Posted - 2006.11.23 21:58:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Nikolai Konakov All i do see in that post are the belated opinions of "vets" trouncing a new players opinions. Of course they feel the way they do, some of them have over 5 mill sp, 800k is insignificant. But for me, who would by kali release be struggling to top 300k, it is a massive boost.
Actually, almost all I see is the OP gnagging on like a broken record. They're obviously a minmaxer type of player who take this game like a contest, which is a flawed argument because you can't win the game.
("Boohoo, Kali 1 people will start with almost as much SP as I'll have then, and my already-gained playing experience, fun playing, 8.0 navy standing and ~100M ISK assets are worthless in the equation of 'I paid 20$ for something they'll get free'!")
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Radix Salvilines
Virtual Democracy Intergalactic Freelance Corporations
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Posted - 2006.11.23 22:48:00 -
[26]
Hmmm there is something that makes me feel uncomfortable with that.
I think on one side its an awesome idea to give newbies more sp at the beginning. I remember my first days when i was looking at my mates able to fly cool ships and me being a complete noob, not even able to fit in a stupid webber/acrambler. Now it will be different im sure.
But...
What if somebody will get around an idea (well one already have ) not to risk his own character, buy expensive clones in case of being podded etc but to make an alt and... you know what i mean at this point i think. This may even escalate - u know Goonswarm? I saw a video of their big fleet of velators crushing everything they meet on their way... Now take a medium sized corp - all members make alts with 800k sp - with that amount of sp they are able to properly fit not only a velator but outfit a frig, give it a web, scram, guns, drones etc. From their mains they recieve one million for the modules and frigs - its quite enough. Now they log in their alts, meet up somewhere and... all the hell starts up.
Fleet battles? Who wuold risk expensive ships when they can make a large frig fleet to lag down enemy and eventually kill it thanks to the numbers of frigs they have... hmm...
Another thingy - ever heard of suicide bses? Ill explain - some pirates found out that it is sometimes good to loose a bs in empire (because of being concordokened) if their vicim is a hauler with a valueable stuff. They work in 3-ships groups - one in a frig that is scanning every passing by hauler (concord dont kill for that) if it has a valueable cargo. If for example it has a full load of nocxium then a suicide bs arrives and insta-kills this hauler before concord gets him. Then another pirate in a hauler arrives and takes the cargo and flee. My alliance mate lost two hulks that way. Well that way pirate is instantly loosing sec status, he has to raise it by doing missions or ratting - so its not that awesome. But... Pirate corp (or even normal corp - no-one looses sec stasus with their mains in corp and no-one knows whoose alts it was) comes by in a 20 frig group. Scanner pilot find out the victim has a valueable cargo, frigs get on the victim, hauler steals the loot. If the alts get too low sec status - no problem, pull them into biomass and make another one...
Also macrominers would be VEEERY happy...
I have been thinking how to limit it. But found out there is nothing that can be done without limitting "normal newbies". You can make a peroid for nwe characters when they cannot attack others, cannot make big gangs... no problem... everyone can make one alt every 15 days (if the no-attack peroid would be 30days) and just wait till its usable. Nerfing gangs? :/. Is that really a problem? Juts dont make gang...
I think everyone got the point. This 800k starting sp can in short time make everyone be afraid of undocking because outside there can be an alt frig swarm waiting and podding everything. If alt looses sp due to not having a clone - no problem, we do another alt.
Hmmm...
I really like the idea of giving new players a boost... but on the other hand... well... u saw what ive wrote above.
Coments and criticism are welcome :)
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2006.11.23 23:06:00 -
[27]
Well, it IS alt-o-rama fun IMHO. Here's a nice little scenario.
Amarr engineer, starts with mechanic 5 and engineering 5 if I'm not remembering it wrong, also L4 int and L2 mem, and either L2 or L3 science. Get Cybernetics L1 in a matter of minutes, plug in full set of +3 implants (less than 100 mil nowadays), buy all normal/advanced learning skills (not like they cost much anyway compared to the implants). You can either start training advanced int first, before cybernetics, but I guess it wouldn't matter much anyway.
So, you get to +10 to each starting attribute in a matter of days, literally (not much more than a week anyway). That is, if learning skills ARE indeed L4-prerequisite in Kali. Well, train in those that "matter", so "ignore" charisma for even less "downtime".
Guess what you'll be training next ? ASSAULT FRIGATES, of course, what else is there ? Most of the prerequisites are already met anyway. And looking at the fact you have little SP "invested" in any specific racial skills, you could just go on and train for THAT specific race's assault frig + weapon system you like most, because, hey, no loss.
Bottom line ? Assault-frig-ready alt in a matter of weeks. Maybe one month tops for some of the relevant support skills.
Not an alt but a brand new goonswarm recruit ? Well, why don't you SELL a bloody timecode then, gets you more than enough ISK and probably saves you the time you'd be spending doing "not fun stuff" instead of just going out into the great wild open swarming with your other goons shooting stuff up badly.
There's three sides to every story: my side, your side, and the truth. _____ -sig-
This is my only char. These are my skills
Always question everything, including yourself |
Radix Salvilines
Virtual Democracy Intergalactic Freelance Corporations
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Posted - 2006.11.23 23:16:00 -
[28]
well that way u have to have another account. Just add another month now and u have the same.
What i meant is that while goonswarm makes 100- velators fleet, now u can make 20-frigs fleet and do the same.
As 20 velators wont do much damage, 20 tier3 frigs will do. U can have this alt on your main account.
What is the point - you dont have to be in a huge alliance to group 100 members to make sucha party - almost every mid sizd corp will now be able to do this.
EVE Community start to tremble in fear... the doom is coming :(
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IteVherokioEst
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Posted - 2006.11.23 23:18:00 -
[29]
Quote: EvE is about much more than mere skill points, there is a whole community out there and they can teach you more than a few thousand skill points can.
Quote: (please note that the above statement is my own personal opinion on this matter and not an official stance of CCP)
Quote: ~Jiekon
I see. A personal opinion is not company policy, but company policy is the same as a personal opinion?
I vaguely sense a awry here.
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Agrias Hellion
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Posted - 2006.11.24 03:25:00 -
[30]
Jiekon speaks the truth.
I've created an alt for pvp, currently he has nearly 300k skill points. This is basically a set of basic skills to allow fitting. Pertinent learning skills to level 3 (intelligence and memory) and around 140k in missle skills. He should be great fun in a Kestrel.
I will probably create a new one with Kali, might even save me some cash. Then again I might concentrate on my Bloodlines character that got a large amount of time free.
Skill points don't make the player, it's amazing how people focus so much on acquring something. Reminds me of WoW "ZOMG I must get a Tier 2 set of armour with uber weapons so I will pwn". Then they are gutted by something with some blue ****e they pulled from a garbage can.
You pay to play the game, over time I've lost a large number of skill points from leaving the game and coming back, forgetting to set skills. I've lost level 5 skills from being podded. Hell today I lost nearly 12 hours of trainign time. Get over it.
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