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The Omen cruiser - Why cant we fit guns on it?

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Securion Wolfheart Caldari Dark-Rising	Posted - 2006.11.24 11:45:00 - [1] Im trying to setup an Omen cruiser here to play around with... but... theres not powergrid to fit guns...? (?!?) I dont really expect it to have any sorta good or very good tank, just.... be able to shoot at something would be nice....? Plz? :) Its a very good looking ship, but i understand now why i dont see them ever being used much anywhere, wich is kinda sad. I have always thought that the Omen should be more like a Thorax. (used by ppl in pvp) Maybe Tux or any other dev could look into this? There must be some sorta mistake/bug? .......And yes I have all relevant skills at lvl 4. Or do amarr cruisers need lvl 5 skills now to fit guns on them? Im pretty sure this is not the case with the Thorax/Caracal/whatever? -----====----- Whether we bring our enemies to justice or bring justice to our enemies, justice will be done.
keepiru Supernova Security Systems	Posted - 2006.11.24 11:52:00 - [2] Because its Amarr, and therefore should not have remotely enough grid to fit the most fitting-consuming weapons in the whole game. At least that seems to be the philosophy @ CCP, the Abaddon has the same PG as the Maelstrom, but it it armor tanks instead of shield tanks and its weapons use about 20% more grid... shrug Just give up, the only amarr tier-1 cruiser worth flying is the arbitrator. ---------------- Kali ships worth flying left: Harbinger, Rokh. Only 2 left tux, you can make it!
FPS Doug	Posted - 2006.11.24 11:56:00 - [3] Originally by: keepiru Just give up, the only amarr tier-1 cruiser worth flying is the arbitrator. Not true! Omen rocks for... um... mining... n' stuff... Yeah...
Securion Wolfheart Caldari Dark-Rising	Posted - 2006.11.24 12:26:00 - [4] But seriously this must be a "bug"? Have the devs said anything about it? If not a bug, whats the reasoning for it to have such a low powergrid that you cant even fit guns on it? Whats the point? Maybe Tux can add some powergrid to the Omen? I wanna be able to fight in it like i can do in the Thorax and the other cruisers. Please? -----====----- Whether we bring our enemies to justice or bring justice to our enemies, justice will be done.
Zaphyr Diamor	Posted - 2006.11.24 12:33:00 - [5] I use an Omen to rat in 0.0 and i can happily take out double BS spawns and attending frigates/cruisers/BC. True, i am pretty much using 99% PG and CPU, but i can fit 4 turrets, a heavy missile bay in the highs, mids have AB, Web, cap recharger, lows are a Med rep, Skadi heat sink, CPR, and active kinetic and thermal hardeners. I'm not sure how easy or hard it is to fit a PvP setup, but you'd probably have to sacrifice tank for damage. I like my Omen and it works well for the purpose i use it, but yeah, more PG would be nice.
Securion Wolfheart Caldari Dark-Rising	Posted - 2006.11.24 12:38:00 - [6] Originally by: Zaphyr Diamor I use an Omen to rat in 0.0 and i can happily take out double BS spawns and attending frigates/cruisers/BC. True, i am pretty much using 99% PG and CPU, but i can fit 4 turrets, a heavy missile bay in the highs, mids have AB, Web, cap recharger, lows are a Med rep, Skadi heat sink, CPR, and active kinetic and thermal hardeners. I'm not sure how easy or hard it is to fit a PvP setup, but you'd probably have to sacrifice tank for damage. I like my Omen and it works well for the purpose i use it, but yeah, more PG would be nice. How can you make that fit? Lvl 5 skills? (mine are at lvl 4) And what guns are you using...? -----====----- Whether we bring our enemies to justice or bring justice to our enemies, justice will be done.
Montero Black Omega Security	Posted - 2006.11.24 12:42:00 - [7] Originally by: keepiru Because its Amarr, and therefore should not have remotely enough grid to fit the most fitting-consuming weapons in the whole game. At least that seems to be the philosophy @ CCP, the Abaddon has the same PG as the Maelstrom, but it it armor tanks instead of shield tanks and its weapons use about 20% more grid... You're comparing tachs to other guns. You should know better. --------- Scrapheap Challenge
Prabms	Posted - 2006.11.24 12:50:00 - [8] Originally by: Montero You're comparing tachs to other guns. You should know better. Yup, tachyons are not guns, they are something... quite else.
Dread Phantom Caldari Project-Chaos	Posted - 2006.11.24 12:58:00 - [9] try quad beams, its your only hope
Artemis Ascarii	Posted - 2006.11.24 12:59:00 - [10] Omen is a great cruiser. :) But it could be much better is only the Devs would boost it's PG abit. Since now you need Engineering V, Electronics V Amarr Cruiser V and atleast a level or two in Advanced Weapons Upgrades so you also need Weapons upgrade V. I fit: 4 Focused Medium Pulse II / Med Nos 10MN AB / ***** left out MAR II / ******* left out / no fitting mods. With that I have no problems ratting blood raider BC's in lowsec. But it's a bit lacking in PvP. BTW. Ratting serpentis Battleships is not that hard. I accually think it's very possible to do in a Incursus or hard (but possible) in a Velator. Gurista cruisers are harder then Serp BS's. I have used a Punisher to rat serp BS's. (just have to skip the ones guarded by ceptors)
Va'n Magnetar Ltd DeStInY.	Posted - 2006.11.24 13:06:00 - [11] I use a omen to pirate with a buddy in a moa (I hit harder while in optimal), it's actually pretty good IMO for the cost, just have it fitted with T1 junk and bout 3 heat sinks for hitting power, but in my experience it has no tank what so ever. So I just slapped on a gank setup grabbed a buddy and went to town. Solo PVP this can not do, but itÆs by no means un*****ble (fit's quite easily in my experience, not sure what nice mods you guys are slapping on a 4m cruiser heh)
Montero Black Omega Security	Posted - 2006.11.24 13:12:00 - [12] Originally by: Prabms Originally by: Montero You're comparing tachs to other guns. You should know better. Yup, tachyons are not guns, they are something... quite else. They are a totaly seperate class of guns which are in no way comparible to other top-tier BS guns. If you want to do that compare mega beams with 1400s or 425s, not tachs. Think before running your mouth off. --------- Scrapheap Challenge
Securion Wolfheart Caldari Dark-Rising	Posted - 2006.11.24 13:13:00 - [13] Originally by: Artemis Ascarii Omen is a great cruiser. :) But it could be much better is only the Devs would boost it's PG abit. Since now you need Engineering V, Electronics V Amarr Cruiser V and atleast a level or two in Advanced Weapons Upgrades so you also need Weapons upgrade V. I fit: 4 Focused Medium Pulse II / Med Nos 10MN AB / ***** left out MAR II / ******* left out / no fitting mods. With that I have no problems ratting blood raider BC's in lowsec. But it's a bit lacking in PvP. BTW. Ratting serpentis Battleships is not that hard. I accually think it's very possible to do in a Incursus or hard (but possible) in a Velator. Gurista cruisers are harder then Serp BS's. I have used a Punisher to rat serp BS's. (just have to skip the ones guarded by ceptors) I only have those skills at lvl 4, but still think i should be able to fit guns on it? I must be doing something wrong... Its strange though that i can setup and have fun with all other ships i can fly.. grr. -----====----- Whether we bring our enemies to justice or bring justice to our enemies, justice will be done.
Shagrath Xarra	Posted - 2006.11.24 14:03:00 - [14] Originally by: Zaphyr Diamor I use an Omen to rat in 0.0 and i can happily take out double BS spawns and attending frigates/cruisers/BC. True, i am pretty much using 99% PG and CPU, but i can fit 4 turrets, a heavy missile bay in the highs, mids have AB, Web, cap recharger, lows are a Med rep, Skadi heat sink, CPR, and active kinetic and thermal hardeners. I'm not sure how easy or hard it is to fit a PvP setup, but you'd probably have to sacrifice tank for damage. I like my Omen and it works well for the purpose i use it, but yeah, more PG would be nice. I use almost the exact same setup and it is easily doable with Electronics 4, Engineering 4 and Weapon Upgrades 2. The thing is with the Omen is you really can't use the upper tier Med lasers {or even beam lasers} on it until you have uber fitting skills. Once you accept that, fitting the Omen is pretty easy. While that sucks to be sure, it is still a pretty nice ratting Cruiser and a decent PvP ship in a gang.

Saucerhead Forum Moderator	Posted - 2006.11.24 14:19:00 - [15] You can get reasonable setups on Omen as long as you use Focused Medium Beams/Pulses, not Heavy ones. -- Read the Rules!

Caldorous Gallente	Posted - 2006.11.24 14:23:00 - [16] Originally by: FPS Doug Originally by: keepiru Just give up, the only amarr tier-1 cruiser worth flying is the arbitrator. Not true! Omen rocks for... um... mining... n' stuff... Yeah... you are right!!! cuz the omen is a tier-2 cruiser On the other side... isn't the omen be soposed to use a gank setup? it's bonuses suggest so. I you want a cruiser that tanks, take the maller -----------------------------
Vaine Amarr	Posted - 2006.11.24 14:45:00 - [17] Edited by: Vaine Amarr on 24/11/2006 14:45:08 Originally by: Caldorous Originally by: FPS Doug Originally by: keepiru Just give up, the only amarr tier-1 cruiser worth flying is the arbitrator. Not true! Omen rocks for... um... mining... n' stuff... Yeah... you are right!!! cuz the omen is a tier-2 cruiser On the other side... isn't the omen be soposed to use a gank setup? it's bonuses suggest so. I you want a cruiser that tanks, take the maller Level 2, not tier 2. Tier 2 would be Zealot ;)
Ter'duk Tarr	Posted - 2006.11.24 14:53:00 - [18] Originally by: Vaine Amarr Edited by: Vaine Amarr on 24/11/2006 14:45:08 Originally by: Caldorous Originally by: FPS Doug Originally by: keepiru Just give up, the only amarr tier-1 cruiser worth flying is the arbitrator. Not true! Omen rocks for... um... mining... n' stuff... Yeah... you are right!!! cuz the omen is a tier-2 cruiser On the other side... isn't the omen be soposed to use a gank setup? it's bonuses suggest so. I you want a cruiser that tanks, take the maller Level 2, not tier 2. Tier 2 would be Zealot ;) No, no. That would be Tech 2 for the zealot. He was right.
genes Caldari Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2006.11.24 15:08:00 - [19] Originally by: Montero They are a totaly seperate class of guns which are in no way comparible to other top-tier BS guns. If you want to do that compare mega beams with 1400s or 425s, not tachs. Think before running your mouth off. Tachs are no longer considered an oversized weapon, tux used them in his own graph and compared them with both 1400mm and 425mm rails a while back. 425mm rails with damage bonus have almost the same dps as a tachyon laser without bonus. Tachs do have more alpha but rails have more optimal instead.
Thoris Levithar Gallente Gadget Factory	Posted - 2006.11.24 15:27:00 - [20] Originally by: Securion Wolfheart I only have those skills at lvl 4, but still think i should be able to fit guns on it? I must be doing something wrong... Its strange though that i can setup and have fun with all other ships i can fly.. grr. Omen: Hi (5, 4/1): 4x Focused Medium Pulse Laser I (28/120) Assault Missile Launcher I (35/50) => (147/530) Med (3): 10mn Afterburner I (25/50) Stasis Webifier (25/1) Cap Recharger I (10/1) => (60/52) Low (5): Medium Armor Repairer II (28/173) Damage Control System (25/1) 2x Energized xxx Membrane II (30/2) Capacitor Power Relay (4/0) => (117/178) Base: 250 tf, 730 mw Uses: 324/300 tf, 760/876 mw Those max. values are with ELE 4, ENG 4. As you see you will need some levels of Weapon Upgrades (or named modules with less CPU usage) to fit this. Quite obviously however: grid is NOT the problem of the Omen, rather its the low CPU :)
Thor Xian Vertigo One E.A.R.T.H. Federation	Posted - 2006.11.24 16:17:00 - [21] The Omen is the fastest Amarr cruiser, and one of the faster cruisers ingame. It's a shame that speed is mostly wasted. Omen tries to play the same game as the geddon. Maller does same dmg unless Omen uses drones and missile launcher. ~Thor Xian, Material Defender "Victory is the weakness of the enemy." Corp/Alliance Services
Tadis Gallente 0utbreak	Posted - 2006.11.24 17:51:00 - [22] 4 x Focused medium Pulse II 1 x 10mn Afterburner 1 x 20k scrambler 1 x web 1 x small rep II 3 x heat sink II 1 x either RCU or plate, cant remember, but I guess it depends on your skills. Using conflag or scorch Is good, catches people out with your damage and can npc pretty good too. ___________________________________
Mastin Dragonfly Amarr	Posted - 2006.11.24 18:19:00 - [23] Edited by: Mastin Dragonfly on 24/11/2006 18:21:11 Originally by: Securion Wolfheart Originally by: Artemis Ascarii Omen is a great cruiser. :) But it could be much better is only the Devs would boost it's PG abit. Since now you need Engineering V, Electronics V Amarr Cruiser V and atleast a level or two in Advanced Weapons Upgrades so you also need Weapons upgrade V. I fit: 4 Focused Medium Pulse II / Med Nos 10MN AB / ***** left out MAR II / ******* left out / no fitting mods. With that I have no problems ratting blood raider BC's in lowsec. But it's a bit lacking in PvP. BTW. Ratting serpentis Battleships is not that hard. I accually think it's very possible to do in a Incursus or hard (but possible) in a Velator. Gurista cruisers are harder then Serp BS's. I have used a Punisher to rat serp BS's. (just have to skip the ones guarded by ceptors) I only have those skills at lvl 4, but still think i should be able to fit guns on it? I must be doing something wrong... Its strange though that i can setup and have fun with all other ships i can fly.. grr. I think it might be useful if you would state which setup you are using/tring to fit, so you can get a more specific answer to your situation. The "Heavy" medium lasers are notoriously hard to fit, the "Focused" ones however shouldn't pose much of a problem unless your fitting skills are seriously lacking.
keepiru Supernova Security Systems	Posted - 2006.11.24 18:35:00 - [24] Edited by: keepiru on 24/11/2006 18:37:12 Originally by: Montero They are a totaly seperate class of guns which are in no way comparible to other top-tier BS guns. If you want to do that compare mega beams with 1400s or 425s, not tachs. Think before running your mouth off. Work out the DPS/range of tachs and 425mm with racial bonus applied - none for amarr, 25% damage for gallente - then tell me again. Tach: 20.736 base dps, 53km optimal 425mm: 20.711 base dps, 58km optimal Yup, different class of gun allright If lasers have to be balance for ships for a dmg bonbus, then by god I want a damage bonus on the majority of them, instead of on 4 T1 ships 2 of which are BS. EVen if it wasn;t painfully apparent to anyone with half a brain cell that atchyons are not a different class of gun - keep mind that dps is with the 5% boost from the last patch! - megbeams STILL use more grid than 1400mm. So there is no excuse whatsoever for the grid on amarr ships. ---------------- Kali ships worth flying left: Harbinger, Rokh. Only 2 left tux, you can make it!

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