olyyy
Gallente
V I R I I
Center for Disease Creation
   |
Posted - 2006.11.26 15:37:00 -
[1]
Edited by: olyyy on 26/11/2006 15:38:13
Respect? For ASCN? ^^
Respect for being a failed alliance right now of the same level of the previous alliance ASCN was in? Respect for failing your entire politics: allying with BoB to destroy a capital shipyard just because ASCN didn't want anybody else to have motherships? Respect for in fact alienating most of Eve universe so that anybody willing to help ASCN now would do it just because they hate BoB more than ASCN?
So yeah, respect to ASCN for getting their asses kicked with a stick they helped to grow and even assisted sometimes.
You played your role on BoB's side long enough. You played it pretty well. You've been a descent tool. Being a tool isn't a bad thing you know. At least it's not a bad thing when you actually realize that you're just a tool and know why you're doing it. You didn't.
Oh don't get me wrong. The fact that you deserve absolutly no respect at this time doesn't mean that you won't deserve some in the future. I hope you will, I don't like when things get too predictable. 
Men never lie more than before elections, during war and after hunting. |
olyyy
Gallente
V I R I I
Center for Disease Creation
|
Posted - 2006.11.26 19:32:00 -
[2]
 Originally by: eleuthereus
Edited by: eleuthereus on 26/11/2006 16:34:23
Originally by: olyyy
[...]
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So, IMHO, if you do not respect ASCN as a whole, then given the tihngs you listed, who you REALLY don't respect in CYVOK and HC -- i.e., the decision-makers. But to use the corporate "YOU" unfairly brings all pilots in ASCN under your condemnation when in reality, very few of the pilots have had anything to do with what you mentioned: previous alliance, politics of game, deciding to ally with BOB.
As for getting our a*** kicked, well, the war is not over yet. This does not mean we will win, it simply means the fight is still raging. You may yet be able to make that comment, but for now, the charge is premature. I do, however, agree with you one point -- I very much hope that in the future ASCN will deserve respect. Point well taken.
eleuthereus
I'll quote it together with this one:
Originally by: Avon
Personally I wouldn't have bothered writting so much in response to that guy.
Any sane person will judge the members of an alliance for who they are, not the flag they fly under.
It makes no difference how much respect people have for an alliance, an alliance is not a person who can be offended or encouraged by respect, it is an organisation.
Respect is for people, not for abstract concepts.
My dear Avon, I can't be bothered with 2isk philosophy on the meaning and impact of the word "respect".
The second thing is, I'm not sure it's such a great idea to make a distinction between alliance members and the decision makers. When you're facing such a conflict as the one opposing ASCN and BoB, trying to draw such a line is already in itself dividing the alliance. Members and leaders are all in the same boat, they're all part of this not-so-abstract entity called "an alliance".
Members choose and follow leaders, even in a dictatorship. Therefore if their leaders take a wrong decision, members are also responsible for it.
Of course it would sound so much better to follow Avon's idea saying respect should be paid to some ASCN individuals since it's all that matters. Then let's pay respect on those who fought well on the battlefield, let's convo them, let's explain them that we respect them, that actually they do much better than their alliance, that they have our respect. It could even be corporations. Those corporations could keep living in this space they fought so hard for (compared to the "others"), and some of those individuals we respect could be recruited. When you reach this stage, it's game over for ASCN 
But I'll give this to you eleuthereus, I actually hope that ASCN will in the future deserve respect. Nothing is ever played already, there is always something that can be done. Many cards are still to be played, and nothing can be predicted
Men never lie more than before elections, during war and after hunting. |