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Level 4 Mission tanking strategy

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Nagamor Lonely Maple Construction Group Lonely Maple Conglomeration 0	Posted - 2011.12.07 17:52:00 - [1] - Quote I've read elsewhere in comments that tanking L4 Missions generally requires 500 hp/s recovery. I'm just wondering if there's any truth to that or if the reality is higher. A little background : I'm running L4's with a friend, since i have the most time and money behind me I'm running tougher tank-boats to keep aggro. Thanks, Nagamor
Spineker 56	Posted - 2011.12.07 18:04:00 - [2] - Quote I think it is lower depending on the ship. Nighthawk doesn't recover that much I don't think been a while since I flown mine but its resist were so high didn't need to be recovering but once it did hit half shields she would regen very fast but I am not sure of the exact numbers. My tengu can boost depending on mission 168hp every 2 second or 89 or something if I only run one booster. But it is a speed tanking ship most things hit it for like 3 to 10 damage as long as I don't get webbed. It is too broad and too many ships to say yes or no. Maybe slow BSs need that or stationary low resist ships.
Caleidascope Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 3	Posted - 2011.12.07 19:32:00 - [3] - Quote Makes sure you have light scout drones and decent drone skills, then just kill scram frigs and if your tank is not working, warp out and refit. Life is short and dinner time is chancy Eat desert first!
Nagamor Lonely Maple Construction Group Lonely Maple Conglomeration 0	Posted - 2011.12.07 19:52:00 - [4] - Quote Largely i'm digging into the numbers and research because as a fitting tool tells me, I had shield boosted recovery at 400/s but I still managed to pull so much aggro that I was chewed away. I run medium drones but I hadn't figured lights to be better for frigate hunting. I'll make that change and see what it does for me. I'm trying to build out a fit for a Paladin and some of the numbers i'm seeing are giving me concern.
Spineker 56	Posted - 2011.12.07 19:54:00 - [5] - Quote Ahh yeah I don't fly that one or would help. I am sure someone will be along though to help you out.
Zhilia Mann Tide Way Out Productions 133	Posted - 2011.12.07 20:50:00 - [6] - Quote Nagamor wrote: I'm trying to build out a fit for a Paladin and some of the numbers i'm seeing are giving me concern. Like so many high end mission boats, the Paladin largely relies on gank to boost its tank. Dead rats don't shoot back and all that. A Paladin probably isn't the ideal tank boat for the use you describe, but it can sport dual LARs in a pulse configuration if you really wanted to go that way.
Alyssa Yotosala School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 48	Posted - 2011.12.07 20:58:00 - [7] - Quote Protip: Tengu So overtanked for LVL4's its laughable, with an weapons system well suited for anti-everything-NPC.
Kilrayn Caldari Provisions 79	Posted - 2011.12.07 20:59:00 - [8] - Quote It's tough to take a paper set-up and figure out how it's going to work in practice. Many factors, including your individual piloting and knowledge, can make a mission easier, or more difficult. Here's my overview of lvl 4 tanking. 1) Train up for t2 modues, whether you armor or shield tank. 2) check Eve-Surv if you are unfamiliar with the mission. 3) Fit mission specific hardners and ammo if you have that capability. This I feel is just about all you need, aside from that aforementioned piloting and knowledge . In the beginning, the Universe was created. This has angered numerous people for many different reasons and is widely considered as a 'bad move'.
NearNihil Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 7	Posted - 2011.12.07 21:06:00 - [9] - Quote Depends on the ship and mission. Fit resists and reps if you're in a battleship, and you usually speedtank your t3s. Also, with the resists, find out what damage the NPCs are dealing before warping in. Wrong hardeners can and will result in a wrecked ship.
Whiteknight03 WESAYSO Industries 20	Posted - 2011.12.07 21:24:00 - [10] - Quote The 500 number comes from effective tank with resists taken into account, not raw regen. I find it a good ballpark for a ship that is not too high on gank. The thing I usually hear quoted is that your tank+gank should equal at least 1000 for a lvl. 500 dps tank + 500 dps gank will probably be fine as long as you pay attention to triggers.
Nagamor Lonely Maple Construction Group Lonely Maple Conglomeration 0	Posted - 2011.12.08 00:56:00 - [11] - Quote Okay, so i'm semi familiar with the tanking layout on mission specific hardeners. Can someone confirm is it 2/1 for Primary/Secondary damage types based on mission, or should I be fitting for 2/1/1 as Primary/Secondary/EANM? Tengu? Gah. Admittedly, yes. It's got a great tank and anyone that can fit mission specific weapons is going to have an easier time than an Amarrian Laser Strategy of "Burn a hole through them". But there's a certain finesse in making non-Tengu fits work.
Zhilia Mann Tide Way Out Productions 134	Posted - 2011.12.08 01:03:00 - [12] - Quote Nagamor wrote: Okay, so i'm semi familiar with the tanking layout on mission specific hardeners. Can someone confirm is it 2/1 for Primary/Secondary damage types based on mission, or should I be fitting for 2/1/1 as Primary/Secondary/EANM? It really depends on the rats you're facing. Guristas, for instance, are generally listed as kinetic primary and thermal secondary. However, their actual thermal component is tiny and kinetic is the only thing really worth worrying about -- so a three resist mod layout would look more like kin/kin/eanm and a four resist mod layout would probably be kin/kin/therm or eanm/eanm for armor. It also rather depends on starting resists. Tanking armor against Angels will require plugging your explosive hole rather aggressively. Same goes for tanking EM on shields (unless T2 Amarr for the former and T2 Minmatar for the latter). It's probably best to play with EFT and swap out damage profiles and resist mods until you're happy with the tank number it spits out.
Korvus Falek Depraved Corruption 0	Posted - 2011.12.08 02:12:00 - [13] - Quote Im curious what your thoughts on this fit would be. Yes, its exspensive, but I have money and dont mind throwing it out there for badass looking ships so ignore the pricetag shock please. Plus, I already have all of the imperial navy peices in my hangar and could use those instead of the deadspace stuff. I originally had mission specific hardeners instead of the heatsinks, however, I felt more dps is always good, so meh. Im not sure on the t2 riggings though, due to the small amount of added bonus they give for their cost compared to the t1 version. In EFT with all 5 skills: tanks 746 on paper dps of 622 cap stable at 36% (which is perfect imo) Resists are: EM - 76.9% Thermal - 70% Kinetic - 71.7% Explosion - 69.8% [Bhaalgorn, Missions] Damage Control II Corpus A-Type Large Armor Repairer Corpus A-Type Large Armor Repairer Imperial Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane Imperial Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Gist A-Type 100MN Afterburner Federation Navy Stasis Webifier Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Corpus A-Type Heavy Nosferatu Corpus A-Type Heavy Nosferatu Corpus A-Type Heavy Nosferatu Large Anti-Kinetic Pump I Large Anti-Explosive Pump I Large Capacitor Control Circuit II Warrior II x5 Valkyrie II x5
Kaanchana Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 46	Posted - 2011.12.08 03:00:00 - [14] - Quote Use paladin if you are missioning in amarr space. Use tachyons, they have more applied dps than mega pulses. Do not try to be cap stable with such high end ships. My paladin caps out in 2 mins if it runs IN LAR while firing. That might look crazy but when you can kill a battleship rat in 2 volleys, you will find that adequate enough. Most of the missions they die before they come into range and i hardly ever turn on my rep. The only times i need that is in gurista/angel missions or in missions where i have to let them come to my tractor range. I don't have any cap mods in it, 2 tracking comps and 2 DG webs. Use navy crystals, less cap use and more shots per crystal. 40km is the optimal range for most of the rats. You will want to have your best damage projection at that range. Mega pulses will hit at 15km with multi's. Tachyons reach to 45km with IN multis and thats what you will want, not plunking them away with silly scorch. p.s: you will loose the ship fast enough if you are careless or semi ask running. This is not like a domi or a drake.
Kesshisan 76	Posted - 2011.12.08 06:55:00 - [15] - Quote Step 1: http://www.ogrank.com/content/view/698/59/ Step 2: http://eve-survival.org/wikka.php?wakka=MissionReports Step 3: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=24359 Step 4: Setup something like this: http://i.imgur.com/nEGmp.jpg Step 5: TANK ALL THE THINGS! .
luvmehard Republic University Minmatar Republic 4	Posted - 2011.12.08 09:32:00 - [16] - Quote Paladin, as stated before, belongs to regions with Sansha/Blood Raiders/Rouge Drones as rats. Or Amarr Navy, that's always a joy [Paladin, T2 Tachs] Dark Blood Large Armor Repairer Armor Thermic Hardener II Armor EM Hardener II Dark Blood Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane Dark Blood Heat Sink Dark Blood Heat Sink Dark Blood Heat Sink Tracking Computer II, Tracking Speed Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Small Tractor Beam I Small Tractor Beam I Salvager I Large Capacitor Control Circuit II Large Capacitor Control Circuit II Hobgoblin II x5 Hammerhead II x5 If you don't have AWU 5, You will need a 2% PGU implant. Get that faction LAR (Dark Blood, Imperial, Ammatar..), it really is worth it. You can also use T1 rigs, you should still be cap stable without tractors and salvager running. Consider investing into a CC8 and a CX-2 implant. It's worth it. Basically, you obliterate stuff so fast, it does not have much time to stress your tank. Please support my proposal for LP relocation! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=30500
Kaanchana Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 47	Posted - 2011.12.08 12:12:00 - [17] - Quote Do not try to be cap stable with paladin guys, really. you won't run everything for even a minute in most missions. Even WC needs only occasional Repper pulsing if u manage the triggers. Being cap stable will gimp the performance in a measurable amount.
luvmehard Republic University Minmatar Republic 4	Posted - 2011.12.08 12:30:00 - [18] - Quote Kaanchana wrote: Do not try to be cap stable with paladin guys, really. you won't run everything for even a minute in most missions. Even WC needs only occasional Repper pulsing if u manage the triggers. Being cap stable will gimp the performance in a measurable amount. While I agree with you in general as far as cap stability of Marauders go (neither my Vargur nor Golem are cap stable), I don't really see the point of it with the Paladin. For the sake of the argument, I was EFT warrioring with all lvl5s: 2x Large CCC = 961 DPS/6613 Alpha Large ECA II + Large ACR = 1017 DPS/6999 Alpha Fifty-something increase in damage per second. Is it worth it? I cannot think of any other form to increase applied damage, maybe a pair of scripted TC's? Please support my proposal for LP relocation! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=30500
Kaanchana Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 47	Posted - 2011.12.08 12:33:00 - [19] - Quote yep, not much increase, but i use a tc, a web usually and 2 x sebos. rigs are aux pumps.. won't increase completion times by much but its better than being cap stable when you don't need it anyway..
Flock Birken COUGARS Corp Redrum Fleet 0	Posted - 2011.12.08 12:38:00 - [20] - Quote against guristas I switched out a heatsink for a radar backup array2, didnt get jammed once.
Korvus Falek Depraved Corruption 0	Posted - 2011.12.09 02:04:00 - [21] - Quote tbh, I dont like the paladin. And its a marauder, which requires AWU5, to whoever said if they dont have that skill while using the paladin =P Everyone seems to be of the mindset of getting the cookie cutter thing instead of finding a ship they have fun flying and enjoy instead of min/max'ing. I guess there are just as many sheep in EVE as there are RL.
Spineker 56	Posted - 2011.12.09 04:32:00 - [22] - Quote Korvus Falek wrote: tbh, I dont like the paladin. And its a marauder, which requires AWU5, to whoever said if they dont have that skill while using the paladin =P Everyone seems to be of the mindset of getting the cookie cutter thing instead of finding a ship they have fun flying and enjoy instead of min/max'ing. I guess there are just as many sheep in EVE as there are RL. I think that would be Mach more than any other. The end all of ships... right if you have 5 to 6 months of nothing but gun skills sure. But there are ships just as good with far less.
Loraine Gess Confedeferate Union of Tax Legalists 5	Posted - 2011.12.09 05:20:00 - [23] - Quote luvmehard wrote: Paladin, as stated before, belongs to regions with Sansha/Blood Raiders/Rouge Drones as rats. Or Amarr Navy, that's always a joy [Paladin, T2 Tachs] Dark Blood Large Armor Repairer Armor Thermic Hardener II Armor EM Hardener II Dark Blood Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane Dark Blood Heat Sink Dark Blood Heat Sink Dark Blood Heat Sink Tracking Computer II, Tracking Speed Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Small Tractor Beam I Small Tractor Beam I Salvager I Large Capacitor Control Circuit II Large Capacitor Control Circuit II Hobgoblin II x5 Hammerhead II x5 If you don't have AWU 5, You will need a 2% PGU implant. Get that faction LAR (Dark Blood, Imperial, Ammatar..), it really is worth it. You can also use T1 rigs, you should still be cap stable without tractors and salvager running. Consider investing into a CC8 and a CX-2 implant. It's worth it. Basically, you obliterate stuff so fast, it does not have much time to stress your tank. >Paladin >If you don't have AWU 5 Please go back to your EFTing thanks
luvmehard Republic University Minmatar Republic 4	Posted - 2011.12.09 08:23:00 - [24] - Quote Loraine Gess wrote: >Paladin >If you don't have AWU 5 Please go back to your EFTing thanks Your point being? People fly these things with AWU 4 all the time. Just like Falcons with Recon 4. Or logis with Logistics 4, etc. I am not one of them, I merely point out the obvious before some of the less intellectually fortunate runs back here, screaming "lies! this dun fit!". Please support my proposal for LP relocation! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=30500
Mysteriax The Graduates Morsus Mihi 2	Posted - 2011.12.09 12:09:00 - [25] - Quote luvmehard wrote: Loraine Gess wrote: >Paladin >If you don't have AWU 5 Please go back to your EFTing thanks Your point being? People fly these things with AWU 4 all the time. Just like Falcons with Recon 4. Or logis with Logistics 4, etc. I am not one of them, I merely point out the obvious before some of the less intellectually fortunate runs back here, screaming "lies! this dun fit!". Can you please tell me how they do it? AWU5 is a prereq for the marauder skill.... Please dont talk about things you have no understanding of.
luvmehard Republic University Minmatar Republic 4	Posted - 2011.12.09 12:11:00 - [26] - Quote Mysteriax wrote: luvmehard wrote: Loraine Gess wrote: >Paladin >If you don't have AWU 5 Please go back to your EFTing thanks Your point being? People fly these things with AWU 4 all the time. Just like Falcons with Recon 4. Or logis with Logistics 4, etc. I am not one of them, I merely point out the obvious before some of the less intellectually fortunate runs back here, screaming "lies! this dun fit!". Can you please tell me how they do it? AWU5 is a prereq for the marauder skill.... Please dont talk about things you have no understanding of. Facepalm, foot -in-mouth, etc. ... Mea culpa! Ok, back to the coffee machine... Please support my proposal for LP relocation! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=30500
Korvus Falek Depraved Corruption 0	Posted - 2011.12.10 04:45:00 - [27] - Quote luvmehard wrote: Mysteriax wrote: luvmehard wrote: Loraine Gess wrote: >Paladin >If you don't have AWU 5 Please go back to your EFTing thanks Your point being? People fly these things with AWU 4 all the time. Just like Falcons with Recon 4. Or logis with Logistics 4, etc. I am not one of them, I merely point out the obvious before some of the less intellectually fortunate runs back here, screaming "lies! this dun fit!". Can you please tell me how they do it? AWU5 is a prereq for the marauder skill.... Please dont talk about things you have no understanding of. Facepalm, foot -in-mouth, etc. ... Mea culpa! Ok, back to the coffee machine... I said it first at top of page 2 =P
darkdooku Malicious Mission Murderers 5	Posted - 2012.01.13 14:40:00 - [28] - Quote Korvus Falek wrote: Im curious what your thoughts on this fit would be. Yes, its exspensive, but I have money and dont mind throwing it out there for badass looking ships so ignore the pricetag shock please. Plus, I already have all of the imperial navy peices in my hangar and could use those instead of the deadspace stuff. I originally had mission specific hardeners instead of the heatsinks, however, I felt more dps is always good, so meh. Im not sure on the t2 riggings though, due to the small amount of added bonus they give for their cost compared to the t1 version. Also, would it be worth it to drop a cap recharger for a tracking computer?? In EFT with all 5 skills: tanks 746 on paper dps of 622 cap stable at 36% (which is perfect imo) Resists are: EM - 76.9% Thermal - 70% Kinetic - 71.7% Explosion - 69.8% Laser Scorch range of 45km+10km falloff Neut Range of 39km Web range of 28km, 36.4km if I feel like overheating Blazing fast speeds of up to 463 overheat, 347 normal [Bhaalgorn, Missions] Damage Control II Corpus A-Type Large Armor Repairer Corpus A-Type Large Armor Repairer Imperial Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane Imperial Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Gist A-Type 100MN Afterburner Federation Navy Stasis Webifier Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Corpus A-Type Heavy Nosferatu Corpus A-Type Heavy Nosferatu Corpus A-Type Heavy Nosferatu Large Anti-Kinetic Pump I Large Anti-Explosive Pump I Large Capacitor Control Circuit II Warrior II x5 Valkyrie II x5 I run a somewhat similar fit,(quite a fun ship for missions tbh). Though mine is slightly different, one Core X LAR versus 2 Core A, Deadspace EANMs, 2 mission hardeners in place of DCU and 2nd LAR, Core X-type AB, only one X-type NOS (42km range is worth the upgrade), rigs can vary, I found the overall best I can get with my fit is ROF rig, tank resist/trimark rig(your pref) , and CCC T1. The ship is cap stable with LAR and guns running with IN Multis, as long as your NOS'ing something, tank alone is cap stable, guns + web alone are cap stable(even with conflags). I can run every mission solo (with aggro control) no problem, Enemies Abound part 5 cuts it close and bonus room in AE I would be advised against soloing in my fit. Besides that a great ship, fun to fly, and definitely not cookie cutter.
Korvus Falek Black Rebel Rifter Club 5	Posted - 2012.01.13 18:29:00 - [29] - Quote @ darkdookou Thanks much for the tips to change the fit. I dont have it yet, but I recently got back into somer blinking, so I may aquire one soon. Legion for 44.5 misk and worm for 12.5 have been my best wins in the last day or so =P
Endeavour Starfleet Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 540	Posted - 2012.01.13 20:16:00 - [30] - Quote Triggers are everything in IVs. And sometimes there is no way to effectively tell what is the trigger. Do it wrong and you can have over 1000 incoming DPS in a heartbeat (Raw)

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