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Nu Wa	Posted - 2007.09.20 18:27:00 - [121] Edited by: Nu Wa on 20/09/2007 18:31:19 Edited by: Nu Wa on 20/09/2007 18:29:35 I flew the nighthawk with passive setup for a long time until I got active with the pithum-A booster and all. I would have to say the passive does come close to rival the active if you go all out in the low slots. But, I would like to add something to the discussion (don't know if anyone has already mentioned) That is the nature of passive shield tank. During a fight, the opponenet either breaks your max peak or it doesn't. But if the DPS does break the peak, it's all downhill from there, there is no recovering. He can have his dps cut to 50% (for lots of reasons: you moving out of his optimum, he ran outa cap/ammo, his buddy left etc.) and he would still be able to kill you. Not the case with the active tank. As long as you have the cap (nos threat isn't as great with the nerf?) you can jump back in with FULL tank boosting at anytime, even if you were at the last HP in structure. I guess what I was trying to say is that with active tank, your maximum tankable DPS stays same through out. Where passive tankable DPS is a bell curve, strongest at the peak but weak as crap after that point. Again, if opponent DPS breaks your max peak and get your shield to 0%,( and it will happen during pvp) you are screwed then because after that point a good frigate can probably finish you off.
Groves111 Antares Fleet Yards SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.24 06:49:00 - [122] I'm going to have to agree with Ferocious FeAr, I recently got my nighthawk and believe the nighthawk is a far better active tanked ship. It's got a 700m3 cargo hold, so plenty of 800's. Not to mention fitting a passive tank will gimp the ability to deal any a decent amount of damage or yet even solo pvp. Whilst a passive tank will do around 1000 dps, thats all it will do. I also find having an active tank you have more control over your ship tanking ability. Here are my 2 nighthawk fittings: Gang/Fleet PvP: Highs: 6 Heavy missile launcher II's(I mainly stock T2 kinetics and precisions and T1 of all damage types), 1 Small named neut(Thanks to the nos nerf) Meds: 1 Large shield booster II, Med electrochem injector(800's), 2 Invul II's, 1 EM hardener II Lows: 3 Ballistic Control Unit II's, 1 Damage control unit II, 1 Power diagnostic unit II Solo/Small Gang PvP: Highs: 6 Heavy missile launcher II's, 1 Small named neut Meds: 1 Large shield booster II, Med electrochem injector(800's), 1 Invul II's, 1 EM hardener II, 1 Warp Disruptor II Lows: 3 Ballistic Control Unit II's, 1 Damage control unit II, 1 Power diagnostic unit II Drones: Warrior II's These fittings tank around 530-560 DPS And deal around 530 DPS From What I've seen with EFT, using HAM's can get a nighthawks damage output to around 700DPS with drones but I've never tried this in practice. --- Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed dimensions of 400x120 pixels and filesize of 24000 bytes -Sahwoolo Etoophie ([email protected])
Aramendel Amarr Coreli Corporation Exuro Mortis	Posted - 2007.09.24 07:47:00 - [123] Originally by: LUKEC And warping back to fight with 1/3 shield is very bright. Unless you warped out with 0% shield you will be far above that by the time you warp in again. Quote: Active tanks have some advantages that can't exactly be included in quickfit. Arguing about pure numbers ... t2 with gang is better than passive, t2 with drugs is better than passive. What does passive have again? Apart from 2x bigger ship and more buffer that won't really save you anymore? Correction: t2 with gang where a vulture is running gangmods is better than passive. Or another fleet command ship. But only really those - because BCs and field commands can only run one link and that usually won't a shield boosting one.
SpinkTon Caldari Stronghold corp	Posted - 2007.09.24 11:29:00 - [124] Guys I have 2 questions. One question is the the advocates of the passive tanks and the other question is to the advocates of the active tank (note: all tech2 stuff listed) Ill start with the active tank Large booster cap injector 1 em 2 inv Versus Large booster cap injector 1 em 1 inv 1 shield amplifier To the passive advocates 2 large shield extenders 1 em 2 invulns Versus 2 large shield extenders 1 em 1 inv 1 shield recharger Thoughts? Thanks -Spink
Aramendel Amarr Coreli Corporation Exuro Mortis	Posted - 2007.09.24 12:27:00 - [125] Edited by: Aramendel on 24/09/2007 12:30:23 Thats pretty simple. At first glance at least. A 2nd invul gives you after stacking penalities 17.1% resistance for EM and 26.1% for the rest. In total an average damage reduction of 23.9% or a 31% stronger tank. Active: A t2 SBA gives a 36% boost to your tank. So the SBA will be better in terms of maximum regeneration. In numbers, you can permatank just with the LSB2 + SBA2 254 dps and with LSB2 and 2nd invul2 245 dps. However the additonal resistance of the invul will not only make each HP you rep more "worth" but also increase the "value" of your starting shield HP. The NH has after shield management 5 6006 shield hp. With the SBA setup that are normalized to 0% resistance average 18689 hp, with the 2nd invul setup 24542 hp. So an effective HP difference of 5853. This is a headstart you have to overtake with the bigger boost, but that takes time. Quite a lot actually - 11 minutes of continuos boosting with that setup. If you include a full HG crystal set, max gang bonuses inculding maxed vulture and 2 t2 duration rigs it takes 4 minutes of continuous boosting to get even. Considering that the invul seems a better option to me. Slightly smaller tank, but a such high effective HP increase that by the time you have boosted enough to get even the battle should be already over. Would only use the SBA2 if I had a deadspace booster. Passive: Invul. No competition. For the regeneration tank 1% resistance and 1% recharge has the same effect and a shield recharger 2 is only -15% while the invul2 has -23.9%. And the same issues with the value of your starting shield HP.
studyhard	Posted - 2007.09.24 12:47:00 - [126] y not 5x spr in bottom and e t2 large extenders and then 3 slots for whatever resists you like. add 2 purgers and you have over 200 regen per second seems like it would be a good setup to me
Gypsio III Darkness Inc.	Posted - 2007.09.24 13:48:00 - [127] Edited by: Gypsio III on 24/09/2007 13:51:59 Quote: y not 5x spr in bottom and e t2 large extenders and then 3 slots for whatever resists you like. add 2 purgers and you have over 200 regen per second seems like it would be a good setup to me It's a good tank, but it's no bloody good at anything else. No cap to run a gang mod, poor DPS, poor mobility and no tackle. It's just a complete waste of ship, really. It's the same problem as the Drake has - people get obsessed with putting the biggest tank possible on, without realising that the resultant ship is useless - just a big fat brick that sits there and does nothing. And any respectable gang has the DPS to break any passive Drake, so you're just left to last and then killed. I'm not a fan of passive Drakes in general - a long-range HM Drake is better off fitting ewar rather than tank, and a close-range HAM Drake has neither the PG or lowslots (after fitting BCS) to fit a viable passive tank.
Allestin Villimar	Posted - 2007.09.24 13:56:00 - [128] 6 heavy launchers with the rate of fire bonus will provide enough DPS to eat through most battleship tanks, and with that kind of tanking you can take on 3-4 battleships without much of an issue. It's not the best for medium-large warfare, no, but it's awesome for small scale.
studyhard	Posted - 2007.09.24 14:05:00 - [129] Edited by: studyhard on 24/09/2007 14:07:22 Originally by: Allestin Villimar 6 heavy launchers with the rate of fire bonus will provide enough DPS to eat through most battleship tanks, and with that kind of tanking you can take on 3-4 battleships without much of an issue. It's not the best for medium-large warfare, no, but it's awesome for small scale. ty for that i can handle alot of damage with this setup works the same on a drake altho i get alot better dps on the nighthawk plus it can tank thru a decent gatecamp with ease. went thru a 4 man camp comprised of 2 battleships a tackler and a deimos i think thats good enought for me the funny part ther ran away you might ask y. becuase i dont need cap and they do to run there tank eventualy i broke there tanks and they had to flee hahha 2 battleships a deimos and a interceptor running from a nighthawk isnt it grand. the bs were a apoc and a nos domi running t2 ogres. also i have no problem running l4 missions or staying alive to give group bonuses sorry that im a horrible typer btw :O also if i drop a lil regen i can run a warfare module if its needed.
Dakisha Mining Bytes Inc. Mass Destruction.	Posted - 2007.09.26 22:08:00 - [130] A passive tank on a nighthawk is just silly. Same as on a drake. Sod all DPS. Groves111 setup is the first sensible setup I've seen in this thread.
Allestin Villimar	Posted - 2007.09.26 23:16:00 - [131] And why would you choose either of them for DPS? Let's face it, a drake with T2 HAMs and 3 BCUs still won't be the king of the hill on damage, and neither will a nighthawk. Missiles just suck for sustained DPS. It's better to use a ship for the strengths it has than try and augment the ones it doesn't.
Dakisha Mining Bytes Inc. Mass Destruction.	Posted - 2007.09.26 23:55:00 - [132] Yes; why would you want DPS as a Caldari pilot. How silly of me.
Allestin Villimar	Posted - 2007.09.27 02:31:00 - [133] Because you can passively tank better than you can actively tank and get near identical DPS?
IceCreamMonster	Posted - 2007.09.27 02:40:00 - [134] Passive tanking blows whenever you are taking more DPS than your tank can handle. Then the damage you absorb till you blow is just the area under the curve. So what if you can manage 130/s passive regen on a passive tank? It's only for that particular moment. On the other hand, the 100/s active tank will be a flat line on the graph. The result of the integral will be much bigger for the active tank..... and in many cases, that will give you the time to either finish the enemy first or kill the tackler to warp away. Get out of quickfit because some of you are so caught up with that magical peak regen number that you are forgetting what happens to your tank when it's past that point.
Cavtrooper Caldari Greenspring	Posted - 2007.09.27 02:47:00 - [135] I like the setup Captin... Need a jump clone? Tired of jumping 30 jumps to hang out with friends? Try our new Jump Clone Service!
Allestin Villimar	Posted - 2007.09.27 04:30:00 - [136] Of course when you can get 300 /s, and your booster only restores for 120 a sec, I only have to be at peak regen for 4-5 seconds before I've equalled everything you'll restore in that entire bar. And if they can't break the tank, then they're just wasting ammo. Of course if you've got some heavy neuts on you you won't be tanking at all, whereas all I'm going to lose is about half the effect of my invuln field. Passive tanks aren't ideal for fleet battles, no, but no tank holds up to fleet battles. I'd rather have a ship virtually immune to 3-4 opponents that can't be neuter'd and save my ship with 40k shields for fleet battles. Don't just know what your ship is good at, know when to use it. Use a vulture for fleet battles since they get better gang bonuses and can strike from farther away anyway. Btw, if I was going to stop at 120 shields / sec with passive, I'd do this: 6x T2 Heavy Launcher, 1x Cloaking Device 2x T2 LSE, 1x T2 Shield Recharger, 1x DG Invuln Field, 1x DG passive EM Resist 3x BCU T2, 2x SPR T2 2x Core Defence Purger Rigs With level 5 skills and 5% implants that nets you around 117 / sec. EM is only resist below 81% at 74%, and I'm doing every bit as much damage as any other set up here. Oh, and did I mention that in order to get 120 shields per second with a booster you either have to use the best faction mods or fit multiple boosters? And that if you fit enough boosters and amps to equal that 117 / s regen, you can't fit a reasonable (meaning medium or larger) cap injector? Of course, even though you're boosting that much, you don't have the extenders (or capacitor) to boost for very long, assuming you aren't neutralized. In other words, it makes no sense not to passive tank this thing. You gain no benefit to actively tanking it since you have less shields, can't regen nearly as much, don't have the grid to fit cap injectors that will make any serious impact on your cap, and you gain no additional DPS.
port22 VeldSPAR Warriors	Posted - 2007.09.27 04:49:00 - [137] Originally by: Dakisha A passive tank on a nighthawk is just silly. Same as on a drake. Sod all DPS. Cause a Drake/Nighthawk are DPS boats... not. Originally by: Allestin Villimar And why would you choose either of them for DPS? Let's face it, a drake with T2 HAMs and 3 BCUs still won't be the king of the hill on damage, and neither will a nighthawk. Missiles just suck for sustained DPS. It's better to use a ship for the strengths it has than try and augment the ones it doesn't. And these ships strengths are passive tanks. Math doesnt lie. Originally by: Dakisha Yes; why would you want DPS as a Caldari pilot. How silly of me. Yes. Originally by: Allestin Villimar Because you can passively tank better than you can actively tank and get near identical DPS? No, passive tanking a NH takes a lot of its DPS. Originally by: IceCreamMonster Passive tanking blows whenever you are taking more DPS than your tank can handle. Then the damage you absorb till you blow is just the area under the curve. So what if you can manage 130/s passive regen on a passive tank? It's only for that particular moment. On the other hand, the 100/s active tank will be a flat line on the graph. The result of the integral will be much bigger for the active tank..... and in many cases, that will give you the time to either finish the enemy first or kill the tackler to warp away. Get out of quickfit because some of you are so caught up with that magical peak regen number that you are forgetting what happens to your tank when it's past that point. Correct me if im wrong, but any tank blows if your taking more damage than you can rep. Try over 200 shields a second (not 130 as you pointed out) at their peak regen. True, active tanks boost flat line, however, show me an active tank for a vulture/nighthawk that outperforms the uber passive tank on caldari commands without using extremely expensive faction/deadspace/officer gear. Passive tanks are a) cheaper than the faction/officer alternatives and b) superiour in the tanks in most situations. Yes your dps does suck, but you cant have your cake and eat it too unless you want to spend billions on your ship. Personally I use the passive tank on the NH for missions with a Domination Invuln field. Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Kinetic Deflection Amplifier II Magnetic Scattering Amplifier II Domination Invulnerability Field I Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II [empty high slot] Core Defence Field Purger I Core Defence Field Purger I Resists 68.8% EM 83.1% THERM 88.3% KIN 77.5% EXP - 13826 Shields Tanks: 100% EM - 624 DPS 100% THERM - 1154 DPS 100% KIN - 1665 DPS 100% EXP - 886 DPS Megathron (Therm/Kinetic 50/50) - 1363 DPS As expected, the vulture is even more impressive. Flame away Originally by: Temp Boi Port FTMFW Period.
Peanut Swsh Interstellar eXodus R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.09.27 04:53:00 - [138] I dunno if you guys have looked at this. But when you calculate the damage that an active tank Nighthawk can handle, you should also include the passive shield regen of the NH. Its probably not a huge amount of extra dps which can be tanked, but it is probably relevant to your discussions.
Gypsio III Darkness Inc.	Posted - 2007.09.27 08:09:00 - [139] Max skilled NH with 3x BCS II and HAMs will do, with 3% implants and drones, 756 DPS. That may not be king of the hill, but it's not exactly passive-Drake level either.
Dakisha Mining Bytes Inc. Mass Destruction.	Posted - 2007.09.27 08:38:00 - [140] Edited by: Dakisha on 27/09/2007 08:44:55 BC 5, CC 4, Heavy missile spec 4, rapid launch 5, warhead upgrades 4. edit: 6x Heavy Missile Launcher II ofc. ----------- non-bonused t2 fury, 1 bcu : 275 dps bonused t2 fury, 1 bcu : 330 dps non-bonused t2 fury, 1 bcu : 370 dps bonused t2 fury, 3 bcu's : 440dps Nuff said.
IceCreamMonster	Posted - 2007.09.27 11:17:00 - [141] You are still just seeing that "awesome" max regen number and not realizing your tanking ability is almost zero from armor to structure. When the shield is gone, you blow up very very quick, there is barely time to respond. "Correct me if im wrong, but any tank blows if your taking more damage than you can rep." Not any tank, tanking 2 minutes vs. 4 minutes means life and death. Ferocious was spot on, passives are mostly Drake converts with the mission runner mentality.
Gypsio III Darkness Inc.	Posted - 2007.09.27 12:30:00 - [142] Quote: A passive tank on a nighthawk is just silly. Same as on a drake. Sod all DPS. Slightly simplistic but the point is valid. Once you've fit HAM IIs and BCS IIs, neither Drake nor NH has the PG or lowslots to fit a viable passive tank. I'm not convinced there's much point tanking a small-gang HM Drake (aside from certain niche roles) when you can sit at range and use ewar instead, and arguably that holds for NH as well. Ok, a HAM NH loses the missile precision bonus, but that bonus is fairly rubbish, tbh.
Dakisha Mining Bytes Inc. Mass Destruction.	Posted - 2007.09.27 15:42:00 - [143] For comparison sake, I guess I should include the HAM dps also. BC 5, CS 4, Heavy Assault spec 4, rapid launch 5, warhead upgrades 4. Unbonused T2 rage, 1 BCU: 355 dps Bonused T2 rage, 1 BCU: 425 dps Unbonused T2 rage, 3 BCUs: 475 dps Bonused T2 rage, 3 BCUs: 570 dps I will concede that the HAM II DPS is a lot nicer than the Heavy II DPS with only 1 BCU - but it doesn't take much to tank a BS for 350dps.
Allestin Villimar	Posted - 2007.09.27 17:33:00 - [144] Originally by: IceCreamMonster You are still just seeing that "awesome" max regen number and not realizing your tanking ability is almost zero from armor to structure. When the shield is gone, you blow up very very quick, there is barely time to respond. And since you're not fitting armor plates or armor reps, I doubt you're going to last long enough to rep twice with a shield booster anyway.
port22 VeldSPAR Warriors	Posted - 2007.09.28 01:17:00 - [145] Edited by: port22 on 28/09/2007 01:23:48 EDITED TO INCLUDE DPS - And these setups do not take into account ANY implants to help tanking. Originally by: IceCreamMonster You are still just seeing that "awesome" max regen number and not realizing your tanking ability is almost zero from armor to structure. When the shield is gone, you blow up very very quick, there is barely time to respond. "Correct me if im wrong, but any tank blows if your taking more damage than you can rep." Not any tank, tanking 2 minutes vs. 4 minutes means life and death. Ferocious was spot on, passives are mostly Drake converts with the mission runner mentality. No offence but you wrote words with no meaning or valid point. You dont tank a drake to shield boost while taking armor or hull damage. Caldari ships go down faster than a *** on * once armor starts taking damage. The math speaks for itself, drakes/nh's/vultures/rattlesnakes make excellent passive tanks. Uber officer/deadspace tanks may be better but for the money, passive is superiour for tanking. This of course does not take into account dps, but as previously pointed out, caldari boats arent dps machines. Passive T2 Nighthawk Setup: (68% EM - 83% THERM - 88% KIN - 77% EXP) 67,232 Effective Shields - 194 shields/sec@peak 81,402 Effective Hitpoints Total 291 DPS Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Kinetic Deflection Amplifier II Magnetic Scattering Amplifier II Domination Invulnerability Field Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II [empty high slot] Core Defence Field Purger I Core Defence Field Purger I Active T2 Nighthawk Setup: (75% EM - 88% THERM - 85% KIN - 84% EXP) 39,960 Effective Shields - 81.6 shields/sec@flat 54,130 Effective Hitpoints Total 428 DPS Capacitor Flux Coil II Capacitor Flux Coil II Capacitor Flux Coil II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Large Shield Booster II Shield Boost Amplifier II Invulnerability Field II Invulnerability Field II Magnetic Scattering Amplifier II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II [empty high slot] Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I Originally by:** Temp Boi Port FTMFW Period.
Weeka Amarr Imperial Shipment	Posted - 2007.09.28 05:38:00 - [146] Originally by: port22 stuff Capacitor Flux Coil II Capacitor Flux Coil II Capacitor Flux Coil II more stuff Any reason you throw away cap, and don't use capacitor power relays?
port22 VeldSPAR Warriors	Posted - 2007.09.28 08:05:00 - [147] Originally by: Weeka Originally by: port22 stuff Capacitor Flux Coil II Capacitor Flux Coil II Capacitor Flux Coil II more stuff Any reason you throw away cap, and don't use capacitor power relays? Cap Power Relays affect your shield boost amount, therefore limiting your tank. Multiply that by a factor of 3 and yeah.... Originally by: Temp Boi Port FTMFW Period.
Gypsio III Darkness Inc.	Posted - 2007.09.28 08:52:00 - [148] Quote: This of course does not take into account dps, but as previously pointed out, caldari boats arent dps machines. Not when you waste those low slots on SPRs, no... 6x HAM II Photon II Inv II LSB II SBA II medium electro cap booster DC II RCU II 3x BCS II 5x hobgoblin IIs 2x Core Defence Operational Solidifier WIth max skills and 3% damage and ROF implants, EFT says: 756 DPS Tanks 707 DPS, cap dies in 6 mins 17 secs (mainly because of rigs) People generally won't primary a NH, because they assume it has a stupid big passive tank and feeble DPS, just like the standard PVE Drake fit. So stop wasting those slots and surprise them.
Weeka Amarr Imperial Shipment	Posted - 2007.09.28 09:59:00 - [149] Originally by: port22 Cap Power Relays affect your shield boost amount, therefore limiting your tank. Multiply that by a factor of 3 and yeah.... I stand corrected
IceCreamMonster	Posted - 2007.09.28 19:54:00 - [150] Originally by: port22 Edited by: port22 on 28/09/2007 01:35:15 Edited by: port22 on 28/09/2007 01:23:48 EDITED TO INCLUDE DPS - And these setups do not take into account ANY implants to help tanking. Originally by: IceCreamMonster You are still just seeing that "awesome" max regen number and not realizing your tanking ability is almost zero from armor to structure. When the shield is gone, you blow up very very quick, there is barely time to respond. "Correct me if im wrong, but any tank blows if your taking more damage than you can rep." Not any tank, tanking 2 minutes vs. 4 minutes means life and death. Ferocious was spot on, passives are mostly Drake converts with the mission runner mentality. No offence but you wrote words with no meaning or valid point. You dont tank a drake to shield boost while taking armor or hull damage. Caldari ships go down faster than a *** on * once armor starts taking damage. The math speaks for itself, drakes/nh's/vultures/rattlesnakes make excellent passive tanks. Uber officer/deadspace tanks may be better but for the money, passive is superiour for tanking. This of course does not take into account dps, but as previously pointed out, caldari boats arent dps machines. Passive T2 Nighthawk Setup: (68% EM - 83% THERM - 88% KIN - 77% EXP) 67,232 Effective Shields - 194 shields/sec@peak 81,402 Effective Hitpoints Total 291 DPS Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Kinetic Deflection Amplifier II Magnetic Scattering Amplifier II Domination Invulnerability Field Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II [empty high slot] Core Defence Field Purger I Core Defence Field Purger I Active T2 Nighthawk Setup: (75% EM - 88% THERM - 85% KIN - 84% EXP) 39,960 Effective Shields - 81.6+15.5(97.1) shields/sec@flat 54,130 Effective Hitpoints Total** 428 DPS Capacitor Flux Coil II Capacitor Flux Coil II Capacitor Flux Coil II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Large Shield Booster II Shield Boost Amplifier II Invulnerability Field II Invulnerability Field II Magnetic Scattering Amplifier II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II [empty high slot] Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I I'm not offended, we are just here dicussing about a game, but I think you guys missed my point when I mentioned the armor+sturcture damage. Once damage gets to armor+sturcture, your tank at that point is: Passive: 1) armor hp with resistance 2) structure hp with 0% resistance (passive tank can't afford damage control II if you want to maintain the same DPS) 3) shield regen at 0% with shield resistance Active tank: 1) armor hp with resistance 2) structure hp with 60% resistance (Damage control II) 3) full shield boosting with shield resistance. See the difference? Every chunk of hp the enemy takes out of armor or sturcture, he would have to fight the cycle of full shield boosting on the active tank, hence a "flat-line" tank through out on the graph. This means it is just as hard to eat through active tank's armor + structure as it is to eat through it's shield, because it's shield tank is still there working fully when in armor and structure! Also, passive tank suffer from "moonsize signature" radius. But I think we all know that. I don't know how much it affects the damage taken because it is very situational. We DO know it certainly does not help the tank. A lot of time in these situations, what matters is effective hp. I don't have any numbers on passive vs. active effective hp in comparison, but I will check the numbers when I get home from work.

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