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Merchantigus	Posted - 2006.12.02 00:20:00 - [1] Edited by: Merchantigus on 02/12/2006 00:46:17 And you thought this was going to be a flame I'm going to post few tips on how not to get ganked. these are very simple and easily done. these are not made of stone but work in general vs most of the current pirate population. 1. Bring a wing man. pirates like to fight when the odds are stacked in their favor. one cruiser/bc/insert ship here alone will eventually get attacked but even if you are both pve equiped the solo pirate will find someone else. Even if you do still get attacked the odds of one of you being able to hit the right range for your guns while he yarrs the other one are quite high. 2. Come setup for pvp This is the best option and if coupled with #1 there are very few pirates that wont end up jumping out. Someone coined the phrase "CareBear with teeth". Most pirates have their mid slots jammed with crap and have much weaker setups/ships than the people they fight. shove it right back up their yarrhole and see how many pirates are around in a month. 3. Avoid obvious gate camps. Since kali and wtz it takes a whole lot of effort and atleast a few wingmen to gatecamp. if you see an area on your path with podkills it's prolly more than just a single noob with a sniper setup. consider this a flagged mine field and simply go around. 4. DO NOT GO MINING WITHOUT AN ESCORT! people do this and then come whine about pirates on the forum and this boggles the mind...would you try to mine/drive a convoy full of gold in/through the middle of iraq alone? :In general: If you ignore these things expect to get ganked to high heavens. if you jump into a shark tank coverd with steaks in the buff you had it comming. Why as a pirate would i post tips on how to avoid death? To much wine not enough cheese to go around lets just say. If people did the above 4 things it would prevent most of the pirate ganks some seem to hate so much. :A note on pirates in general: Many Many of the pirates out there only exist because people make it so easy. if a noob went out for some "wtfgankage" and instead of finding hoards of easy kills he ran into angry bears the pirate population would drop in size very quickly. This game has brought a new breed of carebear and it warms my heart to see some of the li'll fellas taking up arms and fighting back. Most gate campers are spineless noobs that are to lazy/bad at fighting to belt hunt(there are exceptions of corse, snig gardly and such waves). with wtz in place there has already been a drop in gate camps and the numbers will just keep going down untill only the organized real pirates are left. the same thing would happen to belt hunting as well if the prey fought back more often. All i'm going to say enjoy edit also in many games the pvpers hate the carebears with a dark passion because they usually fight to destroy pvp. eve is not like this though. the smart pvpers/pirates have figured out that those spiffy ships and guns they so love to use come from the bears and the bears have figure out that without the pvpers they would have no market. sure if all the pvpers dropped off the face of the universe there would still be a sale here or there to people ratting but there is alot of blood spilt every hour and that blood directly translates to profit for the merchants and the likes. eve is a bloodthirsty game and the more that is shed the faster people get wealthy. it's a beautifull thing edit [b]This post is not about probes or the "issues" people may or may not have with kali. please post those types of things in the many burning threads throughout the forums and leave my little post in peace.[b] piracy is cool in game thread piracy is not ;)
Synapse Archae Amarr Solarflare Heavy Industries	Posted - 2006.12.02 00:26:00 - [2] All of this is true but it misses the point. 1) Missions are one of the last bastions of solo content in the game. Lets face it, if anything eve needs MORE soloable content. People do not always want or have time to fly with friends. 2) If you bring 1 person, youre dividing mission rewards by 2. Bring 5, and you divide by 5. How long until its more profitable (even less boring, for those guarding you) to mine veldspar? Not long. 3) If you come setup for PVP, the mission may take twice as long, doubling the risk that a pirate will come engage you. They already know what ship youre in and what damage you have to tank before coming. It honestly doesnt matter what your fitting is if your enemy knows exactly what it is before arriving. - - - These elite slaves are exceptionally well suited for physical labor.
Merchantigus	Posted - 2006.12.02 00:31:00 - [3] Edited by: Merchantigus on 02/12/2006 00:36:31 "1) Missions are one of the last bastions of solo content in the game. Lets face it, if anything eve needs MORE soloable content. People do not always want or have time to fly with friends." I wasn't speaking about the new missions and probes and such plenty of flame flying around already. dont need more here pls. "the point" is that this is about low sec in general not the new "issues" kali brought. want to fight about probes please find another thread "2) If you bring 1 person, youre dividing mission rewards by 2. Bring 5, and you divide by 5. How long until its more profitable (even less boring, for those guarding you) to mine veldspar? Not long." (missions/probes again not the topic) "3) If you come setup for PVP, the mission may take twice as long, doubling the risk that a pirate will come engage you. They already know what ship youre in and what damage you have to tank before coming. It honestly doesnt matter what your fitting is if your enemy knows exactly what it is before arriving. " If you were setup for pvp you wouldn't be set up for a certian type of damage and would give him a nasty suprise when he found you. once again though this isn't about missions/probes but low/no sec in general. edit and to possibly head you off at the pass "Missions are one of the last bastions of solo content in the game" implying that "the last bastion" has changed/is in peril and thus probes again. i'm not sure what you would of said next but i'm getting really tired of friggen probe threads so i'ma try and steer this one clear preemptivly
Caedicus Minmatar Einherjar Rising Dusk and Dawn	Posted - 2006.12.02 00:34:00 - [4] Good post, OP. These are some of the things people need to do in order to adapt, instead of whining about it on the forums. The only things that need to be added is to prevent the looting of mission items, and missions that give rewards to a gang or corp.
Patch86 Di-Tron Heavy Industries Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2006.12.02 00:36:00 - [5] Its good advice. I've never, ever, ever in my entire EVE life fitted a "PVE Setup"- that is, a setup that is totally gimped against anything but the one racial type of NPC I'll be facing. I've always ratted and mission ran in setup's I'd be happy to PvP in, from day one of noob-dom. Most pirates that attack me I've given a run for their money- one time I even managed to dend off an experienced Geddon pilot in my lil' old Brutix (albeit with several running attempts, and eventually helped by the gate sentries that I'd gotten to). Fighting in a setup with nothing but Kinetic resists because you're in Gurista space is suicide- you deserve to be killed if you do that. Low sec is not solo territory, you're right in that. Unless you're dead confident (and prepared to risk a ship or two) always travel with friends. it's a no brainer. If you travel solo, do so on the complete understanding that you might die at any moment, and be happy about it- don't be surprised or angry when you get ambushed. -----------------------------------------------
Utoxin Kydance Radiant Industries Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.12.02 00:36:00 - [6] I'm a carebear through and through. And I've decided that 0.0 is the safest place for me. Low population, and with the new standings icons visible on chat, I can tell easily if someone jumping into system is an ally or not. I can rat and mine to my heart's content, and there's hardly anyone to bother me. Heck, me and my corp mates have been hunting down hidden deadspaces and having fun with them.
Merchantigus	Posted - 2006.12.02 00:38:00 - [7] Edited by: Merchantigus on 02/12/2006 00:55:32 thanks i love you guys pls make me more ships XD edit i've been reflecting for the past couple of mins. i still have a truckload of hatred for the "carebears" but as much as i've grown to hate them over the years i have an equal amount of love the the "anrgy bears". those that have begun to adapt i welcome as brothers and that's saying something comming from me
Merchantigus	Posted - 2006.12.02 06:17:00 - [8] bump. sorry i want everyone to see this
Azerrad InExile	Posted - 2006.12.02 06:26:00 - [9] Originally by: Caedicus Good post, OP. These are some of the things people need to do in order to adapt, instead of whining about it on the forums. The majority of low sec mission runners are adapting.... they're moving to high sec.
Malena Panic Gallente Acme Technologies Incorporated Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2006.12.02 06:55:00 - [10] Originally by: Azerrad InExile The majority of low sec mission runners are adapting.... they're moving to high sec. You've talked to them all already? Say hi for me!
Miss Overlord Gallente Ferrum Pugnus New Eve Order	Posted - 2006.12.02 07:13:00 - [11] and ppl like me are scanning them in empire and dropping in for a visit to loot - kill their rats and generally harass em - this game is a pure PVP type game missions and mining etc are simply resource gathering - good to see CCP made it stronger on the PVP Focus less carebears back to wow These posts represent my personal views and not those of my corp or alliance. These do not reflect offical alliance or corp views This is a disclaimer
Shameless Avenger	Posted - 2006.12.02 07:27:00 - [12] Originally by: Miss Overlord and ppl like me are scanning them in empire and dropping in for a visit to loot - kill their rats and generally harass em - this game is a pure PVP type game missions and mining etc are simply resource gathering - good to see CCP made it stronger on the PVP Focus less carebears back to wow I have to disagree. Since the beginning Eve was advertised as a place where you could PVP but could also do a lot of other things. Just think about it, for a second and ask yourself, how many BPOs do you have? But you do like to PVP right? Who makes your ships? Your modules? Those skills not sold by NPCs, where do they come from? The minerals for all your ammoà where did it came from? Who hauled it? EVE is not a ôPure PVPö. If all players were ôPure PVPiersö the gameÆs economy will halt. Miners are needed, Haulers are needed, Mission Runners are needed, Manufacturers are needed, Researchers are needed, Traders are needed.
Kiyano	Posted - 2006.12.02 07:29:00 - [13] Originally by: Merchantigus Edited by: Merchantigus on 02/12/2006 00:46:17 Someone coined the phrase "CareBear with teeth". That wouldn't have been me would it? I've never seen anyone else use it but used it here a few days ago >.> Always wanted to coin me own phrase lol.
Miss Overlord Gallente Ferrum Pugnus New Eve Order	Posted - 2006.12.02 07:31:00 - [14] Originally by: Shameless Avenger Originally by: Miss Overlord and ppl like me are scanning them in empire and dropping in for a visit to loot - kill their rats and generally harass em - this game is a pure PVP type game missions and mining etc are simply resource gathering - good to see CCP made it stronger on the PVP Focus less carebears back to wow I have to disagree. Since the beginning Eve was advertised as a place where you could PVP but could also do a lot of other things. Just think about it, for a second and ask yourself, how many BPOs do you have? But you do like to PVP right? Who makes your ships? Your modules? Those skills not sold by NPCs, where do they come from? The minerals for all your ammoà where did it came from? Who hauled it? EVE is not a ôPure PVPö. If all players were ôPure PVPiersö the gameÆs economy will halt. Miners are needed, Haulers are needed, Mission Runners are needed, Manufacturers are needed, Researchers are needed, Traders are needed. but we all need more kill points for the killboards but yes no one should be sheltered from PVP after being in the game 6 months . Being able to probe drop in and basically loot or kill mission runners NPCs has always happened admitadly took longer before as probes are now more efficent. It happens in 0.0 and low sec its a part of the game and CCP endorse it within the rules 100% so im just providing a counter point to the whiny carebears Of course we cant pod em in high sec so their implants are safe but this isnt an instanced game like wow were dungeons fo PVE are safe this is Eve where PVP happens all the time ( suicide ganks are legal) and if i loot some misison runners can they dont need to engage. They and any corp or gang buddies in system do get 15 minutes to kill me perhaps the OP should join a corp of mission runners who can help each other out and warp in on me or anyone else engaging in the Probe dorp in and PVP tactics its been happenng in belts etc and war decs for ages These posts represent my personal views and not those of my corp or alliance. These do not reflect offical alliance or corp views This is a disclaimer
Mallikanth Minmatar	Posted - 2006.12.02 07:56:00 - [15] Oh yesss.....I'm all for us carebears being up for some fun. Although I often out run / out tank / out smart a pirate or gank and of course don't always get away with it it is still that part of eve that gives me a rush and my heart starts to pound. Long may eve have pirates and gankers (yep! I said it ) Now as for the OP advice, on the whole he's right. Common sense, good ship choice for the job, selective route planning and of course suitable ship fitting all makes you more survivable. If you wanna carry 50+mils worth of cargo ina T1 Indy on autopilot then what do you expect? Get my drift? Meanwhile back to my carebear (mostly solo) activities. The difference between a thing that might go wrong and a thing that cannot possibly go wrong is that when a thing that cannot possibly go wrong goes wrong, it usually turns out to be impossible
Galk Gallente Autumn Tactics All the things she said	Posted - 2006.12.02 08:07:00 - [16] Originally by: Miss Overlord no one should be sheltered from PVP after being in the game 6 months . Being able to probe drop in and basically loot or kill mission runners NPCs has always happened admitadly took longer before as probes are now more efficent. By more efficient, you mean you can find people in crowded highsec systems Since you admit in another thread you do this simpley harrass people by ruining there missions in high sec, i realy think ccp should take a look at this. Game should indeed cater to pvp, but not griefers. ______
Merchantigus	Posted - 2006.12.02 08:10:00 - [17] Originally by: Kiyano Originally by: Merchantigus Edited by: Merchantigus on 02/12/2006 00:46:17 Someone coined the phrase "CareBear with teeth". That wouldn't have been me would it? I've never seen anyone else use it but used it here a few days ago >.> Always wanted to coin me own phrase lol. I think it was actually. and i now have one "angry bears" lets see if they catch on. our new brothers need a proper name.
Miss Overlord Gallente Ferrum Pugnus New Eve Order	Posted - 2006.12.02 08:10:00 - [18] Originally by: Galk Originally by: Miss Overlord no one should be sheltered from PVP after being in the game 6 months . Being able to probe drop in and basically loot or kill mission runners NPCs has always happened admitadly took longer before as probes are now more efficent. By more efficient, you mean you can find people in crowded highsec systems Since you admit in another thread you do this simpley harrass people by ruining there missions in high sec, i realy think ccp should take a look at this. Game should indeed cater to pvp, but not griefers. without going into detail ive checked this with the devs and with the looting can theif marking systems in place its perfectly legal - its really the same as stealing someones jetcan when they are mining they have the ability to fight back Of course ill be shouted down by all the lazy players that dont like loosing stuff but if u stop this stle of play ie finding and playing PVP with mission runners in high sec u must also empire wars, can theif ore stealing, suicide ganking etc etc. SO i ask u this should the 4 things i just mentioned that have been ingame for a while shoudl they all be banned as well as well as any PVP within empire - that would also rule out factional warfare and other CCP ideas - i suggest u wake up These posts represent my personal views and not those of my corp or alliance. These do not reflect offical alliance or corp views This is a disclaimer
Merchantigus	Posted - 2006.12.02 08:14:00 - [19] NO fighting over missions damnit XD no! bad peoples! there's like 30 post bickering about all that nooooes no more :)
Miss Overlord Gallente Ferrum Pugnus New Eve Order	Posted - 2006.12.02 08:15:00 - [20] alternative non carebear views are needed here to keep things balanced otherwise eve will cease to be a PVP game and be a PVE shoot em up like WOW Common pirates get with me lets balance things out a bit These posts represent my personal views and not those of my corp or alliance. These do not reflect offical alliance or corp views This is a disclaimer
Merchantigus	Posted - 2006.12.02 08:17:00 - [21] Edited by: Merchantigus on 02/12/2006 08:19:20 Originally by: Miss Overlord alternative non carebear views are needed here to keep things balanced otherwise eve will cease to be a PVP game and be a PVE shoot em up like WOW Common pirates get with me lets balance things out a bit if people want to see both sides of that argument there are zillions of post elsewhere. the second that geddamn topic is mentiond the post instanly catches fire and burns to the ground. no not here no more fighting over freggen missions please. stay on topic nooooo moooooorrrreee fighting over missions. find another thread. that's not just at you. that's at everyone that view this. i will have a single positive thread to read from time to time so help me
Miss Overlord Gallente Ferrum Pugnus New Eve Order	Posted - 2006.12.02 08:18:00 - [22] u could go run afk courier missions thro high sec with a level 4 agent thas about as risk free as u can get - abuot as boring as what the carebear dont touch me empire dwellers are whinig about ( oh hte faction gains are quicker to with warp to 0km) These posts represent my personal views and not those of my corp or alliance. These do not reflect offical alliance or corp views This is a disclaimer
Merchantigus	Posted - 2006.12.02 08:20:00 - [23] Edited by: Merchantigus on 02/12/2006 08:21:16 i have no idea what you just said but it best not be about missions or something >:( trots off to smoke
Miss Overlord Gallente Ferrum Pugnus New Eve Order	Posted - 2006.12.02 08:22:00 - [24] Originally by: Merchantigus Edited by: Merchantigus on 02/12/2006 08:21:16 i have no idea what you just said but it best not be about missions or something >:( trots off to smoke its about hauling missions the ultimate carebear experience These posts represent my personal views and not those of my corp or alliance. These do not reflect offical alliance or corp views This is a disclaimer
Tension	Posted - 2006.12.02 09:03:00 - [25] Originally by: Miss Overlord <usual stream of absolute gibberish> For god's sake, just stop posting.
darklegionca	Posted - 2006.12.02 09:12:00 - [26] even with escorts in iraq they get ganked daily so it would be the same thing in eve so ya ------------------------------------ darklegionca - One name. One legend.
Esaka Caldari	Posted - 2006.12.02 09:13:00 - [27] Originally by: Tension Originally by: Miss Overlord <usual stream of absolute gibberish> For god's sake, just stop posting. QFT -------------------------------------- Agent & Mission-Info: http://www.eveinfo.com Evewide Market-Info: http://eve-central.com/
Nanobotter Mk2	Posted - 2006.12.02 10:38:00 - [28] No offense merchantigus but you are one of the biggest carebears in eve. You lack the fortitude to engange in real pvp so you gank people in ships not able to pvp. When you are ready to stop being a carebear head out for some real pvp, then come back and talk crap on the boards k?
Draconia Blackheart Disciples of the Underverse	Posted - 2006.12.02 12:53:00 - [29] Originally by: Utoxin I'm a carebear through and through. And I've decided that 0.0 is the safest place for me. Low population, and with the new standings icons visible on chat, I can tell easily if someone jumping into system is an ally or not. I can rat and mine to my heart's content, and there's hardly anyone to bother me. Heck, me and my corp mates have been hunting down hidden deadspaces and having fun with them. Once scanners hit the place, have fun while you can. ---
Ghoest	Posted - 2006.12.02 12:59:00 - [30] The original post is worthless. We all know that stuff. The problem we have is low sec missions are no longer profitable in terms of isk and faction. Its that simple. And given the ease of current ganking I dont think you could make low sec profitable barring that you make them worth while for large gangfs to run together(something like a 10x increase.) Wherever you went - here you are.
Cez	Posted - 2006.12.02 13:02:00 - [31] Edited by: Cez on 02/12/2006 13:03:19 I wouldnt call myself a carebear, cuz that term is so pathetic and quite frankly, more pirates can be more carebears than all mission goers. Its true, the only solo game play left is running a mission... thanks tho for CCP to take it away. A few scans and now you're forced to pvp. High sec is still safe... but I think you'll now have less going to low sec for missions, knowing a ganker is a probe scan away. Its one thing to try and beat gate camps... but being found in deadspace missions... thats wrong. I believe it totally neglects what deadspace is supposed to be.
Agrias Hellion Diligentia Sodalitas	Posted - 2006.12.02 13:52:00 - [32] OP most already know this. If they don't they are new and will learn quickly if they don't well they deserve to be ganked. Originally by: Miss Overlord and ppl like me are scanning them in empire and dropping in for a visit to loot - kill their rats and generally harass em - this game is a pure PVP type game missions and mining etc are simply resource gathering - good to see CCP made it stronger on the PVP Focus less carebears back to wow You seriously need to get over yourself. People should be allowed to play a game they pay for the way they want to too, without griefers such as yourself. Mission content is there for solo players. The fact you band people into two groups really shows how ignorant you are.
Itono	Posted - 2006.12.02 17:27:00 - [33] the moment this game becomes impossible to solo play is the moment i quit. I believe quite strongly I'm not the only one. I am quite concerned, because I like eve, and I hate bloody dwarfs and elves, but this expansion has done so many things wrong (contracts, scanning, wrecks) and so few right - at least from the solo player, carebear missionrunner pov - that I'm starting to wonder. There comes a moment when the creators of a game become too disconnected with the actual game population (forums being not necessarily representative) and they no longer have a clue what they're doing. I hope this is not the beginning of the end of eve. And before you ask, no, you can't have my stuff.
000Hunter000 Gallente The Lookers	Posted - 2006.12.02 17:40:00 - [34] i know it's not about missions, but there might be a relative easy solution for that, npc rats in missions are usually somewhat different from regular beltrats allready, why not make it so if someone else warps in to your mission and starts shooting at your rats they get flagged to the original missionholder (unless that person is in your corp/gang) like how it is with cans now, someone steals your cans and gets flagged, someone shoots at your npc's and gets flagged. it will prolly mean more pvp even Resized tag... hope this pleases the tag ninjas from ccp :p
Mary Wan	Posted - 2006.12.02 18:04:00 - [35] Edited by: Mary Wan on 02/12/2006 18:03:59 Solo mission runners add nothing to the game.
DefJam101 Gallente Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate	Posted - 2006.12.02 18:06:00 - [36] Originally by: Shameless Avenger Originally by: Miss Overlord and ppl like me are scanning them in empire and dropping in for a visit to loot - kill their rats and generally harass em - this game is a pure PVP type game missions and mining etc are simply resource gathering - good to see CCP made it stronger on the PVP Focus less carebears back to wow I have to disagree. Since the beginning Eve was advertised as a place where you could PVP but could also do a lot of other things. Just think about it, for a second and ask yourself, how many BPOs do you have? But you do like to PVP right? Who makes your ships? Your modules? Those skills not sold by NPCs, where do they come from? The minerals for all your ammoà where did it came from? Who hauled it? EVE is not a ôPure PVPö. If all players were ôPure PVPiersö the gameÆs economy will halt. Miners are needed, Haulers are needed, Mission Runners are needed, Manufacturers are needed, Researchers are needed, Traders are needed. EVE has more than enough miners and missionrunners and manufacturers, it's the PvPers that are outnumbered. Don't believe me? Look at your map. ***
Lord Frost Minmatar The Crystal Method	Posted - 2006.12.02 18:32:00 - [37] Originally by: DefJam101 EVE has more than enough miners and missionrunners and manufacturers, it's the PvPers that are outnumbered. Don't believe me? Look at your map. I believe you... then again, the map could be skewed from all the gank wars in Empire with everyone who wants to PvP forcing others to PvP for the fun of it. Heheh.. I made a funny.
Seine State War Academy	Posted - 2006.12.02 18:47:00 - [38] But I don't wnat to pvp. All the tips and advice in the world aren't going to make me WANT to pvp... For my money missions and manufacturing are the best parts of this game.
Genericforumalt Minmatar Republic University	Posted - 2006.12.02 18:56:00 - [39] PO: mayb ppl would listn to you more if you wern't so condecending
Merchantigus Minmatar Riot Zone	Posted - 2006.12.02 18:59:00 - [40] Edited by: Merchantigus on 02/12/2006 19:05:41 "No offense merchantigus but you are one of the biggest carebears in eve. You lack the fortitude to engange in real pvp so you gank people in ships not able to pvp. When you are ready to stop being a carebear head out for some real pvp, then come back and talk crap on the boards k?" hey Flame bait, go kill yourself your wasting my air "Once scanners hit the place, have fun while you can." shut the @#%# up about missions and probes "The original post is worthless. We all know that stuff." Obviously not and shut the @#$@# up about missions and probes "PO: mayb ppl would listn to you more if you wern't so condecending" It's op and jesus hates you
Ghoest	Posted - 2006.12.02 20:04:00 - [41] Originally by: Merchantigus Edited by: Merchantigus on 02/12/2006 19:05:41 "No offense merchantigus but you are one of the biggest carebears in eve. You lack the fortitude to engange in real pvp so you gank people in ships not able to pvp. When you are ready to stop being a carebear head out for some real pvp, then come back and talk crap on the boards k?" hey Flame bait, go kill yourself your wasting my air "Once scanners hit the place, have fun while you can." shut the @#%# up about missions and probes "The original post is worthless. We all know that stuff." Obviously not and shut the @#$@# up about missions and probes "PO: mayb ppl would listn to you more if you wern't so condecending" It's op and jesus hates you That post doesnt even make coherent sense. Wherever you went - here you are.
Mnengli Noiliffe	Posted - 2006.12.02 20:44:00 - [42] lol@op. how would you like a carebear's post that would try to teach a pvpers and griefers to play at non-pvp wow server? it'd be so much ridiculous and funny that you cant even imagine it right? Well you post looks exactly the same to any true carebear you're trying to "upbring" to pvper level. The true carebear is carebear for the following resons (maybe along with some others): 1. He does not want to get into a corp because he hates responsability (when he must ever do anything that he himself didn't feel like to do) which any community requires. So sorry, no ganging, no corping, never ever. Maybe spontanious, but such cases don't repeat frequently as pvpers, after such spontaneous gangin, form corps and somewhere else. 2. He does not draw ANY, ANY AT ALL pleasure from blowing up another player. NOT FCKING ANY PLEASURE!! if he killed innocent (to him) victim, he feels a sort of guilt, if he killed in defence, he feels regret for wasted ammo and time. NOTHING ELSE AT ALL. No desire of repeating this useless experience remains. So you see all you're here promoting is against the spirit of true carebear, which would rather quit eve than adapt to those changes that would make his gaming experience more like unsatisfying job, NOT a game he plays for enjoyment. And why would anyone pay for a job he does? So go bring your suggestions to those who are already pvpers, although I bet they don't need them. Nothing really brilliant or new you know. You may or may not believe me, you may hope that carebears will change and adapt. But let the online statistics for coming months show us who was right.
Soporo	Posted - 2006.12.02 20:45:00 - [43] Edited by: Soporo on 02/12/2006 20:51:23 Quote: Solo mission runners add nothing to the game. This is so because you SAY so? Feel free to try and rationalize that thought... Anyway, I liked the Ops post and appreciate it. Sounds like one of those guys who dislikes random n00b ganking and other cheesy easy ganking. Dude wants people to get a grip, if nothing else it will make life more interesting for lazy/incompetent pie rats in low IF people take his advice. The post above mine has a point though, a TRUE hardcore CB avoids pvp usually and just has no interest in it. A lot of people however are industrialists and generalists and are willing to take up arms if they feel thay have a reasonable chance to win through. This post is best aimed at them. <--
Merchantigus Minmatar Riot Zone	Posted - 2006.12.02 21:40:00 - [44] Edited by: Merchantigus on 02/12/2006 21:46:19 Edited by: Merchantigus on 02/12/2006 21:44:09 "A lot of people however are industrialists and generalists and are willing to take up arms if they feel thay have a reasonable chance to win through. This post is best aimed at them." indeed :) also to the other dude. a "true carebear" may not enjoy the combat but he sure as hell enjoys all the yummy isk to be made out there I know this because many moons ago i was a miner in a small production corp. i hated pirates and so did all the others in my corp but we made some sexy money out there and that made it worth it. If no one in your corp can fight worth a sod hire a few pilots that can. 1 battleship will keep away or kill most of the noobs out there and for that 1 extra body you can bring in some serious money. You could buy minerals in high sec. you could pay someone to haul it for you or you could just go get them yourselves. Hard to beat the price of free. to each his own though
Itono	Posted - 2006.12.02 23:16:00 - [45] Originally by: Mary Wan Edited by: Mary Wan on 02/12/2006 18:03:59 Solo mission runners add nothing to the game. ok, so then ccp should just fire me right? Oh wait, it's _me_ paying them... So I don't give crap whether I add something to the game _for you_ or not. I just stated the fact: if soloing the game becomes impossible, that's it for me and I believe for other people as well. I have tried 0.0, I have tried pvp. I didn't like it for a number of reasons, found it extremely boring actually, and got back to empire space. The whole mantra with "this is a pvp game and should be played like that" is crap as well. WTF is this, some self-righteous protestant sect that's only too happy to tell you how to live? I lead my life, both RL and in game, the way I like, and I tend to resent people who tell me that "you should do this and that". You are free to do whatever you like, pirating and such, whatever, but the moment it becomes impossible for me to do what I choose, is the moment I choose a friendlier place.
Merchantigus Minmatar Riot Zone	Posted - 2006.12.02 23:56:00 - [46] Edited by: Merchantigus on 03/12/2006 00:09:40 "So I don't give crap whether I add something to the game _for you_ or not. I just stated the fact: if soloing the game becomes impossible, that's it for me and I believe for other people as well." Good go away. it's not impossible to do alone but there is more risk and therefore more reward as you dont have to split anything. if i go out mining alone and don't pay attention to local i would accept the gank that came a few mins later and be more carefull the next time. if you don't learn and refuse to adapt stop playing eve so we don't have to keep listening to you. "I have tried 0.0, I have tried pvp. I didn't like it for a number of reasons, found it extremely boring actually, and got back to empire space." "i went out to .0 and got podded over and over" "The whole mantra with "this is a pvp game and should be played like that" is crap as well. WTF is this, some self-righteous protestant sect that's only too happy to tell you how to live? I lead my life, both RL and in game, the way I like, and I tend to resent people who tell me that "you should do this and that". You are free to do whatever you like, pirating and such, whatever, but the moment it becomes impossible for me to do what I choose, is the moment I choose a friendlier place." It's not that we care what or how you do it. what people mean by this is a pvp game is exactly that. sure you can mine but you best not do it alone. The whole thing with eve is this. if you go out into this world with no backup and a fitting that couldn't fight it's way out of a pvp sack you will get slaughterd and the rest of us will continue to take your stuff, laugh and then sell it back to you. simple as that. "the moment it becomes impossible for me to do what I choose, (without any forethought or use of my noggin), is the moment I choose a friendlier place(aka whine on the forums)." If you are looking for a friendly place you the picked the worst possible game. whatever it is you chose will always be possible but you have to think and adapt(same as the pvpers). 1.stop trying to run missions only set up for that type of damage with guns and ammo that only work vs 1 type of damage alone in yarr land. 2.Stop trying to go out in a gunless miner alone. 3.Stop jumping through gates with 5 pod kills in the past hour. 4. stop whinning when you ignore common sense and get wtfpwnd. Don't jump into a shark tank coverd in steaks dressed in nothing but your skinnies. and if you do it anyway shut the f up when you get bitten. As i said up there in the op most pirates are clueless nubs that fitted a warp jammer. these are the people that are killing you over and over again because you keep walking into it everytime. stop being such a wussy and the number of pirates will drop through the floor. they have to kill you to win all you have to do is scare them off and if you cant fend off a clueless nub you don't belong here. If you set up for pve as normal but o say set up to take many damage types and bring guns that shot something besides peas you will wtfpwn most pirates. we have 3 of our mid slots full. for most cruisers that's all of them. you have more slots and craploads more isk. most pirates fly cheap ships because 1. we are broke and 2. @#$%# carebears keep comming out to play with worthless setups. the only reason piracy works as well as it does is because of people just like you. keep it up hoss
Romeda Minmatar Trojan industries	Posted - 2006.12.03 00:12:00 - [47] Edited by: Romeda on 03/12/2006 00:12:50 Originally by: Miss Overlord and ppl like me are scanning them in empire and dropping in for a visit to loot - kill their rats and generally harass em - this game is a pure PVP type game missions and mining etc are simply resource gathering - good to see CCP made it stronger on the PVP Focus less carebears back to wow Wrong sir, wrong. If EVE was pure PvP it would be counter strike with a monthly payment, I like to think EVE is much more than shooting other people EVE is more dynamic than that. Also please quit with all the "send them back to WoW" stuff that has been overused and you just look silly saying it, please don't do it again.
Seldon Corran Caldari Camelot Innovations	Posted - 2006.12.03 00:25:00 - [48] I'd love for every 'carebear' and solo player in Eve to leave Eve, if only to show these 'Eve is PvP.. play it that way, MY way, or go away' idiots that the game would be very quiet. I, for one, have cancelled my two accounts. Not out of protest for any patch features or for anything other than I am bored with the PvE content. I'm sure that I will be back sometime, hopefully by then CCP can decide what type of game they are making. The only PvP game that appeals to me is Chess. I don't dislike PvP, and I respect those that do it, but it's simply not something that appeals to me.
Levin Milraco	Posted - 2006.12.03 00:26:00 - [49] The OP is kinda schizophrenic is he? 1st he tells the carebears to come do and will be safe if they do this and such, then he tells them to dont come if you ___________ so... does he want missioner in low sec or not? but yeah, dunno if the op tried, but has he done a lvl 4 mission in a pvp set up with friends in pvp set up? the time vs reward is soooo low that is not worth doing.... hence the problem... A) able to do lvl 4 (in normal, non-faction set up) in a reasonable amount of time vs B) trying to stay alive in lvl 4 but able to take on a group of pvpers...
Merchantigus Minmatar Riot Zone	Posted - 2006.12.03 00:26:00 - [50] Edited by: Merchantigus on 03/12/2006 00:37:03 ] Originally by: Seldon Corran I'd love for every 'carebear' and solo player in Eve to leave Eve, if only to show these 'Eve is PvP.. play it that way, MY way, or go away' idiots that the game would be very quiet. I, for one, have cancelled my two accounts. Not out of protest for any patch features or for anything other than I am bored with the PvE content. I'm sure that I will be back sometime, hopefully by then CCP can decide what type of game they are making. The only PvP game that appeals to me is Chess. I don't dislike PvP, and I respect those that do it, but it's simply not something that appeals to me. They have it's a pvp game. I did the exact same thing you did and got bored within a month. then i came back a second time and joined a .0 mining /ratting corp and i've been here ever since... if all you want to do is bap the same brain dead npcs over and over again good riddens. there are hundreds of games that offer this and only this. Eve isn't only about pvp. All these pvpers that "ruin your fun" need ships and the people that make those ships need minerals. and the people that mine those minerals need guards. you and many others just don't get it. please go play eq2 or something before ccp gives in to your crap and kills the game. Everyone h8s the way eve is? then why has it doubled in size and continued to grow over the years? as long as they don't give you what you want and let the others keep what they play for it will continue to grow. edit and not everyone that pvps is a pirate out to gank miners. large ship production corps sell ships to other huge corps that then take these ships and try to claim the universe as their own only to run into the corp that sold them the ships and now have better ships+ all the money ;) There is an entire living breathing universe and you refuse to partake in it. instead you kill the same drab npcs over and over and whine about how there is nothing to do. and i too would love to see every last carebear leave eve. it would leave only pvpers and "Angry Bears" left which would make the world a much better place.
Levin Milraco	Posted - 2006.12.03 00:32:00 - [51] I say Eve is more of a world simulation than a pvp (in the defination of the CS kiddies) game... yes, there is competition among everybody, (for god's sake, theres tons of stuff in eve that is not pvp with weapons.... ) but it is not the Shoot them up Counterstrike styled thing.... alot of people only thinks that though... and thinks everything else eve has to offer is wrong... but yeah, if its a REAL pvp (in above defination) game, we should be able to shoot each other everywhere, there would be no high sec, no boring mining, no building(everything will be npc seeded) Eve IS a universe Simulation.... wow..I just thought of SWG just now.. SWG was a world simulation..but... the yeah...enough said... stop making eve into counterstrike in space!!!
Merchantigus Minmatar Riot Zone	Posted - 2006.12.03 00:39:00 - [52] Edited by: Merchantigus on 03/12/2006 00:51:10 "wow..I just thought of SWG just now.. SWG was a world simulation..but... the yeah...enough said..." Swg died because they gave in to attitudes like the above few posters. the reson i fight and hate with so much passion is because i'll be damned before i see that happen to my beloved eve. "The OP is kinda schizophrenic is he?" Yes i am. i'm also very angry and under your bed. ps you missed the point of the post btw edit whine? WHine?! WHINE WHINE WHINE WHINE WHINE WHINE WHINE WHHhhhHHHIiiiiINEeeE!!1111!!! "FINE have it your way welcome to suck."
Romeda Minmatar Trojan industries	Posted - 2006.12.03 00:47:00 - [53] Edited by: Romeda on 03/12/2006 00:50:48 Originally by: Merchantigus Edited by: Merchantigus on 03/12/2006 00:45:09 "wow..I just thought of SWG just now.. SWG was a world simulation..but... the yeah...enough said..." Swg died because they gave in to people like the above few posters. the reson i fight and hate with so much passion is because i'll be damned before i see that happen to my beloved eve. "The OP is kinda schizophrenic is he?" Yes i am. i'm also very angry and under your bed. ps you missed the point of the post btw edit whine? WHine?! WHINE WHINE WHINE WHINE WHINE WHINE WHINE WHHhhhHHHIiiiiINEeeE!!1111!!! "FINE have it your way welcome to suck." /me shakes head, tut tut tut, I know many other hardcore PvPer's they don't talk like you. Please don't make yourself look so silly. This has to be the billionth topic on "Carbear-you-must-wise-up-and-do-as-I-say-thread" one pops up every few days, nobody has the right to tell others how to play EVE.
Levin Milraco	Posted - 2006.12.03 00:49:00 - [54] well, to be fair, SWG died cause people keep whining that it is too complex... (I was a shipwright/Engineer and Creature handler/Bio-Engineer) they never had a problem with pvpers not getting kills... here alot of the times are: "Pirates" (real pirates dont have problems) have problems getting "Action"..(which involve fighting someone whos not prepared for them..I mean.. theres ALOT of alliances out there that will glady fight you in 0.0...) you never see any carebear whine to nerf someone...is usually the pvpers complaining how safe some people are, how they arent getting their Epeen-handjob from blowing ppl...... but yeah, I knew I striked a nerve lol..
Merchantigus Minmatar Riot Zone	Posted - 2006.12.03 00:58:00 - [55] "SWG died cause people keep whining" exactly. pvpers whine about this or that ship having a slight advantage or this or that mod is overpowerd this months and that low sec is empty. Carebears whine about getting shot at and cosntantly want things changed to hugalot land. Low sec wouldn't be empty if there was something worth ratting for(as this is what every carebear i've ever seen on the forum does all day long?) and if there were less noobs with guns and a jammer. there would be less noobs with guns if the morons that keep going out there with expensive stuff that's worthless in combat stuck a webber, multi types of resist and perhaps some light drones. If you stop being easy target noobs will stop trying to gank because it wont work.
Ulfar	Posted - 2006.12.03 01:08:00 - [56] Sorry beg to differ but SWG dies mainly because SOE changed the core game. Asking for all level 4 agents in lowsec would have a similar effect, as there are a hell of a lot of people who play this game without wanting to participate in PvP. Solo players do have a point, they are here to enjoy their play. If that doesn't entertain you then tough. Without all the producers, miners and other non combat activities you would have a real fun time in your ibis.
Itono	Posted - 2006.12.03 01:44:00 - [57] Edited by: Itono on 03/12/2006 01:45:45 well it seems the op misunderstood what I was saying. My gripes with eve don't come from "interaction" with pvp-ers and gate-campers. I can easily evade most of those, and when combat was needed (mostly in 0.0) it went quite ok for me. I don't care what you do, understand that. The problem is that the kind of game I like - that is, solo-play - becomes more and more unfeasible, due to some mantra that says we should do everything together and be all so happy and shiny. And the game mechanics _change_ to support that. That's what I find irritating. Not being able to continue doing what I do. Adapting, fine, but there are limits to it. Now, if I run a mission and someone jumps in and kills the boss, running away with the loot needed to finish the mission - the only way to adapt to that is move to another game. Originally by: Ulfar Solo players do have a point, they are here to enjoy their play. If that doesn't entertain you then tough. thank you Ulfar :)
Snarls McGee	Posted - 2006.12.03 02:55:00 - [58] Tunnel vision is bad, mmkay? I've seen this 'This game is PvP and PvP is the ONLY way to play it "correctly"' idiocy in every MMORPG I've ever played. If Eve is PvP and PvP based ONLY then why do we have missions? Why is there Concord? The market? Mining? LPs? For all the talk about how much of a 'sandbox' type MMORPG EVE all this talk of "PvP or leave" is even more ludicrous. When asked why a 2 year old vet in a BS kills a noob in a Ibis the answer is "Because I can.." Yet when a mission runner is asked why they run missions the same answer is somehow "wrong"? Make no mistake.. Carebear is a playstyle, not a profession. I have seen as many or more carebear pirates as carebear mission runners. I've never seen a mission runner use "logoffski" abuse to keep their ship. I've never seen a mission runner use a Raven for L1 missions. Griefing != PvP. Mission ganking != PvP What is even funnier is that if all these 'hardcore' griefers/gankers did succeed in driving off all their detested nemesis (the mission runners) they would be faced with fair fights or even gasp someone bigger or better than them. I don't think it would take much imagination to see who would be in the next mass migration from the game after the mission runners were ever driven out.
Maj Woodcock Minmatar	Posted - 2006.12.03 03:37:00 - [59] Originally by: Synapse Archae All of this is true but it misses the point. 1) Missions are one of the last bastions of solo content in the game. Lets face it, if anything eve needs MORE soloable content. People do not always want or have time to fly with friends. 2) If you bring 1 person, youre dividing mission rewards by 2. Bring 5, and you divide by 5. How long until its more profitable (even less boring, for those guarding you) to mine veldspar? Not long. 3) If you come setup for PVP, the mission may take twice as long, doubling the risk that a pirate will come engage you. They already know what ship youre in and what damage you have to tank before coming. It honestly doesnt matter what your fitting is if your enemy knows exactly what it is before arriving. I agree totally. Make more content for solo players. Bet there are many, many of us that can only long on an hour or 2 at a time. No time for corp missions or mining ops. I slip my game play between mining, mission running and ratting. Right now I'm ratting checking out savlaging. If team play is all you want to do then go play Halo. "Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands,hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." - H. L. Mencken
Justen Kase	Posted - 2006.12.03 03:38:00 - [60] Wow pretty sure Ulfar, Itono and Snarls McGee drove three nails home! Nice job guys. I am so tired of hearing: "Eve is PvP" "PvP is Eve" "Pirates are Eve" "You MUST PvP to play Eve" Pirates are nothing more than ppl who get a rise out of blowing up stuff that can't fight back and making others unhappy or unable to play. Go fight other ppl that consent to PvP and are a challenge. CCP can make a special NPC type for them to "hunt" so they can leave ppl that are not interested in PvP alone.
Shemar Gallente Photesthetics Glamour Syndicate	Posted - 2006.12.03 03:57:00 - [61] Originally by: Esaka Originally by: Tension Originally by: Miss Overlord <usual stream of absolute gibberish> For god's sake, just stop posting. QFT Heh, I am rarely one to judge or tell someone to stop posting, but in this case I have to agree. The level of lameness and lack of any intellect whatosever, the ignorance about any play style other than what this persons limited view is and the obvious need to compensate for lack of any accomplishment or skill in real life with in-game griefing is astounding. I think I can feel brain cells dying just by reading their posts. ________________ Enhanced eye sight does not make up for the lack of vision
Shemar Gallente Photesthetics Glamour Syndicate	Posted - 2006.12.03 04:06:00 - [62] Originally by: Itono I have tried 0.0, I have tried pvp. I didn't like it for a number of reasons, found it extremely boring actually, and got back to empire space. The whole mantra with "this is a pvp game and should be played like that" is crap as well. WTF is this, some self-righteous protestant sect that's only too happy to tell you how to live? I lead my life, both RL and in game, the way I like, and I tend to resent people who tell me that "you should do this and that". You are free to do whatever you like, pirating and such, whatever, but the moment it becomes impossible for me to do what I choose, is the moment I choose a friendlier place. Totally agree. I also tried the 0.0 and tried PvP. And I also got bored with it. I also play mostly solo. I don't have the kind of time to stick around doing nothing so a group can gather. To be frank, a few good friends and the fact that the monthly sub is virtually insignificant for me is why I have not quit already, but making it a 'must group' game would be beyond unacceptable. ________________ Enhanced eye sight does not make up for the lack of vision
SSgt Sniper Gallente In Excess Enterprises	Posted - 2006.12.03 11:09:00 - [63] Originally by: Miss Overlord and ppl like me are scanning them in empire and dropping in for a visit to loot - kill their rats and generally harass em - this game is a pure PVP type game missions and mining etc are simply resource gathering - good to see CCP made it stronger on the PVP Focus less carebears back to wow The next time you have a thought.... let it go. I have exactly two killmails. I got them going to the aid of corpmates mining several systems away where griefers had decided to warp scramble the hauler (apparently you can do that without Conkkorden interference) so as to bring mining to a halt. For my money, two killmails is exactly two more than I want to have. Oh well. Oh and to the op: I'm not shtoopid, I not only know how to mine lowsec without an escort, I have done it many times without interference. The main trick is know your neighborhood, come during times when it is empty, and if someone you are not sure of enters, leave. No minerals are worth buying and fitting a new ship for. :) mails a big box of Carebears to OP --------- Gallente need ONE ship with an ecm bonus option. JUST ONE.
Myxx Gallente Daughters Of Venus	Posted - 2006.12.03 11:24:00 - [64] is a carebear with teeth/angry bear Thank you for the tips merchantigus -- Quote: 2006.11.29 20:35:27 Notify Jita Traffic Control is currently experiencing heavy load and is unable to process your request. You are #550 in queue for jump-in.

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