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Mike Whiite
Geuzen Inc
392
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Posted - 2015.07.28 14:25:42 -
[31] - Quote
Scipio Artelius wrote:Mike Whiite wrote:okay I'll bite.
In the Netherlands, people are taught, depending on their education level, 3 to 6 foreign languages before attending university. Welcome in the country of merchants
English being the first, starting as early as the age of 10, though the "real Teachers" are TV and Cinema as most programs and movies are subtitled instead of using voice over and then there is the internet of course. I guess he's asking a different question. The Dutch are great with languages (lived in The Hague for 7 years), but he is asking, do you have subjects in School/University that are the equivalent of Dutch 101, Dutch 102, etc. In school, a lot of English as a first language countries have English, which focuses on grammar, composition, literature, etc.; essentially subjects that teach the rules of communicating formally in English, even though you might think that is something natural because it's the first language of the country. CAM is asking whether the same sort of thing exists elsewhere. Do Dutch schools have Nederlands 101 that teaches proper grammar, etc.
Really that sounds so natural it wouldn't have come to mind as a question.
ah well still lots of stuff to learn and yes we do have those classes
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Zimmy Zeta
Lisa Needs Braces.
58666
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Posted - 2015.07.28 15:54:45 -
[32] - Quote
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:Tippia wrote:What does any of that even mean? I suppose that answers the question GǣnoGǥ, but it's hard to tellGǪ Go easy on her people , it's a genuine question. From my experience generally European non English speakers tend to have a comparable or better understanding of the English language by the time they enter third level education than most native English speakers use on the internet, particularly notable with Scandinavians and Germans. I have a German friend with a better level of English than her Irish boyfriend
Oh hai, non native speaker here
Whenever I read a very poorly written post on the Internet, I wonder if it is a non-native speaker who is simply struggling with the English language or a native speaker too stupid for his own linguistic heritage.
My personal theory is that you can tell them apart by homophone errors : your / you're, it's / its, should have / should of....those errors are only done by native speakers when they just write how they speak. Non-native speakers usually learn it in written form first and speak later, so that kind of errors won't occur. Another thing, not quite sure about it, is the term "no one". Non native speakers (especially Germans) have the tendency to write it as one word ("noone") while native speakers usually write it as two words.
I'd like to apologize for the poor quality of the post above and sincerely hope you didn't waste your time reading it.
Yes, I do feel bad about it.
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
25433
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Posted - 2015.07.28 16:18:37 -
[33] - Quote
Zimmy Zeta wrote:Another thing, not quite sure about it, is the term "no one". Non native speakers (especially Germans) have the tendency to write it as one word ("noone") while native speakers usually write it as two words.
That will vary within English as well. While the OED doesn't always include them, British English has a long history of hyphenating colliding vowels in prefixed and composite word formations, making GÇ£no-oneGÇ¥ a fairly common occurrence (along with co-operate).
My favourite tip is to take us Scandinavians down a peg is to look for agreement errors. We don't really have number as a factor in our verbs, and thus have a tendency to overlook it in other languages as well. Of course, as the complexity of a sentence increases, it also becomes more difficult to keep track of who the subject, but it'll be far more common for those of us who never have to bother with it on an every-day basis.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skillplan 2.2.
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Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
24474
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Posted - 2015.07.28 16:27:15 -
[34] - Quote
Zimmy Zeta wrote:Another thing, not quite sure about it, is the term "no one". Non native speakers (especially Germans) have the tendency to write it as one word ("noone") while native speakers usually write it as two words.
That's probably a carry over from the structure of the German language itself, if I remember correctly German has two words for no one, and they're both one word as opposed to the two used in English.
I could be hideously wrong though, my command of German is extremely rusty as I haven't really used it in 25 years.
Civilized behaviour is knowing that violence is barbaric, but paying other people to do it is business.
Nil mortifi sine lucre.
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Zimmy Zeta
Lisa Needs Braces.
58669
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Posted - 2015.07.28 16:47:59 -
[35] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Zimmy Zeta wrote:Another thing, not quite sure about it, is the term "no one". Non native speakers (especially Germans) have the tendency to write it as one word ("noone") while native speakers usually write it as two words.
That's probably a carry over from the structure of the German language itself, if I remember correctly German has two words for no one, and they're both one word as opposed to the two used in English. I could be hideously wrong though, my command of German is extremely rusty as I haven't really used it in 25 years. Correct. The corresponding terms in German are both single words: niemand / keiner. Using two words to describe *nothing* sounds illogical for Germans.
@ Tips Cool stuff. I'll have to watch for those errors in the future.
I'd like to apologize for the poor quality of the post above and sincerely hope you didn't waste your time reading it.
Yes, I do feel bad about it.
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Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
24475
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Posted - 2015.07.28 17:09:26 -
[36] - Quote
Zimmy Zeta wrote:Correct. The corresponding terms in German are both single words: niemand / keiner. Using two words to describe *nothing* sounds illogical for Germans. lol you're a nation that insists on making up compound words to describe everyday things, just to troll the rest of the world with the pronunciation and whether or not we can say them without taking a breath
Which goes to show that contrary to popular belief, Germans do have a sense of humour
Civilized behaviour is knowing that violence is barbaric, but paying other people to do it is business.
Nil mortifi sine lucre.
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
25434
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Posted - 2015.07.28 17:31:51 -
[37] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:lol you're a nation that insists on making up compound words to describe everyday things, just to troll the rest of the world with the pronunciation and whether or not we can say them without taking a breath I'd advise you to not try Icelandic of Finnish.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skillplan 2.2.
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Vortexo VonBrenner
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
2044
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Posted - 2015.07.28 17:32:22 -
[38] - Quote
Carrie-Anne Moss wrote: Do you people in france have like French102 where you read French books and write Position Papers and Critical Analysises?
It's not called English 102 right?
Students in France used to have French 102, but for budgetary reasons, something had to go. So, now it's all only English 102.
An example of proper use of French in travrl
ITT: ARE YOU NOT ENTERTAINED?
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Johnny Saxton
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2015.07.28 17:34:55 -
[39] - Quote
Zimmy Zeta wrote:Correct. The corresponding terms in German are both single words: niemand / keiner. Using two words to describe *nothing* sounds illogical for Germans. It's not the words, it's the syllables (Ha! Found that word on the internet).
nie-mand / kei-ner
It's like 'no one', if you don't look at the word count. Or maybe it's just a thing for illogical Germans.
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Which goes to show that contrary to popular belief, Germans do have a sense of humour
No, we have not.
'I AM FUNNYBOT!'
Johnny |
Zimmy Zeta
Lisa Needs Braces.
58669
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Posted - 2015.07.28 17:36:06 -
[40] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Zimmy Zeta wrote:Correct. The corresponding terms in German are both single words: niemand / keiner. Using two words to describe *nothing* sounds illogical for Germans. lol you're a nation that insists on making up compound words to describe everyday things, just to troll the rest of the world with the pronunciation and whether or not we can say them without taking a breath Which goes to show that contrary to popular belief, Germans do have a sense of humour
Difficulties with pronunciation are often brought up by English speakers, it's actually a point I don't quite understand. Like, the German language is a complete mess- there are so many exceptions to all grammatic rules that it's getting pretty close to actually having no rules at all. A mouthful of anarchy. About the only aspect of German that really has comprehensible rules is the pronunciation, everything else is so much worse....
Also, Germans may have a sense of humour, but I don't think there's a typical German humour- it's mostly adopted from foreign countries (Monty Python was a major influence for my generation at least). Because, you know, a few generations ago, we had a government that did not really like comedians making fun of them, and they were pretty efficient in disposing of all kinds of people they didn't like. Evolution at work here- speak to older Germans (70+ years) and be awe-strucken by their total absence of humour.
I'd like to apologize for the poor quality of the post above and sincerely hope you didn't waste your time reading it.
Yes, I do feel bad about it.
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Malaclypse Muscaria
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
188
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Posted - 2015.07.28 17:38:47 -
[41] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Speed Limits - Geschwindigkeitsbeschr+ñnkungen Someone who wears gloves to throw snowballs - Handschuhschneeballwerfer[/i]
Bus - Subanestrujenbajen
(Spanish required to understand this joke )
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Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
24478
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Posted - 2015.07.28 17:46:58 -
[42] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Jonah Gravenstein wrote:lol you're a nation that insists on making up compound words to describe everyday things, just to troll the rest of the world with the pronunciation and whether or not we can say them without taking a breath I'd advise you to not try Icelandic of Finnish. I just looked, I saw letters that I have no idea how to use and words like Hyppytyynytyydytys; is it a real Finnish word, does it actually mean bouncy cushion satisfaction, and how the hell do you say it?
Yeah giving that a miss.
Civilized behaviour is knowing that violence is barbaric, but paying other people to do it is business.
Nil mortifi sine lucre.
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Zimmy Zeta
Lisa Needs Braces.
58670
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Posted - 2015.07.28 17:57:29 -
[43] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Hyppytyynytyydytys;
I'd like to apologize for the poor quality of the post above and sincerely hope you didn't waste your time reading it.
Yes, I do feel bad about it.
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
25434
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Posted - 2015.07.28 18:03:36 -
[44] - Quote
J+ñk+ñl+ñk+ñp+ñl+ñt
GǪapparentlyGǪ
The advantage of Finnish is that it's usually pronounced exactly how it is spelled.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skillplan 2.2.
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Jacques d'Orleans
The Scope Gallente Federation
983
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Posted - 2015.07.28 18:04:37 -
[45] - Quote
Zimmy Zeta wrote: Also, Germans may have a sense of humour, but I don't think there's a typical German humour- it's mostly adopted from foreign countries (Monty Python was a major influence for my generation at least).
Monty Python's Flying Circus and Fawlty Towers, i still love those TV Shows.
Zimmy Zeta wrote: Evolution at work here- speak to older Germans (70+ years) and be awe-strucken by their total absence of humour.
I think they have an other kind of humor than we have today, my Grandpa had some good jokes at hand, well, but mostly about the french.
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Lady Mister
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
2
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Posted - 2015.07.28 19:05:53 -
[46] - Quote
What do you mean 'you people'?! |
Zimmy Zeta
Lisa Needs Braces.
58679
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Posted - 2015.07.28 19:33:10 -
[47] - Quote
Jacques d'Orleans wrote:Zimmy Zeta wrote: Evolution at work here- speak to older Germans (70+ years) and be awe-strucken by their total absence of humour.
I think they have an other kind of humor than we have today, my Grandpa had some good jokes at hand, well, but mostly about the french.
Maybe I am a little biased and this is only a thing in my own family. But then again, my mother is about the funniest person alive- not because of her sense of humor, but because of her complete lack thereof. It's like some brain areas missing or they never developed- she makes Spock look like Benny Hill in comparison. In a very meta way, I love it when she tries to tell a joke- and always completely butchers it in the process. It usually goes like this: 1. First the public announcement that she will now tell a joke, just so everybody knows it's not serious. 2. Before even starting, she apologizes for telling the joke 3. She starts with the punchline 4. Now she explains the punchline, just to make sure everyone gets it 5. She apologizes again for the silliness 6. Now comes the setup, also informing everybody that she's not very good at telling jokes. 7. She explains the joke again, just in case anyone didn't understand her explanation the first time 8. Finally, the middle part of the joke. 9. The third and final apology 10. Public announcement that the joke is now over and we're back to serious.
I'd like to apologize for the poor quality of the post above and sincerely hope you didn't waste your time reading it.
Yes, I do feel bad about it.
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Jacques d'Orleans
The Scope Gallente Federation
1005
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Posted - 2015.07.28 19:55:20 -
[48] - Quote
Zimmy Zeta wrote:Jacques d'Orleans wrote:Zimmy Zeta wrote: Evolution at work here- speak to older Germans (70+ years) and be awe-strucken by their total absence of humour.
I think they have an other kind of humor than we have today, my Grandpa had some good jokes at hand, well, but mostly about the french. Maybe I am a little biased and this is only a thing in my own family. But then again, my mother is about the funniest person alive- not because of her sense of humor, but because of her complete lack thereof. It's like some brain areas missing or they never developed- she makes Spock look like Benny Hill in comparison. In a very meta way, I love it when she tries to tell a joke- and always completely butchers it in the process. It usually goes like this: 1. First the public announcement that she will now tell a joke, just so everybody knows it's not serious. 2. Before even starting, she apologizes for telling the joke 3. She starts with the punchline 4. Now she explains the punchline, just to make sure everyone gets it 5. She apologizes again for the silliness 6. Now comes the setup, also informing everybody that she's not very good at telling jokes. 7. She explains the joke again, just in case anyone didn't understand her explanation the first time 8. Finally, the middle part of the joke. 9. The third and final apology 10. Public announcement that the joke is now over and we're back to serious.
Ah, ok, now i get it. My Grandpa was easier in that way, but his politically totally uncorrect jokes were always something like these: What are 30.000 raised hands? The french 2nd Army!
How wide is France? 48 Panzerhours.
Who won the 1940 Tour de France? The 7th Panzerdivision.
And his jokes about the Italians were even worse. |
Kelleth Kirk
Angels with Artillery
173
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Posted - 2015.07.28 20:52:01 -
[49] - Quote
Jacques d'Orleans wrote:Ah, ok, now i get it. My Grandpa was easier in that way, but his politically totally uncorrect jokes were always something like these: What are 30.000 raised hands? The french 2nd Army! How wide is France? 48 Panzerhours. Who won the 1940 Tour de France? The 7th Panzerdivision. And his jokes about the Italians were even worse.
I liked the last one, but then again, World War 2 jokes about France never gets old =P
I don't trust any event where punching someone isn't an option.
Why don't you move out about 30 km. and stand still for me?
Guess who don't have any money to play EVE for the next 4 months? =(
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Jacques d'Orleans
The Scope Gallente Federation
1007
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Posted - 2015.07.28 20:58:22 -
[50] - Quote
Kelleth Kirk wrote:Jacques d'Orleans wrote:Ah, ok, now i get it. My Grandpa was easier in that way, but his politically totally uncorrect jokes were always something like these: What are 30.000 raised hands? The french 2nd Army! How wide is France? 48 Panzerhours. Who won the 1940 Tour de France? The 7th Panzerdivision. And his jokes about the Italians were even worse. I liked the last one, but then again, World War 2 jokes about France never gets old =P
This one's for ya: Why did the french celebrated the win of the 1998 soccer world championship so greatly? Because it was the first time they won something without the help of the USA and the UK.
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Antihrist Pripravnik
4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation
946
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Posted - 2015.07.28 22:12:51 -
[51] - Quote
Quote: Do you foreign people have english class in college?
No, we learn a foreign language (not limited to English) in elementary school and master it in high school. If you're taking language classes in college here, you either study literature and linguistics or it's already too late for you to learn. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
2130
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Posted - 2015.07.29 00:23:48 -
[52] - Quote
I think the, "no one," camp comes from thinking in terms of, "Not a single one."
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
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High Sec needs a stepping stone to other spaces, where they can grow
Fozzie SOV is treating a symptom.
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Webvan
All Kill No Skill
11575
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Posted - 2015.07.29 02:07:09 -
[53] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:I think the, "no one," camp comes from thinking in terms of, "Not a single one." Yeah it does go together as a single word, but "oo" seems problematic. Maybe "o-o"? I use hyphens in other words sometimes, just to be legible, though still not a very good fit here. Nobody, not noone, knew anyone else, in the forum thread where no one was invited to, and where no-one cared. Good explanation here. I speak American
Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12
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Elyan Mishi
Jadesoturi.
16
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Posted - 2015.07.29 08:55:11 -
[54] - Quote
Native Finn coming through.
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:I just looked, I saw letters that I have no idea how to use and words like Hyppytyynytyydytys; is it a real Finnish word, does it actually mean bouncy cushion satisfaction, and how the hell do you say it?
Yeah giving that a miss. Hyppytyyny (hyppy - jump, tyyny - pillow) is the thing fire department uses to have people jump to from burning buildings so you don't go splat on the ground. It can also mean, I think, an air filled pillow on top of which you can jump. A toy essentially. The satisfaction part of it (tyydytys) is somewhat questionable though, since I'd assume it refers to satisfaction in a lewd sense.
Tippia wrote:J+ñk+ñl+ñk+ñp+ñl+ñt
GǪapparentlyGǪ
The advantage of Finnish is that it's usually pronounced exactly how it is spelled. J+ñk+ñl+ñk+ñp+ñl+ñt translates to Lichen Paws, or The Lichen Paws in this case since it apparently is a name of cub scouts' group (j+ñk+ñl+ñ - lichen, k+ñp+ñl+ñt - paws / k+ñp+ñl+ñ is the singular).
Also yes, Finnish is usually pronounced exactly the way it is written. The exception to this is, at least the one I can think of right now, is the -ng sound in words such as keng+ñt, s+ñngyt and so forth.
Since Mr. Gravenstein was wondering how to pronounce Hyppytyynytyydytys, I recorded it in vocaroo. Hyppytyynytyydytys Bonus: J+ñk+ñl+ñk+ñp+ñl+ñt |
Falken Falcon
32153
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Posted - 2015.07.29 10:13:44 -
[55] - Quote
Elyan Mishi wrote:Native Finn coming through. See you at the market then?
Aye, Sea Turtles
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Elyan Mishi
Jadesoturi.
18
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Posted - 2015.07.29 10:17:59 -
[56] - Quote
Falken Falcon wrote:Elyan Mishi wrote:Native Finn coming through. See you at the market then? Torilla tavataan. |
Jacques d'Orleans
The Scope Gallente Federation
1057
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Posted - 2015.07.29 12:00:36 -
[57] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:I think the, "no one," camp comes from thinking in terms of, "Not a single one."
I'm German and i always mixed "no one" up with "none", maybe that's the reason too, why "no one" is writen "noone" sometimes.
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Vortexo VonBrenner
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
2048
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Posted - 2015.07.29 21:16:22 -
[58] - Quote
interesting...thanks...
ITT: ARE YOU NOT ENTERTAINED?
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Orca Platypus
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
41
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Posted - 2015.07.29 22:39:34 -
[59] - Quote
inb4 people fail to detect it, Carrie-Anne Moss is a known idiot and... I dunno, she might try to troll, but just below the marking line which separates trolling from nonsense, deep in the territory of the latter.
Not that I care about a troll or not, there are english classes for students where I live, but they are so incredibly stupid that I'd be surprised if anyone would learn something in them.
My english is 100% self-taught. To the point where I'm not sure there is any other way to start speaking it. |
Khergit Deserters
Crom's Angels
4152
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Posted - 2015.07.30 21:24:23 -
[60] - Quote
English is a messy language, compared to other languages. I learned that trying to teach it as an EFL teacher. It has a lot of odd grammatical, spelling and pronunciation exceptions that you just have to memorize.
Having a Germanic base, but also a giant load of Latin and medieval French words in it doesn't help with the disorder. So you have the noun house (Germanic), but the corresponding adjective is domestic (Latin). You have the noun woman(Germanic), but the adjectives female and feminine (French). Then again, there's the adjective womanly (Germanic), which doesn't have the same meaning as feminine. According to linguists, the big choice of similar-meaning words from different languages makes English one of the most expressive languages in the world. But the mashup also kind of makes the grammar and spelling a mess.
A study, published in 1973, offered this breakdown of sources of the words in English: Latin, 28.34 percent; French, 28.3 percent; Old and Middle English, Old Norse, and Dutch, 25 percent; Greek 5.32 percent; no etymology given, 4.03 percent; derived from proper names, 3.28 percent; all other languages, less than 1 percent.
You're trying to conquer me
You never will conquer me
-Delroy Wilson
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