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Malcanis
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Posted - 2006.12.05 12:04:00 -
[61]
Originally by: Crumplecorn Edited by: Crumplecorn on 05/12/2006 11:19:14 All attempts at sarcasm fail, logging off is so pathetic that there is nothing to do except say it plainly.
You quit the game when it looks like you're going to lose? Why even play? I hate to use a phrase usually uttered by mindless trolls, but really, children should not be playing this game.
CCP should just treat all disconnects as logoffs and penalise the player as such. Sure it'll hurt people who genuinely get disconnected, but I, for one, would be gratified to hear the whines of cheaters who can no longer escape their rightful deaths, and wouldn't mind losing a ship here or there to random Internet problems.
Hey, woah... I was getting CTDs 1 jump/warp/undock in 3 or 4 last night. I've never logged off to avoid PvP, but I don't want to be penalised for instability I can't help.
What if pressing CTRL-Q automatically deducted the regional average value of your ship from your wallet...? ;o)
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Raneru
Gallente Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed
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Posted - 2006.12.05 12:30:00 -
[62]
Originally by: Viruzzz2 how is trying to save your pod (and expensive implants) killing pvp? pvp is from start of the battle till someone floats around in their pod, if you kill the pod you don't gain anything, except they guy getting killed being hurt even more, and if that is what you get enjoyment from in eve, hurting people more than necessary, then i hope everyone you fight logs off to save their pod. because hurting others for (only) enjoyment is just sad
If you are flying around in 0.0 you need to accept you could (and eventually will) lose your ship and pod.
If im out PvP'ing miles from anywhere and i lose my ship, ill try to warp out. If not.. thats just part of the game and it just saved me a trip back.
Even if I do get out of a lost fight in a pod, more often than not i'll self destruct to get back faster, get a ship and get back into the fight. If im logged off I'm not in game having fun
Why do people kill pods? to remove smack talkers from local and its also like a bonus kill for the killer. A bit like the predator collecting skulls
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Ja'kar
MAFIA
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Posted - 2006.12.05 12:31:00 -
[63]
m8 give up they never gonna get it! let me shout it at them
ITS A HARDCORE PVP GAME WHERE YOU MIGHT GET KILLED, THIS DOES NOTMAKE THE PLAYER ANYLESS OF A HUMAN BEING, IF YOU GOT CAUGHT LOSE THE SHIP THATS THE GAME. IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT PLAY ANOTHER GAME AND STOP BEING A BABY!
dunno if that help, doubt it 2bh carebearshavewon eve
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Starleena
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Posted - 2006.12.05 12:41:00 -
[64]
It all boils down to point of view. Let me explain that with a little history lesson.
Durring the revolutionary war, were americans cowards for hiding in trenches and behind trees and not fighting toe to toe with the british? In the british mind, most likely, yes. In the americans minds, hell no. Take cover! Get out of the line of fire! Do whatever it takes to survive! Live to fight another day! Some may say that makes americans cowards, but guess what, americans won the war!
Does logging off to avoid certain death make you a coward? Point of view. Some think 4 battleships poping and pod killing a lonely cargo hauler for nothing more that there enjoyment is cowardess. Point of view. Everyone has there own point of view. When your trying to kill someone, I guarentee the person your trying to kill will have a different point of view about the situation than you do.
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DropZone 187
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Posted - 2006.12.05 12:45:00 -
[65]
Wow, this is so lame. A bunch of dumb piwats who don't know how to adapt, learn the game and expect that each and every undefendable ship that crosses their path should die instantly no matter what.
Come on, real piwats don't whine about such dribble. As was quoted earlier, take a page out of BoB's book - kill them faster. 60 seconds not enough time? Get back to running missions then or find some more friends to help out.
Is it 'unethical' or 'unhonorable'? Heck no, if anything the aggressor should be embarassed for not having the skills to actually do the job of their chosen profession.
What a joke. You know why it hasn't been 'fixed' yet by CCP? For the most part it isn't broken.... The players complaining about it are.
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Ja'kar
MAFIA
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Posted - 2006.12.05 12:52:00 -
[66]
Edited by: Ja''kar on 05/12/2006 12:53:05 sad sad sad
ok look at my bio on what a pirate is
pirates adapt more than any other player style in eve and popping a hauler with a bs IS PART OF THE GAME - loggin off in just lame why play a gem that is too hard for you to cope with or understand
wow is still live
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namer5
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Posted - 2006.12.05 12:54:00 -
[67]
I've lived in 0.0 for over a year and I've lost 5 ravens to camps so far, nothing I can't replace in two days, but I have to agree logging isn't the best solution, if you want the benifits of low sercuity systesms you need to take the risk, or develop experience with time, such as checking the map, use fast ships with cloak when travel, etc.
Having said that, I don't really think logging is killing pvp in any way
while it might be "dishonable" to log when you are fitted for combat, if you are complaining the lone hauler ran away from your gank squad, the question should really be what "honor" there were in killing the hauler in the first place.
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Crumplecorn
Gallente Aerial Boundaries Inc. Interstellar Starbase Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.12.05 12:56:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Starleena It all boils down to point of view. Let me explain that with a little history lesson.
<stupidly irrelevant>
So someone losing at <insert board game> who knocks the board over isn't really acting like a child, that's just a point of view? STFU ----------
IBTL \o/ EVE is upside down! WTZ+Slower Warp=Win |
Sir Bart
Vendetta Underground Rule of Three
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Posted - 2006.12.05 12:59:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Sinnbad Mayhem
to answer your second point. your in a freaking bubble. you cant warp. your scrambled and you logoff. NOT COOL S&M
I must be missing something, when I have someone scrambled and they log off, they don't warp away, they sit there till they explode.
The fact that logging off alows you to warp out of a bubble is a bug that should be fixed.
To me, the biggest problem is with the, err, "loginski"... Get into a fight and then your buddies log in and warp right to you for a nice little gank. They need to make it so that you can't target anyone for 180 seconds after login. (maybe allow you to target NPC but not another player)
-Bart
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Noluck Ned
FATAL REVELATIONS Lotka Volterra
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Posted - 2006.12.05 13:03:00 -
[70]
Originally by: DropZone 187 Wow, this is so lame. A bunch of dumb piwats who don't know how to adapt, learn the game and expect that each and every undefendable ship that crosses their path should die instantly no matter what.
Come on, real piwats don't whine about such dribble. As was quoted earlier, take a page out of BoB's book - kill them faster. 60 seconds not enough time? Get back to running missions then or find some more friends to help out.
Is it 'unethical' or 'unhonorable'? Heck no, if anything the aggressor should be embarassed for not having the skills to actually do the job of their chosen profession.
What a joke. You know why it hasn't been 'fixed' yet by CCP? For the most part it isn't broken.... The players complaining about it are.
I disagree
Why should lazy players have an i-win button for situations they could easily avoid? When you decide to pack all your life savings into a t1 hauler and set out through low/nulsec all by yourself you should be mature enough to face the consequences of being caught.
No ship is undefendable, its simply that certain ships best defense is to avoid engaging in combat. Or simply use a scout in a shuttle or noobship.
But NO!! We are still seeing those lonely haulers out there and only because they know they are able to escape the consequences of their own lack of foresight. Anyway forget haulers, I have seen every shiptype do this, armed to the teeth or not.
F4T4L is Recruiting! |
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Ja'kar
MAFIA
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Posted - 2006.12.05 13:06:00 -
[71]
Edited by: Ja''kar on 05/12/2006 13:07:12 ok lets flip it what if pirates could make u log of while ur ship was still in space to get a kill (after all its only a point of view), how would you feel?
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DropZone 187
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Posted - 2006.12.05 13:14:00 -
[72]
Originally by: Ja'kar Edited by: Ja''kar on 05/12/2006 13:07:12 ok lets flip it what if pirates could make u log of while ur ship was still in space to get a kill (after all its only a point of view), how would you feel?
Dumb piwats don't do that already with lag generation? Ask most of the haulers popped and they would probably tell you that all they saw was them jumping and then ending up in a station.....
As I said earlier, lame. Take the page out of BoB's book and kill them faster. If you can't go find another profession such as station sanitation inspector or something....
Evolution at its best. This is just darwinism. Whatever, you can figure out the point. Oops, dumb piwats won't, sorry about that but it isn't worth explaining.
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Neko Makai
Black Lance Dusk and Dawn
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Posted - 2006.12.05 13:18:00 -
[73]
Edited by: Neko Makai on 05/12/2006 13:20:22
Originally by: Starleena It all boils down to point of view. Let me explain that with a little history lesson.
Durring the revolutionary war, were americans cowards for hiding in trenches and behind trees and not fighting toe to toe with the british? In the british mind, most likely, yes. In the americans minds, hell no. Take cover! Get out of the line of fire! Do whatever it takes to survive! Live to fight another day! Some may say that makes americans cowards, but guess what, americans won the war!
Does logging off to avoid certain death make you a coward? Point of view. Some think 4 battleships poping and pod killing a lonely cargo hauler for nothing more that there enjoyment is cowardess. Point of view. Everyone has there own point of view. When your trying to kill someone, I guarentee the person your trying to kill will have a different point of view about the situation than you do.
The americans used Guerrilla Tactics, your telling me that its the same if haulers used a UNINTENDED break in the game code (logging in bubbles)? Hmm, maybe if the indy had fit a mwd and several nanos, inertia stabs(ive used this setup effectivly before :D) id say they were on equal grounds with the american "Cowardness as some people say" but id say good game to that indy (specially if he survived).
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Ishquar Teh'Sainte
Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed
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Posted - 2006.12.05 13:20:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Starleena It all boils down to point of view. Let me explain that with a little history lesson.
Durring the revolutionary war, were americans cowards for hiding in trenches and behind trees and not fighting toe to toe with the british? In the british mind, most likely, yes. In the americans minds, hell no. Take cover! Get out of the line of fire! Do whatever it takes to survive! Live to fight another day! Some may say that makes americans cowards, but guess what, americans won the war!
Does logging off to avoid certain death make you a coward? Point of view. Some think 4 battleships poping and pod killing a lonely cargo hauler for nothing more that there enjoyment is cowardess. Point of view. Everyone has there own point of view. When your trying to kill someone, I guarentee the person your trying to kill will have a different point of view about the situation than you do.
the difference is - people who fought (and died) in wars don't respawn in a clone bay.
so please stop using absolute ridicolous "analogies".
what do you have to lose? some bits and bytes.
___________________
EVE: Revelations - The Game for Carebears and Gankbears
no more skill needed for PvP - only skillpoints for Large Bubble and CovOps n00b-alts |
Kuolematon
Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United
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Posted - 2006.12.05 13:22:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Arondor then stay in empire, accept the risks of 0.0 or low sec or stay out of it. Does it hurt of course it does, but for me that is what makes pvp exhilarating.
Wait, where did I say that I don't go to 0.0 or I use logoffski tactics? Oh dear your not the sharpest pencil around here, or what? There is this stuff called "Jump Clones" that protects your implants and also, currently buying isk is cheap and +3 set costs pennies so no problem. "It's great being Amarr, ain't it?Ö"
"A world without pain" |
Hober Zarel
Red Frog Investments Daikoku Trade Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.12.05 13:47:00 -
[76]
People engaged in combat, trapped in a gatecamp or otherwise in a hostile envirenment should not be able to save their ships by logging off. Maybe their pod, but most defenately not ships, cargo and equipment.
If players should loose ships due to disconnects or other _real_ computer problemes, so be it.
You may think I'm a pirat, but in fact I'm a trader who have lost ships and cargo at more than one occation. I will try to run, but haven't even considered logging off to save my ship. Use jumpclones to save you're implants and never travel in something you can't replace.
If you can't avvoid a fight by using ingame tools (map, scouts, intel) then you deserve to get caught. Of course sometimes you're just unlycky, but thats all part of the game.
/me puts on flamesuit
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Raquel Smith
Caldari Freedom-Technologies Knights Of the Southerncross
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Posted - 2006.12.05 13:49:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Sinnbad Mayhem I have seen ASCN, BOB, and every other alliance logoffski in recent days. Sometimes for no reason other than to save their silly pods.
Do you ppl realize your killing this game? Do you realize your taking the joy out of the kill?
I dont wear stabs and if I get tagged in PVP, I go down fighting. Sure I have gate camped but why not? Protecting alliance space is what we do. Nothing more. I never ransom but have jokenly asked for isk and been told to shut up by my CEO. Thats cool. I joke around alot.
I am not suggesting evading PVP is dishonorable. No not at all. If you use your scanner to avoid my bubble, all the power to you. If you see me at a gate and I out number you and you run, thats fine. Only fools fight a fight they cant win.
But remember the next time you logoff in a fight or in a bubble, you are killing the game.
Flame me, war dec me, kill me. But just dont logoffski.
Peace
S&M
So quit if you don't like it.
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Kryss Darkdust
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Posted - 2006.12.05 13:49:00 -
[78]
Edited by: Kryss Darkdust on 05/12/2006 13:51:33 Edited by: Kryss Darkdust on 05/12/2006 13:51:12
Originally by: Sinnbad Mayhem I have seen ASCN, BOB, and every other alliance logoffski in recent days. Sometimes for no reason other than to save their silly pods.
Do you ppl realize your killing this game? Do you realize your taking the joy out of the kill?
I dont wear stabs and if I get tagged in PVP, I go down fighting. Sure I have gate camped but why not? Protecting alliance space is what we do. Nothing more. I never ransom but have jokenly asked for isk and been told to shut up by my CEO. Thats cool. I joke around alot.
I am not suggesting evading PVP is dishonorable. No not at all. If you use your scanner to avoid my bubble, all the power to you. If you see me at a gate and I out number you and you run, thats fine. Only fools fight a fight they cant win.
But remember the next time you logoff in a fight or in a bubble, you are killing the game.
Flame me, war dec me, kill me. But just dont logoffski.
Peace
S&M
logging out during combat no longer saves your ship. I have seen it tested twice, with the new patch if you are engaged and you log off your ship remains in space and the combat continues until you are dead. You can't get the pod, simply because it insta warps away after the ship blows, but you can blow up the ship. So I guess the problem is not 100% solved, but at least you know that you can get the ship which in my view is the most important thing anyway. Are you are gamer? www.playhardliveeasy.blogspot.com |
Oku Kee'lus
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Posted - 2006.12.05 13:50:00 -
[79]
The problem is that people are taking advantage of the fact that CCP doesn't want to punish players who CTD.
It's selfish beyond believe, CCP threw players a bone and they abuse it.
This just confirms other companies in their way of doing customer service.
The people who abuse this have it coming when CCP corrects this issue, and, decide to ignore petitions that involve players losing ships/pods due to CTDs.
Logoffski's will eventually make the game worse, for everybody :(
| Here there be Rangers |
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Vim
Spiritus Draconis
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Posted - 2006.12.05 14:04:00 -
[80]
Get a probing alt and have around your pvp char, works wonders nowdays /* Teach a rookie today watch him takedown a battleship tomorrow... */ |
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Starleena
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Posted - 2006.12.05 14:07:00 -
[81]
What, no one liked my history lesson? That to bad, I was quite proud of that! Heres another senerio for ya...
A man breaks into your appartment with a gun. Do you stand there and say " ok Mr. Robber, you broke in fair and square, I should of had bars on the windows or a security system so go ahead and kill me, I deserve it" or are you gonna do anything you can to survive, run for the bed room and get your gun, dive out the window and try to get away, grab a bat and hope you hit him before he hits you?
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Avaleric
Amarr Afterlife inc
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Posted - 2006.12.05 14:07:00 -
[82]
Originally by: Sinnbad Mayhem I have seen ASCN, BOB, and every other alliance logoffski in recent days. Sometimes for no reason other than to save their silly pods.
Do you ppl realize your killing this game? Do you realize your taking the joy out of the kill?
I dont wear stabs and if I get tagged in PVP, I go down fighting. Sure I have gate camped but why not? Protecting alliance space is what we do. Nothing more. I never ransom but have jokenly asked for isk and been told to shut up by my CEO. Thats cool. I joke around alot.
I am not suggesting evading PVP is dishonorable. No not at all. If you use your scanner to avoid my bubble, all the power to you. If you see me at a gate and I out number you and you run, thats fine. Only fools fight a fight they cant win.
But remember the next time you logoff in a fight or in a bubble, you are killing the game.
Flame me, war dec me, kill me. But just dont logoffski.
Peace
S&M
Oh woo-boo-hoo.
Stop pod-killing and people won't log out...
- Ignorance is bliss... |
Crumplecorn
Gallente Aerial Boundaries Inc. Interstellar Starbase Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.12.05 14:15:00 -
[83]
Originally by: Starleena What, no one liked my history lesson? That to bad, I was quite proud of that! Heres another senerio for ya...
A man breaks into your appartment with a gun. Do you stand there and say " ok Mr. Robber, you broke in fair and square, I should of had bars on the windows or a security system so go ahead and kill me, I deserve it" or are you gonna do anything you can to survive, run for the bed room and get your gun, dive out the window and try to get away, grab a bat and hope you hit him before he hits you?
You just don't get it, do you? This is a game. In a game cheating is not a valid option. ----------
IBTL \o/ EVE is upside down! WTZ+Slower Warp=Win |
NIkis
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Posted - 2006.12.05 14:15:00 -
[84]
Edited by: NIkis on 05/12/2006 14:18:26
Originally by: Avaleric
Oh woo-boo-hoo.
Stop pod-killing and people won't log out...
there's a good point here
what about people who got bountys on their pod tho that would be about the only situation when pod killing is profitable
PS for the advocates Look at it from both sides too... people who log off are takin the others' pleasure (?) of blowing their pod to bits, but also the latter determine the first ones to log off thus taking away game time i think its balanced
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Plutoinum
German Cyberdome Corp Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2006.12.05 14:18:00 -
[85]
Edited by: Plutoinum on 05/12/2006 14:28:43
Originally by: Kryss Darkdust
logging out during combat no longer saves your ship. I have seen it tested twice, with the new patch if you are engaged and you log off your ship remains in space and the combat continues until you are dead. You can't get the pod, simply because it insta warps away after the ship blows, but you can blow up the ship. So I guess the problem is not 100% solved, but at least you know that you can get the ship which in my view is the most important thing anyway.
That was always the case, when you got scrambled with a warp scrambler/disruptor-module and the aggression started, before you logged imho.
People are angry, because players log, before they can be aggressed like after jumping through a gate while still being cloaked or when landing in a bubble. ( Bubbles neither aggress, nor do they hold people who log )
E.g. if I sit in a freighter and someone warps on top off me, I can just ctrl-q, before the guy is fully out of warp and gets a lock and one minute later the freighter disappears from space, no matter what the guy does. If he doesn't scramble me, the freighter warps off, if he scrambles me, the freighter will just disappear after one minute.
Not really how it's meant to be played.
CTD/con-loss vs. log-out. A proposal for a fix. |
Drykor
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Posted - 2006.12.05 14:41:00 -
[86]
Originally by: Black Scorpio
On the contrary my friend. In RL there is a LOT of ways to cheat the system and other people. People do it every day. To think otherwise you're purely naive!
Right 'my friend', you just don't grasp the meaning of this and make a wrong comparision. Cheating the system in Eve is like cheating the basic physical laws in real life, it doesn't compare to some government laws where you'd cheat on taxes or something, it would be like simply saying that gravity doesn't apply to you. If you want to 'cheat' on the robber by setting up a trap, pretending you're asleep while you're awake with a gun in your hand, that's all fine with me. But don't pretend that you can just escape from the universe itself and it will be fine because 'people cheat the system'
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Rumata
Rage and Terror Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2006.12.05 14:42:00 -
[87]
And login trap - a control shot in a head. omg we killed eve
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Tum's babe
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Posted - 2006.12.05 14:46:00 -
[88]
Sure I might get ****ed when someone manages tto escape from a bubble by logging off but I won't ***** about it. Suppose they just managed to work the system to their advantage. Plus, if you aren't scrambling anything bigger then a ceptor at a gate camp before they log...you just suck and they deserve to get away.
So, either get better at catching loggers and probbing them down, or stfu :)
peace out
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Arondor
GalacTECH Unlimited
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Posted - 2006.12.05 14:52:00 -
[89]
Originally by: Kuolematon
Originally by: Arondor then stay in empire, accept the risks of 0.0 or low sec or stay out of it. Does it hurt of course it does, but for me that is what makes pvp exhilarating.
Wait, where did I say that I don't go to 0.0 or I use logoffski tactics? Oh dear your not the sharpest pencil around here, or what? There is this stuff called "Jump Clones" that protects your implants and also, currently buying isk is cheap and +3 set costs pennies so no problem.
I implied it from you sounding like you were supporting the fact that people log off to save their implants, if that is not what you meant, more than a line might have been warranted. Either way it sounds like we're both agreeing that getting podded isn't the worst thing in the world.
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Black Scorpio
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Posted - 2006.12.05 14:57:00 -
[90]
Originally by: Drykor
Originally by: Black Scorpio
On the contrary my friend. In RL there is a LOT of ways to cheat the system and other people. People do it every day. To think otherwise you're purely naive!
Right 'my friend', you just don't grasp the meaning of this and make a wrong comparision. Cheating the system in Eve is like cheating the basic physical laws in real life, it doesn't compare to some government laws where you'd cheat on taxes or something, it would be like simply saying that gravity doesn't apply to you. If you want to 'cheat' on the robber by setting up a trap, pretending you're asleep while you're awake with a gun in your hand, that's all fine with me. But don't pretend that you can just escape from the universe itself and it will be fine because 'people cheat the system'
Unfair tactics in game are "the universe itself"? well tbh, i will use unfair tactics to what i consider unfair, and I will show "lack of balls" to what i deem as "lack of balls" on the other side. To restore the balance! Amen!
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