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Zadrot Huyzabey	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:23:00 - [1] I m a somewhat new player to EVE, my character has some odd 5.5 mil SP and here is the deal. Right after Revelation patch I set learning mechanic and survey to level 5 to enable me to get salvaging. I spent whole week of geting these next to totally uselless skills and as soon as I learn them the requirements for salvaging are lowered. So I spent 1 week learning skills which I do not need. Ok **** happens. And lowering requirements for salvaging is a good thing. But how about a possiblity to convert some unnecessary skills to SP, maybe for a fee. I know this is possible in many other MRPGs why not give it a shot in EVE?
Tranka Verrane	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:27:00 - [2] Edited by: Tranka Verrane on 05/12/2006 17:27:52 Such a change wouldn't reflect the state of affairs in the real world; many times new technology comes out which means something you have learnt is redundant (I was taught many programming languages at school all of which are now extinct), you just have to roll with it. Oh and by the way, snap, i have the same sp as you. This game has the logest period of noob status of anything ive come across gaming wise.
Phoenix Lonestar Litanies of Hate	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:28:00 - [3] Respecs would be awful nice. I'm sure I could reassign some of the wasted skills I learned back when I was a noob and didn't know any better. Would be nice, but never gonna happen.
Deitre Cibrus Chickens with an Attitude	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:29:00 - [4] You'll need Mechanic V in the future (Assault frigates/Heavy assault cruisers/command ships) but yeh survey V is useless :P ----------- Originally by: Santiago Cortes Please don't derail your own thread. What is this sig missing?
Siigari Kitawa Gallente HelpCorp United Eden's Fire	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:29:00 - [5] Originally by: Phoenix Lonestar Respecs would be awful nice. I'm sure I could reassign some of the wasted skills I learned back when I was a noob and didn't know any better. Would be nice, but never gonna happen. All those points you put in "Home cooking" aren't working for you? <3 :p
IDesert FoxI	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:29:00 - [6] Mechanic 5 isnt that bad......
Taedrin Gallente Mercatoris Technologies	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:30:00 - [7] Oh man, I would LOVE a respec. Right now my skills are half minmatar ships, half gallente ships, half shield tanking, half armor tanking, half gunnery, half missiles. If I had just gone straight minmatar or gallente I would probably be flying T2 fitted Battleships by now.
Malcanis	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:31:00 - [8] Mechanics 5 is far from "totally useless". Neither is Survy 5, come to that.
Phyrr Minmatar The Gosimer and Scarab	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:31:00 - [9] Survey 5 isn't bad either it aids your scanning times. Mechanic 5 is useful for t2 ships, for the bonuses it gives you and is required for the skills needed to access R&D agents. Stop whining for the sake of whining.
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:31:00 - [10] Originally by: Deitre Cibrus but yeh survey V is useless :P archaeology _____ -sig- This is my only char. These are my skills Always question everything, including yourself

Jiekon	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:31:00 - [11] Edited by: Jiekon on 05/12/2006 17:59:10 having survey 5 will help while salvaging wrecks, i believe (although, i may be wrong) that it reduces scan time of the salvager module. Actually, i`m wrong, Survey doesn't reduce the scan time ___________________________ ~Jiekon Known Issues Bug Reporting ███████████████ ███████████████ ███████████████ ███████████████ ███████████████

techzer0	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:32:00 - [12] They may be useless skills to you currently, but I've had mechanic 5 for a while as it is required for Assault Ships, and Assault ships is required for Heavy Assault Ships... so yeah, I only minded the training up survey, even though it's been on my list of skills to get, because I want Archaeology... Really, it depends on where you want your character to go, and as for useless skills, the only ones I hate are Learning :)
Baleorg Gallente Guys of Sarcasm	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:32:00 - [13] Originally by: Jiekon (although, i may be wrong) yes ^^ afaik :-P --- BTW: A GOOD Cache-Cleaner
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:33:00 - [14] Originally by: Jiekon having survey 5 will help while salvaging wrecks, i believe (although, i may be wrong) that it reduces scan time of the salvager module. yes you are (wrong) _____ -sig- This is my only char. These are my skills Always question everything, including yourself
Siigari Kitawa Gallente HelpCorp United Eden's Fire	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:33:00 - [15] Originally by: Jiekon having survey 5 will help while salvaging wrecks, i believe (although, i may be wrong) that it reduces scan time of the salvager module. Jiekon, haven't you learned to stop posting? :P Actually in this case though, you are actually right :eng101: The fact that you can use Survey to loot wrecks faster will be the skill that separates the true Salvagers from the Wanna-bes.
techzer0	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:34:00 - [16] Originally by: Taedrin Oh man, I would LOVE a respec. Right now my skills are half minmatar ships, half gallente ships, half shield tanking, half armor tanking, half gunnery, half missiles. There with you... lol, but I don't count it as useless because I plan to be lpaying long enough to us them all :)
Dark 0men	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:36:00 - [17] Please please let me delete Controlled Bursts 4.
Trollin	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:38:00 - [18] I am a somewhat new player to eve, my character had just bought a nice shiney Raven, with some really cool named launchers, and a bunch of named shield mods. Right after I jumped into the Utopia system from Doril, I got killed by some barbarians that live there... I think it was Lopez and Pham, and Tzaiwyn... OK, **** happens.. and letting them defend their claimed territory is a good thing. But how about a possibility to sneak back in to Utopia and... grab my disabled Raven, with all the gear still on it.. I know this is possible in many other MRPG's why not give it a shot in EVE? --------------------------------------------------- A word to the wise ain't necessary, its the stupid ones that need the advice
aimez	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:38:00 - [19] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Originally by: Jiekon having survey 5 will help while salvaging wrecks, i believe (although, i may be wrong) that it reduces scan time of the salvager module. Jiekon, haven't you learned to stop posting? :P Actually in this case though, you are actually right :eng101: The fact that you can use Survey to loot wrecks faster will be the skill that separates the true Salvagers from the Wanna-bes. seperate the boys from the man i disagree with skills backtraining in some other topic about it somebody wrote "the skills you have trained reflect your history in eve" and i quite agree with the guy who said that when you have 50 mil sp, fly cariers and dreads, roam arround in faction bs, you will look at your skilltree, see survey level 5 and smile remembering this topic
Avernus Gallente Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:40:00 - [20] Originally by: Dark 0men Please please let me delete Controlled Bursts 4. If you want to be strong in gunnery in the future, expect to train all 4 of the rank 2 gunnery skills up to L5. Well worth the time. Blog
Avernus Gallente Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:42:00 - [21] Originally by: Trollin I am a somewhat new player to eve, my character had just bought a nice shiney Raven, with some really cool named launchers, and a bunch of named shield mods. Right after I jumped into the Utopia system from Doril, I got killed by some barbarians that live there... I think it was Lopez and Pham, and Tzaiwyn... OK, **** happens.. and letting them defend their claimed territory is a good thing. But how about a possibility to sneak back in to Utopia and... grab my disabled Raven, with all the gear still on it.. I know this is possible in many other MRPG's why not give it a shot in EVE? AHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!! KILL KILL KILL!!!! Blog
Ryan Scouse'UK	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:42:00 - [22] Originally by: Jiekon having survey 5 will help while salvaging wrecks, i believe (although, i may be wrong) that it reduces scan time of the salvager module. You would be wrong , not the 1st time either ;)
herps	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:43:00 - [23] my guess would be that in the long run learning any skill is not waste of time and will make you feel greatful that you invested the time in training it i have just over 1.5m sp and despite the temptation i am concentrateing on getting learning / advanced learning skills up to lvl 5 and 4 respectively .... despite the fact i will not really see the benefit of this for some timje its a skill sink that i have been told by the comunity to trust in ... and even though i am quite new ( a month ) and i would not trust the majority till i get to know them i would trust the advice if there is no chance of harming me ( being told by many diff people helps )
Bazman Caldari Shinra Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:43:00 - [24] Originally by: Avernus Originally by: Dark 0men Please please let me delete Controlled Bursts 4. If you want to be strong in gunnery in the future, expect to train all 4 of the rank 2 gunnery skills up to L5. Well worth the time. Funnily enough, you don't need controlled bursts if your minmatar :P ----- OMG READ TUXFORD!!!1
Plutoinum German Cyberdome Corp Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:44:00 - [25] Perhaps someday you want to train archaeology. Think you need survey V for it. CTD/con-loss vs. log-out. A proposal for a fix.
Nocturnal Prince Tech 2 Holdings Limited	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:46:00 - [26] I could be wrong but I believe she wants to lose controled bursts because projectiles dont use cap anymore... however if blasters bacame the next uber pwn Im sure that skill would be fashionable once more. btw, blasters are not the pwn nor did I imply they would be in the future. .
Billy Sastard Amarr Zephyr Enterprises Inc. Astral Wolves	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:48:00 - [27] Originally by: Trollin I am a somewhat new player to eve, my character had just bought a nice shiney Raven, with some really cool named launchers, and a bunch of named shield mods. Right after I jumped into the Utopia system from Doril, I got killed by some barbarians that live there... I think it was Lopez and Pham, and Tzaiwyn... OK, ** happens.. and letting them defend their claimed territory is a good thing. But how about a possibility to sneak back in to Utopia and... grab my disabled Raven, with all the gear still on it.. I know this is possible in many other MRPG's why not give it a shot in EVE? W..T..F..???** This is not WOW, please don't even go there... Remove the isk grind and what are you left with? If you want to sneak back in, you can maybe get some modules from the wreck of your raven, but chances are the defenders have already looted the wreck and distributed the booty. Just be glad you made it out with your skills intact. Corpse runs FFS..?! Please no,.... just NO. -=^=-
ifeelit2 Gallente Just Cloned Again	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:53:00 - [28] i don't see what this idea would accomplish.. if you do not need the skill now you may in the future and are a few steps ahead of others... as for survey 5, you need it for archeaology which you need to complete some cosmos missions... i just want them to lower the requirement for hacking :)... come on CCP.. you dropped Salvage to level 3's to learn... at least drop Hacking to Electronics Upgrade 4... Just Cloned Again JCA Corp our webpage works on the in game browser
Aphotic Raven Gallente Spectral Armada Eternal Empire	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:53:00 - [29] Originally by: Avernus Originally by: Trollin I am a somewhat new player to eve, my character had just bought a nice shiney Raven, with some really cool named launchers, and a bunch of named shield mods. Right after I jumped into the Utopia system from Doril, I got killed by some barbarians that live there... I think it was Lopez and Pham, and Tzaiwyn... OK, ** happens.. and letting them defend their claimed territory is a good thing. But how about a possibility to sneak back in to Utopia and... grab my disabled Raven, with all the gear still on it.. I know this is possible in many other MRPG's why not give it a shot in EVE? AHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!! KILL KILL KILL!!!! TARGET THE POD! GANK IT! GAAANK IIIT! AND SEND HIM BACK TO THE FIERY PITS OF WoW. Quote: Melicien Tetro: I tried to fight a shark with a pistol underwater once, and I'll be ed if he didn't laugh at me and eat me. Sharks need a ***** nerf. True story
Mark666 Ichirin	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:54:00 - [30] I think some people failed to realise that Trollin was um.... Trollin.
Mark666 Ichirin	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:54:00 - [31] I think some people failed to realise that Trollin was um.... Trollin.
Zadrot Huyzabey	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:54:00 - [32] Thanks a lot - did not expect so many replies The point is not that mechanic 5 and survey 5 are useless - for someone they look that way for someone not. The point is that people do make mistakes sometimes and when it comes to skills in many other MRPGs there is a possibility to correct these mistakes - namely respec. I admit that EVE is somewhat different - there is no limit for your skills here - so your mistake will only cost you some time and isk. However why not make it possible to respec? The idea is not that alien for EVE - all new chars receive 800 k SP for free since Revelation. I think the respec should not be made for free - possibly it should cost isk like clones or maybe require a special skill. But it would be nice
Tao Han Caldari Earth Day Corporation	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:00:00 - [33] Originally by: Mark666 I think some people failed to realise that Trollin was um.... Trollin. Meh, I was just about to post that.. Saving the world, one bottle at the time
Tao Han Caldari Earth Day Corporation	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:00:00 - [34] Originally by: Mark666 I think some people failed to realise that Trollin was um.... Trollin. Meh, I was just about to post that.. Saving the world, one bottle at the time
Taedrin Gallente Mercatoris Technologies	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:03:00 - [35] Originally by: techzer0 Originally by: Taedrin Oh man, I would LOVE a respec. Right now my skills are half minmatar ships, half gallente ships, half shield tanking, half armor tanking, half gunnery, half missiles. There with you... lol, but I don't count it as useless because I plan to be lpaying long enough to us them all :) Actually, it's been fairly useful for flying my typhoon, since that ship uses so many different skills. The only thing that isn't doing me any good are my gallente ships and shield tanking skills. Of course having good shield tanking skills is nice to have even on an armor tanker
Taedrin Gallente Mercatoris Technologies	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:03:00 - [36] Originally by: techzer0 Originally by: Taedrin Oh man, I would LOVE a respec. Right now my skills are half minmatar ships, half gallente ships, half shield tanking, half armor tanking, half gunnery, half missiles. There with you... lol, but I don't count it as useless because I plan to be lpaying long enough to us them all :) Actually, it's been fairly useful for flying my typhoon, since that ship uses so many different skills. The only thing that isn't doing me any good are my gallente ships and shield tanking skills. Of course having good shield tanking skills is nice to have even on an armor tanker
140	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:07:00 - [37] Id like the option to delete skills from my character sheet, i dont want to put the sp elsewhere, i just want to get rid of all the anooying skills taking up space
140	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:07:00 - [38] Id like the option to delete skills from my character sheet, i dont want to put the sp elsewhere, i just want to get rid of all the anooying skills taking up space
Anjerrai Meloanis Minmatar Omerta Syndicate Exuro Mortis	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:08:00 - [39] maybe you could just reverse train skills for the same amount of time required to train them? that would be fairly pointless though, haha.x uh.
Anjerrai Meloanis Minmatar Omerta Syndicate Exuro Mortis	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:08:00 - [40] maybe you could just reverse train skills for the same amount of time required to train them? that would be fairly pointless though, haha.x uh.
Phrixus Zephyr Yesodic Nomads Corp Triumvirate.	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:12:00 - [41] Neo: "I don't know kungfu" Morphius: "Show me..." Morphius flying knee drop hits you perfectly, ending the film. Originally by: Victor Ramirez using it to get the layout of a new system and a quick belt-check is about as practical as using Google Earth to see if your car is still in front of your house.
Phrixus Zephyr Yesodic Nomads Corp Triumvirate.	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:12:00 - [42] Neo: "I don't know kungfu" Morphius: "Show me..." Morphius flying knee drop hits you perfectly, ending the film. Originally by: Victor Ramirez using it to get the layout of a new system and a quick belt-check is about as practical as using Google Earth to see if your car is still in front of your house.
DefJam101 Gallente Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:14:00 - [43] To the OP Once your past 4-5mill SP I wouldn't really call you a "new player"... And this is a good idea up until the point where: If your attributes suck (Like me) I then train skills that I have my best attributes in, then detrain the skill and put the SP into skills I want. Since I was one of the unlucky peopel who started with numerically less SP than other classes, and had 4 base perception and 6 base willpower and it took me 26 days to train Medium Hybrid 5, I would obviously prefer that they just equalized all 'butes and let implants decide. But im sure the swarms of Minmatarr/Caldari people who have 20+ in all attributes(unlike me who will never have above 20 in any of them) will say no. ***
DefJam101 Gallente Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:14:00 - [44] To the OP Once your past 4-5mill SP I wouldn't really call you a "new player"... And this is a good idea up until the point where: If your attributes suck (Like me) I then train skills that I have my best attributes in, then detrain the skill and put the SP into skills I want. Since I was one of the unlucky peopel who started with numerically less SP than other classes, and had 4 base perception and 6 base willpower and it took me 26 days to train Medium Hybrid 5, I would obviously prefer that they just equalized all 'butes and let implants decide. But im sure the swarms of Minmatarr/Caldari people who have 20+ in all attributes(unlike me who will never have above 20 in any of them) will say no. ***
Patch86 Di-Tron Heavy Industries Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:35:00 - [45] Of course I'd have really liked the ability to detrain Drone Navigation V, but luckily I found out about it's horrible consequences before it got anywhere near finishing. Poor peeps who did optimisitcally train it, though.......... Lvl 4 = Uber fast drones of death. Lvl 5 = too fast to actually hit their target................. -----------------------------------------------
Patch86 Di-Tron Heavy Industries Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:35:00 - [46] Of course I'd have really liked the ability to detrain Drone Navigation V, but luckily I found out about it's horrible consequences before it got anywhere near finishing. Poor peeps who did optimisitcally train it, though.......... Lvl 4 = Uber fast drones of death. Lvl 5 = too fast to actually hit their target................. -----------------------------------------------
Ather Ialeas Amarr Karjala Inc. Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:39:00 - [47] Originally by: Patch86 Of course I'd have really liked the ability to detrain Drone Navigation V, but luckily I found out about it's horrible consequences before it got anywhere near finishing. Poor peeps who did optimisitcally train it, though.......... Lvl 4 = Uber fast drones of death. Lvl 5 = too fast to actually hit their target................. Thanks for warning
Ather Ialeas Amarr Karjala Inc. Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:39:00 - [48] Originally by: Patch86 Of course I'd have really liked the ability to detrain Drone Navigation V, but luckily I found out about it's horrible consequences before it got anywhere near finishing. Poor peeps who did optimisitcally train it, though.......... Lvl 4 = Uber fast drones of death. Lvl 5 = too fast to actually hit their target................. Thanks for warning
Kylania Gallente	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:50:00 - [49] Originally by: Zadrot Huyzabey The point is that people do make mistakes sometimes and when it comes to skills in many other MRPGs there is a possibility to correct these mistakes - namely respec. The point is that in EVE you need to take responsibility for your actions, by understanding them before hand and accepting them, no matter what changes. Skill "respec" would simply result in "flavor of the month" characters constantly, the never ending balance nightmare that plagued DAoC. You spent a week or so training Survey IV-V. Big deal. If the skill is "worthless" now, CCP will eventually make it worthwhile. Respec is bad. Accept your choices in EVE. -- Lil Miner Newbie Skills Roadmap \| CCG Card Lookup
Kylania Gallente	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:50:00 - [50] Originally by: Zadrot Huyzabey The point is that people do make mistakes sometimes and when it comes to skills in many other MRPGs there is a possibility to correct these mistakes - namely respec. The point is that in EVE you need to take responsibility for your actions, by understanding them before hand and accepting them, no matter what changes. Skill "respec" would simply result in "flavor of the month" characters constantly, the never ending balance nightmare that plagued DAoC. You spent a week or so training Survey IV-V. Big deal. If the skill is "worthless" now, CCP will eventually make it worthwhile. Respec is bad. Accept your choices in EVE. -- Lil Miner Newbie Skills Roadmap \| CCG Card Lookup
solarwinds ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:57:00 - [51] Edited by: solarwinds on 05/12/2006 18:57:46 GAWD how I'd love to de-train all my Caldari/Amarr/Gallente skills (ships and weapons) and reinvest them. But I can't, and I doubt the devs would want that anyways. A 10mil SP character can become so highly specialized in a certain type of ship to be total pwn against others. Unbalances the game. The learning curve is a part of the balancing process. I could see MAYBE a one time thing to help low SP characters become a little more competitve (how in the blue f@ck can you compete against a 40mil SP character?) but that is about it. It doesn't really penalise anyone, just lets them optimize a little more. Still won't happen until pigs fly.
Fuujin Hadean Drive Yards	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:57:00 - [52] Edited by: Fuujin on 05/12/2006 18:58:09 If you want to respec go back to effing warcraft. Keep it there. Don't bring that garbage over here. Hadean Drive Yards Tier 2 BC Pricing
solarwinds ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:57:00 - [53] Edited by: solarwinds on 05/12/2006 18:57:46 GAWD how I'd love to de-train all my Caldari/Amarr/Gallente skills (ships and weapons) and reinvest them. But I can't, and I doubt the devs would want that anyways. A 10mil SP character can become so highly specialized in a certain type of ship to be total pwn against others. Unbalances the game. The learning curve is a part of the balancing process. I could see MAYBE a one time thing to help low SP characters become a little more competitve (how in the blue f@ck can you compete against a 40mil SP character?) but that is about it. It doesn't really penalise anyone, just lets them optimize a little more. Still won't happen until pigs fly.
Fuujin Hadean Drive Yards	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:57:00 - [54] Edited by: Fuujin on 05/12/2006 18:58:09 If you want to respec go back to effing warcraft. Keep it there. Don't bring that garbage over here. Hadean Drive Yards Tier 2 BC Pricing
Unemployed Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2006.12.05 19:01:00 - [55] Edited by: Unemployed on 05/12/2006 19:02:26 In regard to this topic, I think It would be a really cool implementation. But it would need to have SERIOUS restrictions to be viable. for example, in the entire life of your character your allowed to "untrain" a total of lets say 5 - 10 million skill points. Those skill points could go into a secondary category, called "knowledge burst" or "hindsight" whatever, some name that satisfied role players. Then when you right click skills to train it you are given two options, learn the skill normally, or engage your "hindsight" points and train it instantly. I think if it was added to the game, as long as everyone was given a LIMIT on retrains, that it wouldnt screw the game up. I guess all of this could take place at a special learning facility, like the stations where you buy all your skill books. my thoughts...
Unemployed Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2006.12.05 19:01:00 - [56] Edited by: Unemployed on 05/12/2006 19:02:26 In regard to this topic, I think It would be a really cool implementation. But it would need to have SERIOUS restrictions to be viable. for example, in the entire life of your character your allowed to "untrain" a total of lets say 5 - 10 million skill points. Those skill points could go into a secondary category, called "knowledge burst" or "hindsight" whatever, some name that satisfied role players. Then when you right click skills to train it you are given two options, learn the skill normally, or engage your "hindsight" points and train it instantly. I think if it was added to the game, as long as everyone was given a LIMIT on retrains, that it wouldnt screw the game up. I guess all of this could take place at a special learning facility, like the stations where you buy all your skill books. my thoughts...
mellian Research Associates	Posted - 2006.12.05 19:03:00 - [57] Bah, I am annoyed at the choices I made with my main character almost three years ago when I first played, and haven't since until a month ago. But that is okay! I have a second account with an alt to make things right and already about to surpass my main character. :p -mellian
mellian Research Associates	Posted - 2006.12.05 19:03:00 - [58] Bah, I am annoyed at the choices I made with my main character almost three years ago when I first played, and haven't since until a month ago. But that is okay! I have a second account with an alt to make things right and already about to surpass my main character. :p -mellian
Detavi Kade	Posted - 2006.12.05 19:09:00 - [59] lol respec.... We'll go from "it's great being amarr, ain't it" to "it's great everyone's caldari, ain't it?"
Detavi Kade	Posted - 2006.12.05 19:09:00 - [60] lol respec.... We'll go from "it's great being amarr, ain't it" to "it's great everyone's caldari, ain't it?"
Tsanse Kinske WeMeanYouKnowHarm	Posted - 2006.12.05 19:20:00 - [61] As far as Survey goes, Oveur mentioned yesterday that they'd look into making the skill more useful. * * * In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move. -Douglas Adams, writing about EVE
Tsanse Kinske WeMeanYouKnowHarm	Posted - 2006.12.05 19:20:00 - [62] As far as Survey goes, Oveur mentioned yesterday that they'd look into making the skill more useful. * * * In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move. -Douglas Adams, writing about EVE
Guillame Herschel Gallente Cheers Restaurant and Bar Coalition Of Empires	Posted - 2006.12.05 19:34:00 - [63] Survey is a rank 1 skill, and a basic one for the profession. It's not a lot of SP. Originally by: Tranka Verrane Oh and by the way, snap, i have the same sp as you. This game has the logest period of noob status of anything ive come across gaming wise. Oh and by the way, snap, if you have 5.5 mil SP and are still a noob, it isn't because you lack skill points. -- Guile can always trump hardware --
Guillame Herschel Gallente Cheers Restaurant and Bar Coalition Of Empires	Posted - 2006.12.05 19:34:00 - [64] Survey is a rank 1 skill, and a basic one for the profession. It's not a lot of SP. Originally by: Tranka Verrane Oh and by the way, snap, i have the same sp as you. This game has the logest period of noob status of anything ive come across gaming wise. Oh and by the way, snap, if you have 5.5 mil SP and are still a noob, it isn't because you lack skill points. -- Guile can always trump hardware --
Dark 0men	Posted - 2006.12.05 19:55:00 - [65] Originally by: Avernus Originally by: Dark 0men Please please let me delete Controlled Bursts 4. If you want to be strong in gunnery in the future, expect to train all 4 of the rank 2 gunnery skills up to L5. Well worth the time. As a purely Minmatar spec'd character, controlled bursts does absolutely nothing for me now that cap use has been removed from projectiles. All it is doing right now is making me want to train it to level 5 to make my gunnery skill tree look prettier even though it won't help me in the least. Please CCP, don't make me train controlled bursts 5!
Dark 0men	Posted - 2006.12.05 19:55:00 - [66] Originally by: Avernus Originally by: Dark 0men Please please let me delete Controlled Bursts 4. If you want to be strong in gunnery in the future, expect to train all 4 of the rank 2 gunnery skills up to L5. Well worth the time. As a purely Minmatar spec'd character, controlled bursts does absolutely nothing for me now that cap use has been removed from projectiles. All it is doing right now is making me want to train it to level 5 to make my gunnery skill tree look prettier even though it won't help me in the least. Please CCP, don't make me train controlled bursts 5!
Arii Smith	Posted - 2006.12.05 20:10:00 - [67] The guy who posted about the Raven and finding it disabled was JOKING, you guys need to lighten up...
Arii Smith	Posted - 2006.12.05 20:10:00 - [68] The guy who posted about the Raven and finding it disabled was JOKING, you guys need to lighten up...
Patch86 Di-Tron Heavy Industries Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2006.12.05 20:16:00 - [69] Aside from the few broken skills out there, am I missing something? Training a skill does not exclude you from training a differnet skill aswell. Training something that you did not need in week 3 of your EVE life has no effect on you down the line, aside from a few wasted SP. All it means is that if you ever decide to go ina different direction, or CCP changes a skill to make it more useful, then you'll have a head start. Lots of SP = nothing but good, even if it is in things you'd rather it not be. -----------------------------------------------
Patch86 Di-Tron Heavy Industries Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2006.12.05 20:16:00 - [70] Aside from the few broken skills out there, am I missing something? Training a skill does not exclude you from training a differnet skill aswell. Training something that you did not need in week 3 of your EVE life has no effect on you down the line, aside from a few wasted SP. All it means is that if you ever decide to go ina different direction, or CCP changes a skill to make it more useful, then you'll have a head start. Lots of SP = nothing but good, even if it is in things you'd rather it not be. -----------------------------------------------
Phoenix Jones	Posted - 2006.12.05 20:20:00 - [71] In No Way Shape or FORM will there EVER be a Respec. There is no possible way to determine who gets what points. Skill training talents are caclculated by your present attributes. When an attribute changes (learning skill, implant) all your training times get recalculated. Thats why it takes a person with no learning skills or implants 3 months to learn BS5 vs a person who trained up learning skills (in that case, takes about 30 days). If a respec is implemented, 90% of the char's would be completely overhauled into unbelievable specializations (therefore basically Ganking everybody who has even fathomed the idea of catching up to the leaders). In addition, there is no credible way to determine just how many points a person should aquire, because the time trained is solely dependent on your attributes (to which your first year, they are always in flux). There is a difference between this game and other's in regards to "spec". In all other games, there is a finite point, a actual End # of points you get to spec. In Eve, there is no end. There is no 51 Talent Points you use and thats it. The sole talent pool is solely based on time. Eve is one of the most Forgivable games when it comes to Specing. Because even if you pick the Crappiest Spec on the Planet, it will eventually be useful. In addition, there is no need to respec because there are no Set # of points you get. YOu basically have an unlimited Pool to choose from. The sole factor is time. WHat you are asking for is the time you spent training up Survey 5 back. As much as I would like to say.. Sure. It won't happen. And not because we don't want it to happen, its completely impossible to correctly count and attribute/refund the skill points for such an endeavor (you'd have to go through every character, and retract back 3 to 5 years worth of character data, times killed, implants swapped, learning skills learned, time spent not learning anything, clone death skill loss.. etc etc. Its not Possible, Nor is it actually needed. ---------------The Low Sec Issue------------- Gatecamps that kill all who pass with no remorse and in many cases, no possible way of retaliation, is not PVP.
Phoenix Jones	Posted - 2006.12.05 20:20:00 - [72] In No Way Shape or FORM will there EVER be a Respec. There is no possible way to determine who gets what points. Skill training talents are caclculated by your present attributes. When an attribute changes (learning skill, implant) all your training times get recalculated. Thats why it takes a person with no learning skills or implants 3 months to learn BS5 vs a person who trained up learning skills (in that case, takes about 30 days). If a respec is implemented, 90% of the char's would be completely overhauled into unbelievable specializations (therefore basically Ganking everybody who has even fathomed the idea of catching up to the leaders). In addition, there is no credible way to determine just how many points a person should aquire, because the time trained is solely dependent on your attributes (to which your first year, they are always in flux). There is a difference between this game and other's in regards to "spec". In all other games, there is a finite point, a actual End # of points you get to spec. In Eve, there is no end. There is no 51 Talent Points you use and thats it. The sole talent pool is solely based on time. Eve is one of the most Forgivable games when it comes to Specing. Because even if you pick the Crappiest Spec on the Planet, it will eventually be useful. In addition, there is no need to respec because there are no Set # of points you get. YOu basically have an unlimited Pool to choose from. The sole factor is time. WHat you are asking for is the time you spent training up Survey 5 back. As much as I would like to say.. Sure. It won't happen. And not because we don't want it to happen, its completely impossible to correctly count and attribute/refund the skill points for such an endeavor (you'd have to go through every character, and retract back 3 to 5 years worth of character data, times killed, implants swapped, learning skills learned, time spent not learning anything, clone death skill loss.. etc etc. Its not Possible, Nor is it actually needed. ---------------The Low Sec Issue------------- Gatecamps that kill all who pass with no remorse and in many cases, no possible way of retaliation, is not PVP.
Dark 0men	Posted - 2006.12.05 21:10:00 - [73] Edited by: Dark 0men on 05/12/2006 21:11:06 Originally by: Patch86 Aside from the few broken skills out there, am I missing something? Training a skill does not exclude you from training a differnet skill aswell. Training something that you did not need in week 3 of your EVE life has no effect on you down the line, aside from a few wasted SP. All it means is that if you ever decide to go ina different direction, or CCP changes a skill to make it more useful, then you'll have a head start. Lots of SP = nothing but good, even if it is in things you'd rather it not be. Its purely an aesthetics thing for me. I'm not a miner, nor will I ever be, but I have mining level 1 thanks to character creation and can't get rid of it. Same with controlled bursts which used to be marginally useful, but now doesn't do anything for me, but I have it trained to levle 4. Once I get advanced weapons upgrades 5 and trajectory analysis 5 it will be the only gunnery support skill I won't have at level 5 and will annoy the hell out me. I don't want to get rid of it because it is effecting my character negatively, I want to get rid of it so I can look at my gunnery skill tree and say "Ahh... look how pretty all those support skills to 5 look" while blissfully ignoring the one gunnery support skill which has no effect on me. But now I get to look at my gunnery skill tree and be reminded of that one lousy skill that isn't at 5 and wouldn't help me even if it was at 5. In short, I'm a slave to fashion. Edit: And I don't want the time I invested in that controlled bursts back in any way, shape or form. I just it deleted.
Billy Sastard Amarr Zephyr Enterprises Inc. Astral Wolves	Posted - 2006.12.05 21:38:00 - [74] IF (and I dont think its bloody likely), there was a respec in the game... I feel it would have to be restricted to 10, maybe 15m sp MAX, and when the sp's were given to the player to invest in other skills a certain percentage would have to be lost due to the destructive nature of erasing the neural imprint of the old skills. This would have to be a large percent, maybe even as high as 25%-30%. In addition the respec should be damn expensive, or an extremely rare item that one would get from mission rewards etc. On top of all that, make it so that someone CAN get this device and try to use it a second time, but as soon as it is activated the player is reverted to having 800k sp, distributed according to the corp he was born into. There could even be a small percentage chance that this would happen on the first use, making the use of the retraining device even less appealing. Example: Joe ADHD, who has been playing a while and has 20m sp or so in way too many different skills, decides he is going to drop the 3bil needed for the 1 time use memory recovery device, he then uses it to remove 10m sp of which 7m are available to reassign to new skills. Again, I don't feel that respecs should be added to eve, but if they were, I hope that it is some system like the one I outlined in order to make it an extremely rare occurance. -=^=-
Trollin	Posted - 2006.12.05 21:48:00 - [75] Edited by: Trollin on 05/12/2006 21:50:44 Originally by: Billy Sastard Originally by: Trollin I am a somewhat new player to eve, my character had just bought a nice shiney Raven, with some really cool named launchers, and a bunch of named shield mods. Right after I jumped into the Utopia system from Doril, I got killed by some barbarians that live there... I think it was Lopez and Pham, and Tzaiwyn... OK, ** happens.. and letting them defend their claimed territory is a good thing. But how about a possibility to sneak back in to Utopia and... grab my disabled Raven, with all the gear still on it.. I know this is possible in many other MRPG's why not give it a shot in EVE? W..T..F..??? This is not WOW, please don't even go there... Remove the isk grind and what are you left with? If you want to sneak back in, you can maybe get some modules from the wreck of your raven, but chances are the defenders have already looted the wreck and distributed the booty. Just be glad you made it out with your skills intact. Corpse runs FFS..?! Please no,.... just NO. FFS**... can you not see that it is a parody? you Amarr are too anal. edit: and then you go and outline your little hairbrained plan to allow rare respecs... who here is pushing for the wowification again? --------------------------------------------------- A word to the wise ain't necessary, its the stupid ones that need the advice
Nikla Uthaan Caldari	Posted - 2006.12.05 21:51:00 - [76] 1 scenario why skill respec is a very bad idea. I can fly Caldari Hacs. Oh look! Now I can fly Gallente,, but watch out, now I'm flying Minmataar with full Large Projectile skills! ----------------- One word,, emo,,, The Mishing is an ethnic group in the districts of North Lakhimpur, Sonitput, Dhemaji, Dibrugarh, Sibsagar, Jorhat, Golaghat, Tinsukia of Assam.
James Snowscoran Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate	Posted - 2006.12.05 21:53:00 - [77] Respeccing wouldn't be any fum, it would drastically cut down on the whine threads and I enjoy reading those. -----

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