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The Djego
Hellequin Inc. Mean Coalition
2
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Posted - 2011.12.13 22:30:00 -
[31] - Quote
Opertone wrote:back in the days Gallente were overpowering.
Myrmidon could do 3 km/s, 5 heavy drones tracked like mediums, capacitor vampire NOSF sucked enemies dry, dual rep tank, dual 90% webs. Drakes were laughable, easy pick on noobs with no PvP skills, Myrmidons raped them here and there.
A Myrmidon that could do 3km/s was nanoed and had not much of a tank. Also nobody did nano myrmidons because the nano domi and later the Ishtar did the same thing miles better and rigging a nano setup came at a 100M+ price tag for every hull what made it not attractive for BCs outside specialized fittings to trick single nano HACs into fights with you. This was mostly done with canes or harbingers, because heavy drones never where a relay able weapon against nano HACs, similar as missiles because they where to slow to apply the damage.
I have seen nobody useing dual 90% webs on the myrmidon, because anything you could catch you could hold with a single web.
CCP changed the sig resolution on medium drones, the large ones didn't get changed at all.
Drakes in this days where nearly all purger fitted and just had to kill 2 heavy of the myrmidon to be able to permatank it(it had no spares) assuming it was maxed out on skills and fully gank fitted(what wasn't the case most of the time since you would have seen this people rather in a mega or domi than in a myrmidon). A lot of people actually complained that it was next to impossible to kill a drake solo in another BC.
Opertone wrote:Also back in this times, gallente sensor damps were number one choice for PvP. Very effective.
Funny do you still remember what kind of EW got used on even more hulls before people switched to damps, after a specific nerf? |
Renge Ukyo
Point of No Return Waterboard
5
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Posted - 2011.12.14 12:54:00 -
[32] - Quote
Jeremy Ironforge wrote:^ Wow didn't know the whole dramma of it. Now it's even more unfair.
Flying Gallente isn't fair.
Fly F*cked, Fly Gallente! |
Lady Spank
GET OUT NASTY FACE
460
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Posted - 2011.12.14 13:48:00 -
[33] - Quote
Liang Nuren wrote:Lady Spank wrote:Fly a Keres if looks are more important to you than function. Why choose when you used to have both? -Liang Because no one here has a time machine....
... Plenty of whine machines though! (a¦á_a¦â) ~ http://getoutnastyface.blogspot.com/ ~ (a¦á_a¦â) |
Crazy KSK1
MOJO Mining Manufacturing and Moving
0
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Posted - 2011.12.14 15:05:00 -
[34] - Quote
I heard that ccp some time back changed the armor resist hole from kinetic to explosive is that true? |
Renge Ukyo
Point of No Return Waterboard
5
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Posted - 2011.12.15 11:15:00 -
[35] - Quote
Crazy KSK1 wrote:I heard that ccp some time back changed the armor resist hole from kinetic to explosive is that true?
Nominally yes, that is true. which saddens me greatly since the hole is 10% on gallente hulls -_- |
Jeremy Ironforge
White syndicate R.E.V.O.L.U.T.I.O.N
2
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Posted - 2011.12.20 13:07:00 -
[36] - Quote
So no one feels cheated that Hyperion has 2nd lowest CPU and LOWEST PG of all tier3 Battleships? Seriously even Rokh has more! |
vorneus
Hub2
14
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Posted - 2011.12.20 13:25:00 -
[37] - Quote
Jeremy Ironforge wrote:So no one feels cheated that Hyperion has 2nd lowest CPU and LOWEST PG of all tier3 Battleships? Seriously even Rokh has more!
That does seem rather unfair, given armor mods (particularly large reppers - active tank bonus much?) take more PG than shield ones, but I can sort of understand because the Rohk is designed for rails rather than blasters, which take more PG.
Still, that is a little crummy :(
-Ed |
Renge Ukyo
Point of No Return Waterboard
8
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Posted - 2012.01.12 00:31:00 -
[38] - Quote
I just want to strangle CCP on a daily basis. The Gallente are such a **** of a race to fly. |
Amana Tsasa
Hedion University Amarr Empire
12
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Posted - 2012.01.12 00:45:00 -
[39] - Quote
Jeremy Ironforge wrote:So no one feels cheated that Hyperion has 2nd lowest CPU and LOWEST PG of all tier3 Battleships? Seriously even Rokh has more!
I hate to say it like this, but its foolish to feel cheated, as is the case with everything else 'someone's gotta be the runt' if it wasn't the Hyperion, it would be a different tier 3 BS that would be 2nd lowest. |
Jeremy Ironforge
White syndicate
14
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Posted - 2012.01.22 02:22:00 -
[40] - Quote
Daedalus Arcova wrote:Here's another little Gallente gripe... Why the hell do sleek Gallente ships have such massive signatures (the biggest of all the races), while raggedy-ass Minmatar ships with bits sticking out at all angles have the smallest sigs?
Don't believe me? An armour-tanked Brutix has a bigger sig radius than a shield tanked and rigged Hurricane. That's just not right.
Winmatar strikes again.
Yeah thats ridiculous since gallente is the most MWD reliant race. 40m3 difference now means 200m3 difference when the MWD turns in. Wish they'd change that too. |
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Valea Silpha
Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
25
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Posted - 2012.01.22 02:53:00 -
[41] - Quote
Liang Nuren wrote:Opertone wrote:back in the days Gallente were overpowering.
Myrmidon could do 3 km/s, 5 heavy drones tracked like mediums, capacitor vampire NOSF sucked enemies dry, dual rep tank, dual 90% webs. Drakes were laughable, easy pick on noobs with no PvP skills, Myrmidons raped them here and there.
Guess this is why all that goodness got nerfed. Also back in this times, gallente sensor damps were number one choice for PvP. Very effective.
LOL - even back then the Drake was dramatically superior to the Myrm. You seem to have forgotten that the Drake had the shield recharge of a cruiser and could easily line out a 2-3k DPS passive tank with virtually no invested skills. Furthermore, it had all the advantages that it does today. The Drake had a better Tank/Gank ratio then, it does now, and it will continue to do so. It has always been a better brawler and the only way a Myrmidon ever escaped me (even back then) was if it nos'ed me out and ran like a little *****. Except that back then everyone was all "herp derp, a Drake I'll go kill it because its a noob!" and hundreds of kills just literally fell into my lap. -Liang Ed: And lets just be clear - I trained the Myrm first, and then went to the Drake because it was just that much better. Especially under sentry fire.
I can attest that this is all true.
Sure, its only in the past year that drakes have become a genuine pvp phenomenon, but they've always been just as effective, just that for the most part people didn't fly them in pvp because of 'Loldrake'. Most pvpers didn't have skills in missiles and of course before remote reps were the in thing, armor BS were the kings, so people just forgot about the drake except for PvE. Drakes never had like crazy dps, but they could outlast damn near anything. |
Noisrevbus
69
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Posted - 2012.01.22 03:41:00 -
[42] - Quote
Valea Silpha wrote: I can attest that this is all true.
Sure, its only in the past year that drakes have become a genuine pvp phenomenon, but they've always been just as effective, just that for the most part people didn't fly them in pvp because of 'Loldrake'. Most pvpers didn't have skills in missiles and of course before remote reps were the in thing, armor BS were the kings, so people just forgot about the drake except for PvE. Drakes never had like crazy dps, but they could outlast damn near anything.
If you think the Drake was some hidden gem out there in a world of ignorance waiting to be dusted off, you're quite delusional.
The Drake wasn't used in the oldschool Sniping paradigm because it was too short-ranged and not fast enough to make up for that.
The Drake wasn't used in the oldschool Nano paradigm because it simply wasn't fast enough.
In the RRBS paradigm it couldn't tank DD's or break the chain.
A number of changes popularized it, from the nano-nerf (making it quite sufficient as fire-support in the early post-nano kiting era) to the probing-buff (that changed the sniping paradigm into mobile sniping, where the Drake is quite sufficient between cost-mobility-reach and damage), to the bomber-revamp, to the rigs-buff (where all of a sudden the price difference to a BS became quite distinguishable), especially up until the point when BS insurance got buffed and evened out things a bit again.
It's not like some genius woke up one day and said "guys, you're all doing it wrong".
As far as the Drake go, the only nerf it needs (and i'm going to infer this in more of the post-december CSM minute discussion about them) is a nerf to insurance - since any ship at any level of reasonable overall performance being essentially free to fly is a cancer on this game. You can't grief or murder 'free', the way Mittens imply it. I already mentioned the BS insurance buff, it made sense at the time, in comparson to the BC as they were winning ground. In hindsight though it's becomming glaringly obvious that the BS should not have had an insurance buff - the BC should have had an insurance nerf.
The Drakes problem isn't it's performance - i could easily think of closer to ten counters off the top of my head. People don't fly it for it's impressive performance, they fly it thanks to easily stackable mechanics to a large fleet that don't hurt you the least should you lose it in it's entirety. That's the only real problem with the ship.
If BC and BS got a hefty price-balance overhaul, then the discussion about supercapital profileration would actually make sense. Now it's all a political mess. I like alot of what the Goons are about in this game, but when lobbying for a game where you want as many people flying ships that cost nothing in the greater scheme of things become a reality - then numbers is the only commodity in the game. That's a bad thing for the game as a whole, and why horrible overpowered supercapitals continue to be a balancing factor. Supers are OP, numbers are OP. Nerf the blob, fixing the game (along Mittens' line of thought) become credible.
There is no change this game is in more dire need of than a nerf to grazing enough sheep on a pasture to ruin it's environment. The Drake and the issues revolving around it relate to that problem, and that alone. At smaller scales, all the other BC have redeeming factors that are simply overlooked at 'blob'. |
Batelle
HOMELE55 FORECLOSURE.
2
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Posted - 2012.01.24 05:55:00 -
[43] - Quote
Adding to the Gallente QQ, we got totally shafted in the assault frig buff. |
Hrett
Quantum Cats Syndicate
30
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Posted - 2012.01.24 06:49:00 -
[44] - Quote
Batelle wrote:Adding to the Gallente QQ, we got totally shafted in the assault frig buff.
Enyo. |
Smabs
Higher Than Everest BricK sQuAD.
36
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Posted - 2012.01.24 07:44:00 -
[45] - Quote
The enyo got a 25% damage bonus and an extra mid. That seems pretty good tbh. |
Jeremy Ironforge
White syndicate
14
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Posted - 2012.01.24 08:11:00 -
[46] - Quote
Will 100MB/s bandwith and extra 25m3 dronebay on Myrm obsolete Ishtar? |
Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise Against ALL Authorities
89
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Posted - 2012.01.24 10:35:00 -
[47] - Quote
Jeremy Ironforge wrote:Will 100MB/s bandwith and extra 25m3 dronebay on Myrm obsolete Ishtar?
Ishar still has 125mb .....and the mrym is slow as dirt with a worse tank.
You need 125mb for a full flight of heaviest or sentries.....and myrm only has the bay for a flight of lights and a flight of heaviest anyway
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George Holden
Garoun Investment Bank Gallente Federation
4
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Posted - 2012.01.24 11:42:00 -
[48] - Quote
The Enyo buff seems quite nice to me :> Thinking about dual prop + small rep + full rack of electrons + small nos makes me happy in my pants ^^. Still kinda missing a fourth my on my Diemost :< |
Tanya Powers
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
786
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Posted - 2012.01.24 12:55:00 -
[49] - Quote
Imooo wrote:Doesn't matter what the discussion is about, you can always bet on Alara to turn it about how OP Minmatar is.
Because wolf wolf wolf bites hard and meaww Jaguar knocks your balls so hard you feel them pass by your throat before you spit them by your nose.
Meaw
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X Gallentius
Quantum Cats Syndicate
110
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Posted - 2012.01.24 13:14:00 -
[50] - Quote
/me has two whines. 1. Vexor Navy Issue has only a 100m3 drone bay for a 100m3 drone bandwidth - no flexibility. 2. Exeqeror Navy Issue received no speed boost in the Crucible patch. It would have been great for it to pick up the +5 speed since it's a blaster boat. (Same with Celestis)
I feel better now. |
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Smiling Menace
Star Nebulae Holdings Inc.
113
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Posted - 2012.01.24 13:23:00 -
[51] - Quote
You are all doing it wrong. Train Winmatar and never look back.
Sad that, I, a Gallente character actually said that. I loved blasters and Gallente ships but still no real reason to give up my projectiles even with the buffs of late. |
Tanya Powers
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
786
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Posted - 2012.01.24 13:43:00 -
[52] - Quote
Smiling Menace wrote:You are all doing it wrong. Train Winmatar and never look back. Sad that, I, a Gallente character actually said that. I loved blasters and Gallente ships but still no real reason to give up my projectiles even with the buffs of late.
I could bet my money you'll say exactly the same in another 6 months and probably in a year from now.
Let's hope some day CCP makes some expansion about hybrids rebalance and does some small but important changes on hybrid boats.
Ho w8 ! |
Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise Against ALL Authorities
89
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Posted - 2012.01.24 13:44:00 -
[53] - Quote
Smiling Menace wrote:You are all doing it wrong. Train Winmatar and never look back. Sad that, I, a Gallente character actually said that. I loved blasters and Gallente ships but still no real reason to give up my projectiles even with the buffs of late.
Nor I...
Enyo is going to be mean though, I can't wait to lose a couple. |
mecubed
Amarrian Retribution
3
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Posted - 2012.01.24 15:27:00 -
[54] - Quote
Imooo wrote:Alara IonStorm wrote:Jeremy Ironforge wrote:Why Incursus has the lowest base CPU of all fighting frigs?
So it is that and not the 2 slots less it gets from the other 3 Combat Frigs. Don't worry it gets a Drone. Incursus 8 slots, Rifter 10. Doesn't matter what the discussion is about, you can always bet on Alara to turn it about how OP Minmatar is. And as usually with no concern about the facts. Incursus is not the Gallente counterpart to Rifter so it's only logical it has fewer slots, idiot. Edit: Max von Sydow was quicker pointing this out.
Funny you mentioned about how Alara could turn it to how OP Minnie is.. Stereotypes didnt become stereotypes if they werent true.
You see more minnie ships in use than about everything else.. They are the fastest ships, smallest sig radius, awesome dps, the highest alpha ships in game. Did i mention the most versatile, easiest fitting as well.
Minnie pretty much has the best ship in every class except for t3 in which they are a close 2nd to caldari.
Hmmm, i wonder why people are calling for nerfs, even minnie pilots brag about it. |
Berendas
Clandestine Vector THE SPACE P0LICE
179
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Posted - 2012.01.24 15:47:00 -
[55] - Quote
The Incursus *IS* the counterpart to the Rifter, they are both the t1 assault hulls. The Tristan is the t1 bomber hull - that's all the proof you need.
Any discrepancy with regards to slot layouts is a result of CCP screwing up the frig balance, not people mislabeling ships. CCP has been known to leave glaring problems to fester for years at a time. Remember how many years Amarr were just straight up missing a frigate? It's just another case like that. |
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