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Sensor Damps and ECM Unfair

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Gyro DuAquin1 Tri Optimum Dusk and Dawn	Posted - 2006.12.11 11:29:00 - [31] yeah right...
madaluap Gallente Mercenary Forces Exquisite Malevolance	Posted - 2006.12.11 11:34:00 - [32] Edited by: madaluap on 11/12/2006 11:33:52 Originally by: Gibbal Slogspit Originally by: Hail Xenu 3x T2 sensor damps on an arazu or celestis is really, really powerful. Possibly more than ECM was, since with ecm you had at least a chance at fighting back if jams failed. I wonder if nanophoon with sensor damps as a tank would work... Btw. stilettos with 2x sensor damps are fun. As always you want to fit an IWin ship, its Dominix. Highs - As much heavy nos as possible Meds - MWD, 20km scram, 3 sensor damps Lows - Nanos/Inertias Than you suddenly face a enemy that has more than 1 ship on the gate and he starts firing @ your paperthin boat. Its not that hard to track a bs going 3 km/s @ 20 k. _________________________________________________ Breetime
Felix Dzerzhinsky	Posted - 2006.12.11 11:38:00 - [33] Edited by: Felix Dzerzhinsky on 11/12/2006 11:39:37 While I agree that sensor damps and tracking disruptors are very powerful, it is also a matter of what kind of gang warfare you are dealing with. In small gangs of 5 or so, sensor damps and Arazu style ships are very powerful, seeming possibly overpowered. But start moving up or down in that scale and their effect on combat diminshes exponentially. Ya, sensor damps suck and should be very close range awful falloff mods so should tracking disruptors, the same should be for ECM modules. Yes, all of these 'force multiplyer mods' should be looked at. But is this a question of 'fair' - absolutly not. If you want to use them, no one is stopping you, and if you fear it to such a degree - you can fit tracking enhancer/computers or signal amp/sensor boosters. . . One of the problems with ECM was the chance based element - that no matter how many ECCM mods you put on, you could still be jammed - with sensor damps and tracking disruptors, the negative value is constant, so it is much easier to counter with the right setups. If they need changing, its their range - not their existance.
Dahak2150 HellBrothers Industries	Posted - 2006.12.11 11:44:00 - [34] Originally by: Gibbal Slogspit Originally by: Vardemis Originally by: qwerty007 Originally by: Marquis Dean Obviously you haven't been playing very long. When you reach 2 or so months, and (oh my god!!) dare to venture into losec, you can come back and read this, and realise how stupid you look. I've been playing over 3 years mate, this is just one of my alts. Who looks stupid now. You, after three years you should really know how to counter those modules. I expect next week a topic like: "Nerf guns, I lost a ship to someone shooting me." 1. A Sensor Booster is not enough to counter a ship with around 3 Sensor Dampeners, which is the normal ammount to use. 2. ECCM is a waste of a medium slot You need at least 2 medium slots just to counter this silly disabling EW. I see what he's saying. Unfair is not the word for it though, I would call it poor planning from CCP, and also EW is mainly used because of the lack of other effective medium slot modules. Dampeners should really have a very very poor accuracy falloff, ECM seems fine however seems to be used a hell of a lot on myrmidons, which to me seems they arent detered from using ECM. Having said that fighting a pre-kali iwin domi is even worse now as they fit damps. What!? You mean my one sensor booster doesn't counter their three sensor damps!? Nowai! If you're on IE, pretend this is transparent while you get a better browser.
Romulan Dominiae	Posted - 2006.12.11 12:28:00 - [35] Edited by: Romulan Dominiae on 11/12/2006 12:32:57 Originally by: qwerty007 Not being able to fight back is fair? It's like shooting fishes in a barrel. FIT ECCM OMG like the ECM user YOU would also sacrifice a slot, now i think thats PRETTY fair
Romulan Dominiae	Posted - 2006.12.11 12:32:00 - [36] Edited by: Romulan Dominiae on 11/12/2006 12:32:39 Originally by: qwerty007 Originally by: Marquis Dean Obviously you haven't been playing very long. When you reach 2 or so months, and (oh my god!!) dare to venture into losec, you can come back and read this, and realise how stupid you look. I've been playing over 3 years mate, this is just one of my alts. Who looks stupid now. you, still. sorry. even more now tbh
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2006.12.11 12:35:00 - [37] I've found that ECCM is a very effective module when used. Dulce et decorum est, pro imperator mori It's great being Amarr, ain't it?
qilin S.A.S Cruel Intentions	Posted - 2006.12.11 12:42:00 - [38] lifes unfair, get used to it
Laboratus Gallente BGG Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2006.12.11 13:10:00 - [39] Edited by: Laboratus on 11/12/2006 13:11:36 Edited by: Laboratus on 11/12/2006 13:11:17 Bah. Both are so easy to counter it's just nuts. ECM ---> ECCM or Nos/neut. no cap no active modules. RSD ---> fight close range or fit sensor boosters. SBs are very good modules anyways since you can lock further away and much faster. Fitting 2xSB T2 makes you virtually invul to RSD. Or flying in under 5km. What ever. Frankly RSDs should not have a stacking penalty, since it makes countering them virtually trivial. ___ P.S. Post with your main. Mind control and tin hats
Wanna Kill Caldari Tides of Silence	Posted - 2006.12.11 13:46:00 - [40] Originally by: Dread Phantom Originally by: qwerty007 Originally by: Marquis Dean Obviously you haven't been playing very long. When you reach 2 or so months, and (oh my god!!) dare to venture into losec, you can come back and read this, and realise how stupid you look. I've been playing over 3 years mate, this is just one of my alts. Who looks stupid now. My reaction exactly ---------- Rawr, new sig will be here soon. I'm home!
Radioactive Babe	Posted - 2006.12.11 14:10:00 - [41] Originally by: Risien Drogonne Originally by: Audri Fisher keep the women as sex slaves tbh. I have a feeling most women can beat you up, so good luck with that one. hehehe ... pwned alas, poor risk vs reward, I knew you well
Gibbal Slogspit	Posted - 2006.12.11 14:22:00 - [42] Originally by: Dahak2150 Originally by: Gibbal Slogspit Originally by: Vardemis Originally by: qwerty007 Originally by: Marquis Dean Obviously you haven't been playing very long. When you reach 2 or so months, and (oh my god!!) dare to venture into losec, you can come back and read this, and realise how stupid you look. I've been playing over 3 years mate, this is just one of my alts. Who looks stupid now. You, after three years you should really know how to counter those modules. I expect next week a topic like: "Nerf guns, I lost a ship to someone shooting me." 1. A Sensor Booster is not enough to counter a ship with around 3 Sensor Dampeners, which is the normal ammount to use. 2. ECCM is a waste of a medium slot You need at least 2 medium slots just to counter this silly disabling EW. I see what he's saying. Unfair is not the word for it though, I would call it poor planning from CCP, and also EW is mainly used because of the lack of other effective medium slot modules. Dampeners should really have a very very poor accuracy falloff, ECM seems fine however seems to be used a hell of a lot on myrmidons, which to me seems they arent detered from using ECM. Having said that fighting a pre-kali iwin domi is even worse now as they fit damps. What!? You mean my one sensor booster doesn't counter their three sensor damps!? Nowai! You would fit more than 1 sensor booster to counter RSDs? Doubt it.
Alchimista	Posted - 2006.12.11 14:33:00 - [43] Originally by: qwerty007 Not being able to fight back is fair? It's like shooting fishes in a barrel. Noob
The Anointed Caldari StarBug Industries	Posted - 2006.12.11 14:35:00 - [44] Originally by: qwerty007 Originally by: Marquis Dean Obviously you haven't been playing very long. When you reach 2 or so months, and (oh my god!!) dare to venture into losec, you can come back and read this, and realise how stupid you look. I've been playing over 3 years mate, this is just one of my alts. Who looks stupid now. Im pretty sure its still you. Probably even more so now.
The Anointed Caldari StarBug Industries	Posted - 2006.12.11 14:39:00 - [45] I personally think that ccp should open up completely instanced space. That way everyone that doesnt like the fact that they cant win in every situation could get ported there to play instanced content all day long, where they can beat everything and win eve in a week.
Niskin	Posted - 2006.12.11 17:25:00 - [46] I'm still pretty new to the game but I've read some really good info on ECM and have played with a few setups myself. What people don't seem to understand about fitting ECM is that you have to commit far more slots to use ECM than you do to protect against it. A person fitting ECM is going to have multiple jammers, either racial or mutlispec or a mix of both. That's because you have to fit for any possible ship you might face. However a person protecting against ECM already knows what they are fitting for and can use less slots to get there. In addition when you fit a ship for ECM you generally don't fit it for wtfpwning also. So if you got jammed and then blown up before you could lock again chances are that your ship was so much worse than the one you were fighting that the ECM isn't what did you in. ECM setups are generally for squad or fleet combat, they require help to blow stuff up. So thinking about what is fair and what is not, think of it this way. Unfair would be having you ship blow up automatically when you get jammed. Being jammed only affects your ability to kill, it does not affect your ability to escape or manuever. So what would really be unfair would be if fitting ECM and using it had no real purpose. Currently it has a purpose and it is a fair one. Balance doesn't mean you get what you want, it means both sides have options.
Marquis Dean	Posted - 2006.12.11 20:27:00 - [47] Originally by: Seriya Still you. ECM has just had a massive, massive nerf and is around half as effective as it used to be. You can fight them with amps, with your own ECM (ECM Bursts are pretty effective), FoF missiles, smartbombs, drones, you can warp out and warp back in so they have to rejam you. Plus only the specialist ships are anywhere near consistant jammers now. Originally by: Kehmor /signed. If after 3 years of eve you don't realise how overpowered ecm and damps arn't then you really need to find a new game. Alternatively I offer very competitive rates on basic pvp instruction. Originally by: Vardemis You, after three years you should really know how to counter those modules. I expect next week a topic like: "Nerf guns, I lost a ship to someone shooting me." Originally by: Romulan Dominae you, still. sorry. even more now tbh Originally by: The Anointed Im pretty sure its still you. Probably even more so now. I feel quite vindicated.
Vladimir Norkoff Income Redistribution Service	Posted - 2006.12.11 20:45:00 - [48] What is worse? Posting an obvious flamebait thread, or falling for the bait?.. Come on guys, this is idiot trolling by the OP just to start a fight, let the thread die the lonely death it deserves..
Budz Fergie Caldari Caldari Deep Space Ventures Caldari Deep Space Industral	Posted - 2006.12.11 21:21:00 - [49] Originally by: Gibbal Slogspit Originally by: Hail Xenu 3x T2 sensor damps on an arazu or celestis is really, really powerful. Possibly more than ECM was, since with ecm you had at least a chance at fighting back if jams failed. I wonder if nanophoon with sensor damps as a tank would work... Btw. stilettos with 2x sensor damps are fun. As always you want to fit an IWin ship, its Dominix. Highs - As much heavy nos as possible Meds - MWD, 20km scram, 3 sensor damps Lows - Nanos/Inertias With out any tank? I can kill that easily. damps don't stop fof's and launchers use no power to fire. And drones die quickly to fof's.
Grimpak Gallente Celestial Horizon Corp. Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.12.11 22:22:00 - [50] Originally by: qwerty007 Not being able to fight back is fair? It's like shooting fishes in a barrel. if you are in a fair fight, then you have done something wrong. or smth like that. live by that motto. die by that motto. not applying "fairness" to EVE pvp concept, and you will die much less and kill much more. ------- Originally by: Tiuwaz for caldari perception weapons that hit up to 100km are short range weapons

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