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gyran
Golden Clover Products
0
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Posted - 2015.08.25 15:30:20 -
[1] - Quote
when looking at what it takes to master a battleship time wise and takes almost 2 years to get all the skills that were required for mastery for one battle ship from one race. If i am a new player why would i want to pay for 2 years of game time just to get enough skills to play with the big boys? the big boys being older players with millions of skill points. As a new player why should i pay for this amount of time just to get mastered in one ship when i could spend my money on other games that within a few months of play you are playing with some of the best players in the game. Most other games give players experience based on the activity that are doing in the game yes i know everyone has heard this before.
What i would like to suggest is that skills be both time based for those who like it and activity based for those who like getting skill rewards for in game activities. this lets active new players see a way to catch up some on the skill points with being rewarded for earning skill points for activities in game as well as keeping the time based skill point hour per sp
Combining both might be a better way for all |
Cap James Tkirk
Support Fleet Unit Mortum Ravagers
145
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Posted - 2015.08.25 16:05:26 -
[2] - Quote
this has been suggested many times and now as tehn , NO! this is a terrible idea, it will give advantages to older players and people that can play 23/7.
The current skilling system is perfect everyone is on equal footing. |
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
2382
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Posted - 2015.08.25 20:26:14 -
[3] - Quote
You're just not making the right comparisons. This is incredibly common among newer players. First of all, the mastery categories are... not great. Better than the old certificates were but not actually as helpful as you might think. Second, battleships just aren't that much a part of core gameplay, and utterly mastered battleships are scarce in actual play. My main is sitting on (probably; I haven't checked) mastery 4 for all racial battleships and possibly 5 for some. I haven't used one in... three years? Something like that.
If you want a better comparison, look how long it takes to hit cruiser masteries to 3 or 4. Now, that isn't a perfect guideline, but it's much, much more realistic as far as trying to figure out how long you have to train to be perfectly average and compete with older players on even ground. It's.... not that long. Really.
As for making SP a grind in Eve: no. Hell no. Absolutely not. And "optional"? That's nice. The problem is that it really won't be optional. You can either passively acquire SP OR you can also grind and get more. That's an absolute fool's trade: you have to grind or you "fall behind". The "optional" skill grind is a wolf in a barely passable sheep costume that doesn't so much as bother to hide its canines. Once grinding is an option, grinding is a requirement. |
Do Little
Red Frog Freight Red-Frog
124
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Posted - 2015.08.25 21:43:50 -
[4] - Quote
The skill system in Eve heavily favors newer players - it takes 4 or 5 times as long to train level 5 as it does to train levels 1 through 4 and level 4 gives you 80% of the ability. I like the mastery system but I aim for level 3 as a reasonable goal and may choose to upgrade to T2 weapons beyond that. You'll find that each certificate applies to many ships - once you have Shield Tanking level III certificate you have it for every ship that is designed to fit a shield tank.
To use a battleship for level 4 missions, I would recommend training the hull skill to level 4 to get the hull bonuses and mastery level 3. You'll complete your missions more quickly and more comfortably if you invest the extra month or so to get T2 weapons. |
Mephiztopheleze
Republic University Minmatar Republic
144
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Posted - 2015.08.26 02:10:35 -
[5] - Quote
Here's the thing, a lot of these Level V Mastery thingies have skills in them that no sensible person would ever train to V.
Take the Electronic Warfare and Sensor Linking skills. Level IV in either is more than adequate as it opens up Signal Dispersion and Signal Suppression respectively. Training either to V will just save a little on Capacitor use for ECM/Damps modules. Likewise, Frequency Modulation, which boosts EWAR falloff, is actually almost useless to train beyond III or IV. Yet, the ECM Mastery V thingy requires both Electronic Warfare V and Frequency Modulation V.
The skills that really matter are the ones found under Core Spaceship Operation and Navigation. Mastery V certificates in both of these are well worth pursuing as they'll help with every hull you get into.
Occasional Resident Newbie Correspondent for TMC: http://themittani.com/search/site/mephiztopheleze
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Zihao
Signal Cartel EvE-Scout Enclave
17
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Posted - 2015.08.26 05:15:57 -
[6] - Quote
Train all the things level 3. I'm less than a month old and I am almost complete with this plan and I have no implants. Well, I had a pair, but I learned the hard way they don't last long in wormholes. In all seriousness though, level 2-3 skills are very underrated. They unlock heaps of useful modules and you can ghetto rig all kinds of ships to get the job done.
It's understandable that most of the veteran player base takes "you must get this still to level 4-5 asap," for granted (notable exceptions in this thread <3) since they've had those skills down pat for ages, but if you bother to undock and try to accomplish things in your first days, weeks, etc. ingenuity can stretch a little sp a long way.
Personally, I would hate to see the game move in the direction of active skill training. I prefer the EVE system because I can log in sporadically and not worry about maximizing my training in that time. It's a real godsend when you've got a busy work and family life. |
Mephiztopheleze
Republic University Minmatar Republic
144
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Posted - 2015.08.26 06:47:40 -
[7] - Quote
Zihao wrote: It's understandable that most of the veteran player base takes "you must get this still to level 4-5 asap," for granted...
i'm still pretty n00b, but Thermodynamics V is the ONE skill I believe EVERYONE should train ASAP.
Occasional Resident Newbie Correspondent for TMC: http://themittani.com/search/site/mephiztopheleze
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
5297
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Posted - 2015.08.26 08:13:21 -
[8] - Quote
You can pilot all T1, navy, and pirate faction ships in EVE in about 45 days (that's worst case, as it can be done faster).
If you choose to specialize, you can pilot fewer ships, but significantly better.
The largest class of ships in EVE is medium hulls, closely followed by small hulls. Large hulls, or battleships, are actually a very small class in comparison. The majority of PvP in EVE is done in medium and small hulls.
In fact, stealth bombers (small hulls by the way) have largely forced PvP in battleships to be an excessively risky undertaking. Battleships are very unpopular in the current meta, with only some of the superpowers being able to field them because of a huge amount of support (especially from smaller hulls... like friendly stealth bomber wings, and medium-hull logistics, and somewhat rarely these days with the odd triage carrier when medium-hull logistics isn't sufficient).
Your expectation should be to have fun in whatever you can pilot now, and afford to replace. I'm doubting you are able to afford to keep yourself in battleships, or even know how to earn that much ISK yet (it isn't a matter of skillpoints).
I've been playing EVE over 6 years. I've spent the past three years in a small-hull Assault Frigate. I have it, and its weapons trained to level 4. I have pretty much everything trained to level 4.
"The Skillpoint System and You" |
Viscount Hood
Relentless Terrorism Separatists
71
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Posted - 2015.08.26 20:09:04 -
[9] - Quote
I'd definitely like to obtain more skills other than training. It gets a bit tedious after 12 years. |
Celise Katelo
State War Academy Caldari State
136
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Posted - 2015.10.03 14:15:03 -
[10] - Quote
Such a pointless topic...
How about you go grind some ISK or buy some Plex & go check out:
Character Bazaar
Instant gratification is taking over way to much today. Spending years training skills is the best concept about EVE online ( In my opinion ), that defines what EVE is about.
If you want instant space ships go play "Star Conflict"
EVEBoard ...Just over 26million skill points, each skill was chosen for a reason. I closed my eyes & clicked another skill to train... "BINGO...!!!" ... "This time i got something usefull"
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Zihao
Garoun Investment Bank Gallente Federation
179
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Posted - 2015.10.04 00:17:22 -
[11] - Quote
Celise Katelo wrote:Such a pointless topic...
Spending years training skills is the best concept about EVE online ( In my opinion ), that defines what EVE is about.
Such a contradictory statement... |
Celise Katelo
State War Academy Caldari State
137
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Posted - 2015.10.05 13:47:51 -
[12] - Quote
Zihao wrote:Celise Katelo wrote:Such a pointless topic...
Spending years training skills is the best concept about EVE online ( In my opinion ), that defines what EVE is about.
Such a contradictory statement...
You Sir have no clue what ya on about...
This topic has been covered so many times. Hence why i said "Such a pointless topic" Go read some of the other long winded posts on such topics that say the same things. Starting a new topic that has already been covered is pointless. Do some home work, rather then quote me
The rest of my post that you happen to leave out are facts, you can buy a character if you choose this option. or you can spend years training skills. The latter is what i prefer.
../hands out a cookie
Edit.. typo's
EVEBoard ...Just over 26million skill points, each skill was chosen for a reason. I closed my eyes & clicked another skill to train... "BINGO...!!!" ... "This time i got something usefull"
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Leila Meurtrier
Why Am I Not Surprised
31
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Posted - 2015.10.06 14:28:42 -
[13] - Quote
Before you do any assumption, consider the fact that CCP is not interested in you being decked out in a minute. In fact, EVE is only 12 years old yet it takes twice as many years to master all skills. At the meantime, you start to be relevant at day 3 for PvP (Propulsion Jamming and MWD, duh) and day 21 at shooting crosses (T2 tank, gun support skills, basic drones). You are becoming competitive at day 28 for PvP (t2 tank, t2 guns, cybernetics I, thermodynamics III) and about 40th day for shooting crosses (L4 ship of a choice, t2 guns). Your skill are nearly perfect for a task at day 60 for most of activities. Perfect incursion pilot (Considered high end PvE stuff) takes 83 days. Then? It's eternity to get an edge, pushing extra months and throwing loads of isks for measly 1-2% advantage which also comes with big "Shoot me in the face. Repeatedly" sign. |
Johnny Riko
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
63
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Posted - 2015.10.07 13:19:07 -
[14] - Quote
Celise Katelo wrote:Such a pointless topic... How about you go grind some ISK or buy some Plex & go check out: Character BazaarInstant gratification is taking over way to much today. Spending years training skills is the best concept about EVE online ( In my opinion ), that defines what EVE is about. If you want instant space ships go play "Star Conflict"
Yes, it is a terrible thread. So why did you necro it after 2 months?
OP, what you're suggesting would just mean that older players who grind 24/7 will have the advantage. That is even worse in my opinion. In any given skill, level V takes 80% of the total time, but only gives 20% of the benefit. You can get all the core skills to IV rapidly and then be competitive enough to do PVP. From there you can start getting the shorter level V trains done, for stuff like T2 frigates/tank/weapon systems/fitting skills.
The only concept I really dislike in EVE is how powerful off-grid links are, and how it gives such a huge advantage to people who are willing to/can afford to multibox.
I wanna join up. I think I got what it takes to be a Citizen.
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Celise Katelo
State War Academy Caldari State
137
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Posted - 2015.10.07 13:55:17 -
[15] - Quote
Johnny Riko wrote:Celise Katelo wrote:Such a pointless topic... How about you go grind some ISK or buy some Plex & go check out: Character BazaarInstant gratification is taking over way to much today. Spending years training skills is the best concept about EVE online ( In my opinion ), that defines what EVE is about. If you want instant space ships go play "Star Conflict" Yes, it is a terrible thread. So why did you necro it after 2 months?
Your maths is rather off, the topic was first made 2015-08-25. Thats the 25th, so its the end of the month. My first post was "- 2015-10-03" at the very start of the 10th month, so its closer to a month not two months. Also this topic is on the front page of Skill Discussions when i first noticed it. I gave a valid reponce & the content that i gave is not outdated.
On another point.. you added information after me, So this kinda makes you a necro poster .../Hands out another special cookie just for you
Mmm.. you don't like a multibox player!!! ...But they add more fun to the game / challenge do they not ? Extra cash income injected into this game. I noticed that your in a pvp corp "cough", so multibox players shouldn't be a issue for you.
EVEBoard ...Just over 26million skill points, each skill was chosen for a reason. I closed my eyes & clicked another skill to train... "BINGO...!!!" ... "This time i got something usefull"
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Johnny Riko
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
63
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Posted - 2015.10.07 14:45:20 -
[16] - Quote
Celise Katelo wrote:Johnny Riko wrote:Celise Katelo wrote:Such a pointless topic... How about you go grind some ISK or buy some Plex & go check out: Character BazaarInstant gratification is taking over way to much today. Spending years training skills is the best concept about EVE online ( In my opinion ), that defines what EVE is about. If you want instant space ships go play "Star Conflict" Yes, it is a terrible thread. So why did you necro it after 2 months? Your maths is rather off, the topic was first made 2015-08-25. Thats the 25th, so its the end of the month. My first post was "- 2015-10-03" at the very start of the 10th month, so its closer to a month not two months. Also this topic is on the front page of Skill Discussions when i first noticed it. I gave a valid reponce & the content that i gave is not outdated. On another point.. you added information after me, So this kinda makes you a necro poster .../Hands out another special cookie just for you Mmm.. you don't like a multibox player!!! ...But they add more fun to the game / challenge do they not ? Extra cash income injected into this game. I noticed that your in a pvp corp "cough", so multibox players shouldn't be a issue for you.
The thread was posted in the month of August. You replied in the month of October. October is two months after August. I apologise for not counting the exact amount of days between posts. If you're going to be pedantic over whether the necro was after two months or one month, then you should probably take back your *Special cookie*.
I didn't say I didn't like multibox players. I said that I think off grid boosts are overpowered and give those who do multibox too much of an advantage. Just like how the Svipul is massively overpowered, but I don't complain when friendlies use them. lern2reed. *Hands special cookie*
I wanna join up. I think I got what it takes to be a Citizen.
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Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
25598
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Posted - 2015.11.02 02:44:30 -
[17] - Quote
Celise Katelo wrote:How about you go grind some ISK or buy some Plex & go check out: Character Bazaar You forgot to mention becoming a future Awful Loss Of the Day candidate, a newbie with millions of SP is still a newbie.
Civilized behaviour is knowing that violence is barbaric, but paying other people to do it is business.
Nil mortifi sine lucre.
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