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[Rev] o.O Tier.2 BC's ~VS~ Heavy Assault Ships.

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zwerg Caldari mUfFiN fAcToRy Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2006.12.16 00:45:00 - [1] Edited by: zwerg on 16/12/2006 00:45:26 Hello there. I don't know where i shall begin. Well we had some chilling today and were testing setups against each other. I had a 1on1 against a deimos, all t2 even faction in my hurricane. Do you guys/girls think he even came under 80% of my Armor? Actually no. Then my myrmidon ( i have a few -> but crappy <- drone skills ) against muninn/ishtar/deimos/cerberus. They weren't able to break my tank. I mean what the hell. In RmR you was owning a hac in a battlecruiser too, but: with the right fitting. A Brutix with ECM/NOS/DRONES was owning all cap needing ships with ease. But now BC's are way overpowered due to the shield/armor boost after [Rev] the huge amount of damage and tank they can bring on. Here's my setup for the 2 ships and the opponents: My Hurricane in those 1on1's 6x 220mm Vulcan Cannon II, 2x Medium 'Diminshing' Nosferatu 1x 10mn MWD II, 1x 10km Webifier, 1x 20km Disruptor, 1x Medium 'electromech.' cap injector w/ 800's 1x Armor Exp II, 1x Armor Kinetic II, 1x Armor Thermal II, 1x Energized Adaptive Nano II, 2x Medium Armor Repairer II. Drone Bay: 4x Warrior II, 1x Valkyre II. Cargo: 6 Cap Booster 800, 2500 Barrage M, 2500 Hail M, 2500 Emp. My Myrmidon Setup: 4x Heavy Ion Blaster II, 2x Medium 'Diminsihing' Noferatu. 1x 10mn MWD II, 1x Medium 'electromech.' Cap Injector w/ 800, 1x 10km Webifier, 1x 20km Disruptor, 1x Tracking Disruptor II 2x Medium Armor Repairer II, 3x Active II Hardeners, 1x Energized Adaptive Nano. Drone Bay 5x Ogre I Cargo: Void M, Null M, 6 Caps 800. Edit: Battlecruisers lvl IV. Of course the hacs against i fought weren't the same player all the time We were 5 people. All t2 fitted, sometimes faction. When they were dying under my guns i just thought ''oh my god'' I mean, a 40-50mil ship, imo totally overpowered is killing most of hac's in the game. Edit: The only close fight was the ishtar with uber nos/trackingdis/tank setup. but still, how can a tier2 bc own a hac. before you begin with your IM UBER IN MY VAGABOND flaming please stop it, we know its overpowered, but i still love it Please tell me your opinion of Tier2 BC's against Heavy Assault Ships. We were not using the same setups, well i did, it worked fine for me. The deimos was changing to ions II w/ void. We took our 2nd Ishtar Pilot with t2 heavy drones. Our gunman with 14mil sp's in gunnery. They were just not ripping the hurricane and the myrmidon apart.... In the end they all thought im cheating or doing something else. So we changend BC pilots. Now pyro in BC, me in my muninn, deimos, Nothing, i wasnt able to brake that goddamn tank. Then fire, same. I mean what the he*l?! What you did with those ships CCP?! NERV?! So please forum community tell me your opinion about the topic i just wrote. Edit: Sorry for my bad english, i tried my best to make you get my opinion and if anyone got any questions to setups or anything else, then go ahead, ill try to look into this one as often as i can. /zwerg Save the whales!!! Harpoon some Amarrians!!!!
zwerg Caldari mUfFiN fAcToRy Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2006.12.16 00:50:00 - [2] however im going to bed now, i needed like 1 hour for this thread ( dictonaire work is hard ) So dont expect me to answer your questions today. But i will look @ it tomorrow in the morning and will give my best. /zwerg Save the whales!!! Harpoon some Amarrians!!!!
Dixon Caldari Hells Donkeys	Posted - 2006.12.16 00:56:00 - [3] Well they are, supposedly, anti-cruiser platforms. It really shouldn't be totally unexpected that they pwn cruisers. BTW: Hac build cost is around 18-20M, BC build cost 25-45M. So let's not use that argument. Market prices do not determine amount of pwnage. - - - - - - Originally by: Ath Amon as long as there will be such umbalance there is no hope to make ships balanced...
Ariel Dawn SniggWaffe	Posted - 2006.12.16 01:54:00 - [4] Tier 2 BCs should be beating HACs most of the time. They're larger and more powerful ships by description and cost 50% more than a HAC to produce. If they weren't winning against HACs, then that would be a problem.
Horza Otho Minmatar Silver Star Federation Kurai Komichi	Posted - 2006.12.16 01:57:00 - [5] My Hurricane > Cerb My Hurricane > Vaga I can't believe Tux blessed Matari with a half decent ship O.o --- Eris Discordia is miiiiiine
GrumpyCat	Posted - 2006.12.16 02:03:00 - [6] Need to nerf tier 1 battleships as well. I mean why can a 60m isk ship own a 200m hac. Please nerf the geddon, phoon, and domi so that any vaga or cerb can own them. SP wise and isk wise, it is unfair.
Lextra	Posted - 2006.12.16 02:09:00 - [7] Edited by: Lextra on 16/12/2006 02:09:21 HACs are only 200m because of the T2 BPO system. They are actually much cheaper than that to produce.
Agent2 Holtze Amarr Omega Enterprises Dusk and Dawn	Posted - 2006.12.16 02:17:00 - [8] did you buy denrace's sig or did you steal it? Posting and you!
Andrea Jaruwalski Caldari Angel Deep Corporation	Posted - 2006.12.16 02:55:00 - [9] Your myrmidon setup shouldn't fit.
Angus McLean Gallente Divinity Trials	Posted - 2006.12.16 04:41:00 - [10] Originally by: Andrea Jaruwalski Your myrmidon setup shouldn't fit. Your Myrmidon setup doesnt fit

Andrea Jaruwalski Caldari Angel Deep Corporation	Posted - 2006.12.16 05:13:00 - [11] Originally by: Angus McLean Originally by: Andrea Jaruwalski Your myrmidon setup shouldn't fit. Your Myrmidon setup doesnt fit Same thing.
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial	Posted - 2006.12.16 05:29:00 - [12] Edited by: Goumindong on 16/12/2006 05:30:06 Originally by: zwerg My Hurricane in those 1on1's 6x 220mm Vulcan Cannon II, 2x Medium 'Diminshing' Nosferatu 1x 10mn MWD II, 1x 10km Webifier, 1x 20km Disruptor, 1x Medium 'electromech.' cap injector w/ 800's 1x Armor Exp II, 1x Armor Kinetic II, 1x Armor Thermal II, 1x Energized Adaptive Nano II, 2x Medium Armor Repairer II. Drone Bay: 4x Warrior II, 1x Valkyre II. Cargo: 6 Cap Booster 800, 2500 Barrage M, 2500 Hail M, 2500 Emp. That is a pretty heavy tank on that ship there. Also since you dont have cap using weapons, 400's are better for you. Against nossers the 400's will keep your reppers going 2/3 cycles[cap boost right before you run the reppers, leavs 40 cap left over to drain, vs 800's which give your opponent a bunch of extra cap and only keep your reppers going 1/3 of the time] and against non nossers the boost will be enough to keep your repers going without problem[8.88 cap/second use after cap boost amount figured in, easy enough for an ammaran sized capacitor with 2 NOS's, in fact you could probably drop a NOS or two for HAMs unless you are using it to kill tanks]. ---------------------------------------- Thou Shalt "Pew Pew"
Marcus TheMartin Gallente MAFIA Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2006.12.16 05:41:00 - [13] Originally by: Agent2 Holtze did you buy denrace's sig or did you steal it? Helllooo pirate lol Sig Nerf - Cortes I declare war on ISD! You don't stand a chance -Karl
Viktor Fyretracker Caldari Worms Corp	Posted - 2006.12.16 05:59:00 - [14] BCs beating HACs is not overpowered at all, who cares if they are cheaper. they are Battlecruisers and HACs are cruisers. the BC should win of flown by a skilled pilot who has his **** in gear.
Terraform Gallente	Posted - 2006.12.16 06:05:00 - [15] I've killed a few HACs in my brutix [pre-Rev], so i don't really mind, if anything i'd like to see even more BCs, since the usual way to go for most people is: frig->cruiser->BS, completely ignoring BCs. BC-fights are some of the most fun fights i've ever had. Nobody ever said that a HAC was supposed to kill BCs, the ships that are supposed to kill BCs are other BCs and BS. Bcs are not overpowered, they just got pumped back to where they SHOULD have been all along. I vote for more BCs!!! I hereby remove my sig, sigs are evil, sigs are the devil and i suck at drawing...
ViperVenom Minmatar Fast Food Corp Novus Ordos Seclorum	Posted - 2006.12.16 08:49:00 - [16] Originally by: Terraform I've killed a few HACs in my brutix [pre-Rev], so i don't really mind, if anything i'd like to see even more BCs, since the usual way to go for most people is: frig->cruiser->BS, completely ignoring BCs. BC-fights are some of the most fun fights i've ever had. Nobody ever said that a HAC was supposed to kill BCs, the ships that are supposed to kill BCs are other BCs and BS. Bcs are not overpowered, they just got pumped back to where they SHOULD have been all along. This is a funny post. I have never and i repeat never lost a HAC to a BC. a Vaga -VS- BC Vaga pwn 99% and that 1% i still don't belive. Hacs have better tank better dps. smaller sig. I vote for more BCs!!!
Agent2 Holtze Amarr Omega Enterprises Dusk and Dawn	Posted - 2006.12.16 10:32:00 - [17] Originally by: Marcus TheMartin Originally by: Agent2 Holtze did you buy denrace's sig or did you steal it? Helllooo pirate lol Impersonation (or how it's spelled) is illegal on the forums =) Posting and you!
Kunming Amarr adeptus gattacus Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.12.16 11:03:00 - [18] Originally by: Terraform I've killed a few HACs in my brutix [pre-Rev], so i don't really mind, if anything i'd like to see even more BCs, since the usual way to go for most people is: frig->cruiser->BS, completely ignoring BCs. BC-fights are some of the most fun fights i've ever had. Nobody ever said that a HAC was supposed to kill BCs, the ships that are supposed to kill BCs are other BCs and BS. Bcs are not overpowered, they just got pumped back to where they SHOULD have been all along. I vote for more BCs!!! So what are HACs supposed to kill.. frigates and destroyers?!! I got both BC and HAC and associated skills at lvl 5 and cant say I found a purpose to fly a HAC in Revelations. I'm not really complaining since the BCs are much cheaper but the HAC role should be defined clearer, maybe further reduce their sig and make them BS killers, cause a BS just owns a BC that would be a circle of balance in the end. Quote: READ THIS NEXT PART CAREFULLY AS IT IS VERY IMPORTANT AND POSTING A REPLY WITHOUT READING IT MAY RESULT IN YOU LOOKING STUPID.
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial	Posted - 2006.12.16 11:10:00 - [19] Originally by: Kunming Originally by: Terraform I've killed a few HACs in my brutix [pre-Rev], so i don't really mind, if anything i'd like to see even more BCs, since the usual way to go for most people is: frig->cruiser->BS, completely ignoring BCs. BC-fights are some of the most fun fights i've ever had. Nobody ever said that a HAC was supposed to kill BCs, the ships that are supposed to kill BCs are other BCs and BS. Bcs are not overpowered, they just got pumped back to where they SHOULD have been all along. I vote for more BCs!!! So what are HACs supposed to kill.. frigates and destroyers?!! I got both BC and HAC and associated skills at lvl 5 and cant say I found a purpose to fly a HAC in Revelations. I'm not really complaining since the BCs are much cheaper but the HAC role should be defined clearer, maybe further reduce their sig and make them BS killers, cause a BS just owns a BC that would be a circle of balance in the end. Destroyers, frigates, assault frigates, cruisers. They work as heavy tacklers, damage dealers, they are fast and versitile. They arent strong enough to always kill BC's but they can[though typically not in a straight up fight] ---------------------------------------- Thou Shalt "Pew Pew"
Kunming Amarr adeptus gattacus Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.12.16 11:44:00 - [20] Originally by: Goumindong Originally by: Kunming Originally by: Terraform I've killed a few HACs in my brutix [pre-Rev], so i don't really mind, if anything i'd like to see even more BCs, since the usual way to go for most people is: frig->cruiser->BS, completely ignoring BCs. BC-fights are some of the most fun fights i've ever had. Nobody ever said that a HAC was supposed to kill BCs, the ships that are supposed to kill BCs are other BCs and BS. Bcs are not overpowered, they just got pumped back to where they SHOULD have been all along. I vote for more BCs!!! So what are HACs supposed to kill.. frigates and destroyers?!! I got both BC and HAC and associated skills at lvl 5 and cant say I found a purpose to fly a HAC in Revelations. I'm not really complaining since the BCs are much cheaper but the HAC role should be defined clearer, maybe further reduce their sig and make them BS killers, cause a BS just owns a BC that would be a circle of balance in the end. Destroyers, frigates, assault frigates, cruisers. They work as heavy tacklers, damage dealers, they are fast and versitile. They arent strong enough to always kill BC's but they can[though typically not in a straight up fight] Thats bull**, HACs are raiding vessels they need speed, agility and good dmg to get the job done. With the HP boost they are left in the shadow as it takes ages to finish a fight and raiding is all about quick kills before the cavalary arrives. BTW WTF is a heavy tackler??! Around 200mils for a ship to tackle?! Get a ceptor and learn to orbit, if you say they are vulnerable to NOS so are 90% of the HACs.. Its k if BCs kill HACs but HACs should be a great danger for BS gangs without BC support! If you want bigger to be better then go play WoW or some other retarded grind game. Quote: READ THIS NEXT PART CAREFULLY AS IT IS VERY IMPORTANT AND POSTING A REPLY WITHOUT READING IT MAY RESULT IN YOU LOOKING STUPID.**

Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial	Posted - 2006.12.16 11:55:00 - [21] Originally by: Kunming Thats bull****, HACs are raiding vessels they need speed, agility and good dmg to get the job done. With the HP boost they are left in the shadow as it takes ages to finish a fight and raiding is all about quick kills before the cavalary arrives. BTW WTF is a heavy tackler??! Around 200mils for a ship to tackle?! Get a ceptor and learn to orbit, if you say they are vulnerable to NOS so are 90% of the HACs.. Its k if BCs kill HACs but HACs should be a great danger for BS gangs without BC support! If you want bigger to be better then go play WoW or some other retarded grind game. They are raiding vessels. It is just too much to expect that you can go raiding against battlesips and battlecruises without brining a number of ships. ---------------------------------------- Thou Shalt "Pew Pew"
Leandro Salazar Aeon Industries Confederation of Independent Corporations	Posted - 2006.12.16 12:01:00 - [22] Originally by: Kunming BTW WTF is a heavy tackler??! Around 200mils for a ship to tackle?! Get a ceptor and learn to orbit, if you say they are vulnerable to NOS so are 90% of the HACs.. HAC ARE NOT! 200 mil ships. That price is totally artificial. Maybe them being pwned by tier2 BCs will help to make people realize they are paying 900% extra for a ship costing maybe 20 mil to build. And then STOP them from doing it so prices can go down to a level closer to their actual cost. Making them available to people who are willing to use them in their true roles, and not as the pwnmobiles they are regarded as until now. --------- ZOMG my sig was concordokkened! Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
sariss Art of War Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2006.12.16 12:04:00 - [23] You shouldn¦t compare market prices but built prices. If you do that you¦ll find out that the tier 2 battlecruisers are about 5 to 10 mil more expensive than HACs. Just because an item/ship is sold at a ridiculously high price doesn¦t make it good. HACs have become an ever annoying shipclass in EVE, the BPOs hoarded by the big alliances, almost not affordable on the regular market. I am perfectly happy with BCs being able to kill HACs.


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